Vitamin D Deficiency

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
Excellent feedback from @Soul above. Highest UV index during Spring & Summer months usually occurs about/after 1pm or so (adjusted for DST). Best to get 15 to 20 minutes of exposure, w/o sunscreen, from 11am to 3pm (or 3:30pm).

You might also supplement with 2000 IU (up to 4000 IU) of D3 daily to help get your D level up to normal. Note that 4000 IU/day is regarded as a Safe Upper Limit.

https://www.webmd.com/diet/guide/vitamin-d-deficiency#2-6
https://www.medicinenet.com/vitamin_d_deficiency/article.htm
 
Last edited:

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru


In the South Bay Area, the UV index is getting up to 8+ (nearly 9) from noon to 2pm or so at this time of the year. Best to get 15-20 mins of exposure between 11am to 3pm (or 3:30). Theoretically, the highest UV index would happen close to the first day of summer. So, the highest levels of the year generally occurs 3 months before and 3 months after that = the Spring & Summer months.

NOTE: If you closely inspect sunrise and sunset times for the area, you can calculate the middle of the day occurring about/after 1pm DST (but before 1:30pm).
 
Last edited:

Ramon

Legend
I forgot what my exact level was, but my doctor told me I was deficient in Vitamin D, which I can believe because my job is indoors, and the only time I'm outdoors for an extended time is when I play tennis. I took 10,000 IU capsules of Vitamin D3 3 days a week. On my next blood test, the doctor said I was normal.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
I forgot what my exact level was, but my doctor told me I was deficient in Vitamin D, which I can believe because my job is indoors, and the only time I'm outdoors for an extended time is when I play tennis. I took 10,000 IU capsules of Vitamin D3 3 days a week. On my next blood test, the doctor said I was normal.
Did the doc give you a prescription for that? Or were you just taking two 5000 IU OTC capsules per dose? Your dosing is approx equal to 4000 IU daily -- which is probably fine with the doctor's say so but I, personally, wouldn't take that high a dose for an extended period of time.

Normally, I take only 2000 IU per day and get some additional vitamin D from fortified milk, high pulp OJ (enriched with Ca & vitamin D), eggs, salmon, sardines, tuna, mushrooms (sun grown) and a little bit of midday sun.
 
Last edited:

Ramon

Legend
Did the doc give you a prescription for that? Or were you just taking two 5000 IU capsules per dose? Your dosing is approx equal to 4000 IU daily -- which is probably fine with the doctor's say so , but I wouldn't take high a dose for an extended period of time.

Normally, I take only 2000 IU per day and get some additional vitamin D from milk, high pulp OJ (enriched with Ca & vitamin D), eggs, salmon, tuna and a little bit of midday sun.
All my doctor said was to take more Vitamin D. When I went to the health food store, where I usually get my vitamins, the 10,000 IU capsules were about the same price as the lesser capsules. Since I didn't have to take it as often, it was more economical. My follow-up test did not show an abnormally high amount of Vitamin D, so I figured that was good for me. The doctor said I was doing a good job on the Vitamin D even though I never mentioned what doses I was taking, so I left it at that. I just take them on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Sometimes, if the 10,000 IU capsules are not available, I just take 4,000 IU capsules and still take them 3 days a week.
 
Last edited:

Mac33

Hall of Fame
I struggle with getting enough sunlight too but I would not consider popping pills to make up for it.

Whether it's Big Pharma or vitamin pills from the local supermarket - I just have a in built distrust for them.

Must have popped less than a few dozen pills in my 53 years.
 

Soul

Semi-Pro
Something else to keep in mind, there are other benefits from sun exposure outside of raising vitamin D. There is a long list of benefits I've read, but sun exposure will lower blood pressure, some studies have found it extends life by around 6 years, reduce cancer risks for internal organs, raises nitric oxide levels which some believe low NO levels contributes to heart disease, raises feel good endorphin levels, etc.

There are several articles on the benefits of sensible sun exposure, one that i enjoyed can be seen here ~

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2018/01/12/what-causes-heart-disease-part-44/
 

r2473

Talk Tennis Guru
Since I started taking bacon supplements I've noticed improvements in every area of my life.
 

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
Did the doc give you a prescription for that? Or were you just taking two 5000 IU OTC capsules per dose? Your dosing is approx equal to 4000 IU daily -- which is probably fine with the doctor's say so but I, personally, wouldn't take that high a dose for an extended period of time.

Normally, I take only 2000 IU per day and get some additional vitamin D from fortified milk, high pulp OJ (enriched with Ca & vitamin D), eggs, salmon, sardines, tuna, mushrooms (sun grown) and a little bit of midday sun.
I had a doc prescribe 10,000 IU per day for 1 month cutting back to 4,000-6,000 per day when I was in the OPs boat. It certainly seemed to pick up my mood!
 

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
Not sure how the prescriptions works. I need a prescription for high dosage pills? I am guessing it is not covered by insurance?

I am also open to taking a monthly injection if that is an option. Prefer that over pills.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
I struggle with getting enough sunlight too but I would not consider popping pills to make up for it.

Whether it's Big Pharma or vitamin pills from the local supermarket - I just have a in built distrust for them.

Must have popped less than a few dozen pills in my 53 years.
Well then, you’ve got a problem then if you get to a point where your endogenous vitamin D levels are very low. Difficult, if not impossible, to get high enough levels from food sources alone. Maybe, after eating a ton of vit D-rich foods and getting more midday sun, you might get your levels back up to a respectable level after a number of Years.

High doses of vitamin C has been found to be very effective for reducing the severity and duration of a cold or flu. Not gonna get enough from food sources alone. In your early 50s, you might very well be able to avoid pharma or herbal/supplement solutions. Particularly, if you are blessed with great genes or decades of adequate exercise and good nutrition. But in your 60s and 70s, the body will eventually require other countermeasures.

At some point you will probably need to do some homework and find some herb or supplement manufacturers you trust more than Big Pharma. I suggest you look into Life Extension, Now Foods, Nature Made, Qunol, Vitamin Shoppe, Swanson or Pure Encapsulations to name a few.

If considering a given brand, you might look for a logo that indicates Good Manufacturing Practices. And also go for brands that have certification labels from organizations like the Natural Products Association, the U.S. Pharmacopeial Convention and the NSF as an indication of high-quality brands. The labels may read "USP Verified," "NPA Certified" or "NSF Certified."
 
Last edited:

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
I had a doc prescribe 10,000 IU per day for 1 month cutting back to 4,000-6,000 per day when I was in the OPs boat. It certainly seemed to pick up my mood!
Wow, sounds like quite a high dose. Was the prescription for D2 rather than D3?

Not sure how the prescriptions works. I need a prescription for high dosage pills? I am guessing it is not covered by insurance?

I am also open to taking a monthly injection if that is an option. Prefer that over pills.
If high-dosage D2 is actually prescribed, might be able to get insurance to pay for it. Injection possible as well. Insurance, however, will probably not pay for the more common form, D3. But I could be wrong about this.
 

Ramon

Legend
I struggle with getting enough sunlight too but I would not consider popping pills to make up for it.

Whether it's Big Pharma or vitamin pills from the local supermarket - I just have a in built distrust for them.

Must have popped less than a few dozen pills in my 53 years.
In your natural state you would be spending most of your daylight hours hunting and gathering with your friends and family. However, most of us don't have outdoor occupations, so getting enough sunlight is very difficult. Vitamin D has proven to be an important factor in the fight against cancer. I wouldn't let the simple fact that it's a pill jeopardize my health.
 

Mac33

Hall of Fame
I totally agree most of us are not getting enough sunlight,however popping pills is an unnatural way to get your neutrients.

Likely most of the ingredients will not be absorbed by the body anyway.

Sunlight is pushed by the media as dangerous when the exact opposite is true in most cases.

Just another reason I never watch the tel a lie vision.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
I totally agree most of us are not getting enough sunlight,however popping pills is an unnatural way to get your neutrients.

Likely most of the ingredients will not be absorbed by the body anyway.

Sunlight is pushed by the media as dangerous when the exact opposite is true in most cases.

Just another reason I never watch the tel a lie vision.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
I totally agree most of us are not getting enough sunlight,however popping pills is an unnatural way to get your neutrients.

Likely most of the ingredients will not be absorbed by the body anyway.

Sunlight is pushed by the media as dangerous when the exact opposite is true in most cases.

Just another reason I never watch the tel a lie vision.
I agree that it is normally best to get most of our nutrient needs from food and, in part, from the sun. Not always possible to get optimal amts, however, because of depletion in the soil and our food supply. Other environmental factors, sometimes carcinogenic, require nutrient levels much higher than available from food and the sun.

Many supplements, especially those in tablet form (with binding agents), are often not well utilized by the body. This is not true of vitamin d3 supplements -- which are usually available as gel capsules (no binding agents).

There is not a lot of vitamin D naturally available from food sources. Products such as milk, yogurt, cheese, OJ, soy milk, and almond milk will often be fortified or enriched with vitamin D. In effect, you are getting a vitamin D supplement in liquid form. This is really not all that different from drinking or eating a non-fortified product and then adding a D capsule as a supplement.

Note that a vit D capsule includes a little bit of protein (gelatin) and fat (since vit D is fat soluble). So really, that D capsule could simply be regarded as a processed food (w/o unnatural binding agents).

And, no, the dangers of overexposure to sunlight is not a myth. `tis true, moderate exposure has health benefits. However, an excessive exposure can, indeed, result in adverse effects such as dry leathery skin and, worse, melanoma. I know quite a few people that have this issue from an overexposure to the sun. So I know that it is not just a lie perpetrated by TV.

Part of the problem with too much sun exposure is that we have partially depleted some of our protective ozone layer. The ozone is supposed to prevent UVC from reaching us and, I believe, also limits the amt of UVB that we receive.

Because of this, we need to limit our exposure to the midday sun these days more than our ancestors did a century or two ago. OTOH, a century or two ago, not that many people were living past the age of 50. Many may have died from cancer or they may have died before they had a chance to develop cancer (from exposure to the sun or other causes). We can’t be sure.
 
Last edited:

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
In San Jose, I imagine just in the last month you are moving into the area were UVB rays are reaching the ground. Probably only between 11:00 and 2:00 could your skin make vitamin D this time of year.
I'm getting plenty of exposure during these times. Developed a strong tan over past two months.

Some people are not capable of producing enough Vitamin D. It has been in the 15-22 ng/mL range for years. Although I don't think I have any muscle pain/fatigue symptoms from the deficiency but it's hard to say... maybe I would have better physical endurance if it was normal.




 

Soul

Semi-Pro
Could be Raul. I wish I knew more. From what I've read age can play a roll too in ones ability to create vitamin D. The older one is, the less capable the body is able to make vitamin D. Hope you figure out what works for you.

I personally stopped taking vitamin D supplements. They didn't appear to be helping me as hoped. Now, being in S. Florida, I only sunbathe a few times a week, 10 minutes at a time. Don't know where my vitamin D levels test though.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
I'm getting plenty of exposure during these times. Developed a strong tan over past two months.

Some people are not capable of producing enough Vitamin D. It has been in the 15-22 ng/mL range for years. Although I don't think I have any muscle pain/fatigue symptoms from the deficiency but it's hard to say... maybe I would have better physical endurance if it was normal.




Vegan diet? Strict vegetarians often have lower D levels. And ppl with darker skin can spend more time in the sun but their body produces less D. More melanin equates to less vit D production, esp in older adults. Reduced kidney function can account for lower endogenous D levels. Might want to check that out. Other possibilities mentioned here:

https://www.webmd.com/diet/guide/vitamin-d-deficiency#2
 

WildVolley

Legend
Not sure how the prescriptions works. I need a prescription for high dosage pills? I am guessing it is not covered by insurance?

I am also open to taking a monthly injection if that is an option. Prefer that over pills.
You can go and buy high dosages of Vitamin D at a vitamin store in the US, at least. No need for a prescription.

I saw this video by Dr. Holick and he suggests supplementing about 3,000IUs a day if you're low. You can get the vitamin D in liquid form if you don't like pills.

 

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
Vegan diet? Strict vegetarians often have lower D levels. And ppl with darker skin can spend more time in the sun but their body produces less D. More melanin equates to less vit D production, esp in older adults. Reduced kidney function can account for lower endogenous D levels. Might want to check that out. Other possibilities mentioned here:

https://www.webmd.com/diet/guide/vitamin-d-deficiency#2
I wish I was a vegan. I eat too much meat... My kidney function is slightly below normal... Will check with my Doctor... The webmd link defines deficiency as below 12 ng/mL and 20 as adequate. My lab report defines deficiency as below 20. I am at 15...

The Dr Holick video above mentions that the RDA of vitamin D have gone up 3x in recent years so there is still much being learned on this subject.
 
Last edited:

Mac33

Hall of Fame
Windsurfing and tennis are by far my best two sources of sunshine.

I only play tennis though from mid to late afternoon and windsufing from around 3pm till nightfall.

I work night shift and get up around 2pm.

I open my sliding screen door to let as much sunlight in as possible and on days when I'm not playing sport I will sit on my balcony for 20 minutes or so.

My levels are likely low.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
@Raul_SJ
Windsurfing and tennis are by far my best two sources of sunshine.

I only play tennis though from mid to late afternoon and windsufing from around 3pm till nightfall.

I work night shift and get up around 2pm.

I open my sliding screen door to let as much sunlight in as possible and on days when I'm not playing sport I will sit on my balcony for 20 minutes or so.

My levels are likely low.
Reptile lights...

While some balanced-spectrum or full-spectrum indoor lighting filters or attenuates UV, some, by design, will provide it. Specialty light/lamp shops should carry both fluorescent and compact fluorescent lamps that are full or balanced spectrum. You have to make sure that you buy a product that transmits UVB light.

Reptile lights that you can buy in many pet stores will, I believe, provide both UVA and UVB for your iguana/lizard. I am sure that your lizard won’t mind sharing his UV light with you. They might actually require 2 lamps. One for heat (infrared) and the other one for UV. Someone correct me if I’m wrong about that.

Tanning bed lighting will also provide UVA/UVB. I am fairly certain that Cool white incandescent lighting does not produce UV light. In fact, it probably produces very little blue light either. Note that ordinary glass will filter/attenuate UV. Some UVA might be transmitted but very little, if any, UVB makes it thru. Clear and many translucent plastics are transparent to UV. This is why many eyeglasses made with plastic include a coating to block UV.

Have not see any spectrum specs on bright (ultra) white LED lighting. Don’t know if they provide UVA or UVB light. Gem lighting, used in the jewelry stores, are strong in the blue/violet end of the light spectrum. They probably provide some UV as well.

www.lrc.rpi.edu/programs/nlpip/lightinganswers/fullspectrum/production.asp
https://sunshinesciences.com/frequently-asked-questions
 
Last edited:

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
Note that balanced spectrum or full spectrum lighting with UV can enhance mood during the day. However, this type of lighting along with any bright light sources or light that has a strong blue content should avoided in the evening or at night. Use of these types of lights at night can throw off your circadian rhythm and suppress your melatonin production.

www.anapsid.org/liteheat.html

Note that the full-spectrum hype that in link above is probably referring to incandescent lighting that has been coated with neodymium. Not sure that any neodymium lamps will provide UVB. I think, NOT.
 
Last edited:

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
Correction. I thought that since I had tanned in the recent months I must be creating Vitamin D.

But apparently UV-A rays produces the tanning and UV-B rays produce the Vitamin D, so a tan does not necessarily equate to Vitamin D creation.

I guess most people in the Bay Area are NOT deficient. They synthesize the Vitamin D in other months of the year and that Vitamin D production carries them over for the full calendar year.

 
Last edited:

Mac33

Hall of Fame
Thanks all for the info.

Good to bring attention to what I consider a very serious problem.

Lack of sun exposure is unnatural as someone else mentioned.

We spend most of our adult lives indoors - working like slaves!

The combo of lack of sunshine and being physically and emotionally stressed working long hours very likely reduces our life expectancy greatly.

Everyone deficient in sunshine time should make a conscious effort to spend more time outside.
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
The threshold for Vitamin D3 toxicity is about 7,000 IU which is why OTC D3 typically goes up to 5,000 IU. Above that you need a prescription.

I have the deficiency (not surprising being in New England and working an office job) so I take 5,000 IU pills. It got me closer to normal but still not normal. The doctor said to take 7,000 mg. I suppose that I could ask for a prescription to bump it like some others have and then peel back to 5,000 IU. Lack of vitamin D3 can kill you. Or come close. Or greatly contribute to killing you.
 

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
I am seeing figures that about 20% in this country are Vitamin D deficient.

I would have expected the number to be much higher given all the people that work indoors and are rarely exposed to sunlight... But it is possible that the number is under-reported because many are not being tested and are unaware of the deficiency.
 

sureshs

Bionic Poster
I had one doctor prescribe Vitamin D to me and tell me that it is beneficial for a very wide range of issues. I also had another doctor tell me not to take the high dosage supplement because it increases calcium absorption and leads to kidney stones.
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
I had one doctor prescribe Vitamin D to me and tell me that it is beneficial for a very wide range of issues. I also had another doctor tell me not to take the high dosage supplement because it increases calcium absorption and leads to kidney stones.
Yup. Dosage is very important.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Talk Tennis Guru
I had one doctor prescribe Vitamin D to me and tell me that it is beneficial for a very wide range of issues. I also had another doctor tell me not to take the high dosage supplement because it increases calcium absorption and leads to kidney stones.
Increased calcium absorption sounds like a good thing. Kidney stones, not so much. :confused:
 

ollinger

G.O.A.T.
But it is possible that the number is under-reported because many are not being tested and are unaware of the deficiency.
or, as you find in the medical literature, the number of deficient may be over-reported. Scientists don't all agree that a level of 30 should be the lower limit of normal, and some feel the level should be perhaps 20, or even 12
 

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
or, as you find in the medical literature, the number of deficient may be over-reported. Scientists don't all agree that a level of 30 should be the lower limit of normal, and some feel the level should be perhaps 20, or even 12
This 2011 study used 20 as the lower limit of normal...Still an alarming number of deficiency.

Vitamin D deficiency was defined as a serum 25-hydroxyvitamin D concentrations ≤20 ng/mL (50 nmol/L). The overall prevalence rate of vitamin D deficiency was 41.6%, with the highest rate seen in blacks (82.1%), followed by Hispanics (69.2%). Vitamin D deficiency was significantly more common among those who had no college education, were obese, with a poor health status, hypertension, low high-density lipoprotein cholesterol level, or not consuming milk daily.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21310306
 
Top