Tardigrade
Banned
Lemme guess, you believe he'd beat Fed at Wimbledon and Nadal at RG at their "best".
No, of course not. Just because I believe Djokovic to be better than both Federer and Nadal doesn't mean I think he would be able to beat Federer and Nadal at their best in their strongest slams. In truth, I think the only player who can't be beaten at his absolute best is Nadal at the French Open. Djokovic however would have his chances against Federer at Wimbledon, and would be able to push Nadal harder at the FO than any other player from this era, the only player I would give a better chance to beat Nadal at his best at the FO would be Kuerten (doesn't mean to say I think Kuerten would win either). As for you comment on Safin, I think he's another guy who I think would be able to push Nadal at the FO (Again, please read this clearly - I don't think he would win) just because he never choked in big matches - He didn't care enough to choke, he atleast beat Kuerten at the FO when he was the defending champion.
This whole peak v's peak and 'best' v's 'best' or 'prime v's non prime' thing has circled out of control like some frikkin' plague man. We are talking about matchups which constitute of three players who have amassed 42 slams. Surely they would have chances against each other??? Even Federer has had his chances with Nadal at the FO, I can't even count the amount of matches where he could have won (not should).
It is my opinion though, that Djokovic at his best is clearly leagues above Nadal at his best on hardcourts. I also think Djokovic is a better hard court player than Federer as well. People forget that Djokovic made his first HC slam final at 19 and was winning hard court MS titles at this age, when he was 20 he had a hard court slam under his belt, as well as a few MS titles and a WTF too. How old was Nadal when he made his first HC slam. How old was Nadal when he won his first WTF? The only reason Nadal dominates Djokovic in the slam h2h is because Nadal was never good enough to play Djokovic at the AO. Where as Djokovic was good enough to reach countless semi finals at the FO.
The main reason I think Djokovic is the best player is because he seems to be on course for pretty much all records I expect the greatest player of all time to achieve.
- Slam record
- MS record
- domination at a single slam
- winning all 4 slams at least once (could achieve all four this year but FO is the main focus)
- winning h2h over all top players
- DC/OG wins (could very well win OG this year)
- WTF record
- Beating Nadal at the FO
Reasons why he might not be the GOAT even with these things: His poor 2009/2010 seasons were at times shocking. But even Nadal and Federer have things against them; Nadal outside FO isn't quite the force Federer and Djokovic have been in the slams as a whole, and has taken some serious beatdowns even in years some say have been his best years (aside from 2010 when he was truly unstoppable). He lost 3-2-2 to Tsonga and 2-2-2 to JMDP. 4-2-3 to Gonzo. Federer remains top in terms of achievements but has had some severe luck - couldn't have played a worse Safin at AO 2004, rain delay at W04 and dodged bullets with the scheduling at W07.
Yes, he has some way to go, but the way he is going at the moment, I wouldn't put it past him. Some people might knock me for my last GOAT aspect, because beating Nadal at the FO is not on everyone's GOAT candidate list. But it is for me; Beating Nadal at the FO is the biggest challenge in tennis, even if Nadal was playing poor. Nadal is so amazing on clay, that him playing bad tennis normally sees him beat the top opposition in three sets (in a bo3 format) or 4/5 sets in a best of five match. A lot of people seem to think that Nadal would have lost to Wawrinka in last years final and even Federer, but aside from one win from Wawrinka - which he won in the final set tiebreak against Nadal last year on clay, he has shown absolutely no evidence that he would be able to beat Nadal at the French Open. The only reason Soderling managed to beat Nadal at 2009 was not to do with injury like loads of people say (Nadal was moving fine), it was more to do with the fact the FO in 2009 was not playing like a clay court - most people with a brain knew the FO in 09 was playing like a pretty fast hard court. I'm also pretty sure the FO 2009 was playing faster than Wimbledon.
Like I've said, peak Nadal and Federer would be favourites against peak Djokovic at the FO and Wimbledon respectively. Djokovic would be favourite against Nadal at AO, Wimbledon and US peak for peak. Djokovic would be favourite against Federer at AO and US, pretty much tied at the FO and Federer for Wimbledon. I actually rate Djokovic as a better CC player than Federer because of his ability to beat Nadal way more times on clay than anyone in the history of the game, as well as a win against him at the FO, as well as being the only guy to have pushed Nadal at previous FO's, I remember FO 2013 he battled him pretty hard. Federer has never taken Nadal to a fifth set at the FO.
So please, continue submitting BS statements. Just because I think Djokovic is the best player doesn't mean I think he would take both of them at their best, on their best surfaces. If I thought Nadal was the best, it doesn't mean I think Nadal at his best would be able to beat Djokovic at the AO or Wimbledon - his most successful slams (although I think Djokovic is a better CC player than GC - Nadal has just been too sick). End of this discussion, I feel Djokovic, Federer and Nadal are supreme forces in tennis, I think they would have chances against each other at their very best.
There is no such thing as the 'greatest coach of all time'. It's completely dependant on the player you are training. It's like saying Mayweather Sr is the greatest boxing coach of all time because he trained his son (who coincidentally, probably is the best boxer of all time). Some of the most raved about coaches in the game make mistakes, even Bollitieri rejected Safin because he felt Marat was lacking in pure talent. If Toni actually worked with multiple players then perhaps we could talk, but it could just be a case of having the right player at the right time.
He just went in and disturbed the hornet's nest. Bad idea. Please do it. Please irritate and rile Nole up as much as you can. I welcome it.
