Top 10 female players of all time

[NadalAgassi]

Here are my 10 greatest female players of all time:

1. Margaret Court
2. Chris Evert
3. Martina Navratilova
4. Steffi Graf
5. Suzanne Lenglen
6. Maureen Connolly
7. Helen Wills Moody
8. Serena Williams
9. Billie Jean King
10. Monica Seles
11. Maria Bueno
12. Justine Henin
13. Evonne Goolagong
14. Alice Marble
15. Althea Gibson

 

[TMF]

Graf should be right at the top along with Martina. Are you insane?

I do agree a non-stab Seles would have won more slams or a better career, but we can't judge greatness base on "if", "woulda" or "shoulda".

 

[NadalAgassi]

Best is not neccessarily most accomplished. Despite what Graf fanboys like Mustard or Joe Pike might think Graf's greatness is a fraud. I dont mean just because of the Seles stabbing. She dominated for years against 30 something women like Martina and Chris, wannabee contenders like Sanchez Vicario, Sabatini, and Shriver, or extremely young girls like Hingis (pre dominance) and Seles (pre dominance).

Break down the years of most of her sucess:

1987-1990: 30 somethings Martina and Chris, Sabatini, Shriver, Sukova, Seles and Sanchez aged 14-17.

1993-1996: other than Seles in 96, you otherwise had Sanchez, Martinez, Novotna, Pierce, washed up Sabatini, and nearly retired Navratilova.

During years she had real competition like 1991, 1992, 1997, 1998, and 1999 she won between 0-1 slams per year, and struggled to regularly reach finals.


Davenport, Serena, and Venus showed how helpless Graf could be against real power in 1999, and except for Davenport they werent even close to her best yet. Seles and Pierce also showed how helpless Graf could be against real power in the early to mid 90s.

 

[dannykl]

top 10 from 1950

1. Steffi Graf

2. Court

3. Evert

4. Navratilova

5. King

6. Serena

7. Seles

8. Henin

9. Goolagong

10. Venus

 

[OrangeOne]

Graf should be right at the top along with Martina. Are you

....a troll. That's what you should have asked, and then left.

Anyone leaving Graf out of a top 10 is clearly either insane or a troll, and doing it for the (*******ed) kicks.

 

[NadalAgassi]

This is Graf when facing power.

Graf vs Pierce: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyidS1Mwf6E
Graf vs Seles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvyEnVCEl9A
Graf vs Venus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROgpYkEXRIA
Graf vs Serena: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJE4vCj155o
Graf vs Davenport: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_bZ_ipvcGw


Yes when she faced moonballs she looked awesome, Graf vs Sanchez Vicario: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivonLkOwKwc

Which luckily for her was all she faced the majority of her career along with old ladies, little girls, or talented mental midgets like Sabatini.

 

[dlk]

Mine, my lifetime:
Navratilova
Graf
Evert
King
S. Williams
V. Williams
Goolagong
Henin
Seles
Kournikova (you know why)

 

[Joe Pike]

This is Graf when facing power.

Graf vs Pierce: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyidS1Mwf6E
Graf vs Seles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvyEnVCEl9A
Graf vs Venus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROgpYkEXRIA
Graf vs Serena: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJE4vCj155o
Graf vs Davenport: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_bZ_ipvcGw

...

Yes, that's why all these players have a winning H2H record against Steffi.

Oh, wait ...

 

[NadalAgassi]

Yes, that's why all these players have a winning H2H record against Steffi.

Oh, wait ...

Watch the clips then comment, thanks.

 

[You Can't Be Serious]

Mine, my lifetime:
Navratilova
Graf
Evert
King
S. Williams
V. Williams
Goolagong
Henin
Seles
Kournikova (you know why)

1-Navratilova
2-Graf
3-Serena Williams
4-King
5-Evert
6-Venus Williams
7-Court
8-Seles
9-Henin
10-Goolagong

Sorry---Kirilenko over Kournikova

 

[Joe Pike]

1-Navratilova
2-Graf
3-Serena Williams
4-King
5-Evert
6-Venus Williams
7-Court
...

Do you paint your face red, white and blue all day?
And a lot of black here and there ... ?

Racism and xenophobia at it's worst ...

 

[li0scc0]

My top 2

1. Navratilova - I only have her ahead of Graf due to her longevity and DOUBLES/MIXED career. For pure singles, it is clearly Graf
2. Graf - greatest singles player ever

 

[Steffi-forever]

In your first thread :

I dont mean to diminish Graf who is a truly great player, maybe the greatest ever

Here's some head-to-heads of Seles:

& Graf: 5-10
& old Navratilova: 10-7
& Novotna: 4-4
& Hingis: 5-15
& Davenport: 3-10
& V.Williams: 1-9
& S.Williams: 1-4

 

[Steffi-forever]

My top 10:

1. Graf
2. Court
3. Navratilova
4. Wills Moody
5. Evert
6. Lenglen
7. Connolly
8. S.Williams
9. King
10. Seles

 

[hoodjem]

1. Graf
2. Navratilova
3. Court
4. Connolly
5. Evert
6. Lenglen
7. Wills Moody
8. King
9. Hingis
10. Williams

 

[BTURNER]

This is only Singles
1. Graf 2 Court, 3 Wills, 4 Navratilova 5 Evert 6 Lenglen 7. Connolly 8 Serena 9. King 10 Henin

If we leave off Lenglen and Wills because they are too hard to rank, I'd add Seles and Bueno at the bottom. You could move any of those top 7 names around and justify it with some legitimacy.

 

[NadalAgassi]

How can anyone rank Steffi Graf at #1. What a joke. She doesnt hold the most title at any of the 4 Grand Slams or the most overall slams or the most overall tournaments. She didnt spend the most time at #1 taking into account the players who played before the ranking system was introduced. She isnt even the best player of any decade, 80s she doesnt come close since she was only a noteable player half the decade or less, and 90s it is Seles. Even with weak competition she couldnt dominate for long enough to set any historical marks.

And she doesnt have the greatest dominance, best consistency, best longevity, toughest competition, best rivalry, or best overall game either.

 

[abmk]

has anyone else realised nadalagassi is yet another avatar of thalivest/davey25/julesb/annointedone/grafselesfan/federerfanatic/capriatifanatic, .................zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[TMF]

has anyone else realised nadalagassi is yet another avatar of thalivest/davey25/julesb/annointedone/grafselesfan/federerfanatic/capriatifanatic, .................zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

The previous IDs was Trillus, I think.

 

[abmk]

yeah, that was the latest one that got banned

 

[BTURNER]

I really don't care who I am posting to or how many other IDs he has. I reply to ideas in the post.

 

[Polaris]

has anyone else realised nadalagassi is yet another avatar of thalivest/davey25/julesb/annointedone/grafselesfan/federerfanatic/capriatifanatic, .................zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

You beat me to it. More than 100 posts in less than a month, and already knows the favorite players of people on this board. He is a dead ringer for Trillus/davey25/.....

I really don't care who I am posting to or how many other IDs he has. I reply to ideas in the post.

I don't know: I don't have time for fake-identity tricksters. It is not like his ideas are new. He has the same ideas over and over and over again. It is just that he changes favorites like he changes clothes, and then applies the same perverted logic to different players. If you have the time and patience to reply to his bajillion posts, be my guest.

 

[abmk]

You beat me to it. More than 100 posts in less than a month, and already knows the favorite players of people on this board. He is a dead ringer for Trillus/davey25/.....

I recognised it from the writing style

I don't know: I don't have time for fake-identity tricksters. It is not like his ideas are new. He has the same ideas over and over and over again. It is just that he changes favorites like he changes clothes, and then applies the same perverted logic to different players. If you have the time and patience to reply to his bajillion posts, be my guest.

+1

 

[Limpinhitter]

You beat me to it. More than 100 posts in less than a month, and already knows the favorite players of people on this board. He is a dead ringer for Trillus/davey25/.....


I don't know: I don't have time for fake-identity tricksters. It is not like his ideas are new. He has the same ideas over and over and over again. It is just that he changes favorites like he changes clothes, and then applies the same perverted logic to different players. If you have the time and patience to reply to his bajillion posts, be my guest.

I thought Davey25 was a "her."

 

[TMF]

I recognised it from the writing style



+1

Yeah, and the words he normally use(i.e. lapdog).

 

[TMF]

I thought Davey25 was a "her."

You are not around long enough to know what's going on. Learn more from experience/knowledgeable members(including me) in here.

 

[Limpinhitter]

You are not around long enough to know what's going on. Learn more from experience/knowledgeable members(including me) in here.

I was around before Davey25 was banned, and I recall him/her/it being referred to as a her.

 

[Azzurri]

Best is not neccessarily most accomplished. Despite what Graf fanboys like Mustard or Joe Pike might think Graf's greatness is a fraud. I dont mean just because of the Seles stabbing. She dominated for years against 30 something women like Martina and Chris, wannabee contenders like Sanchez Vicario, Sabatini, and Shriver, or extremely young girls like Hingis (pre dominance) and Seles (pre dominance).

Break down the years of most of her sucess:

1987-1990: 30 somethings Martina and Chris, Sabatini, Shriver, Sukova, Seles and Sanchez aged 14-17.

1993-1996: other than Seles in 96, you otherwise had Sanchez, Martinez, Novotna, Pierce, washed up Sabatini, and nearly retired Navratilova.

During years she had real competition like 1991, 1992, 1997, 1998, and 1999 she won between 0-1 slams per year, and struggled to regularly reach finals.


Davenport, Serena, and Venus showed how helpless Graf could be against real power in 1999, and except for Davenport they werent even close to her best yet. Seles and Pierce also showed how helpless Graf could be against real power in the early to mid 90s.

Graf a fraud? she won 22 slams, this is a fraud?? you are one extremely clueless tool. this entire thread should be nuked. its a shame posters like you pollute the forums. Graf WAS power before the beefy girls came, she had the greatest FH in women's tennis and it had POWER.

 

[You Can't Be Serious]

yeah, that was the latest one that got banned

How about best ever using wood rackets. That would change the playing field. McEnroe said at the twilight of his career that he couldn't see himself beating the bigger and stronger players because of the rackets. If they used wood rackets, I'd move King into No. 1.

 

[Joe Pike]

How about best ever using wood rackets. That would change the playing field. McEnroe said at the twilight of his career that he couldn't see himself beating the bigger and stronger players because of the rackets. If they used wood rackets, I'd move King into No. 1.

No, with wood racquets Steffi's advantage would have been even bigger.

 

[You Can't Be Serious]

No, with wood racquets Steffi's advantage would have been even bigger.

I disagree--not to say Graf would not finish No. 1 since this is all a matter of opinion.

It might hurt the stronger athletes who can't just bang away from the baseline.

 

[BTURNER]

I don't know: I don't have time for fake-identity tricksters. It is not like his ideas are new. He has the same ideas over and over and over again. It is just that he changes favorites like he changes clothes, and then applies the same perverted logic to different players. If you have the time and patience to reply to his bajillion posts, be my guest.[/QUOTE]

See Polaris, If I don't want to reply to a post, I don't. If the ideas aren't new to me or interesting, I don't reply either. Neither depends on knowing which id's are real or fake. Neither requires I waste time trying to ascertain an ID or analyze style or opinions for patterns.

 

[Wuornos]

Just my personal opinion but my top 10 post WWII currently stands at:

1 Martina Navratilova 2809
2 Steffi Graf 2806
3 Monica Seles 2805
4 Margaret Smith Court 2797
5 Chris Evert 2790
6 Serena Williams 2785
7 Maureen Connolly 2779
8 Venus Williams 2770
9 Billie Jean King 2768
10 Martina Hingis 2763

Tim

 

[Polaris]

See Polaris, If I don't want to reply to a post, I don't. If the ideas aren't new to me or interesting, I don't reply either. Neither depends on knowing which id's are real or fake.

Well, to each his own. I can see your point of view. It's still quite strange to me though. Here is this guy taking you for a ride, and you are willingly participating in his game. My feeling is that if more people just called him out and didn't participate, then he would not indulge in this tomfoolery. However, he always finds a few willing suckers.

 

[Game-Set-MATCH!!!]

Here are my 10 greatest female players of all time:

1. Martina Navratilova
2. Chris Evert
3. Margaret Court
4. Maureen Connolly
5. Monica Seles (would be #1 without the stabbing)
6. Serena Williams
7. Suzanna Lenglen
8. Helen Wills Moody
9. Justine Henin
10. Venus Williams

Honorable mentions- Billie Jean King, Steffi Graf, Evonne Goolagong

my top ten (this is soley MY OPNION)



1. Serena Williams- amazing player with all-court game
2. Monica Seles - my coach coached her back in the day
3. Chris Evert- Evert Tennis Academy owner/ president
4. Margaret Court- so good shes has a big *** case for her trophies
5. Venus Williams- playes lik Serena but a little inconsistent for top 3
6. Justine Henin- does have much gas left in the gas tank
7. Helen Wills Moody- unknow and unheard of except if ya cool
8. Billie Jean King -greatest player of all time just forgot to put her for #1
9. Suzanna Lenlen- has a tennis court at Wimbledon named after her!
10. IDK

 

[maxplymac]

1 Navratilova
2 Graf
3 Evert
4 Connolly
5 Serena
6 Lenglen
7 BJK
8 Henin
9 Court
10 Wills Moody

(11) Seles
(12) Goolagong
(13) Hingis

ok ok ok ok

 

[BTURNER]

Well, to each his own. I can see your point of view. It's still quite strange to me though. Here is this guy taking you for a ride, and you are willingly participating in his game. My feeling is that if more people just called him out and didn't participate, then he would not indulge in this tomfoolery. However, he always finds a few willing suckers.

I do not doubt your sincerity or passion but in that case, I'd be letting YOU take me for a ride and participating in your game My feeling is that if more people did not participate, you would not indulge in your tomfoolery and just talk about the tennis rather than guessing 'who is who' and other cloak and dagger games. We dispute who the 'willing suckers' really are.

 

[jrepac]

1 Navratilova
2 Graf
3 Evert
4 Connolly
5 Serena
6 Lenglen
7 BJK
8 Henin
9 Court
10 Wills Moody

(11) Seles
(12) Goolagong
(13) Hingis

ok ok ok ok

those are my top 3 as well and on a given day I still might nudge Chris ahead of Steffi...but hard to fathom how Steffi is not in the Top 3 (or even top 5) of any list. The "problem" with the original post is that there IS a grain of truth to it, but it is rather exaggerated/distorted. Sure, you can argue that the competition is sub par (as some have said about Martina and Chris's) years of dominance. But, you really cannot take the greatness of the win away from the winner...I've said the same about Capriati..overall a very subpar career but with 3/4 very significant wins (3 GS + Olympics over Steffi). Monica, sadly, we never got to really find out what she could've done. She clearly had problems that were more than just physical, but I do think she was a very tough competitor for Steffi to face down, regardless of the final record.

Steffi did have a great forehand and hit it extremely hard, but I don't consider her a power player the way a Davenport or Serena is/was; even Capriati for that matter. Steffi had an all-court game, by my standard and could really mix it up. In regards to Martina and Chris, there are a few examples where Chris really gave her a tussle from the backcourt (despite the age difference) and Martina, with all engines firing, could really take it to her; very hard to stop MN when her S&V game was rolling, I don't care who you are. It would take a Davenport-type A game to really blow Steffi off the court, and its not that easy to produce.

 

[Limpinhitter]

How about best ever using wood rackets. That would change the playing field. McEnroe said at the twilight of his career that he couldn't see himself beating the bigger and stronger players because of the rackets. If they used wood rackets, I'd move King into No. 1.

I'd have Margaret Court, Chris Evert and Martina Navratilova ahead of King with wood racquets.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibU2lMdD2cw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj3j4QXJwoc&NR=1

PS: Looks like Martina hit harder slice-drive backhands with a wood racquet than Federer or Ralph hit today.

 

[BTURNER]

Martina's backhand slice is definitely undervalued on this forum. Consistent enough to make it to all those RG finals despite the entire draw picking on it year after year to avoid the forehand, but positively offensive on grass.

 

[hoodjem]

has anyone else realised nadalagassi is yet another avatar of thalivest/davey25/julesb/annointedone/grafselesfan/federerfanatic/capriatifanatic, .................zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Yep. This explains why all those Selestards are all alike--they are the same person.

 

[You Can't Be Serious]

I'd have Margaret Court, Chris Evert and Martina Navratilova ahead of King with wood racquets.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibU2lMdD2cw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj3j4QXJwoc&NR=1

PS: Looks like Martina hit harder slice-drive backhands with a wood racquet than Federer or Ralph hit today.

I like your suggestion--perhaps you've seen them play more or watched tapes--anyhow--do you have a reason for that based on an aspect of their game? Would like to know

thanks

 

[Limpinhitter]

I like your suggestion--perhaps you've seen them play more or watched tapes--anyhow--do you have a reason for that based on an aspect of their game? Would like to know

thanks

The greatest wood racquet players part, or, the slice backhand part?

 

[You Can't Be Serious]

The greatest wood racquet players part, or, the slice backhand part?

Slice backhand---watching the videos you notice how many balls landed well inside the baseline yet nobody was able to put those balls away unlike today. It obviously has nothing to do with natural athletic ability since we know King, Navratilova and Court were athletes.

That's why it's hard to compare yesterday and today, We might be able to judge athletic ability but equipment made such a difference.

I don't want to slight Evert in regards to athletic ability but someone I know who was a Top 20 player in women's tennis told me a story how they would play big up games in various sports (softball and basketball) after their matches at the Orange Bowl.

Each time they picked sides Evert was always the last one chosen. However, as we know, she beat all of them on the tennis court which frustrated the others to no end.

 

[You Can't Be Serious]

And how would Maureen Connolly stack up against Navratilova ? I remember some guy put together a computer program of Ali fightining another boxer from another time period. It might have been Ali vs. rocky Graziano. I thought Ali won according to his computer program.

 

[maxplymac]

Connolly vs Hingis is my all-time dream match. Would be a beauty.

 

[Limpinhitter]

And how would Maureen Connolly stack up against Navratilova ? I remember some guy put together a computer program of Ali fightining another boxer from another time period. It might have been Ali vs. rocky Graziano. I thought Ali won according to his computer program.

Rocky Graziano was a middleweight whose major rival was Tony Zale. You're thinking of Rocky Marciano, pound for pound, one of the greatest boxers of all time. Marciano won the computer bout. In the real world, for most of his career, Ali had bad hands and typically landed slapping punches for points knowing he could keep his distance and not get hurt by opponents. One exception was when Ali came of the ropes to nail George Foreman with one big right hand. I think more likely than not, Marciano, being the toughest fighter in heavyweight history (except for Joe Frazer), and being always in brutally good shape, and having one punch knockout power in both hands, would get to Ali before the end of the fight. That's the way the computer had it.

Moureen Connolly's game, and mental toughness, were very much like Evert's. I think Navratilova's game and athleticism would prevail against Connolly on grass and fast hard courts, and that Connolly would be too steady, and her passing shots too good, for Navratilova on clay.

 

[Raiden]

Best is not neccessarily most accomplished. Despite what Graf fanboys like Mustard or Joe Pike might think Graf's greatness is a fraud. I dont mean just because of the Seles stabbing. She dominated for years against 30 something women like Martina and Chris, wannabee contenders like Sanchez Vicario, Sabatini, and Shriver, or extremely young girls like Hingis (pre dominance) and Seles (pre dominance).

Break down the years of most of her sucess:

1987-1990: 30 somethings Martina and Chris, Sabatini, Shriver, Sukova, Seles and Sanchez aged 14-17.

1993-1996: other than Seles in 96, you otherwise had Sanchez, Martinez, Novotna, Pierce, washed up Sabatini, and nearly retired Navratilova.

If any of them are better than Steffi then how come that NONE of those players own Steffi in their H2H? :lol:

All those 'superior' players keep getting their asses handed to them LOL

 

[Raiden]

This is Graf when facing power.

Graf vs Pierce: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyidS1Mwf6E
Graf vs Seles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvyEnVCEl9A
Graf vs Venus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROgpYkEXRIA
Graf vs Serena: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJE4vCj155o
Graf vs Davenport: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_bZ_ipvcGw

Haha! Hail all those "powerful" pidgeons of Steffi :lol:

NadalAgassi a.k.a Davy25, however time you try you will be reminded that Steffi owned each and every one of them, yes including even your dearly beloved Serena (Steffi leads 2-1 incl. that one non-wta match)

 

[Raiden]

During years she had real competition like 1991, 1992, 1997, 1998, and 1999 she won between 0-1 slams per year, and struggled to regularly reach finals.

Oh how lovely! So only when Steffi is undergoing some physical or other ordeal and scavengers arrive on the scene that's when there was "real competition" :lol:

Keep'm coming Davey25