Tsitsipas tweets post Coric match

Meles

Bionic Poster
Coric doesn't deserve to even be compared to Zverev. At least Zverev won a few big titles with high level on play. Coric's best result will probably remain beign destroyed by Djokovic in a masters final.
25/2018R32HalleGrassBorna CoricAlexander Zverev6-1 6-4
12/2018QFMiami MastersHardAlexander ZverevBorna Coric6-4 6-4
35/2017R64US OpenHardBorna CoricAlexander Zverev3-6 7-5 7-6(1) 7-6(4)
33/2015R64Cincinnati MastersHardBorna CoricAlexander Zverev7-5 3-6 7-6(5)
 

Sysyphus

Talk Tennis Guru
You're conveniently ignoring the fact that social media has actually taken over people's lives, though, and not just young people, on a much larger scale than anything else.
people whined in precisely the same way about the television since at least the 1950s and in not entirely dissimilar ways about how the novel was taking over people's lives and time in the 18th century.

In E Unibus Pluram: Television and U.S. Fiction, written in 1990, David Foster Wallace pointed to statistics purporting that "television is watched over six hour a day in the average American household." Clearly it could be said to have taken over their lives to a large degree.

In Ray Bradbury 1953 novel Fahrenheit 451, he paints a picture of a society gone numb on endless loops of home entertainment. Bradbury was deeply skeptical of television and went to his grave calling it an "insidious beast, that Medusa which freezes a billion people to stone every night."

These critiques of technology aren't entirely without merit, of course. It has an influence on the culture, sometimes negative, and social media brings it with it certain new conundrums and effects.

But people have been worrying about the decline of youth and of culture as long as there has been any culture to fret over. Latching onto the latest technology and pronouncing it to be the ultimate undoing of the youth or society is nothing more than ahistorical handwringing. The youth will be quite alright, insofar as the youth has ever really been alright.
 

Red Rick

Bionic Poster
people whined in precisely the same way about the television since at least the 1950s and in not entirely dissimilar ways about how the novel was taking over people's lives and time in the 18th century.

In E Unibus Pluram: Television and U.S. Fiction, written in 1990, David Foster Wallace pointed to statistics purporting that "television is watched over six hour a day in the average American household." Clearly it could be said to have taken over their lives to a large degree.

In Ray Bradbury 1953 novel Fahrenheit 451, he paints a picture of a society gone numb on endless loops of home entertainment. Bradbury was deeply skeptical of television and went to his grave calling it an "insidious beast, that Medusa which freezes a billion people to stone every night."

These critiques of technology aren't entirely without merit, of course. It has an influence on the culture, sometimes negative, and social media brings it with it certain new conundrums and effects.

But people have been worrying about the decline of youth and of culture as long as there has been any culture to fret over. Latching onto the latest technology and pronouncing it to be the ultimate undoing of the youth or society is nothing more than ahistorical handwringing. The youth will be quite alright, insofar as the youth has ever really been alright.
I don't think youth will be alright.

Boomer managed economy and being raised by boomers will see to that
 
Nice to read already so many posts (which shows increased interest) for someone the people who post seem to dislike...

I am biased in favor of Tsitsi due to being Greek. But aside that, lets face the truth.
... he is 22 ranked 6th. Only thing he has to do is be patient and healthy, remain around this ranking position and sometime in the coming 3-4 yrs max when all GOATS will have exited the tour, he will have increasingly high chances of becoming number 1-2. So why would he blow his head off for a loss even if it happened that way? How many times have we seen in sports players/teams losing matches due to overconfidence? Having such a visibility in one’s life would be a bless.

And keep in mind since junior he was tasked by his family to either make it and secure the family’s survival or break it and be responsible for the family’s misery due to the extreme financial hardships they were facing. By succeeding ( if you ask me due to a confluence of luck and talent) he has shown his mental strength, something he has shown in matches with superior players (wasn’t he the one who deprived Fed from match or break points, only to turn the match and win it?)

All the next gen are still kids in this age. Some more mature than others, all with different characters and different ways of reactions in the same/similar stimulations. Let them be so they grow up and evolve the sport by their upbringing. This is after all evolution...
 

blablavla

Legend
Nice to read already so many posts (which shows increased interest) for someone the people who post seem to dislike...

I am biased in favor of Tsitsi due to being Greek. But aside that, lets face the truth.
... he is 22 ranked 6th. Only thing he has to do is be patient and healthy, remain around this ranking position and sometime in the coming 3-4 yrs max when all GOATS will have exited the tour, he will have increasingly high chances of becoming number 1-2. So why would he blow his head off for a loss even if it happened that way? How many times have we seen in sports players/teams losing matches due to overconfidence? Having such a visibility in one’s life would be a bless.

And keep in mind since junior he was tasked by his family to either make it and secure the family’s survival or break it and be responsible for the family’s misery due to the extreme financial hardships they were facing. By succeeding ( if you ask me due to a confluence of luck and talent) he has shown his mental strength, something he has shown in matches with superior players (wasn’t he the one who deprived Fed from match or break points, only to turn the match and win it?)

All the next gen are still kids in this age. Some more mature than others, all with different characters and different ways of reactions in the same/similar stimulations. Let them be so they grow up and evolve the sport by their upbringing. This is after all evolution...
Some good points here, although if the next gen will fail to dethrone the Big 3, take #1 in ranking, win GS, I am afraid that the Big 3 will never retire, and subsequently the Next Gen might retire while still being promising talents that need to wait a couple of years and be healthy to take over the Big 3
 

Karma Tennis

Hall of Fame
Let them be so they grow up and evolve the sport by their upbringing. This is after all evolution...
Bravo Nicholas! A great post.

Tsitsipas and his family are living a life that most Greeks would love to have. He is doing Greece and the Diaspora proud with his achievements.

Guys like Tsitsi, Zverev, Shapo, FAA, Rublev, Berrettini, Tiafoe, Struff, Sinner, de Minaur etc. are badly needed breath of fresh air to a sport that was starting to get a bit stale.

Tennis has always had eras where one or two players dominated the sport at any given time. It has also had the odd era where several players were winning big Titles over a short period of time.

Once the Big 3 are gone .. we will probably see a lot more players winning the big Titles for a while. Nothing wrong with that. Will keep the sport very interesting.
 

blablavla

Legend
hey, @jm1980 , can you tell me please, how did Stefanos win 2 sets, and how did get to lead 5:1 in the fourth set with such a weak BH?
couldn't he just play another game based on the strategy that brought him to the 5:1 edge in the fourth set?
or was this the time when Coric understood that Stefanos has a weakness in form of his BH?
in this case, can you please elaborate your analysis and tell us how did Stefanos manage to win his previous matches if his BH is such a weakness?
and also, how did Stefanos manage to defeat Novak in the past, if his BH is such a weakness?
@jm1980 I haven't seen your answer.
really curios to see your analytics.
 

jm1980

G.O.A.T.
hey, @jm1980 , can you tell me please, how did Stefanos win 2 sets, and how did get to lead 5:1 in the fourth set with such a weak BH?
couldn't he just play another game based on the strategy that brought him to the 5:1 edge in the fourth set?
or was this the time when Coric understood that Stefanos has a weakness in form of his BH?
in this case, can you please elaborate your analysis and tell us how did Stefanos manage to win his previous matches if his BH is such a weakness?
and also, how did Stefanos manage to defeat Novak in the past, if his BH is such a weakness?
Attacking somebody's weakness doesn't guarantee you'll win. But just look at the directional serving stats from Coric -- he targeted Tsitsipas' backhand, specially on the advantage side. Contrast that with his approach to serving to Zverev, where he hit more serves to the forehand

Why is Djokovic being brought up at all? Plenty of players with holes in their games have beaten Novak in the past, and plenty more will beat him in the future as he gets older
 

blablavla

Legend
Attacking somebody's weakness doesn't guarantee you'll win. But just look at the directional serving stats from Coric -- he targeted Tsitsipas' backhand, specially on the advantage side. Contrast that with his approach to serving to Zverev, where he hit more serves to the forehand

Why is Djokovic being brought up at all? Plenty of players with holes in their games have beaten Novak in the past, and plenty more will beat him in the future as he gets older
because you are not answering how Tsitsipas won 2 sets vs Coric if his BH is so weak.

beyond this, expanding on the FH vs BH statistics.
can you please tell me, during the poitns which Tsitsipas finished with a FH winner:
- in how many points he managed to avoid hitting the ball with his weak BH. So points in which he only hit forehands
- in how many points he actually prepared the stage with his BH, obtaining a weak answer from Coric, to simply finish the point with a nice FH winner
 

asifallasleep

Hall of Fame
Initially I was not a fan, but sorry folks, I like Tsitsipas. The guy is honest and I mean c'mon, whenever I lose to anyone I think I am still the better player and that I should have won. He feels he's always the best player on the court, is not afraid of anyone, wants to be the best and always tries to improve. What's not to like. What were you guys doing at 22? It's great sitting back and criticizing kids.
 

blablavla

Legend
because you are not answering how Tsitsipas won 2 sets vs Coric if his BH is so weak.

beyond this, expanding on the FH vs BH statistics.
can you please tell me, during the poitns which Tsitsipas finished with a FH winner:
- in how many points he managed to avoid hitting the ball with his weak BH. So points in which he only hit forehands
- in how many points he actually prepared the stage with his BH, obtaining a weak answer from Coric, to simply finish the point with a nice FH winner
@jm1980 do you have anything to answer?
or do you agree that your analysis & conclusions is crap?
 

jm1980

G.O.A.T.
because you are not answering how Tsitsipas won 2 sets vs Coric if his BH is so weak.

beyond this, expanding on the FH vs BH statistics.
can you please tell me, during the poitns which Tsitsipas finished with a FH winner:
- in how many points he managed to avoid hitting the ball with his weak BH. So points in which he only hit forehands
- in how many points he actually prepared the stage with his BH, obtaining a weak answer from Coric, to simply finish the point with a nice FH winner
There are already stats that reflect the conclusion:
 

blablavla

Legend
I know what I saw. There are already stats that reflect the conclusion:
you keep trying to dodge answering my questions.

1. if Stefanos BH is so weak, how did he win 2 sets vs Coric in the first place?
2. why his weak BH came into light only at MP?
3. how his FH winners were set-up, by hitting only FHs or by employing BH shots, which set up the stage to only deliver the nice FH winner at the end?
 

jm1980

G.O.A.T.
you keep trying to dodge answering my questions.

1. if Stefanos BH is so weak, how did he win 2 sets vs Coric in the first place?
2. why his weak BH came into light only at MP?
3. how his FH winners were set-up, by hitting only FHs or by employing BH shots, which set up the stage to only deliver the nice FH winner at the end?
The weak BH was always present. With a decent BH this is an easy 3-0 for Tsitsipas

The FH winners were rarely set up by a BH. Mostly good serve/good FH

I don't know why were are still arguing this when the stats already show the obvious. Breaking it down to groundstrokes, it's even worse: 1 BH winner vs 17 BH errors. Berry good backhand, no?
 
The weak BH was always present. With a decent BH this is an easy 3-0 for Tsitsipas

The FH winners were rarely set up by a BH. Mostly good serve/good FH

I don't know why were are still arguing this when the stats already show the obvious. Breaking it down to groundstrokes, it's even worse: 1 BH winner vs 17 BH errors. Berry good backhand, no?
Interestingly, when the "stats" that you presented for the crucial points showed that his FH and shot selection were as much if not more responsible for him not closing the match when he could, you said that it was the BH that was the reason for it, so really, it is clear that you are not interested in actually looking at data that doesn't fit your agenda.


You moved from "Tsitsipas's BH is the reason why he didn't win the crucial points" to "Tsitsipas BH is his weaker side". Quite a weak effort.

:cool:
 

Raiden

Hall of Fame
Coric is a joke of a player who has no weapons at all. I already forgot about his existence. How Tsitsipas found a way to lose to him is beyond me.
His understated gamesmanship makes his opponents suck just long enough during a few big points.

That's all it takes to lose a match.
 

jm1980

G.O.A.T.
Interestingly, when the "stats" that you presented for the crucial points showed that his FH and shot selection were as much if not more responsible for him not closing the match when he could, you said that it was the BH that was the reason for it, so really, it is clear that you are not interested in actually looking at data that doesn't fit your agenda.


You moved from "Tsitsipas's BH is the reason why he didn't win the crucial points" to "Tsitsipas BH is his weaker side". Quite a weak effort.

:cool:
It's not just his weaker side, it's weak compared to the average BH... Just like most other 1HBH
 

blablavla

Legend
The weak BH was always present. With a decent BH this is an easy 3-0 for Tsitsipas

The FH winners were rarely set up by a BH. Mostly good serve/good FH

I don't know why were are still arguing this when the stats already show the obvious. Breaking it down to groundstrokes, it's even worse: 1 BH winner vs 17 BH errors. Berry good backhand, no?
1. you still don't answer how did Stefanos get to win 2 sets and obtain MP if his BH is so weak?
2. ok, 17 BH errors. Out of how many points played? out of how many shots made on the BH side? how does this ratio looks on the FH side? how does it look vs Coric?
3. if his BH is so weak, how did he manage to defeat Novak twice? out of 5 encounters
 

Bender

G.O.A.T.
Coric: Greek, lay down your Blade!
Tsitsipas: μολὼν λαβέ
Coric: *teleports behind you*
Coric:
psssh...nothin personnel...kid...
 

blablavla

Legend
Garbage like Tsitsipas' BH in this match?

FH winners/UE: 32-18
BH winners/UE: 6-22

dude, @jm1980 , just to show you how useless your "analysis" is.
do you know that the match totaled 350 points played?

well, what you are describing here, is 22.2% of all points played.
78 points out of 350.
even Lew does a better effort in his attempts to present the randomly cherry picked numbers as statistics

by the way, did you know that Borna won 173 points of those 350?
while Stefanos with his weak BH won 177 points?

did you know that 18 UE from forehand + 22 UE from bachkand = 40 points
add here 53 winners from Borna, that amounts to 93 points.
still a big gap to the 173 points that Borna won in total during the match, don't you find Mr. or Mrs. Analysis resulting in BH weaker than average on tour?
 
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