What is the point of the slow HC season?

[nolefam_2024]

Agreed with @Russeljones. "Why should the calendar progression affect our perception of the tennis on offer?" Isn't that point of the thread? That it doesn't translate into slam?

While I agree its not as enjoyable because it doesn't translate into slam, and it affects my perception.

 

[vive le beau jeu !]

what is the point of tennis ?

 

[metsman]

I think it is fine...IW is a truly awesome event, Miami kinda sucks but whatever. Plus slow hard courts are a surface and part of the game. A major and two masters is suitable to represent that surface. Problem is when all the indoor courts are slow and most of the other hard/grass courts are medium....

 

[blackfrido]

slower hard courts mean; longer rallies consequently more exposure on commercials and sponsors on TV

 

[tacou]

I disagree with OP for many reasons.
First, basically the whole tour is "slow HC season." So it seems like you're basically calling out Miami and IW. Well, Miami is disappearing, but IW is the 5th most popular/successful tournament on tour, so good luck "scrapping" it. Also, that explains the "build up." It doesn't build up to nothing, it builds up to the two largest tournaments outside the majors.
Second, while I'd love a longer grass season, sure, moving clay season up by 2 months will completely change the entire tennis calendar. Just not doable.

Finally, I see the first part of the season like this: Australian HC season is short and kicks off the season the right way, with what everyone wants, a slam!
Then the season really begins with 2-4 tourneys per week: the Latin swing, the French tourneys, and the American HC tourneys. A few 500s.
They eventually converge at IW/Miami for some big points/$$$, and then clay season begins.

Seems sensible to me.
I'm all for speeding up courts, more grass tourneys, and schedule changes in general.
But moving IW to early January, or eliminating it altogether? No thanks.

 

[mattosgrant]

The whole set up of the tour is strange. I agree moving the Australian Open to late March would be a good idea and have these other events leading up to it. I wonder if the reason they don't do it is Australia is just too damn hot anytime other than January. Even in 2000 they moved the Sydney Olympics to late September/
early October which is unheard of, probably due to the heat.

 

[jm1980]

What is the point of the slow HC season?

It's so we can hear the whining from Novak haters that everything is slow if he wins IW and/or Miami

 

[mavsman149]

It's so we can hear the whining from Novak haters that everything is slow if he wins IW and/or Miami

Or "insert tourmanet name here"

 

[jm1980]

Or "insert tourmanet name here"

Pretty much. Wimbledon gets increasingly slower as Novak wins it

 

[mavsman149]

Pretty much. Wimbledon gets increasingly slower as Novak wins it

No way a "robotic pusher" like Djokovic could ever win Wimbledon.....

 

[Luckydog]

It looks like that all courts become identical,all as slow as clay courts.I don't think it is a good trend for tennis.Boring to watch.

 

[mattosgrant]

This would be my ideal tennis season:

February and March- slow hard court season including 2 Masters (one mandatory, one non mandatory) leading to Australian Open the final 2 weeks of March.

April and May- clay season including 2 Masters (one mandatory, one non mandatory) leading to French Open final 2 weeks of May.

2 or 3 week break

2nd half of June and July- grass season with 1 Masters (mandatory) and other events leading to Wimbledon last 2 weeks of July.

August and September- fast hard court season with 2 Masters (one mandatory, one non mandatory) leading to U.S Open final 2 weeks of September.

October- carpet season with 1 Masters (mandatory) leading to YEC final week of September.

3 month off season

The indoor hard court events would be sprinkled through the 2 hard court seasons. Whether there would be a Masters on indoor hard court could be discussed, but the end of the year should be true carpet.

 

[augustobt]

3 month off season.

hahahahah dude, you're completely out of your mind, this is a ridiculously short season. Tennis is not only about top players, a season from February to September is a big joke.

 

[mattosgrant]

hahahahah dude, you're completely out of your mind, this is a ridiculously short season. Tennis is not only about top players, a season from February to September is a big joke.

Players often complain about not getting enough of a break. Tennis has much less of an off season than any other sport. Even with 3 months it would still be one of the shortest ones.

 

[augustobt]

Players often complain about not getting enough of a break. Tennis has much less of an off season than any other sport. Even with 3 months it would still be one of the shortest ones.

Players often complain, period. The ridiculous thing is that ever since the 'new' atp regulations in 2009 they kinda 'forced' the players into a lot of tournaments through the year.

A #100 ranked player would starve in the end of a 8.5 months season, hahahahaha.

 

[Djokovic2011]

Players often complain about not getting enough of a break. Tennis has much less of an off season than any other sport. Even with 3 months it would still be one of the shortest ones.

I understand what you're saying but a 3 month break seems too much to me. And would it be fair that whoever finishes as YE#1 basically gets an extra quarter of a year in pole position without even having to hit a single ball? The tour might not be perfect but I think shutting everything down as early as September would be going too far.

 

[tacou]

This would be my ideal tennis season:

February and March- slow hard court season including 2 Masters (one mandatory, one non mandatory) leading to Australian Open the final 2 weeks of March.

April and May- clay season including 2 Masters (one mandatory, one non mandatory) leading to French Open final 2 weeks of May.

2 or 3 week break

2nd half of June and July- grass season with 1 Masters (mandatory) and other events leading to Wimbledon last 2 weeks of July.

August and September- fast hard court season with 2 Masters (one mandatory, one non mandatory) leading to U.S Open final 2 weeks of September.

October- carpet season with 1 Masters (mandatory) leading to YEC final week of September.

3 month off season

The indoor hard court events would be sprinkled through the 2 hard court seasons. Whether there would be a Masters on indoor hard court could be discussed, but the end of the year should be true carpet.

I don't get why so many people like this idea of AO being in March. AO is often the best slam of the year, partly due to two reasons: players have just rested for 6+ weeks, and players have worked on their games/fitness. It makes for a lot of quality, intriguing match ups and surprises.

I'd see a number of changes to the tour schedule, but I like the AO where it is.

 

[The Green Mile]

To inflate Novak's already asterick ridden resume obviously.

 

[Djokovic2011]

To inflate Novak's already asterick ridden resume obviously.

Asterick ridden TGM?

 

[Deleted member 688153]

Showing my fairness, sine Novak excels here, but what really is the point? Why can't we just start with clay? It's cool because it's a great chance for me to see the players in Miami (only US and Cincy is plausible as well), but I hate how this just leads into nothingness. It's totally yawn-inducing for me until Monte Carlo.

Either revamp it so IW and Miami are before AO, or just scrap them. Such a boring period until clay commences. In general the whole gap between AO and RG is ridiculous, just about the same as between USO and AO, and without the WTF in between, this period is arguably even more barren/long seeming.

I don't actually watch tennis between January and May.
I check the scores, but after the AO I don't sit down and watch matches again at least until MC, and often not until RG.

Why not put the AO in March and have a December-March off season?
Tennis is currently eleven months of the year.

 

[mattosgrant]

I understand what you're saying but a 3 month break seems too much to me. And would it be fair that whoever finishes as YE#1 basically gets an extra quarter of a year in pole position without even having to hit a single ball? The tour might not be perfect but I think shutting everything down as early as September would be going too far.

I see what you are saying but on your point about getting extra weeks at #1 without hitting a ball, I actually think a player deserves more of an automatic reward in weeks at #1 for ending a year #1 (which IMO is different than just randomly being #1 at any other point in time) than they currently get. So that particular point I have no problem with for that reason.

Also I have the year ending at the end of October which doesn't seem too bad to me. It is only 1 month earlier than currently (and the tour starting up again 1 month later than currently, so on either side not a big difference). 3 months is still one of the shortest off seasons in all of sports. I know I would hate having only a 1 month off season, but that is just me.

I am mostly agreeing with 125downthemiddle's point though it seems silly you have this post Australian Open slow hard court season that doesn't really lead to something bigger. It just doesn't process.

 

[MichaelNadal]

To inflate Novak's already asterick ridden resume obviously.

You better work

 

[Deleted member 716271]

I don't actually watch tennis between January and May.
I check the scores, but after the AO I don't sit down and watch matches again at least until MC, and often not until RG.

Why not put the AO in March and have a December-March off season?
Tennis is currently eleven months of the year.

Exactly Totally agree, you kind of said what I meant in the OP better. Thanks bro.

 

[TheFifthSet]

I pictured NatF as a distinguished British man of about 50

LOL me too. Not the British part but I thought he was much much older.

 

[insideguy]

Lol this covo comes up every year on this forum. Iw and miami are huge tournaments and are not going anywhere. Both have attendance figures that rival slams. Every freaking year. This is not clay season. For craps sake these tournaments are never going anywhere.

 

[MasturB]

The tour transitions from medium hard court (Aussie) to slow hard court (Indian Wells, then Miami) to make the transition to clay easier. My bigger question is why the clay masters goes from (extremely slow at Monte Carlo, to fast at Madrid, to medium at Rome).

Also, I think it's just easier for Miami and Indian Wells to keep their courts hardcourts than pay for the expenses of maintaining clay.

 

[augustobt]

The tour transitions from medium hard court (Aussie) to slow hard court (Indian Wells, then Miami) to make the transition to clay easier. My bigger question is why the clay masters goes from (extremely slow at Monte Carlo, to fast at Madrid, to medium at Rome).

Also, I think it's just easier for Miami and Indian Wells to keep their courts hardcourts than pay for the expenses of maintaining clay.

Aussie medium? Even nowadays I'd say medium-slow. About the clay masters, it simply makes no sense but mainly because of Madrid. I used to like the way it was before: Monte-Carlo to Rome and then Hamburg. Taking down Hamburg as a masters and changing Madrid from indoor to clay was probably the worst move ever, as that tournament in general makes no sense at all.

I think Miami it's currently the worst masters event (even worse than the blank crowds of Shanghai) and it's pointless after Indian Wells, specially now with IW having 2 high-level stadiums. Miami would need something different and I think that maybe if they played in har-tru clay it would be an interesting change, but then we'd have 4 out of 9 master's on clay.

 

[TheGhostOfAgassi]

IW is one of my favourite tournaments, I prefer it over AO. Im like... YESSS AO is over, tennis can begin! And IW is a celebration of brilliant tennis. Great atmosphere, women and men. And only max 3 sets pr match Love IW!

 

[Deleted member 688153]

IW is one of my favourite tournaments, I prefer it over AO. Im like... YESSS AO is over, tennis can begin! And IW is a celebration of brilliant tennis. Great atmosphere, women and men. And only max 3 sets pr match Love IW!

How come you dislike AO but love IW?
The courts are pretty similar.

 

[TheGhostOfAgassi]

How come you dislike AO but love IW?
The courts are pretty similar.

I dont think the atmosphere is similar at all. Its very different courts. Maybe not the speed, but its much more than speed on court that means something.

 

[Deleted member 744492]

I think both tournaments fit pretty good in the calendar overall. It's just before the clay-court season begins, so there are two big HC events to sort of put an end to the first Q3 of the calendar. With a Grand Slam and two Masters 1000 events already played, we enter the clay season with a better sample regarding player's form. It's quite obvious that Nadal is still struggling, but until those 2 events are played, I'm not going to conclude on what to expect from him this year. Same applies for everyone else, Novak won the AO quite convincingly, but we've seen him play just 2 events this year, Murray did great at the AO as well, but he's become a father since and it's going to be interesting to see him in action again. Lots to look for in those two events!

 

[MLRoy]

Playing on clay for like 5 months and on grass for just a few weeks?

When was the last time YOU played on grass? The surface, I mean. I played on it once, about 20 years ago, at a private club. Fun, because it was different, but I'll take clay any day. Grass courts are like dinosaurs, unfortunately.

 

[dadadas]

When was the last time YOU played on grass? The surface, I mean. I played on it once, about 20 years ago, at a private club. Fun, because it was different, but I'll take clay any day. Grass courts are like dinosaurs, unfortunately.

So you like clay more than grass => it should be clay for 5 months and grass for a few weeks. Your argument?

 

[nmanimaran15]

Why stop at the slow HC season? It's all boring right now [emoji14]

Can't reduce the extremely slow clay season? It's always boring.

 

[nmanimaran15]

There must be a few more grass events, at least two masters in grass.

 

[nmanimaran15]

Yes.Two masters in slow hard courts, AO, three clay masters, FO, two grass masters, Wimbledon, two masters in faster hard, USO and WTF ( WTF must be in hard, clay and grass.If this year is in hard, next year must be in clay, then grass) I want this kind of schedule.

 

[VexlanderPrime]

Showing my fairness, sine Novak excels here, but what really is the point? Why can't we just start with clay? It's cool because it's a great chance for me to see the players in Miami (only US and Cincy is plausible as well), but I hate how this just leads into nothingness. It's totally yawn-inducing for me until Monte Carlo.

Either revamp it so IW and Miami are before AO, or just scrap them. Such a boring period until clay commences. In general the whole gap between AO and RG is ridiculous, just about the same as between USO and AO, and without the WTF in between, this period is arguably even more barren/long seeming.

Wish we could cut Slow Hard out (keep it in the fall) - have a longer offseason (better development/progression from player training), move clay UP a bit and expand Grass.

 

[droliver]

1. the AO is not moving it's date. It's set up around the Australia Day holiday (their 4th of July). The only complaint from the player before was temperatures, but with the new roofs on 3 courts, that's not so much an issue anymore. The players aren't wanting to mess with it.

2. we don't need a longer grass court season, as the surface is rarely played worldwide and there are few places that could hold a large event.

3. an interesting suggestion suggestion would be to change some of the US events after IW (like Miami), to Rubico/Har-tru green clay. It's a very distinct and popular surface of American clubs that's not really represented anywhere anymore above challengers on tour I think. It would be a novel way to ease into the red clay season of Europe and make more sense on the calendar

 

[Deleted member 716271]

1. the AO is not moving it's date. It's set up around the Australia Day holiday (their 4th of July). The only complaint from the player before was temperatures, but with the new roofs on 3 courts, that's not so much an issue anymore. The players aren't wanting to mess with it.

2. we don't need a longer grass court season, as the surface is rarely played worldwide and there are few places that could hold a large event.

3. an interesting suggestion suggestion would be to change some of the US events after IW (like Miami), to Rubico/Har-tru green clay. It's a very distinct and popular surface of American clubs that's not really represented anywhere anymore above challengers on tour I think. It would be a novel way to ease into the red clay season of Europe and make more sense on the calendar

Like that suggestion, I grew up playing on that surface. Itso somewhere between slow HC and clay

 

[Paul Murphy]

I want both tournies to remain but I'd love to see them speed up the courts - sadly, no chance of that.
Having said that, if the choice was between keeping Miami and Indian Wells and their slow hardcourts, or adding clay court events to the schedule, I'll take the former any day and every day.