U.S. Open 2015 QF: Roger Federer (SUI) [2] - Richard Gasquet (FRA) [12]

[underground]

Since 2011 Djokovic leads him 15-8 or something? Not saying Federer is inferior player/promoting that weak era stuff but a generation younger ATG in his prime will be always favoured over other who is in his fall years. Out of 15 wins, I can mark plenty of those in which Federer played great but still got outplayed by Djokovic. WTF 2012, Two Wimbledon Finals, USO 2011 are few examples. Same I can't say for Murray who also has 6 years age advantage but has just two wins over Federer above Masters level. First it was Federer's worst year since 2003 while in other he was struggling with back injury in WTF 2008.

My Point remains same, even if Federer GOATs against Murray/Gasquet or some lower ranked player, it hardly says anything about his chances against Djokovic, least at this age. Those are his favorable matchups when his game is really on while Djokovic always has got upper gears and he is well capable of beating in form Federer no matter of surface/conditions. Same happened in Wimbledon, Federer zoned against Murray since he allows him do so and that performance raised hopes of Federer fans including myself only to lead huge disappointment. I will try to avoid same mistake. Expectations are lower this time. May be he is carrying better form than Wimbledon, he might beat Djokovic too but Federer from "Semis against Murray" or "Quarters against Gasquet" surely will not show up against Djokovic.

We will see.

Agree with the most part but the two highlighted matches Fed wasn't outplayed. Fed choked away his service game in 2011 (apart from that return winner, Fed hit a UE on his second MP, and DF to gift the game away), in 2012 he sprayed a wild error out of nowhere at 6-6 in the TB, and had the same situation from 40-15 whilst serving for the 2nd set.

 

[Chanwan]

Unfortunately he's unlikely to stay at #2 through the fall since he has to defend titles in Shanghai, and Basel, and finals at the YEC while Murray despite playing more tournaments, I'm pretty sure he has less to defend.

depends on who does best and how Fed does for the remainder of the US Open. Should he win it (a big if, but still), he's ahead of Muzz in the race. Should he reach the final, he's a doable 650 behind Muzz. I expect Fed to perform better in the fall than Muzz, but maybe that's just me.
http://live-tennis.eu/race

 

[D.Nalby12]

I think I need a need dictionary. Got outplayed at the two US Open semis, where he held MP's? Got outplayed at the WTF where Djoko won one more point than him? And I'd venture to say he didn't exactly play great at this years Wimbledon final either.

Why so defensive dear Chanwan? You must have bad day. or that SpicyCurry trolled you till death? LOL


Disagree that Federer wasn't great in Final. He played the best that he could at this age but Djokovic was simply better. No excuses for him. Playing great at 34 doesn't equate to prime or peak level, so no need to pull Mainad. I'm hardly bashing Federer here.

Outplayed or not, you decide. I don't remember stats of those but my point still stands that, Djokovic just like Nadal has the game to beat in form Federer at biggest stages. He is the only player on planet who has completed Federer Slam and overall he has got 9 wins over Federer above Masters level. Same can't be said for Murrays, Gaskeys, Raos.

Federer best level still at the age of 34 is enough to routine those but Djokovic always has different plans.

 

[D.Nalby12]

deleted

 

[Chanwan]

Why so defensive dear Chanwan? You must have bad day. or that SpicyCurry trolled you till death? LOL


Disagree that Federer wasn't great in Final. He played the best that he could at this age but Djokovic was simply better. No excuses for him. Playing great at 34 doesn't equate to prime or peak level, so no need to pull Mainad. I'm hardly bashing Federer here.

Outplayed or not, you decide. I don't remember stats of those but my point still stands that, Djokovic just like Nadal has the game to beat in form Federer at biggest stages. He is the only player on planet who has completed Federer Slam and overall he has got 9 wins over Federer above Masters level. Same can't be said for Murrays, Gaskeys, Raos.

Federer best level still at the age of 34 is enough to routine those but Djokovic always has different plans.

I'm not trying to be being defensive, just being factual. You don't get outplayed in matches, where you hold MP. That's at least a very, very odd use of 'outplayed' to my non native speaking ear. Same in a match, where you win 96 points and your opponent wins 97.

Wimbledon 2015, he didn't play great. You can think what you will, but Djokovic - unlike Rafa - for the most part still allows Fed to play the game on his own terms. He didn't serve as well as he could (some, but little to do with Novak), he didn't return as well as he could and he made more errors of the ground and at the net than he should have. He wasn't bad, he just was quite a bit away from as good as he can be vs. Novak - even at 33/34 (as evidenced in Cinci, in Dubai, in Shanghai and - to a lesser extent - at Wimbledon 2014).

But yes, overall I agree. Djokovic can play with and beat an inform Fed. That's exactly what happened at the WTF 2012 for instance. I think that's one of the best matches I've seen Fed play, where he lost.

 

[D.Nalby12]

Agreed, I just thought that comparison with Nadal's case is not the best.

And you are right, we were all carried away by his SF form at Wimbledon and I expected a win against Djokovic, but ...
The difference I see now is that Djokovic isn't playing that well. No matter what people say, Djokovic's performance on grass in 2015 was probably the best in his career. The way he dismantled Cilic in QF and his level against Federer in the final is something I've never seen from him. But, after that, he's not the same player, so the old man still have a small chance to win the whole thing.

As you said, we'll see.

Full agreement.

Djokovic's level has definitely dropped but he always raises his level against Federer. Even he did that Cincinnati too playing full crap Tennis whole week.

Federer has lifted his share working hard as possible, employing new tactics, racket etc as evidenced by his S+R stats which is reaching his career highest but still he just need 5% share of luck in order to lift trophy. That luck could be Wawrinka not showing up or Cilic upsetting Djokovic or may be Djokovic playing well below his best like he did in USO 2012,13 Finals or combination of both.

Imagine, if Djokovic plays as bad as he did in USO 13 Final…

 

[BeatlesFan]

I haven't seen Djoker play poorly against Fed in many years. Even during his losses to Roger post-2010, he never played lousy in any of their matches. Djoker played a great match in both Dubai and Shanghai, but Fed on fast courts just is the better player. Same with Cincy. Djoker did play one poor game in Cincy, where he DF's three times in one game, but otherwise he played reasonably well.

One of Djoker's greatest strengths is that his level is usually extremely high, he doesn't have dips in his play as Rafa and Roger do. He's always damn good!

 

[Steve0904]

I haven't seen Djoker play poorly against Fed in many years. Even during his losses to Roger post-2010, he never played lousy in any of their matches. Djoker played a great match in both Dubai and Shanghai, but Fed on fast courts just is the better player. Same with Cincy. Djoker did play one poor game in Cincy, where he DF's three times in one game, but otherwise he played reasonably well.

One of Djoker's greatest strengths is that his level is usually extremely high, he doesn't have dips in his play as Rafa and Roger do. He's always damn good!

I think that's exaggerating it. First of all, he's still in his prime, hence less dips in concentration. Second he's a pretty slow starter compared to Nadal and especially Federer, he just ends up usually working his way into matches. Cincinnati 2012 was pretty poor, and I would also contend that the Wimbledon 2012 SF wasn't the best either. He pretty much gave Federer the break in the 1st set, and he basically checked out to give him the break in the 4th set that Federer held onto to win the match. He also had a chance to break Federer late in a highly competitive 3rd set and floated a return long that I'm sure he would've wanted back at the time. We could even count MC 2014 although Djokovic injured himself. He was supposed to win that match with it being on clay and all and he didn't play great.

Even the 2 late matches in 2013 (Paris and WTF) were 3 sets despite Roger himself playing poorly. I don't think Djokovic was playing good in either of those. It's just that Federer was so poor himself at the time that he couldn't take advantage.