Arti
Professional
also h25. I think that the 22 and 19 are just different mold codes. the h25 is the lm instinct copy.
Verdasco new head racquet
- Thread starter futureverdasco
- Start date
Anh Bigtoe
Banned
Thank you for your information.
So now I know Wilson's pro stock racquet H19, H22, H25 are 3 copied of Head's pro stock racquets!
Arti
Professional
Ok. What @dr325i is saying, and is very much the correct one in this argument, is that H19, H22 and H25 are the pro stock codes for Wilson's pro stock frames.
H19= Prestige MP copy.
H22= Radical-like racquet with v-shaped throat.
H25=LM Instinct copy.
The code on the hairpin serves to identify the layup and where and when the racquet was manufactured, not the racquet codes that I just described above. @dr325i is correct, you are confusing the name of the mold/frame with the hairpin factory ID code denoting when and where the racquet was made. They are two different codes. All Wilson H-whatever pro stocks are manufactured in China; HEAD pro stocks used to be made in Austria and identified with what @dr325i described "The '22' part is the factory they make them in. Therefore, the '22'= Austria. Newer PT57x's, PT113B, etc have H08xxxx codes, etc. since they moved production to China. My PT113Bs are H08113B", the Head pro stocks are now also made in china.
Anh Bigtoe
Banned
Newer PT57x's, PT113B, etc have H08xxxx codes, etc. since they moved production to China. My PT113Bs are H08113B.
Can you confirm the following:
1. Newer Djokovic's PT113B racquets are now have code PT113B on racquet throat and have code H08113B on hairpin?
2. Newer PT57A racquets are now have code PT57A on racquet throat and have code H0857A on hairpin?
3. Or newer PT113B and PT57A racquets are now do not have any code on racquet throat but they have H08113B and H0857A code on hairpin respectively?
Arti
Professional
Number 3 sounds about right. From pictures of Novak's and Andy's frames. I haven't seen the actual "PT...." code on the throat for a few years. Now they have the retail decals along with the players signature (like how Djokovic's racquet has NOVAK written in the throat).
Anh Bigtoe
Banned
There is another possible scenario that I forgot to mention in my previous post!
4. Newer PT113B and PT57A racquets are now do not have any code on racquet throat and they do not have any code on hairpin as well! I am suspecting the newer PT113B and PT57A racquets will have a piece of paper/sticker on hairpin with H08113B and H0857A code espectively.
If someone take out a piece of paper/sticker from the racquet's hairpin then we are all done. We will completely dumb about what is the racquet!
Head is trying to confuse all recreational players with their pro stock racquet's codes.
In near future, recreational players will not know whether the head racquet that they buy is pro stock racquet or retail racquet?
Head will make head pro stock racquets look exactly the same with their retail racquets!
Head will do that to protect their sale of retail racquets!
Arti
Professional
sure i guess
mpournaras
Hall of Fame
No he has been using the speed PJ since last winterDid Verdasco change PJs again?
moon shot
Hall of Fame
It was GrapheneXT and now it is Graphene Touch paint, that may be what you are seeing.Did Verdasco change PJs again?
MRfStop
Hall of Fame
Didn't he play with the XT Prestige at the USO? I haven't seen him play since then. Since the paint is different has he started back playing with the PT113B? Or is that what was under the XT Prestige paint?
moon shot
Hall of Fame
He had tested what appears to be the same 18x20 he is using now up to the end of 2015, but switched to the 16x19 Prestige before his epic match with Nadal at the AO'16. USO'16 was possibly his last match with the Prestige, after that he changed back to whatever 18x20 is under the Speed XT and now Touch paint.
You can roll through getty stock photos for timeline:
http://www.gettyimages.com/photos/v...erdasco&recency=daterange&sort=newest#license
I call this the Verdasco Cycle
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dr325i
G.O.A.T.
Verdasco is using the PT113B (previously he's used Prestige Rev Pro)He had tested what appears to be the same 18x20 he is using now up to the end of 2015, but switched to the 16x19 Prestige before his epic match with Nadal at the AO'16. USO'16 was possibly his last match with the Prestige, after that he changed back to whatever 18x20 is under the Speed XT and now Touch paint.
You can roll through getty stock photos for timeline:
http://www.gettyimages.com/photos/v...erdasco&recency=daterange&sort=newest#license
I call this the Verdasco Cycle
Here is the PT113B stamp under the pallets as asked above. I was trying to remember the factory code and recalled it was the H08. I was wrong, see below.
moon shot
Hall of Fame
Verdasco is using the PT113B (previously he's used Prestige Rev Pro)
Here is the PT113B stamp under the pallets as asked above. I was trying to remember the factory code and recalled it was the H08. I was wrong, see below.
Before the rev pro was that PT113B as well?
dr325i
G.O.A.T.
Yes, it was
futureverdasco
Rookie
Yea he just went back to the racquet he was using in 2015,
MRfStop
Hall of Fame
That's not what he is saying...he played with the PT113B under Graphene Speed paint, switched to the rev pro, and then switched back to the PT113B under Speed Touch paint.
moon shot
Hall of Fame
With as many frames as he's been with it was only a matter of time before he either got nostalgic or ran out of anything he hadn't used before.
MRfStop
Hall of Fame
It must be nice being able to have access to every rare pro stock racquet there is. With full customization.
mpournaras
Hall of Fame
Even if it was the same mold... it was most CERTAINLY a totally different layup.
Faris
Professional
very noobish question; can u please explain difference in mold versus layup? Is layup the string pattern or grommets?
Automatix
Legend
Mold - the shape/geometry of the racquet e.g. beam shape, width, headsize etc. Except for O3 frames (where the O-port holes are done via molding, not drilling) the mold does not have any impact on string pattern since holes are drilled post molding.
Composition - the type of, and in some cases the ratio at which, materials used. E.g. graphite, kevlar etc.
Layup - the way sheets of material are oriented and the angles they are bent at.
Neither has anything to do with drill pattern (drilled after molding) or length (cut after molding).
Using a cooking analogy.
The mold is for example a muffin form - it defines the shape and only shape. For example a form can be shaped like a star. So everything you bake with it will be shaped like a star but can be anything from carrot to chocolate cake.
The composition are the ingredients - so for carrot cake it will be carrots, flour, sugar etc. while chocolate cake will be different because it won't contain carrots but chocolate.
The layup is the order/orientation at which the ingredients are placed in the form.
I highly recommend watching one of the multiple videos showing how racquets are made.
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Faris
Professional
Thank you, very helpful.
dr325i
G.O.A.T.
Interesting, in another thread (Federer stick) you sounded like you knew or at least understood the basics of racket making and racket differences.
Turns out you know less than the 1% guy...
Faris
Professional
Never claimed I knew more than anyone. Call me out when I claim to know more than the guy designing the stick. I dont think layup or mold has anything to do with Wilson insider information.
haqq777
Legend
That was a cheap shot. He doesn't necessarily need to know technical details like molds, layup etc when it comes to basic supply chain management. I was reading the same thread too, FWIW.
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dr325i
G.O.A.T.
1) The guy you were drooling over is a GRAPHIC designer, not the racket designer. The guy that runs the paint department at BMW does not necessarily know the guts of the BMW latest engines. However, he is also briefed and taught to communicate to the public that it is "the ultimate driving machine"...
2) The pro stick layup has A LOT to do with the insider information. There are PLENTY of examples to show that: Novak's stick (very rare, not available to public, only those that used it and created it know the details about the layup). Same is with Federer's stick (I am not saying that it may not be the exact layup as the one sold in stores, especially since the information on his previous rackets layups is very limited, however, I have my own doubts and what Peter or any Wilson/Babolat/Head official tells here about the pro stocks should not be taken as a 100% correct). The mold is not an insider info as can (in most cases) easily be associated to the racket from plenty of pictures out there...
Faris
Professional
Drooling over? Jeez why do you have your panties in a bunch? If you don't agree with something just let it go. Just because you own a Novak stick does not necessarily make you an expert on how a product is developed from blue print stage all the way to retail sales. Non of the pictures "out here" prove anything so it's speculation of one guy versus someone who has actually worked on the stick. Until you provide a link with pictures of current Federer RF97A why don't you get off that facking high horse. Because you really do know less than you portray. End of discussion since you yourself are pretty much speculating and have no idea about how product development works.
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dr325i
G.O.A.T.
First of all, I C-L-E-A-R-L-Y stated above that I may have own speculations, but not claiming one way or the other.
Additionally, you have no idea what you're talking about as demonstrated by asking simple questions (what is a racket layup).
Your misrepresentation of the guy that "actually worked on the stick" is ruining your credibility in this argument and getting old. Get a simple concept - the guy is a graphic designer, uses CAD to design graphics for the racket. Has nothing to do with the layup, mold or any racket characteristics design...
I never claimed to be an expert on Novak's or any other racket. But yes, owning one, dissecting, analyzing, customizing and playing with two for past 12 months makes me more knowledgeable on it than you
Faris
Professional
Are you really that thick or being dense on purpose? Not knowing what a layup is completely irrelevant. Because a racquet from blue print stage to final retail sales has no weightage on how a basic supply chain for products works. You'd know if you had studied this. Apparently not.
Having worked for the company means he is exposed to things you are not, and clearly he knows more about those things than an anonymous poster like you. How hard is it for you to understand that?
Actually no, it doesn't. You have no idea about how supply chain management works which is pretty darn evident from your top comments right there. Owning a racquet is not the same and it is pretty comical to suggest otherwise. In fact I think because you own a touring pro's stick, you want to feel special and hence you are indulging in a confirmation bias that a pro can not have the same layup as retail.
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dr325i
G.O.A.T.
You got me there.
I do not know nothing about the supply chain industry (except that I worked in distribution for 5 years and managed them for 15)
You also got me on my knowledge of Head rackets.
You are good!
Faris
Professional
Thanks. And you definitely sound like someone who knows about SCM industry. Ahan
Anyway, its getting petty. You can choose to believe whatever you want to and I'll do the same. Only replied to you because you were taking a pot shot at me for no reason out of the blue for something being discussed in a completely unrelated thread.
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dr325i
G.O.A.T.
Both of them are using the PT113B with open string pattern
Benben245
Banned
In
In the interest of defining pronouns, I assume you are not referring to Djokovic playing with an open string pattern.
dr325i
G.O.A.T.
I believe you were talking about Verdasco and Mischa?
Tennisguy777
Professional
So is he using the graphene touch speed mp pj?
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mavsman149
Hall of Fame
Verdasco should switch back to his trusty Tecs!
projectone7
Rookie
ricki
Hall of Fame
It looks like some time after USO Verdasco switched to the 16x19 version.
So it is Prestige MP mold?
Tennisguy777
Professional
Does he have cap grommets?
ricki
Hall of Fame
NO, so radical as Djok?
vsbabolat
Talk Tennis Guru
They lied to you Nando doesn’t use the Speed. He does use a Speed paint job though but under the paint is an ancient Radical MP
I don't expect a racket company to tell me the actual racket they use, that'd break the kayfabe. But I would hope that the actual specs they provided are somewhat accurate.
Edit: Should also mention that these specs are from July but I didn't post until now.
