Western or Semi-Western

E

exigentsky

New User
I'm a Junior Varsity baseline player at my high school and I just don't know what to do with my grip anymore.

I recently switched from SW to Western while using the Wonder Wedge and I love it. I feel that my shots have more control, obviously more topspin and I make fewer errors, but recently some people have been telling me that I'm much better off with SW. They say Western is very bad for lowballs, I personally have not gotten enough low balls to decide. They say Western can cause wrist injuries, but I have had no problems yet. Finally, they say Western can't be used to hit with power because you can't flatten it out, but I haven't really tried to flatten it out.

They say SW is much better overall, but I'm more comfortable with Western now. Should I stick with western on hard courts or learn to use SW better? What are the advantages and disadvantages of each?
 
I've tried both and I'm more comfortable with the sw. If you're more comfortable with the western, then stick with it.
 
I am more comfortable with it, but I don't want to be using something that would eventually limit my growth or put me ata disadvantage. That's why even if I was more comfortable with a continental forehand I would not use it. The grip would put me at a big disadvantage in the end.

Will western put me at a disadvantage too, do the ebnefits outweigh the negatives? How do you handle low balls?
 
I like in between the SW and Eastern. I find it to be more efficient (more drive with less effort) because you have some more of your hand behind the handle rather than under it.

If you find that you're hitting a lot of short balls that land around the service line and have little pace, that is the disadvantage of a more extreme underneath type of grip.

If you're not in the middle of the season, I'd say experiment a bit and figure out what you can make work best for you.

On John Yandell's new website, tennisplayer.net, he has a lengthy article about the modern forehand and how different grips affect it. Sounds like it may be a good read for you.
 
As long as your not too lazy to bend your knees for low balls, stick with the western, especially if you have more confidence.
 
Hey, you don't need to stick to one or the other. The SW and W grips have their uses at differernt times.

Western forehands are great for returning those high balls at shoulder height. They are also useful for flattening out an approach shot close to the net.

Semiwestern provides a more open racquet face which may make shots between knee and waist level more comfortable. You should only be using a western grip on shots in this zone if you are really ripping that shot with top spin. Otherwise, the ball will rest in peace in the net!
 
I have more confidence with western simply because it comes higher over the net and I miss less. my balls also usually land about a good yard or so before the baseline. Though I accidentally hit the line many times. The only problem with western that I have noticed so far is that it is more tiring, but that is not a big deal because I can still play at my peak for an 8 game set without AD. (that's how we advance our rank, we play others in 8 game sets without AD) However, I would probably get too tired if it were for example a 3 set match.

I also haven't considered using both western and SW for forehands, isn't that too confusing? Do you mess up often when you do that?
 
exigentsky said:
I am more comfortable with it, but I don't want to be using something that would eventually limit my growth or put me ata disadvantage. That's why even if I was more comfortable with a continental forehand I would not use it. The grip would put me at a big disadvantage in the end.

Will western put me at a disadvantage too, do the ebnefits outweigh the negatives? How do you handle low balls?
Click to expand...
Although I can handle low balls better with the sw than a full western, I still flip grips to an efh to scoop up low balls. I'm only 1 bevel away from the efh (turning clockwise), but you can turn your handle the opposite way (counterclockwise) and you'd have a continental grip with a small flick of the handle.
 
In my opinion, if you want to further your development as a tennis player into a true all-court player, I would concentrate on developing your Eastern/SW forehand, even at the expensive of some losses now. I believe the Eastern/SW provides more versatility and is more suited to learning a proper volley grip than the Western.

The famous coach, Robert Lansdorp, has a article related to this at his website, www.lansdorp.com. Click on the "Instruction: Drive Time" link on his home page.
 
try this:
a sw with a western swing path, much like guga, who has a weak semi western grip (towards easter) i have discovered through pics on getty. this way you will have the benefits of both
 
I'm pretty sure picking a grip and sticking with it is the way to go. This can increase your reflexes if a ball is coming quickly because you don't have to contemplate which grip to use. Developing one grip to perfection is better than being pretty good with two different grips.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it almost impossible to hit a flat ball with western grip.
I use an eastern, so I can easily flatten the ball when needed. I have to agree though, that I apply moderate spin, and would love to have more spin on short angles like shots (still experimenting), any thoughts?
 
exi,

Marius points to a good thread about this. I agree with Landsdorp, but it is only an opinion. I wouldn't recommend either extreme fh grip (continental or western). Although the are many excellent players w/ western fh. One thing you may want to factor into the decision, are your other grips, on your bh and volleys. If your a grip changes are extremely far apart (say, extreme western fh to extreme eastern bh) it can cause problems later on, as you rise in level, opponents pace increases and your prep time is cut down, especially on returns.

Good luck.
 
Why stick to just one grip? Sure you have your bread butter grip, mine is full western, but I also change to SW or even Eastern on some occasion when such grip is most beneficial.
 
I just read Lansdorp and he's basically saying that on hard court I will never become great with Western and that I should move to Europe if I want to continue using the grip. :( Not what I was hoping for :(

Is western really that detrimental to a player's development? Should I really switch back to SW and forget all about western?

"Why stick to just one grip? Sure you have your bread butter grip, mine is full western, but I also change to SW or even Eastern on some occasion when such grip is most beneficial."

It seems too difficult to change forehand grips in-game, at least to me.
 
I dont think many if iany pros switch forehand grips, unless they're going for slice or dropshot
 
Some posters on here have speculated that Federer may make slight grip changes, depending on what kind of ball is coming in toward him.
 
exigentsky said:
I just read Lansdorp and he's basically saying that on hard court I will never become great with Western and that I should move to Europe if I want to continue using the grip. :( Not what I was hoping for :(

Is western really that detrimental to a player's development? Should I really switch back to SW and forget all about western?

"Why stick to just one grip? Sure you have your bread butter grip, mine is full western, but I also change to SW or even Eastern on some occasion when such grip is most beneficial."

It seems too difficult to change forehand grips in-game, at least to me.
Click to expand...
Changing forehand grips is like changing your backhand grip to continental for slices or volley, also changing your forehand to continental for volley or forehand slice. Its the same.
 
I just played some more today and have shattered all the disadvantages I have heard about western grips.

1. I can easily handle low balls if their bounce is at least 5 inches.
2. I can hit very hard when I need to, not flat, but not with as much topspin as usual.
3. I can slice suprisingly well withouta grip change.
4. I can do ovehead smashes without a problem.
5. I can volley decently, but rarely do so without a grip change.
6. I do a backhand withouta grip change.

The only time I need a grip change is for my serve.

I also figured ou that my western is actually not the normal way people do it. I have the Wonder Wedge facing away from me and my fingers locked on it giving me extreme stability and powera nd my contact point is usually at my side and not as far in front as others.

I tried SW a bit more, but it's just too unstable and does not have enough controllable power.

I think I will most likely stick with western.
 
exigentsky said:
I just played some more today and have shattered all the disadvantages I have heard about western grips.

1. I can easily handle low balls if their bounce is at least 5 inches.
2. I can hit very hard when I need to, not flat, but not with as much topspin as usual.
3. I can slice suprisingly well withouta grip change.
4. I can do ovehead smashes without a problem.
5. I can volley decently, but rarely do so without a grip change.
6. I do a backhand withouta grip change.

The only time I need a grip change is for my serve.

I also figured ou that my western is actually not the normal way people do it. I have the Wonder Wedge facing away from me and my fingers locked on it giving me extreme stability and powera nd my contact point is usually at my side and not as far in front as others.

I tried SW a bit more, but it's just too unstable and does not have enough controllable power.

I think I will most likely stick with western.
Click to expand...

Congratulations, you will never make it past the 4.0 level. I have yet to see anyone volley decently with anything other than a variation of the continental grip, nor overhead smash consistently. Getting the ball back to the other side for your opponent to smash for winners, yes... decent volleys, no. All the 4.5+ level players switch grips without any problems. But if you insist on developing bad habits......
 
The ideal point of contact for western grip is in front of your mouth. Obviously this grip is good for very short people. The only problem is that this type of grip requires bigger swing which means you need more time and space to hit it. And it is problematic for low balls!

If I have the option I will pick semi-western grip. This grip gives you the power of Eastern FH grip, and spin of western fh grip. Personally, I use eastern fh grip for my forehand, but reckon that semi-western grip is the grip of the future. It is the grip of the majority of the aggressive baseliners.
 
I use a semi western grip for forehand shot.

It is possible to use full western grip on slower courts.
With the western you'll have trouble on syngrass and any faster courts against opponents who use effective low slices.

Stick with a semi western grip. It's easier for grip changes.
 
exigentsky said:
I just played some more today and have shattered all the disadvantages I have heard about western grips.....<snip>......I think I will most likely stick with western.
Click to expand...

So basically, after your last hitting session with an extreme grip that you are already comfortable with, you've made your long-term decision.

You believe you've shattered all those "myths" about the disadvantages of Western grip. Apparently, you believe that Lansdorp and other experienced tennis teachers are spouting untruths.

Changing ones game is painful. Sometimes you need to take a short-term step backwards in order to make that longer term leap forward. It's hard, no doubt. However, my guess is that unless you look at the big picture now and make the changes, your game will be limited. I urge you to read that Lansdorp article again. And then really think about what he is saying. He's not just making this stuff up.
 
alan-n said:
Congratulations, you will never make it past the 4.0 level. I have yet to see anyone volley decently with anything other than a variation of the continental grip, nor overhead smash consistently. Getting the ball back to the other side for your opponent to smash for winners, yes... decent volleys, no. All the 4.5+ level players switch grips without any problems. But if you insist on developing bad habits......
Click to expand...

What about Bjorn borg? He volleyed with western.

But anyway, I do plan to rotate grips in game.

"The ideal point of contact for western grip is in front of your mouth. Obviously this grip is good for very short people. The only problem is that this type of grip requires bigger swing which means you need more time and space to hit it. And it is problematic for low balls!
"

I guess my contact point is pretty much there, but still, I have no problem with fast low balls.

"So basically, after your last hitting session with an extreme grip that you are already comfortable with, you've made your long-term decision."

Not really, I was even more comfortable with SW before. I only switched to wesern this week.

"You believe you've shattered all those "myths" about the disadvantages of Western grip. Apparently, you believe that Lansdorp and other experienced tennis teachers are spouting untruths."

Yes, I do, and it's not new. teaching pros have said so much over the last 50 years, you should not expect that they are all correct. There are different views about tennis.

"It is possible to use full western grip on slower courts.
With the western you'll have trouble on syngrass and any faster courts against opponents who use effective low slices.

Stick with a semi western grip. It's easier for grip changes."

Makes one wonder how Bjorn Borg won Wimbledon with a western grip...

But, yes I agree grip changes are much more difficult with full western, but its advantages I think outweigh that problem.
 
Stop discriminating against grips! Just use what works. It would be a pretty one dimensional game if everyone used eastern grips.
 
exigentsky,

Again, the choice is yours to make. However, I encourage you to re-evaluate the beliefs you base that decision on. Particularly re: Borg.

First, Borg does NOT hit a fh volley w/ a western fh grip. He uses continental.

Next, I encourage you to look closer at Borg's fh grip off the ground.
When Borg burst on the scene of professional tennis, the most widely accepted fh grip on tour was continental, made the 'practical' choice at the time, due to 3 of the 4 majors being played on low bouncing, fast, grasscourts. In fact, many of the world's best players, in those years, used one grip, the continental, to hit all strokes.

Compared to the more widely used continental and eastern of the day, Borg's fh grip WAS radical. However, his swing path was much more radical. Borg could flatten it out, but elected to impart more topspin, more often than any other established star on tour at the time. Also, in executing his fh, Borg never 'cocked' the racket above his wrist and then allowed the racquet head to drop far below his contact point and far below his hand prior to contact (further deviating from the accepted norm). Very radical technique in its day.

Other's may not agree, but I find Borg's fh grip to appear remarkably similar to Federer's strong eastern or Agassi's sw fh grips. To me, Borg's grip doesn't even remotely resemble the full western grips of Moya, Ferrero or Hewitt.

I don't believe the terms, semi-western or strong-eastern, existed at that time. At the very least, those grip names were certainly not 'en vogue' as they are today. As a result his grip was labeled 'western'. In the mid to late 70's early 80's, Borg's fh grip was very radical as compared to the much more commonly accepted continental fh grip. But, by today's standards, I believe Borg's fh grip would be classified as a 'less extreme' sw or strong eastern grip.

Its JMHO and I encourage you to examine it for yourself.

Were I in your position I would opt to eliminate the two fh grips at the most extreme ends of the grip chart (continental and western) and choose the less extreme sw.

Good luck.
 
Thanks for the info.

I will give SW a second shot, but it would be so hard to go back now...

I'm also curious, is Hewitt really using full western? Because I think he's past the 4.0 level :p
 
exigentsky said:
Thanks for the info.

I will give SW a second shot, but it would be so hard to go back now...

I'm also curious, is Hewitt really using full western? Because I think he's past the 4.0 level :p
Click to expand...
Im not sure, but I read he is using semi western.
 
exigentsky said:
Thanks for the info.

I will give SW a second shot, but it would be so hard to go back now...

I'm also curious, is Hewitt really using full western? Because I think he's past the 4.0 level :p
Click to expand...

Do you know the difference between a ground stroke and a volley? Wait you are just beginning and hitting everything from the baseline so that would be no.
 
alan-n said:
Do you know the difference between a ground stroke and a volley? Wait you are just beginning and hitting everything from the baseline so that would be no.
Click to expand...

That was unnecessary
 
"Do you know the difference between a ground stroke and a volley? Wait you are just beginning and hitting everything from the baseline so that would be no."

Don't be stupid, I know that much. Though I am a baseline player, I do volley ocasionally.
 
Wow, what a great discussion. I am a big fan of the SW grip but I have seen a lot of college players from South America who come over here and do very well on the hard courts with the Western grip. I really think that if exigentsky is doing so well with the Western forehand he ought to stick with it. I think it would be great if he could also learn the SW. The more grips that you can master, the better you can adjust and compete against various styles of play. You really need to be able to use multiple grips on both the forehand and the backhand. Granted you are going to have you favorite, primary grip.

Ed - Tennis Geometrics - the Wonder Wedge

http://www.tennisgeometrics.com

Any site problems, please let us know, we are struggling. Thanks.
 
Hmmmm....we'll a couple of people on this thread referenced the Robert Landsdorp article about the western grip and how it has stunted the growth of alot of America's junior players. He states that this grip will severely limit a tennis player's ability in the advanced levels.

It must admit, at this time I don't I fully agree with it, although I know he is an accomplished coach. It's difficult for me to understand how he can say the western grip is so detrimental to the developement of tennis in America, when the western grip is currently one of the most popular grips being used by the pros around the world today (along with the SW). I mean, as of now, America's top world ranked player is AROD, and does he not use the western grip for his forehands ????????
 
I have a full western forehand, but switch grips when I need to. When the ball bounces low, I'll switch to an eastern forehand. I use to hit with a SW forehand grip, but the western grip just feels more natural to me.
 
troytennisbum said:
I mean, as of now, America's top world ranked player is AROD, and does he not use the western grip for his forehands ????????
Click to expand...

The western grip is slightly more stressfull than less extreme grips, whether players will have the longevity of less extreme grips I don't know, but common sense would equate additional stress with potential failure/injury.... But that isn't conclusive as some people can handle more stress on their arms/shoulder/body than others, and it is a "trained" grip. Most kids growing up used the western the deal with high balls, they never grew out of using that grip.

Watching Hewitt play Federer on faster courts and seeing how much pace he is losing due to exessive topspin.... No doubt that his heavy spin ground stokes compliments his game of consistent tennis well, but seems to have limit his power to put a dent into someone who is able to move as well as him. As he has a harder time flattening out shots... Western grips require so much effort to hit put away shots, it may look awesome seeing Roddick hit those shots on TV..... but compared to how effortlessly Federer or Sampras put away their forehand shots, I'll take less effort for equal results.
 
Hi, I'm not Marius, but I did see a segment on CNN World Sport where Roddick was hitting balls with Candy Reid the news correspondent. He looked like he was using a semi-western.

Previous discussions here have said that Roddick uses an extreme semi-western, as Mahboob said. His forefinger's base knuckle is on the corner between the semi-western and western bevels.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

E
Western or Semi-Western?
Replies
21
Views
3K
KingOfTennis
KingOfTennis
L
Changing from western to semi-western?
Replies
3
Views
1K
Rickson
Rickson
Z
Western grip=more spin, more loopy shot?
Replies
5
Views
752
skuludo
S
F
Going from Western to SW as an 18 year old?
Replies
7
Views
915
TearSNFX
T
F
How to change stroke when switching from a Western to Semi-Western?
Replies
7
Views
1K
FedExpress117
F
Back
Top