Toss too far in front for kick serve?

[EddieBrock]

If you're pushing off and jumping into the serve how can you tell if the toss is too far in front or if the height is too high or low? I noticed that when I'm just warming up and getting a feel for the brushing motion I can hit my serve a lot more consistently than when I'm in the match and trying to put something on it.

I figured out that my toss was in front so when I'm nervous and don't use my legs correctly to go up I was dragging my right foot past the baseline and leaning forward to just try and reach the ball, causing me to drop my body and hit the ball in the net.

Other times what I think is happening is the ball is so far in front I can't get the right part of the brush and finish, which is why I've been missing my kick serve long so often recently.

You can see here he tosses pretty far into the court and is able to still get a lot of kick. I've heard people say to toss directly on top of your head, which would be barely in front of the baseline and it doesn't seem like you'd be able to get much on it. Is there a visual I can use while serving to realize I shouldn't hit the toss because it's too far in front?

 

[Chadillac]

There isnt a wrong way. Just depends what your trying to hit. A toss more in front with run upon bounce where a toss behind will make it bounce higher.

Do you want penetration or height?

For 2nd serve's, you want a bit of height for net clearence, so not in front.

 

[EddieBrock]

There isnt a wrong way. Just depends what your trying to hit. A toss more in front with run upon bounce where a toss behind will make it bounce higher.

Do you want penetration or height?

For 2nd serve's, you want a bit of height for net clearence, so not in front.

I'd prefer height and safety. I'm double faulting again and was thinking maybe my toss is why. I also don't want a weak 2nd serve.

 

[Curious]

Are you swinging the racket as fast on the second serve as on the first or slow it down a bit to not miss it?

 

[EddieBrock]

Are you swinging the racket as fast on the second serve as on the first or slow it down a bit to not miss it?

I'm trying to swing fast and am hitting the serve hard, but am afraid I'm hitting it too forward and not finishing to the side enough

 

[Curious]

I'm trying to swing fast and am hitting the serve hard, but am afraid I'm hitting it too forward and not finishing to the side enough

Trial and error should fix it.

 

[EddieBrock]

Trial and error should fix it.

Is there something where I can tell when I'm going up to hit the ball that it's too far in front? Like if I start having to drop my head/arm and lean forward does that mean it's too far? Should I make sure to let the ball drop a bit also? Seems like sometimes I'm overextended as well

 

[LeeD]

Is there something where I can tell when I'm going up to hit the ball that it's too far in front? Like if I start having to drop my head/arm and lean forward does that mean it's too far? Should I make sure to let the ball drop a bit also? Seems like sometimes I'm overextended as well

 

[LeeD]

Net clearance tells you where you should have tosses the ball.

 

[EddieBrock]

Net clearance tells you where you should have tosses the ball.

How? My concern is I'm hitting the ball too square on like for a flat serve instead of brushing up on it because I can't reach it.

 

[heninfan99]

Net clearance tells you where you should have tosses the ball.

yer back

 

[Kevo]

Is there something where I can tell when I'm going up to hit the ball that it's too far in front? Like if I start having to drop my head/arm and lean forward does that mean it's too far? Should I make sure to let the ball drop a bit also? Seems like sometimes I'm overextended as well

This comes down to learning a proper swing path and tossing the ball into the right spot for that swing. After you learn the proper swing then it's simply a lot of practice. IMO, you always want to start with what you should look like at contact and work back from there. If you're not sure of the swing path and proper contact spot then you can't be sure where to toss. If you aren't sure where to toss, then you won't have a good serve.

So first, figure out where contact should happen and what your racquet should look like at contact. Then practice tossing until you can put the ball there every time. The toss is absolutely the most important part of the serve. Once you have those two things down, just practice the swing path at a speed which you can execute reliably and then do it over and over again until it's reliable and consistent. Then add a little more speed, rinse and repeat.

Also, the toss is the most important thing. (Can't be said enough IMO). If your toss is not consistent then your serve practice won't be either. And practicing an inconsistent serve will just make you an inconsistent server. It all starts with a good toss.

A good instructor can help you a lot with the serve in one lesson if you are a good student. So it might be worth spending $50ish to get everything clear in your mind so you don't waste a lot of time and effort trying to figure it out on your own. You can do it from videos and pictures though if you are motivated and observant.

 

[Gazelle]

Net clearance tells you where you should have tosses the ball.

LeeD! Alive!

 

[Hmgraphite1]

Is there something where I can tell when I'm going up to hit the ball that it's too far in front? Like if I start having to drop my head/arm and lean forward does that mean it's too far? Should I make sure to let the ball drop a bit also? Seems like sometimes I'm overextended as well

So once you're full loaded and ready to drive up you should be looking up watch goffin how he lays his head sideways

Also look how Karlovic doesn't throw way into court

 

[dct693]

You have to toss to where the contact point will be, given how your body will move under it. If you lean into the court, you'll need to toss more into the court. If you're just warming up, you won't toss quite as far in front. It's a "feel" thing. And the contact point can be off by an inch or two and the serve can still be effective.

For me, when I'm trying to be very aggressive on the second serve, sometimes I don't lean back enough and point my chest to the sky. Other times I don't toss the ball to the left enough. All these mistakes end up with a serve that slices more than it kicks.

Have someone video you and examine the serves that don't kick compared to those that do.

 

[Chas Tennis]

Use high speed video to compare your serve to a high level kick serve of ATP players. Use the same camera angles and a very fast shutter for small motion blur = shoot in bright sunlight.

The racket for a kick serve rises more during impact than a slice or flat serve - it is a clear signature. Google search my posts:Toly gif kick slice Chas The forearm to racket angle at impact is smaller for a kick serve than for a slice or flat serve. This rapidly changing angle during impact gives the rise necessary for the top spin of the kick serve.

Note that the racket is probably tilted at 15 d. or so closed just before touching the ball. See Rod Cross book Technical Tennis.

 

[Jens Gabler]

Just toss a little bit in front. And never ever behind you. If you hit the ball behind your head (we define "behind" by saying the net is in front) then you tossed badly.
Other than that there is not too much that you can do wrong honestly.

 

[EddieBrock]

You have to toss to where the contact point will be, given how your body will move under it. If you lean into the court, you'll need to toss more into the court. If you're just warming up, you won't toss quite as far in front. It's a "feel" thing. And the contact point can be off by an inch or two and the serve can still be effective.

For me, when I'm trying to be very aggressive on the second serve, sometimes I don't lean back enough and point my chest to the sky. Other times I don't toss the ball to the left enough. All these mistakes end up with a serve that slices more than it kicks.

Have someone video you and examine the serves that don't kick compared to those that do.

I felt like I was leaning forward and pointing my chest forward since I was chasing the ball. I tried getting my body in the correct position but couldn't reach the ball. The other day I practiced and changed the toss so I released it later and got it just barely in front and it made all the difference in the world.