Tsitsipas' backhand...

Stefanos Tsitsipas is a talented player. He has a very good forehand, he moves well, volleys well and has a habit of playing really great on the big points. However, one area lacking in his game is his backhand.
He often does nothing with this shot, just returns balls with it and hardly gets them deep or well placed. As a 1hbh, the shot itself is not pleasing to watch. It doesn't have good technique, as it often looks as if he scoops up the ball without completing his rotation. This is what I can see that will hold him back unless he works on it and improves it.
 

Yoneyama

Hall of Fame
I believe this to be nonsense. He has a very good, consistent OBH. In the matches I have watched he keeps the ball deep to where you can't attack off it and then has the capability to drive the ball flat as well.

I agree, it's a great 1HBH with good technique, just a bit more whip at the end - kind of like Gasquet's but not as extreme. It's certainly more reliable than alot of others too, including Shapovalov, and probably Dimitrov too.
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
I agree, it's a great 1HBH with good technique, just a bit more whip at the end - kind of like Gasquet's but not as extreme. It's certainly more reliable than alot of others too, including Shapovalov, and probably Dimitrov too.
it Is more of natural swing, looks like he doesn't even think about It. he just swings out and balls explode off his racket. Wawrinka backhand is more of technically perfect backhand where as Stepano is more of natural talented backhand.
 

Notirouswithag

Professional
he has his federer moments on the backhand, but overall I'd say it mostly consistent, as mentioned more so than Shapavalov.

Ive seen it in person at Citi Open and I was pretty impressed, but I do feel he should hit it just a smidge deeper, sometimes it will end up short or shanking
 
he has his federer moments on the backhand, but overall I'd say it mostly consistent, as mentioned more so than Shapavalov.

Ive seen it in person at Citi Open and I was pretty impressed, but I do feel he should hit it just a smidge deeper, sometimes it will end up short or shanking
This is kind of what I'm saying. He doesn't hit hard from that wing like Shapo or Thiem hence less unforced errors obviously.
It feels like he is holding back on it and it could improve a lot
 

Fairhit

Hall of Fame
Every shot can be improved but it doesn't mean that it's a bad 1hbh I think it's a very good natural swing with room for improvement.
 

Notirouswithag

Professional
This is kind of what I'm saying. He doesn't hit hard from that wing like Shapo or Thiem hence less unforced errors obviously.
It feels like he is holding back on it and it could improve a lot


exactly, He's pretty consistent with it for the most part, but needs a tad more height or depth to get it to be a bit more effetive
 

Bobby Jr

G.O.A.T.
I wonder whether OP watches tennis or is in actual fact a trial algorithm going through some teething issues?
Yep. I often can't fathom how people can claim to watch tennis and then see stuff which is empirically false and, worse, continue to convince themselves of what they're seeing.

Tsiptsipas' backhand is fantastic. Seeing him go toe to toe in crosscourt backhand rallies with Khachanov yesterday, and Monfils earlier, is all you needed to see how good his rallying backhand is even if you've never seen him play before. He's so solid for one of the new guys.
 

byealmeens

Semi-Pro
His BH is better than Federer's was at his age.
I do agree ... his one hander is excellent, particularly for his age. Perhaps what the OP is referring to is his willingness to be a bit passive on that side. He seems a little more defensive off that wing in comparison to his forehand (though he certainly has the ability to crack the one hander). Perhaps it's intended to be the more consistent side for now.

One thing I would add, however, is that I am surprised by how weak his slice is. I realize most of the next gen have weaker slice BHs, but for a one hander I expected more bite on the slice. This shot definitely looks more defensive and that may be why he comes over the BH so much.
 

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
I do agree ... his one hander is excellent, particularly for his age. Perhaps what the OP is referring to is his willingness to be a bit passive on that side. He seems a little more defensive off that wing in comparison to his forehand (though he certainly has the ability to crack the one hander). Perhaps it's intended to be the more consistent side for now.

One thing I would add, however, is that I am surprised by how weak his slice is. I realize most of the next gen have weaker slice BHs, but for a one hander I expected more bite on the slice. This shot definitely looks more defensive and that may be why he comes over the BH so much.

His slice is pretty ugly and weak. I have seen him use the DTL slice aggressively though, so that is good.
 

mental midget

Hall of Fame
Yep. I often can't fathom how people can claim to watch tennis and then see stuff which is empirically false and, worse, continue to convince themselves of what they're seeing.

Tsiptsipas' backhand is fantastic. Seeing him go toe to toe in crosscourt backhand rallies with Khachanov yesterday, and Monfils earlier, is all you needed to see how good his rallying backhand is even if you've never seen him play before. He's so solid for one of the new guys.

agree. he's only 20, what impresses me with how solid he is off that side on rallies. often watching, say, shapo, i give him about three rally balls till he misses. tsitsipas is really quite remarkably consistent off that wing. he's looking very good honestly.
 

dunlop_fort_knox

Professional
ummm he is 20 and close to top 10 in the world.

Stefanos Tsitsipas is a talented player. He has a very good forehand, he moves well, volleys well and has a habit of playing really great on the big points. However, one area lacking in his game is his backhand.
He often does nothing with this shot, just returns balls with it and hardly gets them deep or well placed. As a 1hbh, the shot itself is not pleasing to watch. It doesn't have good technique, as it often looks as if he scoops up the ball without completing his rotation. This is what I can see that will hold him back unless he works on it and improves it.
 

FedLIKEnot

Professional
This is kind of what I'm saying. He doesn't hit hard from that wing like Shapo or Thiem hence less unforced errors obviously.
It feels like he is holding back on it and it could improve a lot

Funny you mentioned those two they dont have traditional 1hbh, in fact though more of a weapon at this time they are not pleasing to look at as far as 1hbh go. However yes they are willing to go for broke on that wing more so than Tsitsipas. What is underrated and what I havnt seen you mention is he is more consistent on that side than most 1hbh, and he hit incredible angles of that side. Is it this huge weapon, not yet it can be and it certainly isnt holding him back from some really good results.
 

MLRoy

Hall of Fame
I'm going to have to check it out again. I thought it was pretty good, but he does run around it a lot I've noticed. If I were coaching someone, I'd NEVER let them runaround either side. I love his game, and how unafraid he is of the net.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
I'm going to have to check it out again. I thought it was pretty good, but he does run around it a lot I've noticed. If I were coaching someone, I'd NEVER let them runaround either side. I love his game, and how unafraid he is of the net.

He is so light in his feet to be so tall. Cuz he is tall.
 

ChaelAZ

G.O.A.T.
his is what I can see that will hold him back unless he works on it and improves it.

People just crack me up.

Holding back from what?

How is it that being 16th in the world over 10's of thousands of players through the futures tournaments and the ATP (PRO level) equates to a faulty 1HBH? I think technically everything he does is good and what needs to improve is performance in pressure situations and improving his court IQ. He seems to go for too much in point scenarios where he could easily use better placement over trying to power through a shot.
 

el sergento

Hall of Fame
I'm going to have to check it out again. I thought it was pretty good, but he does run around it a lot I've noticed. If I were coaching someone, I'd NEVER let them runaround either side. I love his game, and how unafraid he is of the net.

You do realize that in 99% of cases, the forehand will always be stronger than the backhand. Why on earth would you choose to play your weaker shot (no matter how strong it is) when you have a chance to hit to your strength?

All the greats since the 80's (if not longer), even ones with extremely good backhands, consistently run around the backhand to hit forehands. The forehand is the main weapon:

Federer
Nadal
Djokovic
Sampras
Agassi
Becker

Even Stan and Djokovic run around what are argueably some of the best backhands in history. Your advice is objectively terrible.
 
D

Deleted member 733170

Guest
You do realize that in 99% of cases, the forehand will always be stronger than the backhand. Why on earth would you choose to play your weaker shot (no matter how strong it is) when you have a chance to hit to your strength?

All the greats since the 80's (if not longer), even ones with extremely good backhands, consistently run around the backhand to hit forehands. The forehand is the main weapon:

Federer
Nadal
Djokovic
Sampras
Agassi
Becker

Even Stan and Djokovic run around what are argueably some of the best backhands in history. Your advice is objectively terrible.

I guess that’s why she’s not coaching. :rolleyes:
 

Dolgopolov85

G.O.A.T.
Actually, that's not true. There's a lot of players, too numerous to mention, who have better backhands. (Ok, just a few: Evert, Connors, Borg, Laver, King, Goolagong, Henin, Bacsinzsky -- ever hear of them? And Rafa's forehand has not been his dominating shot, like days of old, buddy. His great 2-hander got him to number 1 this year. It's been MUCH more reliable than his forehand. Not my fault you're not very observant.)

Anyone that has a great backhand, yet runs around it to hit a forehand is a f****** i****. Ever notice how many winners those produce?? NOT MANY. I wouldn't expect anyone defending that kind of stupidity to understand, but thanks for your reply. FY
There were only three male names in there and all very old. He clearly said 80s and onwards. Not very observant, are you?

As for your second para, so presumably you with zero slams are right while Djokovic with 14 is wrong because he has the best backhand in the world and still often runs around it to hit an inside out/in forehand. Because the latter happens to be a stronger shot. The old players you mentioned couldn't whip the forehand the way today's players do because of the wood racquets they played with. What worked then doesn't now. Bacsinzsky, like Gasquet or Paire, runs around her forehand. You know why? Because her forehand is weak, like those players.
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
Grip I see Tsitsipas use look very small. what grip size do they use ? is it better to have small grip size for great 1 handed backhands ?
 

BeatlesFan

Bionic Poster
You do realize that in 99% of cases, the forehand will always be stronger than the backhand.

Not in 99% of cases, not anywhere close. These guys all had/have greater BH’s than FH’s:
Connors, Edberg, Djokovic, Murray, Wawrinka, Nalbandian, Safin, Vilas, Rosewall and Laver.

There’s 50 major slams represented among these players.
 

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
Not in 99% of cases, not anywhere close. These guys all had/have greater BH’s than FH’s:
Connors, Edberg, Djokovic, Murray, Wawrinka, Nalbandian, Safin, Vilas, Rosewall and Laver.

There’s 50 major slams represented among these players.
When you talk about better FH than BH you may be saying that they go to it by choice more often than most players, but unless you see them deliberately run around the FH to hit a BH this is an exaggeration.

For that you have to use for an example a guy like Paire who truly runs around his FH. That's very unusual.
 
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Chanwan

G.O.A.T.
Not in 99% of cases, not anywhere close. These guys all had/have greater BH’s than FH’s:
Connors, Edberg, Djokovic, Murray, Wawrinka, Nalbandian, Safin, Vilas, Rosewall and Laver.

There’s 50 major slams represented among these players.
Point still stands though: In the current era both Djoko and Wawa - and heck even Murray, who has a, comparatively speaking, weaker forehand - will from time to time run around their backhands to hit a forehand. Not as often as Rafa back in the day, but still. Why? Because as great as their backhands are, the forehand is still capable of doing even more.
When you talk about better FH than BH you may be saying that they go to it by choice more often than most players, but unless you see them deliberately run around the FH to hit a BH this is an exaggeration.

For that you have to use an example a guy like Paire who truly runs around his FH. That's very unusual.
This.
 

Dolgopolov85

G.O.A.T.
Not in 99% of cases, not anywhere close. These guys all had/have greater BH’s than FH’s:
Connors, Edberg, Djokovic, Murray, Wawrinka, Nalbandian, Safin, Vilas, Rosewall and Laver.

There’s 50 major slams represented among these players.

Djokovic, Murray and Wawrinka do not have stronger backhands than their forehands. It's just that their backhands are ranked higher among the top shots in the game vis a vis their forehands. Which only means that say Fed/Nadal/Delpo have even better forehands.
 

el sergento

Hall of Fame
Actually, that's not true. There's a lot of players, too numerous to mention, who have better backhands. (Ok, just a few: Evert, Connors, Borg, Laver, King, Goolagong, Henin, Bacsinzsky -- ever hear of them? And Rafa's forehand has not been his dominating shot, like days of old, buddy. His great 2-hander got him to number 1 this year. It's been MUCH more reliable than his forehand. Not my fault you're not very observant.)

Anyone that has a great backhand, yet runs around it to hit a forehand is a f****** i****. Ever notice how many winners those produce?? NOT MANY. I wouldn't expect anyone defending that kind of stupidity to understand, but thanks for your reply. FY

First, if I’m an idiot, then what does listing names of players from before the 80’s make you when I specifically said since the 80’s. Also, did not know we were discussing the WTA, pretty sure I only listed men.

Second, are you seriously arguing that Rafa has a better backhand than forehand now? Yes, his backhand has improved, but the forehand is still the money shot. Simple question, ever seen him run around his forehand?

Third, you realize you just called the big 3, holders of 50+ slams ***** idiots. Federer actually has a great backhand yet he runs around it; Rafa, who you now say has a better backhand than forehand, runs around it; Djokovic might have the greatest backhand of all time, yet he runs around it.

These guys would be shining shoes had they listened to you.

Not in 99% of cases, not anywhere close. These guys all had/have greater BH’s than FH’s:
Connors, Edberg, Djokovic, Murray, Wawrinka, Nalbandian, Safin, Vilas, Rosewall and Laver.

There’s 50 major slams represented among these players.

Pardon my hyperbole. Still, for every one of those players I can name 10 that had a better forehand than a backhand. I’ll just run off names from the 90’s :)

Also, many of the guys you listed still run around the backhand. Just watch them on the ROS: when they get a weak serve to the backhand, even Wawa runs around and smacks a forehand.
 

MLRoy

Hall of Fame
First, if I’m an idiot, then what does listing names of players from before the 80’s make you when I specifically said since the 80’s. Also, did not know we were discussing the WTA, pretty sure I only listed men.

Second, are you seriously arguing that Rafa has a better backhand than forehand now? Yes, his backhand has improved, but the forehand is still the money shot. Simple question, ever seen him run around his forehand?

Third, you realize you just called the big 3, holders of 50+ slams ***** idiots. Federer actually has a great backhand yet he runs around it; Rafa, who you now say has a better backhand than forehand, runs around it; Djokovic might have the greatest backhand of all time, yet he runs around it.

These guys would be shining shoes had they listened to you.



Pardon my hyperbole. Still, for every one of those players I can name 10 that had a better forehand than a backhand. I’ll just run off names from the 90’s :)

Also, many of the guys you listed still run around the backhand. Just watch them on the ROS: when they get a weak serve to the backhand, even Wawa runs around and smacks a forehand.

So, running around your stronger shot makes sense to you? Have you ever noticed how few winners they hit when they do that? Yet, that still makes sense to you and you're going to argue with me over that, right? Okay. Have an interesting life, as they say in Shanghai.
 

McEncock

Professional
A bit superficial maybe? Elegance is not everything. Look at the high bounce when he goes crosscourt, and the easiness of his down the line stinger. Very few player hit OHBH like he does imo.
 

McEncock

Professional
As he is is very tall, he has lots of amplitude so the movement may look slow and underpowered, but he hits 150kph BH winners.
 

Gazelle

G.O.A.T.
His backhand is the stuff of dreams for Nadal, as evidenced by their two meetings this year.

People overhype it just because it's a onehander so it receives an automatic 10 bonus points.

But he's young, maybe he can improve it.
 

el sergento

Hall of Fame
So, running around your stronger shot makes sense to you? Have you ever noticed how few winners they hit when they do that? Yet, that still makes sense to you and you're going to argue with me over that, right? Okay. Have an interesting life, as they say in Shanghai.

Are you saying Nadal, Djokovic, Wawrinka, virtually every pro never hit inside out forehand winners?

Do you watch tennis or only listen to it on the radio?
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
His slice is pretty ugly and weak. I have seen him use the DTL slice aggressively though, so that is good.
For Tsitsipas his heavy cross court backhand is also his defensive backhand that resets points. He rarely needs to hit slice so rarely does and its not a shot worthy of praise. On clay his backhand is very consistent and effective. I've been utterly amazed at how well it holds up on other surfaces including recent match with Medvedev in Basel.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
His backhand is the stuff of dreams for Nadal, as evidenced by their two meetings this year.

People overhype it just because it's a onehander so it receives an automatic 10 bonus points.

But he's young, maybe he can improve it.
And yet somehow he took Rogers Cup 2nd set to breaker really surprising Nadal.;) Crazy to write him off even versus Nadal on clay.
 

Dolgopolov85

G.O.A.T.
Are you saying Nadal, Djokovic, Wawrinka, virtually every pro never hit inside out forehand winners?

Do you watch tennis or only listen to it on the radio?

Maybe he confused WTA and ATP. But even Masha used to hit inside out forehand winners all the time. It was a money shot for her. This even though she had a beautiful double hander with great extension.
 

Dolgopolov85

G.O.A.T.
I overall like how Tsitsipas is shaping up. I am not going to write in slams to his name yet, not even close. I still find his return position too defensive. I know Nadal gets away with it but he's literally the only one among tier 1 greats who returns like that and he's a panther compared to Tsitsipas. But Tsitsipas has found a good balance, a nice zone to play in. Not like Zverev staying passive and then losing his cool when things don't go his way and not like Thiem who relies too much on ball bashing. Tsitsipas' easy rally ball is nice and he has weapons too. Still feel he is a touch sluggish while moving. It's not just his height. Safin used to look more animated than Tsitsipas. Perhaps he takes it too easy at times and could do with a little more fire. Mentally I still feel ADM is the best, he knows what it's like to scrap out a win and fight every inch of the way. Sadly lacks the weapons to do so and it's equally sad that it has become a must in today's tennis because, again, that means we are going to see only one type of player rise to the top again and again. No space for a Wilander like smart counterpuncher.
 

Gazelle

G.O.A.T.
And yet somehow he took Rogers Cup 2nd set to breaker really surprising Nadal.;) Crazy to write him off even versus Nadal on clay.

So these are the standards we are now applying to the next gen? Losing a close set against an old player they should be replacing at the top of the game right now is considered an achievement?
 
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