Tips on tossing the ball higher + controlled?

[kingp1ng]

Does anyone have any tips on tossing the ball higher while keeping it controlled?

On this forum I've learned to toss with my shoulder rather than with my arm. This really helped with the control and consistency. But I still don't get the height I want unless I put some more arm into it... which usually leads to me winging the ball wayyy over to my left (I'm right handed).

Everyone always tells me my toss is about 1 foot low.

 

[SinjinCooper]

Try lifting the lead toe.

Lower the straight tossing arm as you do so. This enables/encourages you to bend forward slightly at the waist, so that as you toss, you get a boost from the powerful hip and glute muscles without adding any superfluous motion to the arm or hand.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

Couple tips that have worked for me:
* start my tossing arm touching my leg (give you more runway to accelerate the arm)
* don't stop until my chin is on my shoulder... like you're forehand you want to accelerate your tossing arm through the release point (i used to stop shortly after i let go)
* practice practice practice.... for something as "trivial" as the toss, i've had to spend ALOT of time practicing to get the right spot consistently.... especially when i started adding: lower body load, core load, shoulder tilt, etc...

 

[Deleted member 23235]

Try lifting the lead toe.

Lower the straight tossing arm as you do so. This enables/encourages you to bend forward slightly at the waist, so that as you toss, you get a boost from the powerful hip and glute muscles without adding any superfluous motion to the arm or hand.

good point... forgot that connecting my hand to my leg... allows my hip movement to start the motion of my tossing arm.
fyi: i use pinpoint

 

[fuzz nation]

One approach I've recently been working on with a couple different students that's been helpful has been setting the racquet up in the trophy position before tossing the ball - this is instead of using the "both hands down together, up together" style of tossing. Lifting both arms together can sort of trick us into using more effort to lift the ball than necessary, so controlling the toss can be tougher like that.

I know that you're trying to get your toss a little higher, but I'm just offering this idea in case it helps with controlling the toss as you boost it up a little higher overhead.

When I had to rework my toss a few years ago, I experimented by starting with the elbow of my tossing arm bent instead of straight. As I lifted the ball to toss it, I could straighten my elbow so that I was effectively lifting the ball more through a straight vertical path instead of through an arc as with my elbow straight all the way up. I think my problem with the straight arm lift was that my wrist would get too "flippy" with the ball when trying to release it.

Lifting through more of a straight path (while straightening my elbow) made my toss a lot more accurate and consistent. If putting a little more height on your toss also makes it more unpredictable, don't be afraid to try your own experiments. My method might be helpful, but you might easily find your own style of holding the ball or lifting it to keep it under control. If something works for you, it's probably right.

 

[Stupendous1HBH]

don't bend your elbow too much. keep the tossing arm as straight as you can and release eye level will keep it more controlled. if you start bending the elbow halfway through, you'll find that you'll start tossing the ball too much behind you.

 

[PittsburghDad]

You're just going to have to do it and get out of your own head. Think about it. You definitely have the capacity to toss a ball where you want it. Toss the ball to a spot. Couple 1000 times and you will have it. Too many tips are bad news. Especially with the toss.

I'd also not practice serves and toss separate.

 

[sureshs]

Make sure to look up at where you expect the ball to be. That completes the feedback loop.

 

[Bobs tennis]

Try lifting the lead toe.

Do you mean your front foot big toe???

 

[SinjinCooper]

Do you mean your front foot big toe???

At least, but it's fine if you want to lift some of the smaller ones as well.

I mean, of course, the toe of the shoe.

(Lifting it -- Sampras/Berdych/etc style -- takes stress off the hamstring and facilitates bending forward at the waist.)

 

[Bobs tennis]

thanks-another good tip

 

[Fintft]

(Lifting it -- Sampras/Berdych/etc style -- takes stress off the hamstring and facilitates bending forward at the waist.)

I think that Federer also does the bending forward part, in order to get a higher toss...

 

[SinjinCooper]

I think that Federer also does the bending forward part, in order to get a higher toss...

He does, but somewhat differently. And not in a way I would coach someone to adopt if their expressed goal were to add height to the toss with minimal risk of anything else going awry.

 

[Fxanimator1]

Try lifting the lead toe.

Lower the straight tossing arm as you do so. This enables/encourages you to bend forward slightly at the waist, so that as you toss, you get a boost from the powerful hip and glute muscles without adding any superfluous motion to the arm or hand.

Good tip.
I Notice that many of your posts sound similar to the poster that used a Bill Murray in a tux avatar...know what I mean?

 

[Fintft]

He does, but somewhat differently. And not in a way I would coach someone to adopt if their expressed goal were to add height to the toss with minimal risk of anything else going awry.

I'll try your tip, b/c I have tried Roger's at times...

 

[kramer woodie]

Does anyone have any tips on tossing the ball higher while keeping it controlled?

On this forum I've learned to toss with my shoulder rather than with my arm. This really helped with the control and consistency. But I still don't get the height I want unless I put some more arm into it... which usually leads to me winging the ball wayyy over to my left (I'm right handed).

Everyone always tells me my toss is about 1 foot low.

kingp1ng

Good tips in the above posts. Today, had this same problem with a young girl. Showed her to toss 2-3 feet higher than she needed to and wait for
the ball to come down to the right height to then hit. Seemed to work well for her as she quickly found the correct toss height for her serve.

Try it, toss much higher than you need to. This will help you to accelerate the tossing arm from the shoulder, keep the toss arm up and eyes up,
wait for the ball to descend. By tossing too high, you'll be less timid about the ball toss.

When I showed this young girl, I would toss the ball 15-16 feet above the court. Then slowly lower the toss for the right height.

Aloha

P.S. I use the front hip pushing forward to start the toss because the hand is touching the
top of my leg.

 

[Todd Hicks]

Does anyone have any tips on tossing the ball higher while keeping it controlled?

On this forum I've learned to toss with my shoulder rather than with my arm. This really helped with the control and consistency. But I still don't get the height I want unless I put some more arm into it... which usually leads to me winging the ball wayyy over to my left (I'm right handed).

Everyone always tells me my toss is about 1 foot low.

Experiment with using your shoulder, your arm and your wrist to come up with what makes you most comfortable. I try to get my toss no more than a few feet above my head.

 

[PMChambers]

My toss was poor of late, probably lack playing. My solution was as about, straight arm to the point where it's nearly locked out. The second thing was really slow toss and using Salzenstein Arm The Enemy concept to get room and timing on the serve. Surprising how just a little straighter arm and good first move helps.
Note I use a big unit turn, not to Sampras level but bigger than most hacks so do need decent toss. I can easily chase a bad ball. "Sorry Mate" ©Rafter.

 

[kingp1ng]

Thanks guys. 3 things I'll try to implement this week:

1) Do a slight rock of my hips/glutes and lift my lead toe.

2) Start my arm motion at my thigh to get more runway distance.

3) Toss the ball much higher than necessary and actually watch the ball.

 

[kingp1ng]

Try lifting the lead toe.

Lower the straight tossing arm as you do so. This enables/encourages you to bend forward slightly at the waist, so that as you toss, you get a boost from the powerful hip and glute muscles without adding any superfluous motion to the arm or hand.

Couple tips that have worked for me:
* start my tossing arm touching my leg (give you more runway to accelerate the arm)
* don't stop until my chin is on my shoulder... like you're forehand you want to accelerate your tossing arm through the release point (i used to stop shortly after i let go)
* practice practice practice.... for something as "trivial" as the toss, i've had to spend ALOT of time practicing to get the right spot consistently.... especially when i started adding: lower body load, core load, shoulder tilt, etc...

An update on my practices on Friday and Sat:

• I immediately got results from starting my arm motion at my thigh. Probably got 4-6 inches more height within two days.
  
• Got some results from lowering my arm down and rocking up with my hip/glutes like the pros do. I would occasionally screw up my trophy position timing. I'm used to tossing the ball while keeping my lower body static since that's how I was taught initially as a kid. Will try to loosen up and practice the motion. Honestly, it might take months take months to fully implement this.
  
• Lifting my toe was hard to implement since my lead foot wasn't used to it. My lead foot REALLY likes to stay planted and consciously lifting it feels like being stuck in mud

 

[Deleted member 23235]

An update on my practices on Friday and Sat:

• I immediately got results from starting my arm motion at my thigh. Probably got 4-6 inches more height within two days.
  
• Got some results from lowering my arm down and rocking up with my hip/glutes like the pros do. I would occasionally screw up my trophy position timing. I'm used to tossing the ball while keeping my lower body static since that's how I was taught initially as a kid. Will try to loosen up and practice the motion. Honestly, it might take months take months to fully implement this.
  
• Lifting my toe was hard to implement since my lead foot wasn't used to it. My lead foot REALLY likes to stay planted and consciously lifting it feels like being stuck in mud

when you lift your toe, your weight is on the back foot (and slightly bent at the waist)

when you xfer your weight to the front foot, that's when you, start your toss, using you hip as an "assist" when you unbend.

don't forget to continue reaching with your tossing arm well past your release point. i like to touch my chin to my shoulder as a marker that i'm extending fully.

 

[SinjinCooper]

An update on my practices on Friday and Sat:

• I immediately got results from starting my arm motion at my thigh. Probably got 4-6 inches more height within two days.
  
• Got some results from lowering my arm down and rocking up with my hip/glutes like the pros do. I would occasionally screw up my trophy position timing. I'm used to tossing the ball while keeping my lower body static since that's how I was taught initially as a kid. Will try to loosen up and practice the motion. Honestly, it might take months take months to fully implement this.
  
• Lifting my toe was hard to implement since my lead foot wasn't used to it. My lead foot REALLY likes to stay planted and consciously lifting it feels like being stuck in mud

Is 4-6 inches enough?

If not, and if you're still finding yourself pressed for time, you might find greater success doing something to speed up/streamline the service motion. Or maybe preloading the serving arm Todd Martin style.

 

[kingp1ng]

Is 4-6 inches enough?

If not, and if you're still finding yourself pressed for time, you might find greater success doing something to speed up/streamline the service motion. Or maybe preloading the serving arm Todd Martin style.

I meant I got 4-6 inches more height added to my current toss. I was just replying to how easily I gained height on my toss from one tip. Heck with more practice I might be able to get 8 inches on added on.

 

[Fintft]

don't forget to continue reaching with your tossing arm well past your release point. i like to touch my chin to my shoulder as a marker that i'm extending fully.

The only way for me to properly achieve this is to:

1. Lead with a locked elbow (something that the head coach at my club had told me years and I keep forgetting and re-discovering like tonight)

Some other things that help:

1. Toss into the swing, as opposed to swing into the toss. Anyhow don't stop your racquet arm, at least until it gets into the trophy....A delayed racquet arm makes things more difficult and injury prone.
2. Coil/turn like Sampras/show your belly to the sun
3. Elbow someone behind you

 

[Deleted member 23235]

The only way for me to properly achieve this is to:

1. Lead with a locked elbow (something that the head coach at my club had told me years and I keep forgetting and re-discovering like tonight)

Some other things that help:

1. Toss into the swing, as opposed to swing into the toss. Anyhow don't stop your racquet arm, at least until it gets into the trophy....A delayed racquet arm makes things more difficult and injury prone.
2. Coil/turn like Sampras/show your belly to the sun
3. Elbow someone behind you

the toss into the swing tip is misleading... i've said that to some folks and they want to start their swing before they finished/started their toss... when the tip is just saying, don't chase your toss.

 

[Fintft]

the toss into the swing tip is misleading... i've said that to some folks and they want to start their swing before they finished/started their toss... when the tip is just saying, don't chase your toss.

I think that the tip is rather saying (again):
Anyhow don't stop your racquet arm, at least until it gets into the trophy....A delayed racquet arm makes things more difficult and injury prone.

 

[mnttlrg]

OP: Lots of great servers have a fairly low toss, even at the pro level.

I don't think it's such a problem to toss with your arm as long as your arm is straight. Bent arms create more variance in the level of power you will get.

However, it sounds like maybe also struggle with what my buddy does, where you get excited about the prospect of blasting a big serve, and you launch a mega toss out of that energized state. Sometimes it helps just to try tossing during a slightly different point in the serve motion, and you might find a different level of power feels consistent / natural to you.