Ultimate Holy Grail classic

Ciaron

Semi-Pro
So what is it ? Use the parameters that you have seen at least one for sale or you found at some charity shop by chance. Is it the Wilson Pro Staff 6.0 85 St Vincent or the Adidas GTX Pro T or that Volkl Zebra which tends to be ultra rare. It's got to be a classic ... Suppose this goes without saying in a classic racquet forum. Value also comes into the equation . Just go for it .. Your personal holy grail .
 

Sanglier

Semi-Pro
100% Bakelite experimental frame made by Edson Gallaudet circa 1923. If it exists at all, it is as likely to be found as the real Holy Grail. It may not fit your criteria, but no one has ever come across the real Holy Grail for sale in a thrift store either... :)
 

BorgCash

Legend
You mean great playability or just ultra rare? For example, Max 200G considered by many as the one of the greatness racquets ever made, but there were produced more than million, so it's not a problem get them. Sometimes racquets were made limited edition series, but not great in play, so it can be valuable just for certain collectors only.
 

MoL

New User
I am using Head Prestige Tour 600 and there are just amazing. However, there are not that rare, so if you ask for for rarity, I am sorry to disappoint.

I've tried Max 200G and it feels great in terms of flexibility. But I have to admit that it's a bit too heavy for me to play with, my max weight on racquets is about 380g. I suppose the 200G is closer to a woody.

Speaking to woodies, I have a Head edgewood in really rough condition. I quite enjoy the unique touch of wooden racquets, but since I didn't grow up with them, I don't have particular interest to them.

My father uses a Pro Staff 6.0 85 with no bumper guard, it that a rare classic? Well it's classic enough but I don't suspect that racquet to be valuable because their are paint chips and scratches everywhere.
 

Ciaron

Semi-Pro
You mean great playability or just ultra rare? For example, Max 200G considered by many as the one of the greatness racquets ever made, but there were produced more than million, so it's not a problem get them. Sometimes racquets were made limited edition series, but not great in play, so it can be valuable just for certain collectors only.
Rarity isn't a thing ... Just your ultimate racquet
 

Ciaron

Semi-Pro
I am using Head Prestige Tour 600 and there are just amazing. However, there are not that rare, so if you ask for for rarity, I am sorry to disappoint.

I've tried Max 200G and it feels great in terms of flexibility. But I have to admit that it's a bit too heavy for me to play with, my max weight on racquets is about 380g. I suppose the 200G is closer to a woody.

Speaking to woodies, I have a Head edgewood in really rough condition. I quite enjoy the unique touch of wooden racquets, but since I didn't grow up with them, I don't have particular interest to them.

My father uses a Pro Staff 6.0 85 with no bumper guard, it that a rare classic? Well it's classic enough but I don't suspect that racquet to be valuable because their are paint chips and scratches everywhere.
The Max 200G is the closest to a woody I feel. Great for volleys but I wasn't so hot in the serves.
Your dads pro staff may have some value if it was made in St Vincent (West Indies) . Do a search and you will find plenty of information surrounding this racquet and its mythical qualities.
 
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MoL

New User
The Max 200G is the closest to a woody I feel. Great for volleys but I wasn't so hot in the serves.
Your dads pro staff may have some value if it was made in St Vincent (West Indies) . Do a search and you will find plenty of information surrounding this racquet and its mythical qualities.
I know quite a bit about the St Vincent version. They have red primer and stiffer feel. My father's racquet does have red primer so presumably that's a St Vincent.

That being said, my father is not a collector, and nor am I. He suggested that I use Pro staff 90 because it feels like a 6.0 85, but I ended up using Prestige Tour because of its feel.
 

galain

Hall of Fame
Holy Grail is tough to say because the two at the top of my list aren't really 'classics' in the sense that they had much presence on tour.

Still - rarer than chicken lips - the Lacoste Equijet LT 301 and Snauwaert's Hit Ten 30 are the one's I'd really like to have.
 

Ciaron

Semi-Pro
I know quite a bit about the St Vincent version. They have red primer and stiffer feel. My father's racquet does have red primer so presumably that's a St Vincent.

That being said, my father is not a collector, and nor am I. He suggested that I use Pro staff 90 because it feels like a 6.0 85, but I ended up using Prestige Tour because of its feel.
You can also check on the butt cap code
 

TadDavis

Rookie
My current holy grail is the GTX Pro. Funnest racquet in my collection, it's like a cannon. I also love the Puma Super and Winner. Been hitting with a 200g and absolutely need to get one of them.
 

Ciaron

Semi-Pro
My current holy grail is the GTX Pro. Funnest racquet in my collection, it's like a cannon. I also love the Puma Super and Winner. Been hitting with a 200g and absolutely need to get one of them.
I got myself a Adidas GTX Pro T from a guy in Moscow.
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah120/ciaronf/Mobile Uploads/2016-01/9C9479AC-92C2-404F-9EB0-165EEE6C57DD_zpskbptv5aa.jpg
It didn't come with a butt cap "sticker"
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah120/ciaronf/Mobile Uploads/2016-01/E4D2DB62-8557-4348-BA57-96532DF03233_zps19ctdzwi.jpg
But no problems I had them made
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah120/ciaronf/Mobile Uploads/2016-01/821A5F45-143E-4CEB-B2AD-BF8DC323DFBF_zps6qwzqx8t.jpg
It's a really solid racquet ... Grip size I got was a 5 which makes the racquet feel even heavier generally but head light . I can't believe Lendl was able to grind out those hectic topspin forehands with such a small head
 

TadDavis

Rookie
I got myself a Adidas GTX Pro T from a guy in Moscow.
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah120/ciaronf/Mobile Uploads/2016-01/9C9479AC-92C2-404F-9EB0-165EEE6C57DD_zpskbptv5aa.jpg
It didn't come with a butt cap "sticker"
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah120/ciaronf/Mobile Uploads/2016-01/E4D2DB62-8557-4348-BA57-96532DF03233_zps19ctdzwi.jpg
But no problems I had them made
http://i1378.photobucket.com/albums/ah120/ciaronf/Mobile Uploads/2016-01/821A5F45-143E-4CEB-B2AD-BF8DC323DFBF_zps6qwzqx8t.jpg
It's a really solid racquet ... Grip size I got was a 5 which makes the racquet feel even heavier generally but head light . I can't believe Lendl was able to grind out those hectic topspin forehands with such a small head
Beautiful racquet, Ciaron. I agree about the topspin. Using the old gear really makes you appreciate some of the things these guys were able to do.
 

Crockefeller

New User
Holy Grail is tough to say because the two at the top of my list aren't really 'classics' in the sense that they had much presence on tour.

Still - rarer than chicken lips - the Lacoste Equijet LT 301 and Snauwaert's Hit Ten 30 are the one's I'd really like to have.
I recently spoke to a gentleman selling (potentially) 5 LT301s. I have 2 myself.
 

frinton

Professional
I think the frames are different prices based on condition and provenance but from around 250EUR I believe.
Is that a price per frame :eek: or for the lot of 5 LT301s? I have 1... and it sure is an interesting racket... very, very solid feel!
 

Ciaron

Semi-Pro
Bit of an obscene price from my side . 1 Euro = R 18. So that would cost me 4500 South African Rands. That's 250 Big Macs
 

frinton

Professional
Bit of an obscene price from my side . 1 Euro = R 18. So that would cost me 4500 South African Rands. That's 250 Big Macs
Man, 250 Big Macs... how unhealthy is that? Better get an LT301 ;-) It's the better long term investment... or maybe not... the belly you get from the burgers might stick around too!
 

rodracquet

Rookie
I have been collecting for nearly 10 years now and there are so many lovely racquets.From the 1930's the idea of open throat, slotted shaft etc along with some other Australian trends including the re discovery of semi flat top, handle insert glass tubes of mercury for weight adjustment and key wind balance adjustment. So I do love the Hazell Streamline, Lillywhite & Frowd Twinshaft and Canadian Andreef. Below that we have the French Darsonval Tri Flex. Of course as you move into the 80's graphite permitted some pretty weird shapes and designs but one of the amazing things is how even back in the 1880's inventors were playing around with metal racquets, complex stringing patterns, double strung models like the Blackburne, single string models, tension adjustment. Final pic is the 1928 Craven patent tension adjustment system with a butt cap wind system to draw the bar down to tighten the mains.





 

Ciaron

Semi-Pro
I have been collecting for nearly 10 years now and there are so many lovely racquets.From the 1930's the idea of open throat, slotted shaft etc along with some other Australian trends including the re discovery of semi flat top, handle insert glass tubes of mercury for weight adjustment and key wind balance adjustment. So I do love the Hazell Streamline, Lillywhite & Frowd Twinshaft and Canadian Andreef. Below that we have the French Darsonval Tri Flex. Of course as you move into the 80's graphite permitted some pretty weird shapes and designs but one of the amazing things is how even back in the 1880's inventors were playing around with metal racquets, complex stringing patterns, double strung models like the Blackburne, single string models, tension adjustment. Final pic is the 1928 Craven patent tension adjustment system with a butt cap wind system to draw the bar down to tighten the mains.





Unbelievable re the mercury thing
 

rodracquet

Rookie
Here is the ad for SLAZENGER AUSTRALIA'S "DYNAMIC FLOATING POWER" invented by local Sydney man Harry Webeck. Never seen one.

 
Yes, it's one of the few innovative racket designs in my collection that seems to work! I have long, slow by modern standards, classic style 70s strokes so the movement of the liquid coincides with my contact point fairly well. I seem to hit a "heaver" ball with the Dynaspot. I think "modern" players with significantly more racket head speed would have a much more difficult time controlling their shots this racket. It doesn't really matter since the USTA (and other governing agencies) declared the design illegal. Here is the notice sent out to USTA league tennis captains in 2010:

7/23/2010
ATTENTION CAPTAINS !
Non Conforming Tennis Racquets
The following products, available in the market, do not conform to the
Rules of Tennis, and cannot therefore be used in any game played
according to the official Rules.
Tennis Rackets:
• Head Tsi7
• Dynaspot movable mass racket
In addition, any racket that exceeds 29 inches (73.66 cm) in overall length,
including the handle, is non-conforming. The rule to limit racket length
became an official Rule of Tennis on 1 January 2000.
Stringing Systems:
• “Spaghetti” strung rackets, invented by Werner Fischer (Germany).
Vibration Dampening devices:
Prince “The Silencer”
If any of your players use this racquet, you must inform them that it cannot
be used during district, state, sectional or national USA League Tennis
Championship play.
 
Yes, it's one of the few innovative racket designs in my collection that seems to work! I have long, slow by modern standards, classic style 70s strokes so the movement of the liquid coincides with my contact point fairly well. I seem to hit a "heaver" ball with the Dynaspot. I think "modern" players with significantly more racket head speed would have a much more difficult time controlling their shots this racket. It doesn't really matter since the USTA (and other governing agencies) declared the design illegal. Here is the notice sent out to USTA league tennis captains in 2010:

7/23/2010
ATTENTION CAPTAINS !
Non Conforming Tennis Racquets
The following products, available in the market, do not conform to the
Rules of Tennis, and cannot therefore be used in any game played
according to the official Rules.
Tennis Rackets:
• Head Tsi7
• Dynaspot movable mass racket
In addition, any racket that exceeds 29 inches (73.66 cm) in overall length,
including the handle, is non-conforming. The rule to limit racket length
became an official Rule of Tennis on 1 January 2000.
Stringing Systems:
• “Spaghetti” strung rackets, invented by Werner Fischer (Germany).
Vibration Dampening devices:
Prince “The Silencer”
If any of your players use this racquet, you must inform them that it cannot
be used during district, state, sectional or national USA League Tennis
Championship play.
I have all three sticks and even the silencer ! o_O
 
Hard to see why "The Silencer" would be illegal but other worm style dampeners are not.

Compare:


With:


The only difference I see is that the silencer is permanently attached to the strings by putting the strings through the holes and the shock buster is attached to the strings with hooks.
 
The silencer was technically partially inside the pattern which is illegal.
I agree that is the reason but the "powers that be" don't always seem to follow their own rules. A portion of every dampener that hooks into the middle mains and get pushed up into the bottom cross is technically inside the pattern. Almost everyone I know who uses a dampener does this. I've seen many pros on tour do this as well. Remember Agassi's rubber band dampener? That was tied to the center mains and the bottom cross:





Compare a traditional dampener, technically inside the pattern:



With the Prince Silencer, technically inside the pattern:



I'd argue that there is more of the Head dampener inside the pattern than there is of the Prince dampener.
 

joe sch

Legend
You mean great playability or just ultra rare? For example, Max 200G considered by many as the one of the greatness racquets ever made, but there were produced more than million, so it's not a problem get them. Sometimes racquets were made limited edition series, but not great in play, so it can be valuable just for certain collectors only.
Agree, for playing get a nice max 200g in good condiiton and a Dunlop Max 200G Golden Grand Slam Edition, 1988 if your a classic graphite collector http://www.80s-tennis.com/pages/dunlop-golden-grand-slam.html
Would also be a holy grail to have a racket made for Bjorn
 
So why they only mentioned this Head racquet?

That letter is from 2010 and I don't believe it was meant to be comprehensive. There are many other rackets that are "illegal".

Check out this thread:

Illegal Rackets

15.5 inches is the max limit for the "hitting surface". Several "legal" rackets have mains longer than 15.5 inches but any length over 15.5 inches is outside the "hitting surface" which makes them legal. The Sp.In rackets are a good example of this.



Here are the rules regarding racket construction:

a. The hitting surface, defined as the main area of the stringing pattern bordered by the points of entry of the strings into the frame or points of contact of the strings with the frame, whichever is the smaller, shall be flat and consist of a pattern of crossed strings connected to a frame and alternately interlaced or bonded where they cross. The stringing pattern must be generally uniform and, in particular, not less dense in the centre than in any other area. The racket shall be designed and strung such that the playing characteristics are identical on both faces. The racket shall be free of attached objects, protrusions and devices other than those utilized solely and specifically to limit or prevent wear and tear or vibration or, for the frame only, to distribute weight. These objects, protrusions and devices must be reasonable in size and placement for such purposes.

b. The frame of the racket shall not exceed 73.7 cm (29.0 inches) in overall length, including the handle. The frame of the racket shall not exceed 31.7 cm (12.5 inches) in overall width. The hitting surface shall not exceed 39.4 cm (15.5 inches) in overall length, and 29.2 cm (11.5 inches) in overall width.

c. The frame, including the handle, and the strings, shall be free of any device which makes it possible to change materially the shape of the racket, or to change materially the weight distribution in the direction of the longitudinal axis of the racket which would alter the swing moment of inertia, or to change deliberately any physical property which may affect the performance of the racket during the playing of a point. No energy source that in any way changes or affects the playing characteristics of a racket may be built into or attached to a racket.

d. The racket must be free of any device that may provide communication, advice or instruction of any kind, audible or visible, to a player during a match.
 
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Tommy Haas

Hall of Fame
Andy Murray's sub 12oz, 56RA, 16x19 PT57A2. I've never seen one with those specs on the grey market. Either Murray keeps all his old frames or the people he gives them to don't resell them.
 
It sounds just like ProKennex Kinetic using liquid instead of beads.
The "kinetic" technology is quite a bit different. Unlike the liquid in the Dynaspot, the beads in the Kinetic are enclosed in small chambers which force them to move very slightly along the horizontal width of the racket ( x-axis) rather than vertically along the full length of the racket head (y-axis). Since this slight movement does not change the weight distribution along the long axis of the racket head it was deemed legal.
 
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joe sch

Legend
The "kinetic" technology is quite a bit different. Unlike the liquid in the Dynaspot, the beads in the Kinetic are enclosed in small chambers which force them to move very slightly along the horizontal width of the racket ( x-axis) rather than vertically on the along the full length of the racket head (y-axis). Since this slight movement does not change the weight distribution along the long axis of the racket head it was deemed legal.
PK made some great player rackets also including the 5G and Redondo's, especially if the new tech hurts your arm/elbow
 

Tommy Haas

Hall of Fame
PK made some great player rackets also including the 5G and Redondo's, especially if the new tech hurts your arm/elbow
Do you still have the two Adidas GTX Lendl racquets that I sold you many years ago? It's something I've regretted.
 
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