Very low poly tension on multi/poly ?

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
I know we use poly to tame gut. I am going to use iso baseline 16 as a cross for Velocity 16. Velocity is already tame. :cool:

I just tried first fb baseline 16 at 45 ... and that was a good. I think I could go a lot lower in fb. I know guys (@mikeler ) are going as low as 30# fb poly. FB Velocity 52 is control ... nothing like gut.

Has anyone tried something like Velocity 52-55/poly 30s? If fb poly 30# is good, why not as a cross for multi? I doubt you would get a launch angle problem with Velocity like gut or powerful multi.
 

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
No, the Baseline will still lose tension faster than Velocity and stabilize in the high teens. Pro Line II, maybe not since it is already pre-stretched. Too loose and the mains will tend to behave erratically-->loss of control and higher launch angles. If your mains were much stiffer, then this would not be an issue. But Velocity is not Kevlar. I would advise a trial of 52# Velocity and perhaps 46# or 47# Baseline crosses. The Baseline will lose tension anyway, but hopefully stabilize in the high or mid 30's. You could pre-stretch the Baseline before giving it to your stringer. Just don't hurt yourself doing it. :D

The frame may squash a little < ¼", but I would not worry about it unless it were ½" shorter.
 

fjcamry

Semi-Pro
I don't know about 16g at very low tension , but I've tensioned the 1.20 and 1.25 and 1.15 at 39lbs and the feel is good only for an hour . Then the accuracy and trajectory starts to become unpredictable.


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esgee48

G.O.A.T.
OP's name is ByeByePoly for a reason. He is dipping his big toe back into poly waters but poly feel is not his goal. As @Traffic says, he may end up with a string machine.
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
No, the Baseline will still lose tension faster than Velocity and stabilize in the high teens. Pro Line II, maybe not since it is already pre-stretched. Too loose and the mains will tend to behave erratically-->loss of control and higher launch angles. If your mains were much stiffer, then this would not be an issue. But Velocity is not Kevlar. I would advise a trial of 52# Velocity and perhaps 46# or 47# Baseline crosses. The Baseline will lose tension anyway, but hopefully stabilize in the high or mid 30's. You could pre-stretch the Baseline before giving it to your stringer. Just don't hurt yourself doing it. :D

The frame may squash a little < ¼", but I would not worry about it unless it were ½" shorter.

The V1s are egg shaped ... could probably only improve them with some squashing.

Yeah ... where the tension settles is what I need to know. I need to play this first fb long enough to see if/when it settles. Velocity is great on the front ... it drops approx 10% pretty quickly and settles there until it breaks. If the cross drops much more than the main ... you could make the case to string at equal tension, and then you end up at your goal after cross tension loss. Say V loses 10% and B loses 20%. V 50/B 50 ends up as 45/40 DT.
 

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
Look at the TWU string database. Most of the polys lose about 40% or more of ref tension. Only one that does not is the fabled 4G. YMMV, but if you string Vel/50 and BL/50, you may end up Vel/45 and BL/30 or thereabouts. To mitigate the BL tension loss, pre-stretch the sucker. That's one of the reasons you pre-stretch poly. There's an art involved as well as knowing polys suck at holding tension. :p

FWIW, you would have been better off using Babolat SpiralTech (SG) as a cross as it is as slippery as Hэll. That or ZX which is way more $$.
 

USPTARF97

Hall of Fame
OP's name is ByeByePoly for a reason. He is dipping his big toe back into poly waters but poly feel is not his goal. As @Traffic says, he may end up with a string machine.

My bad, thought he said in the original post there he hit with a full bed of poly at 45 and it was good. If that was good, low tension hybrid 44/48- 48/52 with poly mains and the multi crosses is much easier on the arm than what he was hitting with and gives some good results. Never heard of multi mains staying in a racquet very long and they turn into a rocket launcher. I have tried a few times with the same results.
 
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ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
Look at the TWU string database. Most of the polys lose about 40% or more of ref tension. Only one that does not is the fabled 4G. YMMV, but if you string Vel/50 and BL/50, you may end up Vel/45 and BL/30 or thereabouts. To mitigate the BL tension loss, pre-stretch the sucker. That's one of the reasons you pre-stretch poly. There's an art involved as well as knowing polys suck at holding tension. :p

FWIW, you would have been better off using Babolat SpiralTech (SG) as a cross as it is as slippery as Hэll. That or ZX which is way more $$.

40% … I'm going to need to mail @Shroud my newly strung Baseline so he can beat down to elbow safe range. :p
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
Thought he said in the original post there he hit with a full bed of poly at 45 and it was good. If that was good low tension 44/48- 48/52 with poly mains and the multi crosses is much easier on the arm than what he was hitting with and gives some good results.

I liked fb poly (RPM) in the past. I tried poly/sg a couple of times and never liked it. Still got the negative feel of poly ... but without the big spin. I'm not a big string breaker, so multi/poly makes more sense for me. It keeps the strings straight/er, maybe a bump in spin, and more comfort from multi main. I already tried velocity/cream and liked it, just got the tension to low the first try. If V/B doesn't work, I will go back to that and up the tension. Cream holds tension great. For $40 a reel, it was a cheap experiment to see if baseline could work as the cross. This one attempt at fb poly again is more curiosity at my 1 year post tennis elbow. My hand and forearm are feeling poly fatigue right now after just one ball machine session. Guess I answered that for sure, forget poly accept maybe poly cross.
 

USPTARF97

Hall of Fame
I liked fb poly (RPM) in the past. I tried poly/sg a couple of times and never liked it. Still got the negative feel of poly ... but without the big spin. I'm not a big string breaker, so multi/poly makes more sense for me. It keeps the strings straight/er, maybe a bump in spin, and more comfort from multi main. I already tried velocity/cream and liked it, just got the tension to low the first try. If V/B doesn't work, I will go back to that and up the tension. Cream holds tension great. For $40 a reel, it was a cheap experiment to see if baseline could work as the cross. This one attempt at fb poly again is more curiosity at my 1 year post tennis elbow. My hand and forearm are feeling poly fatigue right now after just one ball machine session. Guess I answered that for sure, forget poly accept maybe poly cross.

RPM blast in a Head Speed pro, the original white racquet with black on top is how I hurt my arm. Strung too tight and didn't realize how stiff that racquet was until it was too late. Went to a Head IG Radical Pro and played Isospeed mains and prince synthetic gut crosses after rehab for a number of months. Eventually went back to soft poly but even to this day I play low tension with whatever poly I use. Good luck with the set up.
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
RPM blast in a Head Speed pro, the original white racquet with black on top is how I hurt my arm. Strung too tight and didn't realize how stiff that racquet was until it was too late. Went to a Head IG Radical Pro and played Isospeed mains and prince synthetic gut crosses after rehab for a number of months. Eventually went back to soft poly but even to this day I play low tension with whatever poly I use. Good luck with the set up.

Cr@p ... fellow RPM victim. TE? How many months were you out? It's hard to believe we ever touch poly again.
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
About 3mths without playing. Allot of rehab. Played with low tension hybrid for awhile.

I could not play matches (serves and FHs pain) for 8+ months, but 3-4 of those were winter where I would not have played anyway. I did use light hits as part of my rehab after 2+ months. I think many of us never heal 100% and we need to be very careful from now on. That said, I was like you and got very little warning. My elbow is making a few popping sounds (I assume tendon or ligament) this morning. No pain. I had this popping sound clear into this year, even when I seemed healed and playing with zero pain. I hadn't noticed that popping had totally disappeared.

I have my warning ... heading back to stringer this morning. My fb poly days are over. My poly cross days may also be over, but that is the next test. Velocity 16 @52/Baseline 16 @45. I am disappointed that I can't track the baseline tension loss in the fb ... but not worth the risk.

If baseline cross doesn't work, might try velocity 17 black as a cross for my velocity 16 natural mains.
 

USPTARF97

Hall of Fame
I could not play matches (serves and FHs pain) for 8+ months, but 3-4 of those were winter where I would not have played anyway. I did use light hits as part of my rehab after 2+ months. I think many of us never heal 100% and we need to be very careful from now on. That said, I was like you and got very little warning. My elbow is making a few popping sounds (I assume tendon or ligament) this morning. No pain. I had this popping sound clear into this year, even when I seemed healed and playing with zero pain. I hadn't noticed that popping had totally disappeared.

I have my warning ... heading back to stringer this morning. My fb poly days are over. My poly cross days may also be over, but that is the next test. Velocity 16 @52/Baseline 16 @45. I am disappointed that I can't track the baseline tension loss in the fb ... but not worth the risk.

If baseline cross doesn't work, might try velocity 17 black as a cross for my velocity 16 natural mains.

Good luck to you, you will hit a combination that works. I am definitely much more conscious of doing stretches, using bands, and elbow specific exercises especially before I play. All it took to get hurt was one 120-125mile an hour serve into my backhand when the temp was in the 40's.
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
Good luck to you, you will hit a combination that works. I am definitely much more conscious of doing stretches, using bands, and elbow specific exercises especially before I play. All it took to get hurt was one 120-125mile an hour serve into my backhand when the temp was in the 40's.

That doesn't sound the same as TE/RSI. With TE, my number #1 recommendation is forearm and tricep massage (I use roller bar), and during healing theraband flexbar.

Thx for feedback ... let's stay on the courts.
 

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
Very good! Passing on some basic ideas. If you are afraid of shock from hitting the ball, gravitate towards softer strings (stiffness < 190#/in), thicker gauges (≥ 16 Ga) and lower tensions (≤ 55# unless NG) or some combo. Other factoid is to move towards higher SW frames, not necessarily higher mass, but perhaps more HH. The frame will win the ball collision and your arm does not have to hurt. You may give up some rpms, but the arm comes first.

You could probably sell your remainder of the BL to someone on the forum. There are a lot of string-a-holics here.

SpiralTech comes in Blue. :D
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
Very good! Passing on some basic ideas. If you are afraid of shock from hitting the ball, gravitate towards softer strings (stiffness < 190#/in), thicker gauges (≥ 16 Ga) and lower tensions (≤ 55# unless NG) or some combo. Other factoid is to move towards higher SW frames, not necessarily higher mass, but perhaps more HH. The frame will win the ball collision and your arm does not have to hurt. You may give up some rpms, but the arm comes first.

You could probably sell your remainder of the BL to someone on the forum. There are a lot of string-a-holics here.

SpiralTech comes in Blue. :D

BLUE? BBP is such a girl.

Sell my V1s I bought for TE? You are just f****** with me aren't you.

BTW ...my hamstring feels WAY better after limping ball machine session. Whack.
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
Very good! Passing on some basic ideas. If you are afraid of shock from hitting the ball, gravitate towards softer strings (stiffness < 190#/in), thicker gauges (≥ 16 Ga) and lower tensions (≤ 55# unless NG) or some combo. Other factoid is to move towards higher SW frames, not necessarily higher mass, but perhaps more HH. The frame will win the ball collision and your arm does not have to hurt. You may give up some rpms, but the arm comes first.

You could probably sell your remainder of the BL to someone on the forum. There are a lot of string-a-holics here.

SpiralTech comes in Blue. :D

My stringer just shook his head this morning. I told him Velocity/Baseline ... he said: 1) that won't change anything 2) you want the Velocity in the mains ... more head shaking 3) it's your $.

Stringers aren't good listeners like bartenders. :p
 

BlueB

Legend
I've played various multis, natgut and syngut crossed with poly, at 60/40. It's totally doable. Launch angle and spin will be up, control down. The head will shorten by few mm.
You need to prestretch the poly.

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Traffic

Hall of Fame
My stringer just shook his head this morning. I told him Velocity/Baseline ... he said: 1) that won't change anything 2) you want the Velocity in the mains ... more head shaking 3) it's your $.

Stringers aren't good listeners like bartenders. :p
So when are you shopping for a DW stringing machine? Actually, if I had to do it again, I might think about a crank... Something about the straight pull and being able to control the rate of pull and how many times you have to load the string as you dial in the right tension.

BTW, I had a chance to hit with a co-worker. I strung his APD with Gamma Moto Soft/Cream. Wow, that stick hits fun. I was able to swing much faster for good drive with even more spin. Nice Nadal-esque FH going line drive 4' over the net and then dipping at the service line. I can also see that I was taking harder swings than I do with my V1P. Probably elbow soreness would eventually get me. The GMS/Cream felt pretty comfy though. Initially, not noticeably stiffer than gut/poly. I'm thinking the lighter racquet plus harder swings would eventually be my downfall.

My co-worker is a better player. He was commenting on how it didn't take much to get some pop out of my racquet. He needed to add the spin to prevent the ball sailing long. I had a lot of trouble returning his low, flat groundstrokes. And his shots were so consistent. Like hitting a ball machine.
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
I've played various multis, natgut and syngut crossed with poly, at 60/40. It's totally doable. Launch angle and spin will be up, control down. The head will shorten by few mm.
You need to prestretch the poly.

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Interesting ... seems like it could work. I don't have enough experience with hybrids, but it seems you could take the tension you prefer for a sting in FB, and use same tension for hybrid. Gut at 60 makes sense, and poly at 40 makes sense, so why not 60/40? I figured someone here had tried it.

We will see what V 52/B 45 plays like off the stinger, and see if it plays "consistent enough" until I restring. If it feels good with straight strings for 20 hours I win.
 

BlueB

Legend
Well you could always restring the cross at higher tension, if 60/40 ended up playing too loosy-goosy.

I personally have stopped using such a high differential...

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ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
So when are you shopping for a DW stringing machine? Actually, if I had to do it again, I might think about a crank... Something about the straight pull and being able to control the rate of pull and how many times you have to load the string as you dial in the right tension.

BTW, I had a chance to hit with a co-worker. I strung his APD with Gamma Moto Soft/Cream. Wow, that stick hits fun. I was able to swing much faster for good drive with even more spin. Nice Nadal-esque FH going line drive 4' over the net and then dipping at the service line. I can also see that I was taking harder swings than I do with my V1P. Probably elbow soreness would eventually get me. The GMS/Cream felt pretty comfy though. Initially, not noticeably stiffer than gut/poly. I'm thinking the lighter racquet plus harder swings would eventually be my downfall.

My co-worker is a better player. He was commenting on how it didn't take much to get some pop out of my racquet. He needed to add the spin to prevent the ball sailing long. I had a lot of trouble returning his low, flat groundstrokes. And his shots were so consistent. Like hitting a ball machine.

Never hit a APD, but figure it's in the ballpark of my old PD. PDs are ridiculously easy to hit ... that's why they sell so many of them. Lot's of player styles could easily hit a PD. You are still young enough with great wheels to play heavy ts baseline game if you want. I need to start shortening some points. BTW ... your FH struck me as something primed and ready to go bigger/heavier if you ever wanted to.

Don't think a stringer is in my future. My experimenting is temporary. :rolleyes:
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
Well you could always restring the cross at higher tension, if 60/40 ended up playing too loosy-goosy.

I personally have stopped using such a high differential...

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Velocity is mid-low power, not even close to gut. 55 is the highest I have strung it, and would not go higher. So what I'm really working out is the baseline cross tension. I almost started at 55/45 ... but I figure Baseline 45 is still lower powered that Velocity at 52. I expect V 52/B 45 to be a little less power than FB V @52. We will see. I don't get the racquet until Saturday, so maybe a Sat ball machine session.
 

cg.tennis

Rookie
Just for your reference.
I strung Velocity 17g full bed, main 50 lbs, and cross 45 lbs (on my IG extreme pro 2.0). The power is about average with this setup.
I also strung Velocity 17g hybrid, Velocity main 50 lbs, and Volkl Vstar 18g 35lbs. The power is also around average. The benefit with this hybrid set up is it has more spin and predictability of launch angle. It's a little bit stiffer than the full string job of Velocity 17g.
I recently purchased Cream 17g to test. I also strung Velocity main 50lbs and Cream 17 cross 35 lbs. I haven't played with this set up yet.
 

ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
Just for your reference.
I strung Velocity 17g full bed, main 50 lbs, and cross 45 lbs (on my IG extreme pro 2.0). The power is about average with this setup.
I also strung Velocity 17g hybrid, Velocity main 50 lbs, and Volkl Vstar 18g 35lbs. The power is also around average. The benefit with this hybrid set up is it has more spin and predictability of launch angle. It's a little bit stiffer than the full string job of Velocity 17g.
I recently purchased Cream 17g to test. I also strung Velocity main 50lbs and Cream 17 cross 35 lbs. I haven't played with this set up yet.

I will be curious how the cream works for you. I found v 52/c 50 to powerful. I expect cream @35 will be to powerful, but you are use to lower tensions. Let us know.
 

USPTARF97

Hall of Fame
That doesn't sound the same as TE/RSI. With TE, my number #1 recommendation is forearm and tricep massage (I use roller bar), and during healing theraband flexbar.

Thx for feedback ... let's stay on the courts.

In the rehab process cross fiber massage from the elbow to the wrist and stretches was most effective. Once I could do allot of the rehab without pain.. continued stretches and building strength with my wrist, forearm, tricep etc with bands and light dumbells. All of this was necessary before picking up a racquet again. If you have pain and you play anyway the epicondylitus can become chronic and it won't matter what string you play with. Starting back too early is extremely counter productive. I've been 5yrs without pain playing open level tennis.
 
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ByeByePoly

G.O.A.T.
In the rehab process cross fiber massage from the elbow to the wrist and stretches was most effective. Once I could do allot of the rehab without pain.. continued stretches and building strength with my wrist, forearm, tricep etc with bands and light dumbells. All of this was necessary before picking up a racquet again. If you have pain and you play anyway the epicondylitus can become chronic and it won't matter what string you play with. Starting back too early is extremely counter productive. I've been 5yrs without pain playing open level tennis.

I did some of the cross tendon massages at first, but then pretty much just did the flexbar and massaged with fingers lengthwise from wrist to elbow. Also, roller bar. I did no stretching because I read several places where you really don't want to stretch a tendon injury, other than the eccentric load stretch (flexbar). Who knows with TE for sure .... nobody including doctors, PT, scientists. You can go to the "health" forum and search for me and you will find me there talking about TE for months. Thank goodness it's strings and tips now. Yes, well aware that TE can turn chronic. One of my "guesses" was light hitting was good/best PT for me rather than just sit out for 6-12 months. It worked out ... but you are never sure with TE that it would have worked out the same regardless given enough time.

Your "happened on a serve return" still sounds like something different than RSI. Maybe a tendon injury is a tendon injury regardless if one time trauma or repetitive stress injury.

Open ... good for you. I peaked at 4.5 ... with some 5.0 play. You were one of those guys that would pass me when I came to the net on a bluff. :D
 

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
So when are you shopping for a DW stringing machine? Actually, if I had to do it again, I might think about a crank... Something about the straight pull and being able to control the rate of pull and how many times you have to load the string as you dial in the right tension.
Your upgrade path is easy. Get a WISE and DW adapter. The rest of your system is fine.
 

USPTARF97

Hall of Fame
I did some of the cross tendon massages at first, but then pretty much just did the flexbar and massaged with fingers lengthwise from wrist to elbow. Also, roller bar. I did no stretching because I read several places where you really don't want to stretch a tendon injury, other than the eccentric load stretch (flexbar). Who knows with TE for sure .... nobody including doctors, PT, scientists. You can go to the "health" forum and search for me and you will find me there talking about TE for months. Thank goodness it's strings and tips now. Yes, well aware that TE can turn chronic. One of my "guesses" was light hitting was good/best PT for me rather than just sit out for 6-12 months. It worked out ... but you are never sure with TE that it would have worked out the same regardless given enough time.

Your "happened on a serve return" still sounds like something different than RSI. Maybe a tendon injury is a tendon injury regardless if one time trauma or repetitive stress injury.

Open ... good for you. I peaked at 4.5 ... with some 5.0 play. You were one of those guys that would pass me when I came to the net on a bluff. :D

I don't know, just took the doctors diagnosis and followed the directions of he and the trainer. Arm healed and hasn't been a problem.
 

fjcamry

Semi-Pro
My bad, thought he said in the original post there he hit with a full bed of poly at 45 and it was good. If that was good, low tension hybrid 44/48- 48/52 with poly mains and the multi crosses is much easier on the arm than what he was hitting with and gives some good results. Never heard of multi mains staying in a racquet very long and they turn into a rocket launcher. I have tried a few times with the same results.

How about hybrid on my youtek speed pro with mains 16g Kirschbaum multifilament- crosses 17L Kirschbaum proline X at 55-51lbs? Or maybe 57-53lbs? My references are 57lbs on full syngut 17g and 53lbs on full poly setups .


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fjcamry

Semi-Pro
58/52 would be a good tension. Something interesting is put the poly in the mains and go around 44/48- 48/52.

I would like this in my multi mains / proline ll crosses for my youtek speed pro . I already play on 17g syngut / 18g proline ll crosses at 55/51. But multifilament being softer than syngut , would it be better to go with 57/53? As my references for full 17g syngut is 57lbs , and 53lbs for 16g poly.


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TennisCJC

Legend
in a v1, I would use poly mains in 46-52 lb range depending on the poly and a syn gut cross + 3 lbs from poly tension. longer mains in v1 need to be tamed. If you want softer mains, try a good multi 16G in the mains at 52 and a smooth poly cross at 48 lbs.
 
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