This is what NTRP 4.5 is looks like?

Here we go again...

Depends on whether this is a legit USTA tournament or not. It may or may not be true 4.5. They have awkward looking strokes, but tennis is a deceptive game. Time and time again I will observe 4.5 players playing their league matches and I feel like I could compete or even beat these guys. Yet reality hits and when I'm on the court I lose to solid 4.0s pretty handily.
 
jiejenn said:
Not sure if I agree with the video, but if they are "truly" NTRP 4.5, then I am pretty sure I am between NTRP 4.5 -5.0. So basically I just need some opinion from the "professionals" here on the forum. Opinions and judgments can be very objective, so I am pretty sure we are going to get different type of opinions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9ncoombS0E&feature=channel_page
Click to expand...

Really, it's hard to tell ratings based on video clips - especially on you tube - and it very easy to be delusional about your level of play.

My recommendation is to use the USTA "find a partner" feature and find yourself some computer rated 4.5's. Set up some matches. Or play in a few 4.5 tourneys. You'll quickly find your level of tennis.

BTW- What's your tennis background? Juniors? High School? College? How long have you been playing?
 
jiejenn said:
Not sure if I agree with the video, but if they are "truly" NTRP 4.5, then I am pretty sure I am between NTRP 4.5 -5.0. So basically I just need some opinion from the "professionals" here on the forum. Opinions and judgments can be very objective, so I am pretty sure we are going to get different type of opinions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9ncoombS0E&feature=channel_page
Click to expand...

They have nice feel for the ball especially fat guy in white. Strokes look GOOFY but you notice his shots always land close to the lines. Yes in the Past and also in Florida, they could be seen as 4.5 just cause they have such good control and they seem to do everything pretty well.
But now with Ringers everywhere, they are no longer seen as 4.5. Now, in places like California and *******, they would be seen as USTA 4.0.
 
The bottom line is that if they are legit 4.5's and you can beat them, then you're at least a 4.5 yourself. You really can't tell from watching a video if you can actually beat them in a real match on a real tennis court. The only way you can know is to play them yourself.

With that said, I don't know what region of the country they're in, but if I had to make a determination based solely on this video, I would say that both of these guys would probably be no higher than a 4.0 in California.
 
JRstriker12 said:
The guy in white was rated a 5.0 in 2007 by USTA - check him out on tennis link.

So it's plausible they guy is playing 4.5-5.0 tennis.
Click to expand...
But that doesn't necessarily mean anything. I know guys that are computer rated 5.0's but are no better than 4.0's in reality. How did they do it? By joining a 5.5 team and self-rating themselves 5.5. They lose every match and the computer rates them 5.0's.
 
I thought it said that they were 5.0? They don't have overwhelming power, but they don't make many errors and they have all court games. They might be tougher to beat than they look, I wouldn't dogmatically say that they're not 4.5s. They're good players.
 
They're certainly not 5.0 players, but 4.5 is very much possible. For sure they're at least 4.0, although I wouldn't argue about them being 4.5 either. Despite how awkward some of their shots look, I see plenty of control and construction of points. There's also consistency with the strokes they've developed in order to be competitive.

In short, I've seen 4.5s with nastier strokes, yet they are able to dominate more technically sound players and win.
 
BreakPoint said:
But that doesn't necessarily mean anything. I know guys that are computer rated 5.0's but are no better than 4.0's in reality. How did they do it? By joining a 5.5 team and self-rating themselves 5.5. They lose every match and the computer rates them 5.0's.
Click to expand...

So USTA computer ratings based on about 6 years of play don't mean anything????? HUH?? If he wasn't close to being a 5.0, I think he'd either be dumped by any 5.0 team or fallen below to about 4.0 in 6 years time.

Not saying the dude is super impressive or World Champion, but the most accurate assessment we have of one of these guys is his USTA rating. Who knows, maybe the other dude is a 4.0 playing up.

Yes, there may be some sandbaggers playing 4.0 and yeah, there may some 4.0's who made a mistake in self rating and manage not to get blown out too bad by playing 5.0 doubles.

But if we are asking what these guys ratings are, Tennis Link provides the most probable answer for at least one guy. Unless any posters want to fly to Hawaii and challenge the guy.
 
jiejenn said:
Not sure if I agree with the video, but if they are "truly" NTRP 4.5, then I am pretty sure I am between NTRP 4.5 -5.0. So basically I just need some opinion from the "professionals" here on the forum. Opinions and judgments can be very objective, so I am pretty sure we are going to get different type of opinions.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9ncoombS0E&feature=channel_page
Click to expand...

In Florida, in my area, they'd be 4.0, possibly low 4.5.

Service motions are not great.

The fellow in white is fat, so I wonder if he'd be around for the second set.

The fellow in green has decent footwork, and might play 4.5. He's also fairly athletic, though he could use some serious stroke work, IMHO.

They aren't having any long points, which also suggests 4.0 level.

-Robert
 
JRstriker12 said:
So USTA computer ratings based on about 6 years of play don't mean anything????? HUH?? If he wasn't close to being a 5.0, I think he'd either be dumped by any 5.0 team or fallen below to about 4.0 in 6 years time.

Not saying the dude is super impressive or World Champion, but the most accurate assessment we have of one of these guys is his USTA rating. Who knows, maybe the other dude is a 4.0 playing up.

Yes, there may be some sandbaggers playing 4.0 and yeah, there may some 4.0's who made a mistake in self rating and manage not to get blown out too bad by playing 5.0 doubles.

But if we are asking what these guys ratings are, Tennis Link provides the most probable answer for at least one guy. Unless any posters want to fly to Hawaii and challenge the guy.
Click to expand...

With all due respect to you, I don't have that much faith in USTA rankings. Plus, they vary widely. In Montana, I might be a 5.0, but in California and parts of Florida, I'd be 4.0, maybe 4.5.

Personally, I think USTA ratings are a crock of merde.

-Robert
 
^^^:lol: There's a guy who plays at my local public courts that looks a lot like the guy in the video, actually. He's short, not fat but sort of barrel-torsoed. He uses a N1 - and basically owns everyone he plays! He has short, ugly, choppy looking serves and strokes. He uses a lot of slice volleys. Good speed for an older guy and really good pace on his serve and groundies. That N1 sure has plenty of power. It's an ugly game to watch, but entertaining at the same time with him running around with that giant white racquet. It's almost as big as he is. He mostly plays doubles and he's always the best player on the court. I have no idea what his rating would be.
 
JRstriker12 said:
So USTA computer ratings based on about 6 years of play don't mean anything????? HUH?? If he wasn't close to being a 5.0, I think he'd either be dumped by any 5.0 team or fallen below to about 4.0 in 6 years time.
Click to expand...
What you do is to start your own team. You can't be dumped from the team if you're the captain. There's nothing to stop a 4.0 from starting a 5.0 team. :)
 
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I appreciated the tight editing. I hate watching these videos where the first minute is the guy saying "is it on?", "yeah it's on" "ok"... slow walk, slow start.

And... my vote... 4.0 to low 4.5
 
This was entertaining to watch. I agree with most of you. Stroke mechanic wise, 4.0 (Consistentcy). But then again, playing a "anything goes" match, having a pretty looking stroke does not get you very far. Consistency and a good solid game is what it takes in 4.5's.
 
These are the type of guys that make posters on these boards start threads like,,,,,, "I lost to a pusher today". :)

Great stuff.
 
boojay said:
4.5 is very much possible. For sure they're at least 4.0, although I wouldn't argue about them being 4.5 either. Despite how awkward some of their shots look, I see plenty of control and construction of points. There's also consistency with the strokes they've developed in order to be competitive.
Click to expand...

I agree with you.
 
JRstriker12 said:
Really, it's hard to tell ratings based on video clips - especially on you tube - and it very easy to be delusional about your level of play.

My recommendation is to use the USTA "find a partner" feature and find yourself some computer rated 4.5's. Set up some matches. Or play in a few 4.5 tourneys. You'll quickly find your level of tennis.

BTW- What's your tennis background? Juniors? High School? College? How long have you been playing?
Click to expand...

I played for 2 year in high school, on and off in college, and 2 years consistently after college. So let me see, probably a good 4 years. I am 24 right now, hopefully I will reach a good 4.5 next summer. One of my partners played in college, the other is a solid 4.0.
 
ith all due respect to you, I don't have that much faith in USTA rankings. Plus, they vary widely. In Montana, I might be a 5.0, but in California and parts of Florida, I'd be 4.0, maybe 4.5.
Click to expand...

LMAO. You wish. They don't vary that much at all. You can see the national results and the tennis hot bed areas do not clean up.

The better areas have more high level players. if they had better players at each level they would always win at the nationals.
 
And by the way, I really appreciate all the post. The reason why I post the thread is because I am really trying to measure my NTRP so I can see from which area I can improve even more. I played a lot matches this summer, and all I can say is I hit a lot harder\, faster, and more consistently then those guys (footwork + knees). But if they are truly 4.5 then I can assume I am at least 4.5 based on my match performances BUT I always assume 4.5 or 5.0 players are suppose hit the ball as fast as Federer maybe just not as consistently. Correct me if I am wrong.
 
Jie, i remember when you and I battled it out at the 3.0 level...at least it made us feel like we were 5.0's on some of our points.
 
jiejenn said:
The reason why I post the thread is because I am really trying to measure my NTRP so I can see from which area I can improve even more. I played a lot matches this summer, and all I can say is I hit a lot harder\, faster, and more consistently then those guys (footwork + knees). But if they are truly 4.5 then I can assume I am at least 4.5 based on my match performances BUT I always assume 4.5 or 5.0 players are suppose hit the ball as fast as Federer maybe just not as consistently. Correct me if I am wrong.
Click to expand...


Your post doesn't make sense. You state you want to meausre your NTRP, and then later, state you are better than these guys, based on your own "match performance". Have you played NTRP tourney/leagues?? If so, then you would know what your NTRP is.

Lastly, 4.5-5.0 players don't come close to hitting as hard or as with much spin as a guy like Fed. fact is, 4.5-5.0 players are a dime a dozen, and there are tens of thousands of players better than them.
 
Tyrus said:
Jie, i remember when you and I battled it out at the 3.0 level...at least it made us feel like we were 5.0's on some of our points.
Click to expand...

Haha yeah. I played a whole different game now. You still play? And did you get a new racquet eventually? I use Aeropro Drive now since I use seim-western and western forehand.


The weather is getting colder, but let me know if you are interested to hit sometimes as well. One of my partners is having a baby soon + work, so he can't play until next year. And my other partner who I play almost every week is out of town sometimes, but if you wanne play a match or two let me know. I am so obsess with my forehand right now.
 
Both of those guys would be 3.5, maybe 4.0 at best here in Atlanta.... unorthodox looking strokes, bad court sense and shot selections, and way too many unforced errors. An average 4.5 singles player would eat those guys for breakfast.
 
Wakenslam said:
Both of those guys would be 3.5, maybe 4.0 at best here in Atlanta.... unorthodox looking strokes, bad court sense and shot selections, and way too many unforced errors. An average 4.5 singles player would eat those guys for breakfast.
Click to expand...

I agree. I watch a lot of this guys videos. He lives in asia (used to be in hawaii) so his ratings are inflated. Hes older but he has good strategy. His shots are just too weak though. Good volleys though. Look how shallow / weak they are hitting the ball. They have decent placement but the putaway power is not there. Looks more like pushing that rallying.

Tall guy in green shirt has a "decent" serve. Im a 4.5 in Florida and my 1st serve averages in 100-110. I know for a fact I would destroy either. Weak 1H backhand on the white shirt. A solid 4.5 would exploit that like crazy. Huge windup on the green shirts forehand is another good target. I think if they face anyone who hits with pace they are done for.

At least in florida these guys get 4.0's no questions asked.

Im a 4.5 and the following video looks like a typical match I would play in a tourny against a 4.5-5.0 player.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHrDP62RcQU&feature=related


As previosly mentioned it matters where you are from.
 
coyfish said:
I agree. I watch a lot of this guys videos. He lives in asia (used to be in hawaii) so his ratings are inflated. Hes older but he has good strategy. His shots are just too weak though. Good volleys though. Look how shallow / weak they are hitting the ball. They have decent placement but the putaway power is not there. Looks more like pushing that rallying.

Tall guy in green shirt has a "decent" serve. Im a 4.5 in Florida and my 1st serve averages in 100-110. I know for a fact I would destroy either. Weak 1H backhand on the white shirt. A solid 4.5 would exploit that like crazy. Huge windup on the green shirts forehand is another good target. I think if they face anyone who hits with pace they are done for.

At least in florida these guys get 4.0's no questions asked.

Im a 4.5 and the following video looks like a typical match I would play in a tourny against a 4.5-5.0 player.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHrDP62RcQU&feature=related


As previosly mentioned it matters where you are from.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the video. Now I have better idea where I am at right now. My baseline stroke is heavier than yours, but your volley is way better than mine. Now I just need to work on my volley this winter.....
 
Coy's video isn't better then the guys in the first video. The big difference is the camera angles and the general style. What I have noticed is that people who play with loopier strokes get slammed on these review threads. And that camera angle emphasizes the loop facto of those strokes..
 
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GuyClinch said:
Coy's video isn't better then the guys in the first video. The big difference is the camera angles and the general style. What I have noticed is that people who play with loopier strokes get slammed on these review threads. And that camera angle emphasizes the loop facto of those strokes..
Click to expand...

I disagree. Coy's video shows put away ability that you didn't see in the first video. Coy's video is more representative of the 4.0 maybe low 4.5's I see around here. The first video, though they run well, and not even considering the "look" of their strokes, wouldn't make half the points they do here because they wouldn't be close enough to return strokes to make the volley in the first place. I think Coy's video is more in line with the different levels of NTRP self ratings as they were intended to be.
 
Wakenslam said:
Both of those guys would be 3.5, maybe 4.0 at best here in Atlanta.... unorthodox looking strokes, bad court sense and shot selections, and way too many unforced errors. An average 4.5 singles player would eat those guys for breakfast.
Click to expand...

mtommer said:
I disagree. Coy's video shows put away ability that you didn't see in the first video. Coy's video is more representative of the 4.0 maybe low 4.5's I see around here. The first video, though they run well, and not even considering the "look" of their strokes, wouldn't make half the points they do here because they wouldn't be close enough to return strokes to make the volley in the first place. I think Coy's video is more in line with the different levels of NTRP self ratings as they were intended to be.
Click to expand...

Okay, now how would you rate the red shirt guy on the below videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuQqUOj6z8o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNYD9kLYlAY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfVdwTbVNxs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAmk5rv7WeA
 
chess9 said:
With all due respect to you, I don't have that much faith in USTA rankings. Plus, they vary widely. In Montana, I might be a 5.0, but in California and parts of Florida, I'd be 4.0, maybe 4.5.

Personally, I think USTA ratings are a crock of merde.

-Robert
Click to expand...

True there are slight difference in each region.

But what's the point of asking if these guys are 4.5 or 5.0 if it means nothing at all?

6 years or playing at the 5.0 level - even if it's in a weaker region - means that at least in Hawaii, the one dude is somewhere in the 4.5 to 5.0 level.
 
who cares what they would be in atlanta, so cal, or in your backyard>>> the USTA has them computer rated at 4.5-5.0. End of effen story.

and BTW, you guys are making 4.5-5.0 players out to be "god-like". They aren't. Not all of them have "pretty strokes".

Here is a 5.5 that would kick the living snot out of 90% of the posters on this forum (6-0, 6-0,)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZgQ2lbCpO0
 
drakulie said:
who cares what they would be in atlanta, so cal, or in your backyard>>> the USTA has them computer rated at 4.5-5.0. End of effen story.

and BTW, you guys are making 4.5-5.0 players out to be "god-like". They aren't. Not all of them have "pretty strokes".

Here is a 5.5 that would kick the living snot out of 90% of the posters on this forum (6-0, 6-0,)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZgQ2lbCpO0
Click to expand...

I agree. Since when do you have to have "nice looking" strokes to be a high level player or be crazy fit (as chess said the guy in the white wouldn't last in 2 sets).

I'll bet the majority of people lose to people with weird strokes then just make excuses to no end. Get over yourselves.

Also check out this guy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJZW...09AB4C9E&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=23 he has quit the belly but took a set and 3 tie breaks to Grigor.
 
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