UGA Men's Tennis

mikej

Hall of Fame
I would expect Jarry to win this fairly comfortably as he is kind of an upgraded version of the current Michelsen. But maybe Alex can squeeze out a tiebreaker.
interesting, i always feel like tall guys who have to expend a lot of energy changing directions don't like playing quirky baseliners that have good feel for opening up the court and hitting the dropper

we shall see!
 

mikej

Hall of Fame
Isner should keep playing he still looks good out there
leaving too late can be just as bad as leaving too early

and i can think of several folks who have done / are currently doing the latter

props to Isner for getting out at the right time and getting to spend more time with his family, and for doing it before he was losing 1,1 to people whose last names rhyme with linen
 
Yeah I think it’s the right time. He has had a rough season including loses like; first round at Atlanta, 1st round Wimbledon to a clay counter, Brouwer, Nava, Barrere. Ranked 137 in the 2023 race rankings.
 

MisterP

Hall of Fame
I hope Michelsen made the right decision. I’m sure when he looked at his checking statement on Monday after Newport finals it was an easy decision. Playing at UGA would have had some real benefits though.

Hope he stays healthy and well-funded.
 

mikej

Hall of Fame
I hope Michelsen made the right decision. I’m sure when he looked at his checking statement on Monday after Newport finals it was an easy decision. Playing at UGA would have had some real benefits though.

Hope he stays healthy and well-funded.
absolutely the right decision, he's already 115 in the world

no one 115 in the world plays men's college tennis
 

Gemini

Hall of Fame
absolutely the right decision, he's already 115 in the world

no one 115 in the world plays men's college tennis

After the ATP establishes the "guaranteed pay" program (that's what I'm calling for now since I don't know the details), there'll be a lot more men skipping the college route at rankings even lower than 115.
 

andfor

Legend
How about Ethan Quinn already getting a prudential commercial?
Maybe sponsors are coming back to recent NCAA champions as was the case roughly 20 years ago. Seems like since the Bryan Bros and Bobby Reynolds, big sponsorships for NCAA champs of their caliber have dried up.
 
Maybe sponsors are coming back to recent NCAA champions as was the case roughly 20 years ago. Seems like since the Bryan Bros and Bobby Reynolds, big sponsorships for NCAA champs of their caliber have dried up.

College players continuing to make deep runs at slams can only mean good things for college tennis. Eubanks made a splash at Wimbledon. And even seeing non Americans like Gojo and Hijikata make round of 16s is great to show that college can be a pathway for players from all over.

15 players with college ties currently in the ATP top 100 which is more than double the 7 that were there in the end of year 2013 rankings. (And like 4 of those were barely in it ranked lower than 80th).
 

andfor

Legend
College players continuing to make deep runs at slams can only mean good things for college tennis. Eubanks made a splash at Wimbledon. And even seeing non Americans like Gojo and Hijikata make round of 16s is great to show that college can be a pathway for players from all over.

15 players with college ties currently in the ATP top 100 which is more than double the 7 that were there in the end of year 2013 rankings. (And like 4 of those were barely in it ranked lower than 80th).
Right. I like your point on Eubanks. His commentary work with TC prior to his rankings break though has to have been noticed positively as well by sponsors that may have interest.
 
How about Ethan Quinn already getting a prudential commercial?
Maybe sponsors are coming back to recent NCAA champions as was the case roughly 20 years ago. Seems like since the Bryan Bros and Bobby Reynolds, big sponsorships for NCAA champs of their caliber have dried up.

Have to give a lot of credit to his agency, GSE. Tobias been around forever and well known. Quinn being a 19-20 year old makes it a lot easier if that is the target audience Prudential is seeking.
 

Sureshot

Hall of Fame
Surprised to see Ignacio Buse not on the roster. Did he go pro? That would be a big loss considering the departure of Quinn and the non-arrival of Michelsen
 

ashicks

New User
I believe he is January
The latest information from the UGA athletic dept reports the signing of Freddy Blydes of England who will be active on roster for Spring 2024. His highest ITF junior ranking was 117. This year he has played on the ITF Tour instead of the junior tour and has had good results in doubles. There is no mention of Ignacio Buse being included on Georgia’s 2023-2024 roster.
 

Sureshot

Hall of Fame
The latest information from the UGA athletic dept reports the signing of Freddy Blydes of England who will be active on roster for Spring 2024. His highest ITF junior ranking was 117. This year he has played on the ITF Tour instead of the junior tour and has had good results in doubles. There is no mention of Ignacio Buse being included on Georgia’s 2023-2024 roster.
Yes it seemed odd that there was no mention of Buse on the UGA social media. They did rope in a promising US junior in Cyrus Mahjoob. I think this season will call for Manny Diaz to be at his coaching best to have the Dawgs be in the top tier that they are accustomed to
 
Wonder if Quinn made the right decision to go pro. Hasn’t had the best results so far in the challengers. Losing round 1 to Strong Kirchheimer the most recent example.
 

Sureshot

Hall of Fame
Wonder if Quinn made the right decision to go pro. Hasn’t had the best results so far in the challengers. Losing round 1 to Strong Kirchheimer the most recent example.
Was going to say. Watched a bit of the match. He made quite a few unforced errors. He dictated for long stretches but couldn’t close the deal. It’s probably unfair to compare him to Shelton who’s a generational talent but I don’t see how college could have benefited him considering he won Tulsa and Orlando, I am sure he’ll find his feet
 

andfor

Legend
Was going to say. Watched a bit of the match. He made quite a few unforced errors. He dictated for long stretches but couldn’t close the deal. It’s probably unfair to compare him to Shelton who’s a generational talent but I don’t see how college could have benefited him considering he won Tulsa and Orlando, I am sure he’ll find his feet
Right. The climb in the rankings is a bumpy road for most.
 
Was going to say. Watched a bit of the match. He made quite a few unforced errors. He dictated for long stretches but couldn’t close the deal. It’s probably unfair to compare him to Shelton who’s a generational talent but I don’t see how college could have benefited him considering he won Tulsa and Orlando, I am sure he’ll find his feet
Ethan made the right decision. College helped him last year. He did everything that he needed to do. He has an incredible forehand and his volleys are outstanding. He will find his way but it will take time.
 

JAJ

Rookie
I think the reality of pro tennis is that you don't know what a kid is made of until they start getting competitively scouted by better players, and until they have to start defending points. When they are straight out of college (or juniors) and they are swinging away with no pressure, it's amazing how they can plow through a handful of Challengers and crack the top 200. Somewhere around 160, they have to start defending points but if they've shot right through Challengers to the main tour (like Shelton and JJ), they have kind of bought a little margin and can afford to hit some speed bumps as they improve, and they have the points to take time off for training blocks to deal with vulnerabilities that the better players inevitably identify.

But for most of them, it's more likely that you kind of hit a wall where you have points to defend; haven't quite gotten to a sustainable ranking on the main tour; and you are playing a ton of tennis to defend a handful of Challenger points just to hold your position. That's when bodies start breaking down, and guys who were ranked 170 two years out of college are suddenly back in the 400s; and then they are selling commercial real estate or are D1 volunteer coaches.

I'm a former volunteer coach myself (which doesn't confer any particular insight, beyond enjoying college tennis) but it's amazing how many times I've seen a college player and said "that's a top 200 kid" and I've been right. Three years later they're out of the game. You have to get through the Challenger level within a couple of years or it's going to be a tough road. Tennis is hard. And to state the obvious, income inequality is a huge variable.
 

mikej

Hall of Fame
I think the reality of pro tennis is that you don't know what a kid is made of until they start getting competitively scouted by better players, and until they have to start defending points. When they are straight out of college (or juniors) and they are swinging away with no pressure, it's amazing how they can plow through a handful of Challengers and crack the top 200. Somewhere around 160, they have to start defending points but if they've shot right through Challengers to the main tour (like Shelton and JJ), they have kind of bought a little margin and can afford to hit some speed bumps as they improve, and they have the points to take time off for training blocks to deal with vulnerabilities that the better players inevitably identify.

But for most of them, it's more likely that you kind of hit a wall where you have points to defend; haven't quite gotten to a sustainable ranking on the main tour; and you are playing a ton of tennis to defend a handful of Challenger points just to hold your position. That's when bodies start breaking down, and guys who were ranked 170 two years out of college are suddenly back in the 400s; and then they are selling commercial real estate or are D1 volunteer coaches.

I'm a former volunteer coach myself (which doesn't confer any particular insight, beyond enjoying college tennis) but it's amazing how many times I've seen a college player and said "that's a top 200 kid" and I've been right. Three years later they're out of the game. You have to get through the Challenger level within a couple of years or it's going to be a tough road. Tennis is hard. And to state the obvious, income inequality is a huge variable.
so well described, the physicality of modern tennis is so brutal, just all the more incredible how long Fed / Nadal / Djokovic have stayed at the top
 
You can take a look at UVA players alone for an example of that. Jenkins (injury) Kwiatkowski, Ritschard (still plugging away), all kind of peaked out around that near 160 level.

Altamirano, Shane, Aragone and Singh did so at lower ranking levels.
 

andfor

Legend
You can take a look at UVA players alone for an example of that. Jenkins (injury) Kwiatkowski, Ritschard (still plugging away), all kind of peaked out around that near 160 level.

Altamirano, Shane, Aragone and Singh did so at lower ranking levels.
Would be interesting to see the percentage of tour players who make it to the top 200, 150 top 100. Got to be small numbers.

I support the PTPA's efforts to spread prize money deeper so that roughly 300 players or so can sustain themselves annually.
 

ClarkC

Hall of Fame
Would be interesting to see the percentage of tour players who make it to the top 200, 150 top 100. Got to be small numbers.

I support the PTPA's efforts to spread prize money deeper so that roughly 300 players or so can sustain themselves annually.
The counter-argument that has been made is that, if you hang around below 150 for a couple of years, it might be best if you got out of the way for those who would have a better chance of climbing if the landscape were not so cluttered.
 
The point of the challenger tour at the moment is to provide a pathway for young players to make it to the top of the game. As things currently stand, I think that simply giving more money to lower ranked players is a bandaid solution and as Clark C pointed out may actually hurt the game because it makes it so much harder for any new talent to break through a seemingly infinite wall of experienced veterans. Though maybe some of this should be done anyhow because at the moment it is a bit attrocious.

Here's what I think should happen:
-Tournaments should have a much more equal distribution of prize money. For example, I don't quite understand why the champion gets double the prize money as the runner-up. From an entertainment pov, they have played roughly the same amount of time. The ratio between rounds is currently about 2x - I would think about reducing this to around 1.5. And to get to the top of the game where you are actually competing in the finals, I don't think the money is even so much motivaiton.

-Challengers should be much, much more aggressively marketed. Every time I've taken friends to local challenger events they have all had amazing experiences. Add to this that challengers normally have much more local representation than bigger events and I think it's quite a good recipe for local fan support. Increasing revenue for these smaller events means that the players are earning money more organically, and I'm sure that playing in front of crowds, even if only 300-500 strong would go a long way to reducing player burnout. I think that this is a pretty reasonable solution because there are already many challenger events with great attendance, for example in France, Australia, and South America

-If it's not feasible to have so many well-attended lower ranked tournaments, then there should be just a few hotspots for ITFs/lower tier challengers, preferrably either in low cost of living areas or organic tennis hotbeds, like Southern California. The SoCal pro series is a great step in this direction. Why are players traveling hundreds of miles to play in front of 10 fans and for 10$ and 10pts? If the point of these tournaments is to provide a pathway to the pros, I think it makes more sense to just keep them in a central few locations. That way you can start optimizing costs with economies of scale ideas, like player housing, practice courts, etc. Players are less burnt out from traveling all the time. you can even switch to more league formats, team formats, etc.
 

andfor

Legend
The counter-argument that has been made is that, if you hang around below 150 for a couple of years, it might be best if you got out of the way for those who would have a better chance of climbing if the landscape were not so cluttered.
Agree. Not sure of the details, but my guess is the PTPA will provide some additional funding and benefits for players making their way up somewhere around 300 to 150. Pretty sure it won't be structured to allow below 150 to be a long-term destination. Move up or move on. I'll see what details I can find.
 

Sureshot

Hall of Fame
I have heard club tennis in Germany along the lines of the Bundesliga is an option many European players exercise to make money and fund their efforts on tour. It’s pretty regionalized and high level pros participate. Why not implement a similar setup in the US with all the facilities that are available? Is it that funds simply aren’t available for this model? I get democratization of the pay structure on the tour is the best outcome but it’s more the holy grail. There’s been talk about it for so long but very little in the way of actual change. Quinn has a contract with Prudential to bridge him to potentially the top 100. But for every Quinn there are hundreds who are self funding
 

andfor

Legend
Here's a couple of links to the PTPA. It's a little vague. Guessing you would have to join to get more details. The wiki page give the best indication of who they are trying to help, top 500 singles, top 200 doubles.


 

Sureshot

Hall of Fame
Here's a couple of links to the PTPA. It's a little vague. Guessing you would have to join to get more details. The wiki page give the best indication of who they are trying to help, top 500 singles, top 200 doubles.


Sounds like a workable plan. Let’s see progress
 

ey039524

Professional
The point of the challenger tour at the moment is to provide a pathway for young players to make it to the top of the game. As things currently stand, I think that simply giving more money to lower ranked players is a bandaid solution and as Clark C pointed out may actually hurt the game because it makes it so much harder for any new talent to break through a seemingly infinite wall of experienced veterans. Though maybe some of this should be done anyhow because at the moment it is a bit attrocious.

Here's what I think should happen:
-Tournaments should have a much more equal distribution of prize money. For example, I don't quite understand why the champion gets double the prize money as the runner-up. From an entertainment pov, they have played roughly the same amount of time. The ratio between rounds is currently about 2x - I would think about reducing this to around 1.5. And to get to the top of the game where you are actually competing in the finals, I don't think the money is even so much motivaiton.

-Challengers should be much, much more aggressively marketed. Every time I've taken friends to local challenger events they have all had amazing experiences. Add to this that challengers normally have much more local representation than bigger events and I think it's quite a good recipe for local fan support. Increasing revenue for these smaller events means that the players are earning money more organically, and I'm sure that playing in front of crowds, even if only 300-500 strong would go a long way to reducing player burnout. I think that this is a pretty reasonable solution because there are already many challenger events with great attendance, for example in France, Australia, and South America

-If it's not feasible to have so many well-attended lower ranked tournaments, then there should be just a few hotspots for ITFs/lower tier challengers, preferrably either in low cost of living areas or organic tennis hotbeds, like Southern California. The SoCal pro series is a great step in this direction. Why are players traveling hundreds of miles to play in front of 10 fans and for 10$ and 10pts? If the point of these tournaments is to provide a pathway to the pros, I think it makes more sense to just keep them in a central few locations. That way you can start optimizing costs with economies of scale ideas, like player housing, practice courts, etc. Players are less burnt out from traveling all the time. you can even switch to more league formats, team formats, etc.
It's insane that kids trying to make it are traveling to Africa (Morocco) or similar countries to get points.

Luckily for Michelson, he had the breakthrough at Newport and is now top 100, and hopefully, will never have to experience that.
 

andfor

Legend
Please beat Kypson :rolleyes:
Well that did not work out. AM looks like he will finish in the 90's, not a bad spot to start 2024.

My big question is will Michelson and Shelton show up in Jeddah for the NextGen Finals? Do they get points for that event?
 
Saw it mentioned how Ignacio Buse of Peru, who was committed to UGA beat Jarry in Davis Cup and took the first set from Tabilo. Imagine if UGA had kept Quinn, Michelsen and Buse. They would be national title contenders. But instead they look like a middle of the pack SEC team and could very well lose to GT tomorrow.

A case of recruiting too well.
 

mikej

Hall of Fame
Saw it mentioned how Ignacio Buse of Peru, who was committed to UGA beat Jarry in Davis Cup and took the first set from Tabilo. Imagine if UGA had kept Quinn, Michelsen and Buse. They would be national title contenders. But instead they look like a middle of the pack SEC team and could very well lose to GT tomorrow.

A case of recruiting too well.
and in a different world UF still has ATP #16 and ATP #193 on its roster instead of losing 0-4 to FSU

womp womp
 

jcgatennismom

Hall of Fame
Saw it mentioned how Ignacio Buse of Peru, who was committed to UGA beat Jarry in Davis Cup and took the first set from Tabilo. Imagine if UGA had kept Quinn, Michelsen and Buse. They would be national title contenders. But instead they look like a middle of the pack SEC team and could very well lose to GT tomorrow.

A case of recruiting too well.
Reach for the sun-might get burnt. UGA used to draw the best of the players from GA. Then starting in 2019 the top GA players were choosing to play elsewhere-maybe they thought they would not get playing time at UGA with all the top world ITF players Manny recruited. Then those top recruits dont show up or only stay a year. Now the top player for GA class of 2023 is playing for South Carolina, and GT will probably beat UGA with two players from GA in top 3. The two GA blue chip recruits for 2024 are going to Kentucky and Auburn plus another top 100 from GA to Auburn.
 
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Reach for the sun-might get burnt. UGA used to draw the best of the players from GA. Then starting in 2019 the top GA players were choosing to play elsewhere-maybe they thought they would not get playing time at UGA with all the top world ITF players Manny recruited. Then those top recruits dont show up or only stay a year. Now the top player for GA class of 2023 is playing for South Carolina, and GT will probably beat UGA with two players from GA in top 3. The two GA blue chip recruits for 2024 are going to Kentucky and Auburn plus another top 100 from GA to Auburn.
This young Dawg team took care of a very veteran Georgia Tech team today. Thomas Paulsell has improved so much under the tutelage of Manny Diaz and Jamie Hunt. Paulsell was sensational today in his straight set win over Andres Martin.
 
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