USTA doesn't care about Self-rated sandbager

R

robert

Rookie
Just back from our Sectional. We found a self-rated 3.5 player who played not only 4.0 but also 4.5 usta league/tournaments this season. And his 3.5 winning record is 94%. 4.0 & 4.5 winning record is 64%. All these are records are from tennislink.

My captain filed a grievance against him. And USTA denied the grievance. They said that "He has improved the game in the 2010 season and is competitive at the 4.0 level now. Note that USTA Tennis allows for a player to improve without fear of disqualification." Funny, he self rated in feb 2010. And start playing 4.0 tour in May. That means it took him at most 3 months to improve from 3.5 to 4.0 based upon usta records.

Looks like usta doesn't care about Self-rated sandbager at all.
 
J

JavierLW

Hall of Fame
It's not necessarily "The USTA". That's a decision that was made by your grievance committee. (it's made by the majority of 3 people most likely...)

And people wonder why we have this system where the computer decides everything.....
 
CrispyFritters

CrispyFritters

Rookie
I've heard that ratings grievances are handled on a pure numbers basis. The player is either within range or not based on his match scores vs other players. There really isn't any gray area about it.

The grievance committee is most empowered to address fuzzy things like...unsportsmanlike conduct, threatening another player, blatant cheating, etc.
 
A

andfor

Legend
robert said:
Just back from our Sectional. We found a self-rated 3.5 player who played not only 4.0 but also 4.5 usta league/tournaments this season. And his 3.5 winning record is 94%. 4.0 & 4.5 winning record is 64%. All these are records are from tennislink.

My captain filed a grievance against him. And USTA denied the grievance. They said that "He has improved the game in the 2010 season and is competitive at the 4.0 level now. Note that USTA Tennis allows for a player to improve without fear of disqualification." Funny, he self rated in feb 2010. And start playing 4.0 tour in May. That means it took him at most 3 months to improve from 3.5 to 4.0 based upon usta records.

Looks like usta doesn't care about Self-rated sandbager at all.
Click to expand...

You'll have to build a case that the player in question lied on his self-rate profile. Did he ever play on the pro tour, D1 tennis or does he have a USTA membership under a different name and USTA #, etc. Unfortunatly, and I understand your beef, the USTA/Section does not penalize player for improving or playing above their level any more, they leave it up to the computer.
 
A

amarone

Semi-Pro
CrispyFritters said:
I've heard that ratings grievances are handled on a pure numbers basis. The player is either within range or not based on his match scores vs other players. There really isn't any gray area about it.
Click to expand...
Not so. Dynamic DQs are handled on a pure numbers basis, but self-rate grievances are adjudicated. The evidence has to be fact-based, e.g. "he played college tennis", rather than subjective e.g. "he has a great kick serve and fearsome forehand." I wonder what evidence was presented in the self-rate grievance in question. If it was just pointing out his USTA results, then the grievance would certainly be denied - the computer system handles ratings from the results.

The grievance committee is most empowered to address fuzzy things like...unsportsmanlike conduct, threatening another player, blatant cheating, etc.
Click to expand...
Self-rate grievances are assessed by a different committee from other grievances, at Section level.
 
A

amarone

Semi-Pro
robert said:
"He has improved the game in the 2010 season and is competitive at the 4.0 level now. Note that USTA Tennis allows for a player to improve without fear of disqualification."
Click to expand...
Who wrote that? It looks plain wrong to me. If you get three strikes you are DQed, irrespective of whether it was caused by an inaccurate rating or improvement - how can the computer tell which it was?
 
P

PK6

Semi-Pro
robert said:
Just back from our Sectional. We found a self-rated 3.5 player who played not only 4.0 but also 4.5 usta league/tournaments this season. And his 3.5 winning record is 94%. 4.0 & 4.5 winning record is 64%. All these are records are from tennislink.

My captain filed a grievance against him. And USTA denied the grievance. They said that "He has improved the game in the 2010 season and is competitive at the 4.0 level now. Note that USTA Tennis allows for a player to improve without fear of disqualification." Funny, he self rated in feb 2010. And start playing 4.0 tour in May. That means it took him at most 3 months to improve from 3.5 to 4.0 based upon usta records.

Looks like usta doesn't care about Self-rated sandbager at all.
Click to expand...
And that’s what’s wrong with the USTA!!!! You wonder why interest is down/they promote cheating. Hope this organization burns in flames
 
P

PK6

Semi-Pro
It’s promotes sandbagging and cheating!!! No way you’re 3.0/3.5s if you’ve played high school or college tennis. Doesn’t matter how long you haven’t played. Andfor-don’t be that guy!
 
P

PK6

Semi-Pro
I did!!! Tennis did more damage than good. But it pisses me off this is still going on. I have no intention whatsoever of playing USTA again. Watching/going to sports blows playing tennis out by a long shot!!! Had I still be playing I wouldn’t be able to go to games and cheer my teams on!!!
 
P

PK6

Semi-Pro
I have moved on-rather see my team win championships instead. That’s/gym is taking all my time
 
cks

cks

Hall of Fame
PK6 said:
I have moved on-rather see my team win championships instead.
Click to expand...
I guess I look at USTA league differently. Most of the time, the teams I played on end up on the bottom half of the table by season end. I'm fine with that. Yes, it would have been cooler to win more matches, but I also enjoy "just playing tennis." League provides me the opportunity to play tennis all over town instead of playing with my small group of regular hitting partners. I loved that I've had a chance to play at multiple private tennis clubs around my city and meet other players who share my passion for the sport.
 
P

PK6

Semi-Pro
cks said:
I guess I look at USTA league differently. Most of the time, the teams I played on end up on the bottom half of the table by season end. I'm fine with that. Yes, it would have been cooler to win more matches, but I also enjoy "just playing tennis." League provides me the opportunity to play tennis all over town instead of playing with my small group of regular hitting partners. I loved that I've had a chance to play at multiple private tennis clubs around my city and meet other players who share my passion for the sport.
Click to expand...
How can you watch sports and play tennis at same time? You can’t. Asides from sleeping/gym-watching/going to sports takes up all my time.
 
Last edited:
innoVAShaun

innoVAShaun

G.O.A.T.
hate-hate-hate-yeah.gif
 
A

andfor

Legend
PK6 said:
It’s promotes sandbagging and cheating!!! No way you’re 3.0/3.5s if you’ve played high school or college tennis. Doesn’t matter how long you haven’t played. Andfor-don’t be that guy!
Click to expand...
You said "interest is down/they promote cheating". I posted facts showing participation in tennis as a whole is up. Just curious what your source is?

What percentage of the drop is play is directly attributable to sandbagging/cheating? Posting those numbers would be helpful.

For the record, I deplore sandbagging and cheating. Does the USTA have problems enforcing their own rules? Hell, yes! Have I ever been able to get a sandbagger DQ'd? Yes, twice. In spite of some folks perceived level of play of their opponents, I still enjoy the team atmosphere and competition.
 
Last edited:
jm1980

jm1980

Talk Tennis Guru
PK6 said:
It’s promotes sandbagging and cheating!!! No way you’re 3.0/3.5s if you’ve played high school or college tennis. Doesn’t matter how long you haven’t played. Andfor-don’t be that guy!
Click to expand...
Having played HS tennis doesn't really mean much, specially if we're talking about someone who stopped for 10, 15 years (or more), and/or were never any good to begin with. They could be legit 3.0s
 
T

TennisOTM

Professional
jm1980 said:
Having played HS tennis doesn't really mean much, specially if we're talking about someone who stopped for 10, 15 years (or more), and/or were never any good to begin with. They could be legit 3.0s
Click to expand...
Absolutely true. I was #1 on my high school team (which wasn't saying much) for two years back in the early 90's and now I'm barely able to hang in 4.0. My teammates at the tail end of our varsity lineup were probably two levels of 6-0, 6-0 beatings below me. Imaging them now, pushing 50, being forced to self rate at 4.0 is pretty laughable.
 
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