USO 2019 SF: Nadal [2] vs. Berrettini [24]

Who you got?


  • Total voters
    104

Yugram

Hall of Fame
NO! Numbered because no player can go on, year after year, playing less tennis and getting injured more often, well after the age of 30. Two of the big three out in this USO with injuries. Rafa was playing WAY below his normal high level at the AO this year because of coming back from injuries, taking all the way until half way through the clay season to peak on clay, skipping more tournaments due to knees that he can no longer help by bandaging, hand cramp at RG in 2018, something wrong with the forearm last night.

I don't believe he's going to continue playing at his former high level for years more, not with that body, not with those knees.

What do you disagree with me about here?

Why don't you skip the short, sarcastic reply and think a bit!
Well, in first comment you were saying only about match against Schwartzman, nothing about injuries, so kind of wide open for guessing, no offense.

The talk about Nadal not lasting much longer begins somewhere around 2009, if not even earlier, as there was always this "Nadal will retire before 30’s because of his style" argument, which is now long past due. At this point I’m done with guessing how much time has left for him on tour, as I thought he was absolutely finished in 2015-16.

Just find a seat and enjoy the show. :)
 

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
Well, in first comment you were saying only about match against Schwartzman, nothing about injuries, so kind of wide open for guessing, no offense.

The talk about Nadal not lasting much longer begins somewhere around 2009, if not even earlier, as there was always this "Nadal will retire before 30’s because of his style" argument, which is now long past due. At this point I’m done with guessing how much time has left for him on tour, as I thought he was absolutely finished in 2015-16.

Just find a seat and enjoy the show. :)
I picked Nadal to win this USO before the event started. I'm mostly shocked at how close he came to losing last night. Yes, I know he won in 3 sets, but for those of us who watched the whole thing, it was a shocker. He was totally in the driver's set in the first two sets and then he lost something. His serve has looked so much better on HC before the last couple matches.

Let's see how he does in the next two matches. Maybe he rights the ship and cruises. I thought he was done in 2012. But you have to admit that each time he gets injured and has to stop playing for months, its more and more unreasonable to expect him to return to tennis and resume winning. Sure, he's done it many times before, but do you think this can continue to go on at the age of 33?
 
Lol, Nadal is not going to destroy Medvedev in every meeting. Federer destroyed Del Potro 6-3 6-0 6-0 in AO 2009, we know what happened when they met in USO final that year. And Nadal destroyed Soderling 6-1 6-0 in Rome 2009, just few weeks before that RG match. It happens.
 

mightyrick

Legend
Nadal in 4. Berrettini doesn't have the movement that Schwartzman has. Also, Schwartzman has a better return than Berrettini.

Nadal is light years ahead of Monfils and it took Berrettini 5 sets to close it... and even then he almost choked it away.
 
I picked Nadal to win this USO before the event started. I'm mostly shocked at how close he came to losing last night. Yes, I know he won in 3 sets, but for those of us who watched the whole thing, it was a shocker. He was totally in the driver's set in the first two sets and then he lost something. His serve has looked so much better on HC before the last couple matches.

Let's see how he does in the next two matches. Maybe he rights the ship and cruises. I thought he was done in 2012. But you have to admit that each time he gets injured and has to stop playing for months, its more and more unreasonable to expect him to return to tennis and resume winning. Sure, he's done it many times before, but do you think this can continue to go on at the age of 33?
Of course Nadal will decline and not come back at some point. But we should not forget the field is extremely weak right now. You want proof? This is only the second year after 2008 when Nadal managed to reach all slam semifinals. So long past his prime Nadal managed to achieve something he did only once in his career when he was at his peak. I believe the weakness of the field is the reason why the big 3 are still playing. Nadal looks more declined than Federer and Djokovic, but both of them would also look done if the competition was like in 2007-2013.
 

Tiki-Taka

Hall of Fame
Nadal in 3 hopefully. Needs to be as fresh as possible for the final match. Last year was really fun but it ended badly...
 

Rickenbacker4003

Hall of Fame
wow, is that a slam SF ?!

tennis gods throwing everything they can at the nadal to try to stop him from ruining tennis...
... his titanic draw is starting to take biblical proportions ! :eek:

Who did Djokovic have at Wimbledon until he faced Fed in the final? Just asking, because the butthurt is real.
 

TennisFan3

Legend
Let's call a spade a spade. I agree with @Gary Duane that Nadal played a BAD match yesterday. I disagree that he is DONE or anything like that.
But he is definitely on a steady downward spiral. And in UsO 2019, arguably against a top player (likes of Fed/Djokovic) he would have already lost - as he did in AO and Wimb.

The problem with Nadal is mental. He lacks belief these days, and doesn't play the fearless tennis which got him to the pedestal of the mentally strongest player in the game.
My opinion is that it's physical. Maybe Nadal is NOT 100%. So since he lacks confidence is his own body, it takes a toll in the mind.
After the 2014 back injury, he's never been the same player and the one earlier this year, probably hampered him even more. Even at his beloved clay, Nadal was losing to everyone in the beginning.

Anyway, yesterday Vs Diego being double broken twice in consecutive sets - not being able to run away with leads, had MORE to do with Nadal and LESS to do with Diego. It wasn't about the Argentinian GOATing but about Nadal CHOKING.
Nadal was arming simple forehands. His timing was way off and there were times when he was hesitant to hit a forehand - which I've never seen from Nadal in 15 years.
He was too anxious and some of his shots landed at the bottom of the net and on one the ball actually bounced twice before he got it. This is problem between the ears, not on the racquet.
 

aman92

Hall of Fame
It's not one bad match. He really looks declined even compared to 2017, and let's not even compare to his prime. He is forced to attack more because he can't play long rallies anymore and we saw what happens as a result-he just misses lots of easy shots. No professional player should ever miss 4-0 and 5-1 leads in back to back sets. There were no excuses even when Federer lost sets like that to 2008 Nadal on clay. (in Monte Carlo and Hamburg)
He is quite literally on course to having his second best slam season at freakin 33... I don't quite understand what Nadal's so called fans expect of him
 

Lefty5

Hall of Fame
Berrittini is great and I can't wait to see him play more, but I think he's just happy to be here. Go on court, waive to everyone, soak in his epic tourmanement at NYC, and lay down in 3 easy sets. Next year, Berrettini will get him though.
 
He is quite literally on course to having his second best slam season at freakin 33... I don't quite understand what Nadal's so called fans expect of him
The competition is extremely weak, this makes all the big 3 look better than they really are. No way prime Nadal would choke like he did in the first two sets against Schwartzman.
 

gn

G.O.A.T.
Nadal will win the match in straight sets but Berrettini will secure the moral win if gets at least 9 games.
 

irishnadalfan1983

Hall of Fame
NO! Numbered because no player can go on, year after year, playing less tennis and getting injured more often, well after the age of 30. Two of the big three out in this USO with injuries. Rafa was playing WAY below his normal high level at the AO this year because of coming back from injuries, taking all the way until half way through the clay season to peak on clay, skipping more tournaments due to knees that he can no longer help by bandaging, hand cramp at RG in 2018, something wrong with the forearm last night.

I don't believe he's going to continue playing at his former high level for years more, not with that body, not with those knees.

What do you disagree with me about here?

Why don't you skip the short, sarcastic reply and think a bit!
Well said....Feel like Rafa is maybe hanging on a bit....People say he is a lock for RG next year but 9 months is a long time at his age....Nole does not appear to be slowing besides the obvious shoulder injury....
 

Demented

Rookie
The patterns of play don't really support Berrettinni in this one. His best shot by far is that excellent inside in forehand that gets an extreme angle. Rafa is likely to never ever give him a wide ball in the duece court unless he's hitting a winner. I don't think he can play Rafa camped out in his backhand corner and I don't see him forcing Nadal out of his pattern.
 

Hera

New User
It’d be nice to have two youngsters in the final. Berrettini vs Medvedev will be a breath of fresh air for me. Needless to say Berrettini has a very tough task ahead of him. But he is young, has no pressure since he is not the favorite and his serve and forehand are weapons. Hopefully that would be enough to make it a match against Nadal.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Berrittini is great and I can't wait to see him play more, but I think he's just happy to be here. Go on court, waive to everyone, soak in his epic tourmanement at NYC, and lay down in 3 easy sets. Next year, Berrettini will get him though.
I don’t think anyone would play through a TB fifth set in the previous round just to make a cameo appearance in the SFs of a slam, especially a player that has come out of nowhere in the last 13 months.

Berrettini sat more than a month after his Wimby 4R trouncing by fedr with an ankle he obviously injured but concealed until he was bounced. The only time he has looked weak was his one and only HC tuneup in Cincinnati, where he lost to Londero. He’ll be fresh despite the Monfils marathon.

I fully expect Nadal will when but it won’t be a beatdown. The serve and FH are real weapons and the backhand, while not a winner factory stroke, is reliable. Movement is going to be key. For a 1.95m guy, he is decent, hence his success on both natural surfaces.

Expect a match. It will happen.
 

Mike Sams

Legend
I’d be more worried if Berrettini beat monfils in straight sets at 2 hours. But he didn’t. It took him five sets and a lot of energy.
Yeah but he's only 23. Nadal expended a lot of energy and he's 33. So Berrettini shouldn't be tired tomorrow as he's had 2 solid days off and plenty of ice baths and massages to get him ready.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
It’d be nice to have two youngsters in the final. Berrettini vs Medvedev will be a breath of fresh air for me. Needless to say Berrettini has a very tough task ahead of him. But he is young, has no pressure since he is not the favorite and his serve and forehand are weapons. Hopefully that would be enough to make it a match against Nadal.
I think it will. Nadal is not covering the court nearly as well as Monfils at this US Open. If Berrettini has enough in the tank he can do this and is very likely to be bold given that a grueling five set match would hurt his chances.

Berrettini is very much like Khachanov who gave Rafa so much trouble last year. Better forehand and maybe a weaker backhand, but more than capable of troubling Nadal especially if his serve gets hot.
 

mightyjeditribble

Hall of Fame
I'm surprised at all the people building up Berrettini for this match. Admittedly I've only seen bits of Nadal, mainly against Cilic who may have made him look good, but he's seemed in good form. He doesn't waste this kind of draw.

I believe Berrettini has never played Rafa before either. We all know that Rafa plays a ball that's pretty much different from anyone else on tour.

Seriously, I would love a final without the big 3, it's bloody well time for the younger players to break through at slam level. But I can't see it happening.



Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Professional
I am so excited! :) I have a gut feeling that the first match between Dimitrov and Medvedev will be a long one, which will be good for me because I will be out for at least the beginning of the Nadal-Berrettini match. I will miss less of it if the other match is a marathon match!

I absolutely believe that Nadal knows how big an opportunity he has in this tournament and will be determined to prevail! :) I think he will go up several notches in his play. Fortunately I do like Berrettini so while I would be disappointed if Berrettini wins at least it's a player who I truly like. But I am predicting Nadal without a doubt will win! :)
 

marc45

G.O.A.T.
I think it will. Nadal is not covering the court nearly as well as Monfils at this US Open. If Berrettini has enough in the tank he can do this and is very likely to be bold given that a grueling five set match would hurt his chances.

Berrettini is very much like Khachanov who gave Rafa so much trouble last year. Better forehand and maybe a weaker backhand, but more than capable of troubling Nadal especially if his serve gets hot.
excellent point about Monfils defense being better than Nadal's at this point, of course Nadal will try to be far more offensive than Gael...he also will be smarter and try to avoid Matteo's forehand as much as possible...Gael did do a pretty good job returning Matteo's big first serve and I can see Nadal really struggling with that.....he'll stand far back as usual and getting it back in play with some depth will be difficult....if Matteo starts racking up easy holds it will put a lot of pressure on Rafa's serve...the advantage for Rafa is he won't be serving to Diego, anybody (outside of Djokovic) should be easier
 
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Vamos Rafa Nadal

Professional
Anticipation - is making me late - is keeping me waiting! (;

Come on Rafa! This is too golden an opportunity! Take it and seize it! :)
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
excellent point about Monfils defense being better than Nadal's at this point, of course Nadal will try to be far more offensive than Gael...he also will be smarter and try to avoid Matteo's forehand as much as possible...Gael did do a pretty good job returning Matteo's big first serve and I can see Nadal really struggling with that.....he'll stand far back as usual and getting it back in play with some depth will be difficult....if Matteo starts racking up easy holds it will put a lot of pressure on Rafa's serve...the advantage for Rafa is he won't be serving to Diego, anybody (outside of Djokovic) should be easier
This match has potential. Very likely the roof will be closed and relatively cool so these slow conditions should help Nadal with the Berrettini serve, but also will make both of their topspin games less brutal and high bouncing. Nadal was put out on this surface for the year and remember as of last year US Open has a cement bass for maximum impact on the Nadal knees. Perhaps in these conditions Nadal will be able to keep things more on the Berrettini backhand and save himself having to borrow Gael's track suit. He'll be able to afford to just pressure for the error. The indoor conditions will help Berrettini be aggressive with his placement on serve and all ground strokes so he won't be entirely toothless. Given his success on clay and grass I'm quite confused as to what hard court conditions suit him well, but I suspect given his foot speed weakness that these may be optimum conditions for him to deploy a Nadal brutalizing game like with Monfils. He may not win the match, but could cause Nadal to lose the war.

Both SFs are surprisingly good, unlike year after year after year at the US Open of deadbeats showing up in semi-finals we have a set of very interesting contestants all set to reach new heights.:p
Reviews of SFs over the last few years
2018 - complete joke
2017 - possibly worse than 2018
2016 - great final, but Monfils and Nishikori out of gas for SFs
2015 - great final, Wawrinka and Cilic far from impressive in SFs
2014 - an impressive looking year, but really Medvedev a greater player than the two finalists
2013 - Nadal joke draw with Gasquet in SF, but Stanimal bloodies Djoko for the final in the other.
2012 - SFs power by the dual pigeons of Bendych and Ferrer
2011 - The Big 4, hard to beat
2010 - Comrade Youzhny gives Nadal cakewalk to final, but Big 3 hard to beat
2009 - Early Big 3 plus Delpo - 2018 has Medvedev who is turning out to be similar level player to Delpo
2008 - Early Big 4 with Murray's level probably close to Medvedev in 2019, but Nadal and Djoko not fully formed on hard courts

2019 has potential. Who is to say Berrettini is not some light weight Delpo capable of causing all sorts of trouble? Dimitrov seems very much like Stanimal in 2013, again ready to cause all sorts of trouble. Medvedev has proven himself on the hard courts and easily the best we've seen outside of Big 3 save Delpo or Murray. Really looking forward to today's matches.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
I'm surprised at all the people building up Berrettini for this match. Admittedly I've only seen bits of Nadal, mainly against Cilic who may have made him look good, but he's seemed in good form. He doesn't waste this kind of draw.

I believe Berrettini has never played Rafa before either. We all know that Rafa plays a ball that's pretty much different from anyone else on tour.

Seriously, I would love a final without the big 3, it's bloody well time for the younger players to break through at slam level. But I can't see it happening.



Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk
This has me thinking of Berrettini versus Nadal approximations:
27 / 2019 Wimbledon
R32 Grass Matteo Berrettini Diego Sebastian Schwartzman 6-7(5) 7-6(2) 4-6 7-6(5) 6-3 H2H
25 / 2019 Halle
QF Grass Matteo Berrettini Karen Khachanov 6-2 7-6(4) H2H
R32 Grass Matteo Berrettini Nikoloz Basilashvili 6-4 6-4 H2H
24 / 2019 Stuttgart
R16 Grass Matteo Berrettini Karen Khachanov 6-4 6-2 H2H
22 / 2019 FO - RG
R64 Clay Casper Ruud Matteo Berrettini 6-4 7-5 6-3 H2H
20 / 2019 Rome Masters
R16 Clay Diego Sebastian Schwartzman Matteo Berrettini 6-3 6-4 H2H

16 / 2019 Monte Carlo Masters
R64 Clay Grigor Dimitrov Matteo Berrettini 7-5 6-4 H2H (Threw this is just because they might play in final)
10/2018 R64 Indian Wells Masters Hard Daniil Medvedev Matteo Berrettini 6-7(6) 7-5 6-4 3.50 - 1.29 (ditto)
6 / 2019 Sofia
QF I Hard Matteo Berrettini Fernando Verdasco 4-6 7-5 6-4 H2H
R16 I Hard Matteo Berrettini Karen Khachanov 6-7(6) 6-3 6-4 H2H

I'd say on clay Berrettini would get smoked by Nadal based on his trouble with Schwartzman and Ruud. Slow hard gives him a chance, but Matteo probably needs faster conditions for his best chance.
 

BeatlesFan

Talk Tennis Guru
Nobody's talking about Berrettini choking against Monfils, who just outchoked him to lose. Berrettini couldn't even serve out the match and his last serve in that game dropped into the bottom of the net against Gael. It was a pathetic collapse.

So if the Italian chokes against Monfils, he is going to wither and die when facing Rafa on Ashe in a slam semifinal. This is going to be a very ugly match. Berrettini has no BH and no ROS and Rafa is going to make him look like a club player.
 

Lebsta

Rookie
Nadal should really win this in 3 as Berretini really has no depth to his game. He has a big serve and will bash enough winners to take a tie breaker set, but to keep that consistent level for possible 3 -4 hours will be too much for him.

I still have this ongoing fear that Nadal will pull out through injury. He's so close to a GOAT enhancing 4th US Open that i'm scared something is going to go wrong. He should've have taken Schwartzmann out in under 2 hours yet played over 3 for a straight set win. I just sense something bad will happen but hope i'm wrong.
 
Nobody's talking about Berrettini choking against Monfils, who just outchoked him to lose. Berrettini couldn't even serve out the match and his last serve in that game dropped into the bottom of the net against Gael. It was a pathetic collapse.

So if the Italian chokes against Monfils, he is going to wither and die when facing Rafa on Ashe in a slam semifinal. This is going to be a very ugly match. Berrettini has no BH and no ROS and Rafa is going to make him look like a club player.
Except that choking against one player doesn't imply choking to another player. Anderson had some of the biggest chokes in history. Actually, just in RG 2018 he choked a 6-1 6-2 5-3 lead against Schwartzman, also was up a break in the fourth set. But just a few weeks later he beat Federer in Wimbledon after coming back from 2-0 down in sets and saving a matchpoint.

Also, Berrettini's "choke" was nothing compared to missing 4-0 and 5-1 leads in back to back sets. Had Nadal lost to Schwartzman that would bring choking to a new level.
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Professional
Rafa is going to be fine and he will prevail! Stop with all the doom and gloom! Rafa is going to win #19 - haters are gonna hate, but that's just the way it goes! :) Rafa the magnificent is winning this tournament! :)
 

MichaelNadal

Bionic Poster
Nobody's talking about Berrettini choking against Monfils, who just outchoked him to lose. Berrettini couldn't even serve out the match and his last serve in that game dropped into the bottom of the net against Gael. It was a pathetic collapse.

So if the Italian chokes against Monfils, he is going to wither and die when facing Rafa on Ashe in a slam semifinal. This is going to be a very ugly match. Berrettini has no BH and no ROS and Rafa is going to make him look like a club player.
I hope you're right.
 

The Blond Blur

Hall of Fame
I voted RAFA in 3. Worst case scenario it goes 4 ala the Cilic match. Unfortunately, I'll be making sure a bunch of high school football players don't die so I'll miss the match. @Yugram you'll have to roast Strongrule and Tennis_fan3 for their pessimism without me :cry:

Also @Federer and Del Potro and @StANDAA I see that Hitman has not voted in the poll. Make sure you get his prediction for the match. I repeat make sure you get his prediction for the match.

What is your workout routine? I repeat what is your workout routine?
 
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