Western or Semi-Western?

[EricW]

I'm a 4.0-4.5 player and I hit with the Western (recently switched like 2 months ago) and i'm wondering what people have to say about it. One person told me the western got more topspin, and less power. And the semiwestern had less topspin, more power.. I'm wondering what you guys think regarding the western/semi, and if it's just preference or one has some drawbacks that the other doesnt? Advantages? Thanks

I haven't really used it enough to make comparisons lklike some of you may be able to

 

[alan-n]

I'm a 4.0-4.5 player and I hit with the Western (recently switched like 2 months ago) and i'm wondering what people have to say about it. One person told me the western got more topspin, and less power. And the semiwestern had less topspin, more power.. I'm wondering what you guys think regarding the western/semi, and if it's just preference or one has some drawbacks that the other doesnt? Advantages? Thanks

I haven't really used it enough to make comparisons lklike some of you may be able to

4.0 - 4.5 and you don't know the difference... HMMMM most 4.0-4.5 players have already tried out various grips for themselves to figure the general weakness of each.. or better yet broken their opponents down during the match based on the weakness of the strokes, common now be honest about your rating.

 

[skuludo]

I get about the same max power. When I use western, I have problems timing shots that are around 60mph and up.

 

[EricW]

4.0 - 4.5 and you don't know the difference... HMMMM most 4.0-4.5 players have already tried out various grips for themselves to figure the general weakness of each.. or better yet broken their opponents down during the match based on the weakness of the strokes, common now be honest about your rating.

I asked my coach and he said i was 4.0 close to 4.5, i switched to the western not too long ago and i find it hard to play against flat hitters and don't get as much power with it. Now my question is, in the future, what will be the advantages and disadvantages. Know what I mean? Doing the western for such a short time i dont know if those problems will jhust get fixed or they will be longterm.

The thing is, I'm better with the western but I've read so much about how it's not a good longterm grip so I think i'm gonna switch to semi, I was just wondering what some of you think

 

[alan-n]

I asked my coach and he said i was 4.0 close to 4.5, i switched to the western not too long ago and i find it hard to play against flat hitters and don't get as much power with it. Now my question is, in the future, what will be the advantages and disadvantages. Know what I mean? Doing the western for such a short time i dont know if those problems will jhust get fixed or they will be longterm.

Your actual rating will always be lower than what your shots and strokes indicate until you get a lot of match play experience under you. A true 4.0 player will beat just about 95% of the "pushers" out there. A 4.5 player ground strokes aren't deep and don't have the pentration/pace as a 5.0 usually but can put away any short balls / floaters.. basically punish a pushed or mishit shot for a winner.

I can only picture 2HBH players using western grips. At the beginner stroke level, yes western grips usually generate more spin than SW since most of the time you are timing your ground strokes as the ball is coming down in which you brush on the ball from low to high. Its easier to do that with a western grip. Western grip players have a harder time getting to low balls and tend to hit those into the net, not to mention that western grips are hit out in front more than SW type grips... If your timing is late especially against flat shots, yes misshits are common (big brushing motion, what do you expect). Western grips hit with elbows closer to the body than SW.

SW is a more reasonable grip and can do what the western does (high balls, heavy spin), it just takes more skill and timing. To generate the topspin equivalent to that of a western grip, requires a loose arm and wrist and awesome timing (watch Federer hit his top spin shots) because you have to allow your wrist to pronate a bit when you hit the ball so the racket face rolls over the top of the ball slightly. Contact point is farther out to the side of the body and not in front like the western and your elbow isn't as bent as with western grips. Its easier to get to low balls and balls that stretch you out wide with less exteme (relative to western) grips. Its easier to flatten the ball out for winners when you 1st learn forehands with the less extreme grip simply due to the swing path of it.

Western grips are a bit more physical of a swing to generate racquet head speeds since elbows are so closer to the body. SW takes a bit longer to learn how to hit the varying topspin / flat / outwide shots etc.. since small variations in how you allow your wrist to break / take back the racquet and whip the racquet face makes a big difference in the result of your stroke.

At any rate, you should start off with least extreme grip that you can consistently play with. Its easier on your body in the long run.

 

[EricW]

Thanks for the info, I'm going to switch back to the semi when I play tonight and i'll post how I do, I've had alot of experience with the semi so it should be easy going back.

By the way, I'm a 2 hander(right handed) who uses the continental grip(a little more towards eastern) for my right hand and eastern for my left combo

I used to hit 1 handed and it was pretty good, but it hurt my shoulder and I decided to pick up with 2 hander, I get better consistency and easier power from it, although my hardest backhands are 1 handed

 

[Defcon]

There is some good discussion going on in the General pro talk forum (look under the slingshot and Ion Tiriac thread) that Federer might actually use an eastern grip! Or something less semi-western. So its possible to produce extreme topspin with those grips too.

 

[EricW]

There is some good discussion going on in the General pro talk forum (look under the slingshot and Ion Tiriac thread) that Federer might actually use an eastern grip! Or something less semi-western. So its possible to produce extreme topspin with those grips too.

Oh, cool. Everyone I play who uses an eastern grip hits it really flat, but then again, federer can do anything

Anyway about playing tonight, unfortunately I lost but I did better with the semi. My shots were better but I missed alot fumbling around with my new grip or accidentally having the western grip thinking i'm holding it like a semi. Also sometimes I ended up swinging like a western even though my grip was a semi. Overall i'm happy though, once I get through the transition ill be better and have a better future.

Also, by the way, how do people handle really low balls? My friend I play always dinks it really low to mid court when I hit a good shot

 

[ucd_ace]

I always felt like I got more consistent depth with a semi-western grip than I did with a western grip. After I got over trying to hit with as much spin as possible, I realized that depth was much more important to I switched to a semi-western grip so I was hitting through the ball more and getting it deep in the court more consistently.

 

[beoron001]

I am going through the exact same phase. I am in the process of switching from Western to Semi-western. I am getting better with semi-w. I started a thread on this a couple of days ago and there were some good advices. I will keep a close watch on this thread.

The reason for my switching to semi-w was that I was not able to hit the low balls.

 

[alan-n]

The key to hitting low balls with the SW grip is to hit through the ball and allow your wrist to pronate over the top of the ball for topspin. You don't need to and should never force the wrist action, it should be loose and break over the top of the ball at the point of contact. You also don't need to excessively try to drive the ball upward with your legs so much, since your usually going to be hitting the low balls as approach shots (moving forwards) and the SW grip gets the racquet face pretty square on the low balls. Trying to drive the ball upwards with your legs too much will cause you to hit through the ball less or even miss hit it to the fence. Just relax a bit, think about getting the racquet just barely underneath the ball, drive through it / pronate over the top of the ball.... Once you get a few clean hits experiment with how much body weight you can get going forward and how you can vary the wrist pronation (never ever force it) to generate the spins you want..... Its a tricky shot but just keep your eyes on the ball and don't look up until its gone and you'll begin to see and get a feel for how to control the spins and power on low shots.... don't forget about the angle the ball comes into the racquet face...

Again, try using the least extreme grip that you can control. If you can control the ball well using a hybrid eastern / SW grip do it.

 

[EricW]

Thanks for all the advice, alan. For me the approach shot has always been a weakness for me so i'll keep your advice in mind and try it today when I play

I think a problem I have is I underestimate the power of topspin and when I hit low approach shots I still aim down and it goes into the net

 

[FEDEX1]

i was thinking about switching to the SW grip from the western grip and i have tried it out but the only problem i have with it is it feels weird to hit a 2 handed back-hand with the SW grip without changing the grip on my right hand (im a righty) does anyone know what i can do with out changing the grip on my right hand or do i have to change that grip for it to work good

 

[lethalfang]

A good opportunity to ask this question again.
What grip am I using?

Semi-western?
Western?
In-between?

 

[dave333]

Its a semi-western.

As for the power thing, people using semi-westerns hit relatively flat by nature and western grippers typically naturally have a spinnier shot.

However, changing the stroke path has a lot do with it as well. I personally use a western grip with a classical stroke style and htis results in a flatter shot than my friend who uses a windshield wiper style.

 

[paulfreda]

Why can't you continue to learn to hit with both W and SW ?
Play with one for one or more months, but get to a wall or ball machine and work on each one. Noting the differences will give you more shot making skills.

As for problems with low balls with a Western; this is a myth. You just need to bend your knees to get down and then suppinate your forearm thru the ball which opens the face [very closed to closed, or closed to square, or square to slightly open] and you'll have no problem getting ankle high balls over. I can do it using my Hawaiian grip. But it does take paying your dues by hitting lots of balls to get the feel and confidence.

For depth with a W grip, hitting a bit farther in front with a closed to square action thru the ball will give you all the depth you need.

 

[KingOfTennis]

i dont like western cuz the ball drops too much and i find it hard to get it over the net in some situations

 

[RM05]

I, too, use a western forehand grip and noticed i had to muscle my shots for depth. Low balls (around knee or below knee level) are a little difficult to hit at times but I just use all my leg, shoulder, and arm strength to return it with some power. Its hard work. I've noticed that my upper body got a pretty good work-out once i changed to the western grip. I had to accept the fact that others would break my pace and i'd be running around a bit more than usual (on hard courts). For me...the western grip is just physically more demanding but great for keeping your super wide angled shots in very nicely. I'd actually use both grips for different purposes as i have no problems switching grips on the fly.

 

[J011yroger]

A good opportunity to ask this question again.
What grip am I using?
Semi-western?
Western?
In-between?

Strong semi/weak full.

J

 

[Punisha]

um in australia that is western...

 

[J011yroger]

Yea, that is the problem. There are a million ways to hold the racquet, and it is nearly impossible to lump them all into three categories. I mean, where is the base knuckle, where is the heel of the palm, are your knuckles in line with the bevels or do they go across them. Then you have the swingpath to consider.

That is why I said, Strong Semiwester, or Weak Full Western. You could say either and I wouldn't disagree.

J

 

[KingOfTennis]

alot of people use eastern as well.