Turning down the "hackers" at my club

[jdubbs]

I'm a 4.5 and occasionally (maybe two or three times a month) play social doubles night at my club, as its sometimes hard to line up players at my skill level to play on my schedule. This doubles night is fairly low level hit and giggle doubles, and no harm done, it can be fun to work on some things in my game.

The problem is now when i show up to my club hoping to run into a few guys at my level and pick up a hitting session (which happens sometimes)...instead I see guys from the social doubles night and they usually ask to hit with me, but they are pretty bad. Also, the courts are indoor and cost money by the hour. I would rather just work out.

I know when I want to play someone above my skill level I usually have to either play a tourney or pay a pro for an hour.

How do I turn these guys down and be friendly about it, they are usually pretty nice guys (and sometimes ladies), but its a waste of time and money to play with them.

Sorry if this comes across as arrogant, it's not meant that way, I'm looking for a tactful way to do it, they are smart enough to know I'm there looking for a game.

 

[atatu]

What do the 5.0 and 5.5 players say when you ask them to hit ?

 

[LeeD]

Most playground players have to face this issue.
I know you are in a club, SFRacket? But it's still an issue.
Hard to keep as "friends", those guys you turn down, without looking like an arrogant person.
But you also stated that for you to play better players, you have to play in tourneys. That is so very true.
I know I've offended a few of the 3.5 doubles crew at SanPabloPark, by staying out of their ending sets, but what good is it for me to hit with a 3.5 who basically hit's weaker than I do with my right hand, and I"m lefty? Worse part is, I"ve beaten most, not all, of the weekday AM 3.5 doubles crew using my right hand, 1hbh, rightie serve.
And yet, they STILL want me to join in on their "fun".

 

[LeeD]

Yeah, and sometimes, they harp on me from 2 courts away, "why aren't you waiting?". And, "C'mon, our set is about to end, we need someone"....
My standard reply, AFTER I told them I'm done.... 'does me NO good whatsoever to hit with you guys"......
Yet surprisingly, the day after, they all invite me to play, some saying they will open a new can of balls to entice me into their court. :shock::shock:

 

[Legend of Borg]

There are no hackers only world class talent in progress.

 

[jdubbs]

What do the 5.0 and 5.5 players say when you ask them to hit ?

The truly great players always have a different excuse ("i just drank two beers" was one I heard last night), and some of them actually charge for a lower level person to play with them.

 

[dizzlmcwizzl]

We have a public park where here is a lot of pick up tennis where this comes up. I take the direct approach ... I will say "I am waiting for one of a couple guys, I will hit with you till they get here but then I have to go". Usually this works without much difficulty.

Your problem is worse in that you have to pay for court time so you just cant hit around for a few minutes and then break off. Once you start you have to stay.

I would be direct .... say "I only can play tennis a few hours a week and I was hoping to spend that time playing with another 4.5." I believe direct is going to be better than anything you could come fabricate.

 

[Timbo's hopeless slice]

I'll play with anyone...

But then, I'm past the point where I'm ever going to improve and my skills are grooved by hitting a million balls.

Also, if you're a member, our club does not charge for court time.

And, every player is a potential client!

 

[OrangePower]

I'm a 4.5 and occasionally (maybe two or three times a month) play social doubles night at my club, as its sometimes hard to line up players at my skill level to play on my schedule. This doubles night is fairly low level hit and giggle doubles, and no harm done, it can be fun to work on some things in my game.

The problem is now when i show up to my club hoping to run into a few guys at my level and pick up a hitting session (which happens sometimes)...instead I see guys from the social doubles night and they usually ask to hit with me, but they are pretty bad. Also, the courts are indoor and cost money by the hour. I would rather just work out.

I know when I want to play someone above my skill level I usually have to either play a tourney or pay a pro for an hour.

How do I turn these guys down and be friendly about it, they are usually pretty nice guys (and sometimes ladies), but its a waste of time and money to play with them.

Sorry if this comes across as arrogant, it's not meant that way, I'm looking for a tactful way to do it, they are smart enough to know I'm there looking for a game.

I don't think it's arrogant to turn down a hit or match with players significantly weaker than you.

In general I do try play with everyone who wants to, but yes there are times when I specifically want to be challenged and just don't have the spare time for a more casual hit.

Just be honest about it. Say that you don't have time / are not in the mood for a casual hit, and were looking for a more competitive hit. If you are polite about it most people would not take offense.

BTW what I do think borders on arrogant is referring to players weaker than you as "hackers" and "pretty bad". It's all relative - there are plenty players stronger than you by the same margin that you are stronger than these "hackers". So no need to use derogatory terms.

 

[Steady Eddy]

They should know better than to ask you. Tennis pros should help out in letting people know these things, IMO.

Then on the other hand, you should be gracious, and sometimes invite a lonely hacker to hit with your group.

 

[Legend of Borg]

Everyone is a hacker compared to Rafa/Nole/Fed.

Ultimate comparison.

 

[NLBwell]

I'm pretty much with Timbo. If I'm playing on a court I have to pay for, the matchup is usually set up ahead of time.

 

[tennisbuck]

Sometimes I think the people that post these social situation questions just lack common sense

 

[Cindysphinx]

Honestly, if I were you, I would say: "Oh, hey. Thanks. I sometimes do hitting sessions with people. I charge $20/hour, and the student pays for the court. If that sounds good, text me and let's set up a time."

Should take care of the problem . . .

Cindy -- who would definitely hire you to rip serves at her

 

[gregor.b]

I'm a 4.5 and occasionally (maybe two or three times a month) play social doubles night at my club, as its sometimes hard to line up players at my skill level to play on my schedule. This doubles night is fairly low level hit and giggle doubles, and no harm done, it can be fun to work on some things in my game.

The problem is now when i show up to my club hoping to run into a few guys at my level and pick up a hitting session (which happens sometimes)...instead I see guys from the social doubles night and they usually ask to hit with me, but they are pretty bad. Also, the courts are indoor and cost money by the hour. I would rather just work out.

I know when I want to play someone above my skill level I usually have to either play a tourney or pay a pro for an hour.

How do I turn these guys down and be friendly about it, they are usually pretty nice guys (and sometimes ladies), but its a waste of time and money to play with them.

Sorry if this comes across as arrogant, it's not meant that way, I'm looking for a tactful way to do it, they are smart enough to know I'm there looking for a game.

I don't get much chance to hit nowadays so I like to play Sunday morning social. I drink wayyyyy too many beers Saturday night so it evens it up a fraction. The players vary from your 3.5 to 5.0 or thereabouts. Then if I play crap at least I expected it.

 

[eelhc]

I'm a 4.5 and occasionally (maybe two or three times a month) play social doubles night at my club, as its sometimes hard to line up players at my skill level to play on my schedule. This doubles night is fairly low level hit and giggle doubles, and no harm done, it can be fun to work on some things in my game.

The problem is now when i show up to my club hoping to run into a few guys at my level and pick up a hitting session (which happens sometimes)...instead I see guys from the social doubles night and they usually ask to hit with me, but they are pretty bad. Also, the courts are indoor and cost money by the hour. I would rather just work out.

I know when I want to play someone above my skill level I usually have to either play a tourney or pay a pro for an hour.

How do I turn these guys down and be friendly about it, they are usually pretty nice guys (and sometimes ladies), but its a waste of time and money to play with them.

Sorry if this comes across as arrogant, it's not meant that way, I'm looking for a tactful way to do it, they are smart enough to know I'm there looking for a game.

I think the issue is that you are just show up hoping to find someone for an unplanned hitting session. In the age of smartphones and text messaging... why take the chance?

On the other hand... I fully understand that it may be a waste of time for the much better players to hit with me so I don't ask.

I do play social matches a couple of times a month as well and if I'm in a group that's well below my level I'll pull out the 85.

 

[blakesq]

Just say "Sorry, I am looking for another 4.5 player, but thanks".

I'm a 4.5 and occasionally (maybe two or three times a month) play social doubles night at my club, as its sometimes hard to line up players at my skill level to play on my schedule. This doubles night is fairly low level hit and giggle doubles, and no harm done, it can be fun to work on some things in my game.

The problem is now when i show up to my club hoping to run into a few guys at my level and pick up a hitting session (which happens sometimes)...instead I see guys from the social doubles night and they usually ask to hit with me, but they are pretty bad. Also, the courts are indoor and cost money by the hour. I would rather just work out.

I know when I want to play someone above my skill level I usually have to either play a tourney or pay a pro for an hour.

How do I turn these guys down and be friendly about it, they are usually pretty nice guys (and sometimes ladies), but its a waste of time and money to play with them.

Sorry if this comes across as arrogant, it's not meant that way, I'm looking for a tactful way to do it, they are smart enough to know I'm there looking for a game.

 

[cknobman]

Tell them you'd be glad to play for a wager.

Put somewhere between $25 - $50 down and ask them if they'd be willing to wager that they can win the match.

Most will walk away but if anyone bites just look at is as a way to earn some easy money

 

[Bdarb]

you need a better phone tree of available players.

You don't need to charge people to hit with you, thats a bit presumptuous in my opinion. You COULD tell them sure, but I can't pay for the court. I would think that they would not do this. If they do, hey, free tennis..

 

[kevrol]

If you don't want to play just say, "sorry but I'm not sure that would be much fun for either of us."

Not sure why you guys that are 4.5s feel the need to act like you're doing some 3.0 or 3.5 a huge favor for hitting with them and they should be honored to share the same court with you.

 

[sureshs]

Honestly, if I were you, I would say: "Oh, hey. Thanks. I sometimes do hitting sessions with people. I charge $20/hour, and the student pays for the court. If that sounds good, text me and let's set up a time."

Should take care of the problem . . .

Cindy -- who would definitely hire you to rip serves at her

4.5s don't rip serves. You are better off with a good junior boy.

 

[sureshs]

Sometimes you wish players who think of themselves as better would be able to make up their mind. We had an ugly incident in the men's open doubles night here when 2 guys were on a court waiting for 2 more, then these 2 guys walk over several courts to reach them without using the side entrances, then after taking a closer look at their faces, walk back across all the courts they came through. You would think that being such great players, they would be able to stick to their great group by emailing and setting up a court in advance.

There was also the case last week at a social when a couple of guys (and these are barely lower-level 4.0 men) showed up and when the organizer asked for the 2 bucks token fee for charity, they tried to evade her, but kept circling around. Every time they would come close to the courts, she would ask for the money, and they would look the other way and walk away. Turns out they had decided to play only if "good" people showed up and they had no problem making life difficult for the organizer. Really pathetic low-level players who somehow think they are any good.

 

[Mongolmike]

4.5s don't rip serves. You are better off with a good junior boy.

Ummm.... I think that IS what she was implying. If you know what I mean...wink, wink.

 

[PMChambers]

You should play them to your utmost ability and destroy them if you have that ability, that's treating your opposition with respect. Never game an opposition as that will break your game and they won't respect you for showing off. If you're that much better they're unlikely to play you again. If you think you're that much better then use it as a practice of put away shots and aggression. The only issue is when players who are distinctly lower standard and shown so repeatedly want to constantly want to play you and can't read that your not interested. Then you're better off saying that you where anticipating playing against X & Y, maybe another time.

 

[burosky]

I think being honest about it while using tact is the best way to go. I just can't help but relate to the hackers at your club. I am a hacker myself and would always jump at the chance to get a hit with better players. Unless the better player is a good friend I would never ask for a hit.

 

[beernutz]

The fact that you are paying for court time is the sticking point to me. If money is the main issue would you agree to hit with the other player if they'll pay for the court?

If I had approached a better player and asked if they wanted to hit I'd be fine with picking up the court cost.

I understand about wanting to play with players of your own ability as our club has a men's night which tends to attract the once-a-week hackers who don't play any league or other matches. As a three-time-a-week hacker I just don't get much out of it when I play with them.

 

[sureshs]

Most playground players have to face this issue.
I know you are in a club, SFRacket? But it's still an issue.
Hard to keep as "friends", those guys you turn down, without looking like an arrogant person.
But you also stated that for you to play better players, you have to play in tourneys. That is so very true.
I know I've offended a few of the 3.5 doubles crew at SanPabloPark, by staying out of their ending sets, but what good is it for me to hit with a 3.5 who basically hit's weaker than I do with my right hand, and I"m lefty? Worse part is, I"ve beaten most, not all, of the weekday AM 3.5 doubles crew using my right hand, 1hbh, rightie serve.
And yet, they STILL want me to join in on their "fun".

Yeah, and sometimes, they harp on me from 2 courts away, "why aren't you waiting?". And, "C'mon, our set is about to end, we need someone"....
My standard reply, AFTER I told them I'm done.... 'does me NO good whatsoever to hit with you guys"......
Yet surprisingly, the day after, they all invite me to play, some saying they will open a new can of balls to entice me into their court. :shock::shock:

Here is a pic of leed being humble:

 

[thehustler]

I'm a 4.5 as well and it's hard for me to find players that can push and challenge me. I wind up in meetup groups where players may top out at 4.0 or a high 3.5 if I'm lucky. Sure it gets a little boring but I work on stuff and everyone seems to enjoy me being there even if I'm the best. I get some players who want to be against me so they can learn. I don't mind, everyone is friendly and so am I, so when I leave I feel good about at least getting out and hitting rather than being on the internet or indoors on a beautiful day (because any day I can play tennis is a beautiful day).

 

[heftylefty]

I'll play with anyone...

But then, I'm past the point where I'm ever going to improve and my skills are grooved by hitting a million balls.

Also, if you're a member, our club does not charge for court time.

And, every player is a potential client!

I like your take! I will hit with anyone who ask. It doesn't make me Mr. Wonderful, but I want to pay it forward. Someone took time out to hit with me when I was a " hack".

 

[sureshs]

I have been to meetups on high-school courts where there is a mix of players of all levels, from 2.5 to 4.5. There is usually an organizer who tries to match people and maintain the flow, but you have to be ready to fill a spot if none is available. Or leave. It is just plain disrespectful to the organizer and the others not to do so.

 

[dlk]

Honesty is the way to go. But know you will sound arrogant in the end (you're not getting paid to play 4.5 tennis, if you know what I mean-it's still a game that everyone loves, especially 3.5s). Obviously it's great to hit with a 4.5, and probably not so great for the 4.5, but that's the breaks when there's not many people at the 4.5 level.

I've been lucky, most every 4.5 I've dealt with has been gracious and respectful, in fact most seem to take tennis less serious than 3.5s.

 

[heninfan99]

The best way is to begal them once (if you can) and then you won't sound like a jerk when you say you're looking for an intense battle today and so you have to pass on the offer.

...however if they get two games off you then you are beatable in their minds.

 

[sureshs]

I think it is also a social thing. There are not many real 4.5s, and they tend to get comfortable with each other over time.

 

[ttocs013]

I can relate to this issue.. but it's fairly easy to handle as long as you are polite. The best thing for you to do, especially since you are paying for court time, is to get a network of players at your level in your phone and set up times beforehand. I play in a 5.0 flex singles league and basically anytime I can I will trade numbers with the guy and let him know I like to shoot out text messages during the day for pick up games.

My problem with playing doubles in a social format or with lower rated players is getting into a rhythm. Almost every time I will be paired with the weakest player in our group of 4 to "even" it out and then they will exclusively hit 70% of their shots in his direction. I always try to pick something I'm not that good at and work on that in these games.. tends to help. Oh, and beer. Bring beer.

 

[jdubbs]

My problem with playing doubles in a social format or with lower rated players is getting into a rhythm. Almost every time I will be paired with the weakest player in our group of 4 to "even" it out and then they will exclusively hit 70% of their shots in his direction. I always try to pick something I'm not that good at and work on that in these games.. tends to help. Oh, and beer. Bring beer.

This is true, it can be fine, but the worst is when they're hitting all the shots to my 3.0 partner and whooping it up when they win points like they're in the finals of Wimbledon. That really gets on my nerves. A few weeks ago I had 4 aces in a single game...and still lost because the serves they got back all went to my partner...who missed them all.

 

[Steady Eddy]

This is true, it can be fine, but the worst is when they're hitting all the shots to my 3.0 partner and whooping it up when they win points like they're in the finals of Wimbledon. That really gets on my nerves. A few weeks ago I had 4 aces in a single game...and still lost because the serves they got back all went to my partner...who missed them all.

Wow! That partner needs stand near the net and the sideline.

 

[forthegame]

Dude, go pro.

 

[mctennis]

Dude, go pro.

My thoughts exactly. You posted it before I could. Ditto +1.

 

[TennisCJC]

.5 level down and you can usually get a good workout.

If the other player is 1 full level down, maybe hit to their strength all the time. Like hit every shot down the middle slightly to their FH side. Also, work on things like hit approach shots to their strength and go to net to work on volleys.

But, I would not pay indoor fees to hit with someone that is 1 level down from my level. I would likely hit with them if the courts were free at least for a few minutes.

 

[jdubbs]

Dude, go pro.

I appreciate it, and it's flattering, but me compared to say, an ATP pro, I wouldn't even get a point off of them (even Donald Young). But then, I'm not asking them to hit with me and split the court fees!

So, it's all relative.

 

[KineticChain]

I appreciate it, and it's flattering, but me compared to say, an ATP pro, I wouldn't even get a point off of them (even Donald Young). But then, I'm not asking them to hit with me and split the court fees!

So, it's all relative.

i'm pretty sure the 'dude, go pro' was tongue-in-cheek... as the Brits would say

 

[LeeD]

You're a 4.5, so you already know your place in the tennis hierarchy.
No 3.0 knows his place.
About half the 3.5's know.
Most 4.0 are starting to figure it out.
JDubbs, if it's the SFRacketClub, have you seen to two little black girls hit yet? Azaria is NorCal JuniorGirl''s 12 year old No. 4 this year.
We hit for 1/2 an hour this morning.

 

[Bdarb]

i'm pretty sure the 'dude, go pro' was tongue-in-cheek... as the Brits would say

I love the "even Donald young" quip lol. Forget Donald young, you wouldn't be getting points off of unranked nobodies we've never heard of, nvm someone who has been in the top 100.

 

[jdubbs]

I love the "even Donald young" quip lol. Forget Donald young, you wouldn't be getting points off of unranked nobodies we've never heard of, nvm someone who has been in the top 100.

Well, I did play a match a couple of years ago against a guy who had been ranked in the 700's (he was pro about 5 years prior) and he beat me 0 and 1...oh, he was ****ed about that one game but I just hit every shot as hard as I could to the corners and it worked for those four points.
But by and large, you are right...

 

[chatt_town]

I'll tell you what I've learned. Many of the so called 4.5's are scared to get their *ss beat anyway. That's why there are very few if any 4.5 leagues. Then some of them are too good to hit with even 4.0's much less 3.5's. Many of them want to walk around with the title of being 4.5 without having to prove it. That may not be the case with this guy but many of them are like this. I play with anyone. Like someone said. It's all relative. I'm just as far ahead of a 3.0 as 5.0 is to me. If I'm out there with what is obviously a 3.0. I just work on things I don't do well to try and get confidence in them. I use to say it would not bother me one bit if I ever played 4.5 when I was a 3.0. and not because they were so good...but because many of them are arrogant as hell. Many of them don't call the score or even call balls out and consequently end up arguing a quite a bit.

I played a set with a 5.0 in Destin. It took about 20 minutes if that long. He did what he had to do to pretty much just let me know that I indeed was two levels below him without breaking a sweat and I respect him to this day for doing it. Now if you are paying for the court, you do have to be careful. I wouldn't pay to play a 3.0. This is all free tennis.

If you don't want to play just say, "sorry but I'm not sure that would be much fun for either of us."

Not sure why you guys that are 4.5s feel the need to act like you're doing some 3.0 or 3.5 a huge favor for hitting with them and they should be honored to share the same court with you.

 

[SwankPeRFection]

Typical 4.5 arrogance. Lol

 

[skraggle]

Ummm.... I think that IS what she was implying. If you know what I mean...wink, wink.

That kind of innuendo has no place on these boards.

 

[LeeD]

You know what's really weird?
My weekday AM tennis is a mixed bag of mostly 3.5-4.0's.
Quite often, I don't drop into a 3some with weak hitting 3.5's, so they rightly get offended.
Then, when a 3.0 shows up to play, they don't want the 3.0 to join in, acting just like I did to them, but now they are doing it to someone of a lower level than them.
Just look in a mirror.

 

[tennis tom]

You know what's really weird?
My weekday AM tennis is a mixed bag of mostly 3.5-4.0's.
Quite often, I don't drop into a 3some with weak hitting 3.5's, so they rightly get offended.
Then, when a 3.0 shows up to play, they don't want the 3.0 to join in, acting just like I did to them, but now they are doing it to someone of a lower level than them.
Just look in a mirror.

That's the pecking order, life is not fair. To get better at tennis you need to play 30% with players better then you, 30% with players worse then you and 40% at players at your level. I have the great advantage of being handicapped so I get to play with a great diversity of players.

 

[Engelworks]

How do I turn these guys down and be friendly about it, they are usually pretty nice guys (and sometimes ladies), but its a waste of time and money to play with them.

It's only a waste of time if you make it a waste. Just agree to hit with whoever asks, and then use it as an opportunity to practice either being as aggressive as possible or as consistent as possible. If you ever reach a level where the "hackers" can't win a single point against you and are flat out humiliated, they'll probably stop asking to hit. Until then, you can still improve by playing with them.