Thiem's 3 GOAT FHs in a row

MeatTornado

G.O.A.T.
Honestly the next person that figures out the net game in a serious way will feast on these people

They dont go to the net because they cant volley

The time is now for someone to rattle these people
Roger, Rafa, Sampras, Edberg, whoever. All of them would've been passed by those Thiem forehands. That's my point. It doesn't matter how skilled you are at net when your opponent can hit groundstrokes like that.
 
Roger, Rafa, Sampras, Edberg, whoever. All of them would've been passed by those Thiem forehands. That's my point. It doesn't matter how skilled you are at net when your opponent can hit groundstrokes like that.
You have imagined a situation where anyone would let him hit those forehands

Zverev's approach game was 14 and under clinic level

What makes you think he would pass people like that?
 

MeatTornado

G.O.A.T.
Zverev's approach game was 14 and under clinic level
That's ridiculous. He definitely rushed recklessly on a few points, but not here.

On that 2nd point he hits a great angle BH, drawing Thiem outside the doubles alley and giving himself a perfect opportunity to sneak in. Thiem actually got the ball back really well but Zed managed to bunt it back over the high part of the net pretty well. It took Thiem on the dead run and hitting his FH as hard as he could to win that point. That's not a bad approach, that's just getting outplayed.

On the 3rd point he's already in no-man's land and chose to move forward instead of retreating. I have no problem with that. The forehand could've been a little stronger, but again, it took Thiem ripping it as hard as he could to get it past him.
 

Dragan

Semi-Pro
Honestly the next person that figures out the net game in a serious way will feast on these people

They dont go to the net because they cant volley

The time is now for someone to rattle these people
There are still players whose playing stile is predominantly S&V (e.g. Dustin Brown). I tremendously enjoy watching them, but obviously that playing style does not win matches and tournaments well enough in modern tennis. They can surprise top tier players once or twice, but they eventually get smoked with passing shots next time they meet.
 

canta_Brian

Semi-Pro
That's ridiculous. He definitely rushed recklessly on a few points, but not here.

On that 2nd point he hits a great angle BH, drawing Thiem outside the doubles alley and giving himself a perfect opportunity to sneak in. Thiem actually got the ball back really well but Zed managed to bunt it back over the high part of the net pretty well. It took Thiem on the dead run and hitting his FH as hard as he could to win that point. That's not a bad approach, that's just getting outplayed.

On the 3rd point he's already in no-man's land and chose to move forward instead of retreating. I have no problem with that. The forehand could've been a little stronger, but again, it took Thiem ripping it as hard as he could to get it past him.
Zverev should have won the 2nd point. He covered cross court despite Theim only just getting to the ball. You have to have the line covered when your opponent is that stretched.
 

MeatTornado

G.O.A.T.
Zverev should have won the 2nd point. He covered cross court despite Theim only just getting to the ball. You have to have the line covered when your opponent is that stretched.
Based on my very anecdotal evidence, Thiem usually prefers the cross-court pass on the forehand side. Sascha stayed left but looked to be expecting one to his right.
 
Roger, Rafa, Sampras, Edberg, whoever. All of them would've been passed by those Thiem forehands. That's my point. It doesn't matter how skilled you are at net when your opponent can hit groundstrokes like that.
Thiem missed plenty of passes. The tour standard of passing shots isn't Nadal-like at all. Regular s&v is of course not an option, but incorporating net play is vital to be able to finish points from advantageous positions without having to paint the lines with groundstrokes. Otherwise, you get drawn into exhausting rallies until somebody misses. See Thiem-Medvedev SF, Thiem kept resetting rallies with slicing but Medvedev wouldn't come forward because his net play is poor. That hurt him a lot because he struggled to outgrind Thiem while Thime had bigger strokes to win extra points.
 
The approach on the third point was pretty poor, Thiem didn't have to move much to get it and had time since it wasn't especially deep or fast, actually just crossed the service line.
 
The approach on the third point was pretty poor, Thiem didn't have to move much to get it and had time since it wasn't especially deep or fast, actually just crossed the service line.

Something tells me that Zed can afford actual cameras of his shots

Its remarkable how trash most of his are when you freeze them

He is twisted into a pretzel with no salt every time on big points
 

King No1e

G.O.A.T.
Reminds me of those insane shots Rafa hit last year in the final when he was about to be broken in the 5th that somehow barely went in magically.
Reminds me (ok, this might be a little very disrespectful to the AO12 final) of the AO12 final when Nadal blasted those winners from 0-40 in the 4th set.
 

MeatTornado

G.O.A.T.
The approach on the third point was pretty poor, Thiem didn't have to move much to get it and had time since it wasn't especially deep or fast, actually just crossed the service line.
The 3rd one was definitely a bit Roddick-esque. Coming in on a forehand to forehand exchange just because he's already a step in the court. Not the best play in hindsight.
 
Thiem missed plenty of passes. The tour standard of passing shots isn't Nadal-like at all. Regular s&v is of course not an option, but incorporating net play is vital to be able to finish points from advantageous positions without having to paint the lines with groundstrokes. Otherwise, you get drawn into exhausting rallies until somebody misses. See Thiem-Medvedev SF, Thiem kept resetting rallies with slicing but Medvedev wouldn't come forward because his net play is poor. That hurt him a lot because he struggled to outgrind Thiem while Thime had bigger strokes to win extra points.
Indeed. It's not as if Thiem was ripping passes at will all night.
 

mental midget

Hall of Fame
It really wasn't. Zverev covered the net well for the most part. Best I've ever seen him at the net.
agree, he's made huge improvements and clutched plenty of tough volleys. the bigger issue for him, and everyone nowadays really, isn't technique so much as positioning and knowing what to come in on, and when. i see lots of missed opportunities to close when they have a guy on the defensive, and lots of kamikaze rushes on stuff where the guy's got plenty of time to get balanced and set up for an easy pass. guess that's just experience.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
Thiem showed some clutch in this match, apart from that 6-5 service game
Tim and Zverev were both cramping at the end. For those not watching;), Tim had his leg worked on before that last service game.

Ironically or perhaps because of these three great forehands Tim cramped, Or was he forced to hit these knowing that the cramps were coming on?:unsure:
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
He choked in the TB on matchpoint too.

Happy he won though, glad he finally got his slam.
Both players were cramping at the end of the match so it's hard to label any of it choking especially when Zverev couldn't even hit a first serve. Now if you want to call their cramping choking well I'm all ears.:sneaky:
 
Both players were cramping at the end of the match so it's hard to label any of it choking especially when Zverev couldn't even hit a first serve. Now if you want to call their cramping choking well I'm all ears.:sneaky:
The TTW sharks are never satisfied, man. If you're not an ATG, you're basically trash for them. Murray, who is borderline ATG, is probably the most mocked player ever on here. Even Nadal endured so much hate on this site for many years. I remember people mocking Djokovic before his 2011 run as a washed up one-slam wonder.
I am not sure why people can't just be fans of the game and stop bashing anyone who comes up the ranks.
 

SonnyT

Hall of Fame
Zverev made big mistakes when he came to the net at the end of final set, just gave Thiem targets to shoot at!

What did Thiem's 3 forehands remind me of? Federer-Djokovic '10 USO SF: 23-year old serving at 4-5 final set. Federer had double matchpoints at 15-40, Djokovic unleashed 3 mighty forehands that won him that game. Djokovic then took the next 2 games to win the match.
 

Shaolin

G.O.A.T.
Both players were cramping at the end of the match so it's hard to label any of it choking especially when Zverev couldn't even hit a first serve. Now if you want to call their cramping choking well I'm all ears.:sneaky:
Thiem up 6-4 tiebreak, hit a massive (prob close to 100 mph) inside out fh, got a short sitter forehand and hit it straight into the net. Had nothing to do with cramping (except between the ears).
 
Tim and Zverev were both cramping at the end. For those not watching;), Tim had his leg worked on before that last service game.

Ironically or perhaps because of these three great forehands Tim cramped, Or was he forced to hit these knowing that the cramps were coming on?:unsure:
I watched the entire 5th set today, thanks to hotstar(as I missed the final itself) and I can safely state that Thiem was playing at 50% of what he's capable of. He was definately compromised
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
I watched the entire 5th set today, thanks to hotstar(as I missed the final itself) and I can safely state that Thiem was playing at 50% of what he's capable of. He was definately compromised
And really the only explanation for him being this compromised is nerves causing the cramping. Zedly had a lot of longer matches this tournament but they may not of been that bad because his semifinal five sets was actually easier for him than tim's victory over Medvedev. They both may have been cramping due to the tension of the moment, in fact I don't know how anyone can conclude otherwise.:eek:
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
Thiem up 6-4 tiebreak, hit a massive (prob close to 100 mph) inside out fh, got a short sitter forehand and hit it straight into the net. Had nothing to do with cramping (except between the ears).
Well for some of the glass is half empty. I saw a player cramping pulling off a lot of very good shots I am let's not forget Zverev was cramping in the final tiebreaker and could not hit a first serve. Zverev is cramping could've been conditioning but I think Tim's was brought on by a heightened state of nerves during the entire match.

The tiebreaker and the end of the match had everything to do with cramping. With both players very candid about the facts it's hard to see it any other way.

Tim is not alone and his sluggish starts; Djokovic and his performance in the 2017 Rome final comes to mind and of course Nadal's start against Tim at the 2018 U.S. Open. it's all on these players for the bad starts and they have a little excuse for it. If we call that choking so be it, because the impact is almost as insidious and difficult to get away from. Federer finish to the 2015 US open final smells a little bit too though I personally think Novak did the breakpoint thing to too many players but fed still look like a deer in the headlights and one can say he was tight. for me choking on something that a player does when a match gets really tight and they start double foaultng or can't get any first serve in play with no good reason and most of these players have a history of it (Rainic, Berdych, and Dimitrough quite reliable in this:sneaky:.)
 
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