USTA Tournament Frustration (10 & Under)

You're really fighting an uphill battle in this thread aren't you? The fact is, people who have been around the game know better. You are putting up a good fight, I'll give you that, but really? The people that have a passion for tennis and still compete are mostly the people that are frustrated with the USTA. That means, the people that have contributed to tennis, brought in many people through teaching the game, live to play, and watch it on TV...we're the ones constantly frustrated because WE CARE ABOUT THE GAME. It's absurd what the top people make. It is NOT a non profit in our eyes. If I hear that the US Open had a larger attendance than any of the other Grand Slams another year I'm going to be sick. Why, because they built a stadium too large for tennis and are selling more grounds passes than should be allowed on a tournament day. The bottom line for the USTA is to make money. Forget the loyal fans experience, we just want your money.
I totally disagree and think he made excellent points. The USTA's job is to grow the game of tennis. It's sad, but the USTA deserves every bit of criticism they receive, as they are lacking in common sense all too often. I have been a USTA member for over 30 years as well as countless friends of mine (we are mostly 5.0 tournament players) and none of us are happy with them. I've been in the Eastern and New England sections and we are constantly in shock at the lack of awareness they have for the game. Whether it be the way the rankings in each section are conducted (I actually won a tournament this summer and my ranking dropped!), or the way they have now forced Quickstart down the throats for our kids. My son is 9, has been playing tournaments with normal balls since he was just under 8, and took his lumps initially. Now that he is 9 he is experiencing success since he is getting stronger and is winning tournaments now. He absolutely does not want to use the green ball. We used them when he was 5-7. It's not fair that he should move up already, since he is still much smaller and not as strong as many of the 11 year olds playing twelve and under. At this age two years is a major difference. So what do we do now? Just tell him there are no tournaments for him since we all agree he cannot go backwards after 2.5 years with a normal ball. Is this too tough to understand for the USTA? This program needed to be phased in. Once the kids that are currently using the regular balls turn 11 then the green ball should be brought in (next year). At this time, the kids who are used to using QS balls, green or otherwise, can be brought in seamlessly. Why continue to punish your most loyal customers? It seems this is the habit of the USTA...punish the people that spend the most amount of money on your events. Making the move this year to QS has made many of the parents that frequent the tournaments furious and many will just skip the rest of the 10's and wait a year until the 12's. My last point is that if the QS is so important to the USTA, why not give it the best chance to succeed? Don't anger people with it. Introduce it properly, when kids don't have to go backwards in their development. That surely does not keep children in the game. How many kids would go back to Tball once they were hitting a pitched ball for a couple of years?


It is understandable, you are frustrated. You and I are very similar, only difference between you and I is anger. You are angry, I am not.:)

The fact is many of the top 50 are playing 12's. If your kid is ready, play him in the 12's and see what happens, if not, he is fine for now (3-6 months) with the green ball on full court.

BTW,,,,,,Where were you when we were debating if 7-8 year olds should play in tournaments:confused:

stay cool ;)
 
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So far it has been a 50/50 mixed feeling,

The top players have decided to play up in the 12's and get their butts kicked, :)

The others 50% have opted to stay green for a little while, say 6 months

Bottom line if your kid is emotionally ready for losing in the next 6 months and hope he/she will not get discouraged, then stay with regulation,

If not then your kid should be playing green ball for at least 6 months until their game gets better (physically and emotionally as well)

This applies to the sections that are already using green,
 
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Funny you say that. I did something similar, I worked at a school with a boy who is in a talent squad, his brother (15) just returned from playing on some form of junior tour in Spain I believe. The boy (8) was playing regulation ball and at a high level, I believe he went very deep in some strong U10's tournaments with reg ball. I, among others in a school group, put him on an orange court and he had no concept of spin, direction, pace, etc. He struggled to hit the ball in a good strike zone and he was used to the pace and bounce of a regulation ball, this meant he had no skills besides hitting a high bouncing ball. Slice, he was done.

We have several average kids at our clubs, train once a week for 1 hour, usually just mucking around as well, and they would have beaten him easily.

I believe in the quickstart system because I'm a part of a program that is developing fast and has dedicated staff and parents. Go find out about Mike Barrell and see some of his stuff

I know you did not mean to, but you have made my point for me with your post. I have said many times 8 year olds get rushed into tournaments and win U10s and are set up for failure. Your example is exactly that. It also makes my point that U10s tournies are worthless. When you say "strong U10s" I almost choke with laughter....sorry.

The problem with your 8 year old was not Quickstart or lack of it....it was horrible coaching and rushing into tournaments. You can teach kids spin, pace, direction, positioning with regulation balls. We have done it for decades using hand feeding etc.

Now...do not be offended....your comment on "good strike zone" made me cringe. That is so 10 years ago. Who taught you that?

Today's game involves the ability, especially with boys, of being able to handle high kicking top spin. The concept of hitting every ball in the waist strike zone is done, over, dead end. You teach a boy that with today's equipment and topspin and he will be destroyed by the top players by age 14.

That is the problem with Quickstart, the kids sit and wait and every ball is at just the right spot. Not translatable to the real world. Moving back to get into proper position when there is time is fine.....taking every ball in the "good strike zone" is horrible training.

I suggest you read this from a fellow Australian who I hope you have heard of as he is quite big in Australian tennis circles. He knows all about this...today's game is about taking balls up high and taking time away.

Here is a quote:

"JOHN FITZGERALD: I'm not sure about pampering. I think what you have to do is give your young players the best facilities, the best coaching to give them the right technique because the game is different now than when I played.

It's not played on surfaces that are low and fast. This is a slow surface and high bouncing game now worldwide. If you make it into the pros you never virtually play on a court surface that is low and fast. It's a different ball game now.

So you have to teach them the right technique"

http://www.abc.net.au/sundayprofile/stories/3064923.htm?site=perth

And I flat out guarantee you my 6 year old would blow any kid you have off the court with an orange ball, as would many of my students. She would get to balls sooner, set up faster, generate more pace and spin. She would take balls on the rise and your kids would not have a clue what to do as they would get very few in the "good strike zone". Your kids try to slice like you say and she would be on those before they even landed on a small court.

It is not rocket science, a well trained kid used to having to cover an entire court and react to regular balls would own a kid used to only a small court and slow balls.

The 8 year old you cited just was trained very poorly. But the funny thing is you say "his only skill is hitting high bouncing balls"....well my friend that is a skill all your kids better learn dang soon.

I have a funny feeling if you checked back in 7 years the 8 year old will get the last laugh on your Quickstarters.
 
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^^^^^^ TCF I need royalties for this parallel ;)

BTW If Li NA wins the Australian there will be a billion chinese players and your prediction will come true:)
 
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Yup, they are already training loads of them over there, attacking tennis the same way they attacked other sports. Li Na will just inspire them even more.

Making it in the pros in tennis is going to become orders of magnitude harder with each passing decade.
 
And I flat out guarantee you my 6 year old would blow any kid you have off the court with an orange ball, as would many of my students. She would get to balls sooner, set up faster, generate more pace and spin. She would take balls on the rise and your kids would not have a clue what to do as they would get very few in the "good strike zone". Your kids try to slice like you say and she would be on those before they even landed on a small court.

It is not rocket science, a well trained kid used to having to cover an entire court and react to regular balls would own a kid used to only a small court and slow balls.

I hear what you're saying, but I think you'd probably agree that it would take an extremely well-taught, disciplined, and physically gifted 10-year old to be able to do this over two sets of regulation tennis. That's probably another reason to instill the good habits you mentioned early on as much as possible and not rush into tournaments.

The 8 year old you cited just was trained very poorly. But the funny thing is you say "his only skill is hitting high bouncing balls"....well my friend that is a skill all your kids better learn dang soon.

As I'm sure you've seen, many youngsters remedy the high bouncing balls by out-lobbing his/her opponent from the back fence, probably using an extreme grip in the process. Seems like it's just something they can't help, either because they are not strong enough or not disciplined enough to do what they're taught in a match setting - and they want to win!!
 
It is understandable, you are frustrated. You and I are very similar, only difference between you and I is anger. You are angry, I am not.:)

The fact is many of the top 50 are playing 12's. If your kid is ready, play him in the 12's and see what happens, if not, he is fine for now (3-6 months) with the green ball on full court.

BTW,,,,,,Where were you when we were debating if 7-8 year olds should play in tournaments:confused:

stay cool ;)

Yes, I'm sure we are very similar. I'm just frustrated for my son. You're right about being angry with the USTA, this is not a new development. Now that my son is feeling the frustration my feelings have escalated (depends on my level of sleep. :) As of now, there is not much of a reason, I don't believe, to play with the green ball. I have put my son in a USTA league to play some matches. He is playing on a 14 and under intermediate team (the advanced kids are way too big and strong). In the summer I'll have him play a 12 and under perhaps. 9 year olds are much more emotional than 11 or 12 year olds, and my son does not take to losing very well, which is one reason why he has improved greatly over the last two years. He won his last two tournaments at the end of the year and his ability level is top 10. Do you think that there will be more young players in the 12's now?
 
Yes, I'm sure we are very similar. I'm just frustrated for my son. You're right about being angry with the USTA, this is not a new development. Now that my son is feeling the frustration my feelings have escalated (depends on my level of sleep. :) As of now, there is not much of a reason,I don't believe, to play with the green ball. I have put my son in a USTA league to play some matches. He is playing on a 14 and under intermediate team (the advanced kids are way too big and strong). In the summer I'll have him play a 12 and under perhaps. 9 year olds are much more emotional than 11 or 12 year olds, and my son does not take to losing very well, which is one reason why he has improved greatly over the last two years. He won his last two tournaments at the end of the year and his ability level is top 10. Do you think that there will be more young players in the 12's now?
I know of a top 10 who will turn nine next month who will start playing 12's next month yet may not be emotionally ready. Another top 10 who is 8 is still playing green, and is fine with winning green, so there you have it. But like I said there are many top 50 who are 9 years old who are playing 12 and getting their butts kicked, they are ok with losing. So if your kid is not ready for the 12's emotionally, he should stay in the 10's green for a little while say 3-6 months max. It will not screw up his timing providing they are using the green dunlops (they just came out and are very close to regulation in weight feel and playability only they bounce a little lower). We are also playing intermediate U14 team tennis using regulation, it is fun and more relaxing.
 
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It will not screw up his timing providing they are using the green dunlops (they just came out and are very close to regulation in weight feel and playability only they bounce a little lower).

Do you have a good source for these balls (green Dunlop)? I have Price Play n Stay 78 and Gamma Quick Kids 78 and the Gammas are too soft and slow, almost like orange balls IMO. I like the Prince, but the are quite expensive.
 
Do you have a good source for these balls (green Dunlop)? I have Price Play n Stay 78 and Gamma Quick Kids 78 and the Gammas are too soft and slow, almost like orange balls IMO. I like the Prince, but the are quite expensive.

http://www.dunlopsport.com/gb/catalog/2010/tennis/balls/stage1-green

contact your dunlop distributor or TW ( they might want to consider getting them in the future)

I have tried more than 1/2 dozen green balls as well as the prince and these dunlop are the closest to regulation and the most consistent bounce, the others were just too light, went dead quick, not consistent and flight path curved when you smack them, more like quickstart type orange ball (which BTW have been updated to make them a little heavier)
 
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the wilson green dot are a close second, the prince play/stay and penn control are close third

again these balls just came out and if you say you have used green balls 1,2,3 years ago chances are you were using the light stuff which are no good and are slowly being discontinued and phased out.

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another one plus million given in grants in 2010 by usta serves, now before you go and jump on me and say this is only one million where is the rest:confused:, this is only one branch of the USTA there are many more branches and foundations etc......

http://www.racquetsportsindustry.com/news/2011/01/usta_serves_awards_more_than_1.html

over the years usta serves has given

$3 million in college scholarships and player incentive awards to middle school students and high school seniors.
$10 million to fund 196 programs in over 150 cities in 43 states, the District of Columbia and Puerto Rico.
18 million hours of mentoring, tutoring and nutritional guidance to more than 170,000 children.
$427,650 has been awarded to 17 Tennis Programs serving people with disabilities in 10 states plus Puerto Rico
 
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I know of a top 10 who will turn nine next month who will start playing 12's next month yet may not be emotionally ready. Another top 10 who is 8 is still playing green, and is fine with winning green, so there you have it. But like I said there are many top 50 who are 9 years old who are playing 12 and getting their butts kicked, they are ok with losing. So if your kid is not ready for the 12's emotionally, he should stay in the 10's green for a little while say 3-6 months max. It will not screw up his timing providing they are using the green dunlops (they just came out and are very close to regulation in weight feel and playability only they bounce a little lower). We are also playing intermediate U14 team tennis using regulation, it is fun and more relaxing.

Thanks for your thoughts. My son isn't in the top 10 but only due to the number of events he has played. He has a win over a top 10 player 6-1. I think the USTA U14 team is a nice stop gap until the summer when he can try playing some 12's. It is pretty clear to me that many matches are won due to size and strength and not talent at these levels. The young guys just don't have the height or the strength of someone 2-3 years older. The older kids can just push the ball back until the smaller guy misses or hit semi lobs that land mid court and bounce over the kids head at the baseline. This is one reason I am all for the soft ball. My frustration lies in the fact that 2012 was supposed to be when Quickstart was initiated, at least that's what was sent to me in the mail. Kids, in my opinion, should not go backwards if they have been playing for over 2 years with the regular ball.
 
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