What to work on with coach

[lockbox]

Hi,

My old coach was an older gentleman who had a number of drills to work on each lesson which really improved my game. My new coach is younger and a better athlete - but I feel like we just hit every lesson. How should I go about structuring my lesson in order to improve? Obviously, hitting with him helps as he generates a great deal of pace/spin etc. But I feel i'm not utilizing my lesson time as best as I could.

Advice?

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

http://www.essentialtennis.com/podcast-170-maximize-your-lessons/

http://www.essentialtennis.com/cookie-cutter-coaches-podcast-227/

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Pick a shot you keep messing up in matches.
Spend half the lesson working on that shot.

You are paying. He is your employee for that time.

I find it is CRITICAL to be able to "manage" your coach,
and make sure the time is spent to your liking.

If he suggests a drill that is not perfect, change it.

I am currently working on approach shots and split stepping for the volley put away.
One coach just fed a ball mid court and then hit another new ball for me to volley.
I did not like this, and asked him to move back to the baseline and actually hit back my approach shot for a more realistic split step timing.
The next coach I worked with, I said up front, this is how I want the drill to work.

 

[ChaelAZ]

It is your time you've bought so if you feel you want them to work on something specific you need to let them know. I have had coaches for my son that I thought were giving too many breaks so I had them work longer for my son with less breaks. Better coaches though will continually look for ways to instruct, push, and develop a player, so it could be this coach just is not a good fit for you.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

I am currently working on approach shots and split stepping for the volley put away.
One coach just fed a ball mid court and then hit another new ball for me to volley.
I did not like this, and asked him to move back to the baseline and actually hit back my approach shot for a more realistic split step timing.
The next coach I worked with, I said up front, this is how I want the drill to work.

You've spent several threads claiming the split step is a net negative and that your game improved when you dropped it; what made you change your mind?

 

[Mongolmike]

I agree with TTTS... you are paying him to help you.

So first, be realistic in 1 or 2 things you need to work on and tell him the situation. If it is work on your backhand, be specific. Is it high backhands, running backhands, short ball back hands, return of serve backhands? Are you trying to improve pace, shot location, etc? And don't say "All the above". Be specific and a good coach can help you.

If you are totally unsure, ask him to hit with you for a few minutes and put you under some stress. He should be able to see how your game breaks down, then he will likely want to work on the biggest, easiest fixes first.

For something more "static" like "I want to work on my serve", again, be specific. First serve? Second serve? Are you trying to get more spin, more speed or better location? Trying to hit a flat serve, or learn a kick? Be specific about your desires and a good coach will help you improve. At least that has been my experience.

Also, like TTTS said, you can tweak the lesson. If he has you doing something which you don't think is useful, tell him (nicely). Make sure you understand what he is trying to get you to do, then ask if there is another drill you can try. If he explains something and you don't really understand, ask if he can explain it in a different fashion.

Be specific, listen, admit you do or do not understand what is being asked, give him/her feedback also. It's your money, get the most out of it. Same as going to a nice restaurant. If something is wrong with your order, tell someone. If you don't understand what something is on the menu, ask someone. If you'd like to sit somewhere different, request it.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

You've spent several threads claiming the split step is a net negative and that your game improved when you dropped it; what made you change your mind?

I am only split stepping on my approach shot.
Otherwise, I am running straight thru the volley, and crashing the net.
This makes it very easy to pass me or lob me.
So, I am working on stopping once the approach shot is hit back.

For all other shots, I think split step should be avoided unless you're 5.0+

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I have so much to say on this topic of how to take a lesson.
This deserves a new thread, in fact.

There is a fine balance between hijacking the lesson and missing out on the coach's wisdom,
and wasting time with a poorly managed lesson.
I have now taken many lessons, so I have a better sense of what works and what doesn't.

You also need to manage the duration of a drill. Sometimes, the coach will want to work on too many things. My mantra is that you can only learn one thing at a time. I have spent 10 or 20 lessons on a single thing. (groundstrokes, for example)
However, sometimes, you might think you have it "down", but the coach knows better, and knows you do not have it down, and will want to continue the drill.

This is why I vastly prefer D1 coaches over park&rec "career coaches", who are too far removed from the learning process,
and really have no accountability on any improvement in their weekly housewive and 8 years old lessons. (Those people learn zero after 10 years)
The D1 kids know what it takes, and are closer to the time investment they put in themselves.

Like anything in life, you need experience to know.
Once you take a lot of lessons, you will develop a sense of what is useful and what is not.
The gauge is to see if the skill translates into live points and your matches.
If it does not, you do not have the skill. Keep drilling. It takes a LONG TIME to break habits and form new ones.

 

[lockbox]

Just wanted to say thanks for all the great advice. I have been taking lessons for the better part of a decade so I know what to expect. With this new coach of a few months, I have brought issues that I found during match play to work on during the lesson. However, I'm wondering how much of the onus should be on me to prompt the drill/direction of the lesson and how much I should expect from the coach. I see most are stating that i'm paying for it so I should ask for what I want (which I often do). If anyone has any more tips, please let me know.

 

[ChaelAZ]

I'm wondering how much of the onus should be on me to prompt the drill/direction of the lesson and how much I should expect from the coach.

In my experience, the better coaches usually ask what you think you need work on, but also hit with you to evaluate everything,. The will address issues you think you have, but more so things they see you really need to improve. I haven't done much myself, but have had my son in a lot. I find a good hour will have a majority of the time spent on just a few changes, then points or drills at the end to enforcement and challenge those changes. For younger kids you may get on court warm-up as part of the session, but I don't like that and both my son and I do our own warm-ups before so I get more training during the hour.

 

[GuyClinch]

In my experience, the better coaches usually ask what you think you need work on, but also hit with you to evaluate everything,. The will address issues you think you have, but more so things they see you really need to improve. I haven't done much myself, but have had my son in a lot. I find a good hour will have a majority of the time spent on just a few changes, then points or drills at the end to enforcement and challenge those changes. For younger kids you may get on court warm-up as part of the session, but I don't like that and both my son and I do our own warm-ups before so I get more training during the hour.

This.

I think MOST good coaches will form a plan for you without input. Those are the better coaches - usually expensive. But even the not as good coach can sometimes be quite helpful if they are told what to teach. These guys just need direction. But there is a third type that is merely a good player - has unconcious competence - and can only function as a hitter. But whether your coach is a complete coach/guy who needs guidance/or a hitter - all can be valuable. Just make sure you are getting what you pay for.. Don't pay Rick Macci prices and get junior college hitters..

 

[Notirouswithag]

Prior to the lessons I always ask what students want to work on 3-5 days out from our scheduled lesson. I always ask them to be specific, do they struggle with certain stroke scenario's(high defensive backhands, on the run, etc) or is it more point play scenarios, or is it more footwork oriented.

I always tell them, its their time and their money, dont be afraid to tell me if we're deviating from what your working on, or if its right or if your still having a hard time understanding anything from the mechanics to the movement. I always encourage feedback at any point and to never hesitate.

Ideally i'd spend about 5-7 minutes on warm up(mini tennis-baseline) if they havent warmed up but I always try to encourage them to show up 10 minutes early to stretch or hit against a wall to get their warm up in and then move into the first 25-30 minutes of the lesson working on said objectives with controlled hand feeding drills. Depending on if they are getting the idea and being pretty consistent with the drills then I may shorten it or lengthen it just a bit to get more repetitions in.

The second half is usually moving into a controlled rally situation trying to reinforce the practice but in a point play scenario with unpredictable ball movement

 

[thomas daniels]

Hi,

My old coach was an older gentleman who had a number of drills to work on each lesson which really improved my game. My new coach is younger and a better athlete - but I feel like we just hit every lesson. How should I go about structuring my lesson in order to improve? Obviously, hitting with him helps as he generates a great deal of pace/spin etc. But I feel i'm not utilizing my lesson time as best as I could.

Advice?

Yeah, don't spend another dime until you sit down and talk to him about what you need to work on in the near future and then come up with a lesson plan that is catered towards your needs and what you need to be working on with him. Get on the same page with him or find another coach. Private lessons must be directed by the student, the coach should give the student what they want or can't get in a group lesson.

 

[Chadillac]

Experience brings expertise. He is a younger pro and trys to gain approval with athletic ability. You may have to push the envelope in reguards to what could make you better. Ask questions after misses and stuff like that.

Teaching and playing are two different things. If your coach is beating you badly like ttps/ny, you may want to take a second look. A pro should be capable of playing at your level, letting you win a little bit, then defeating you. Brings hope for the next lesson

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

If your coach is beating you badly like ttps/ny, you may want to take a second look. A pro should be capable of playing at your level, letting you win a little bit, then defeating you. Brings hope for the next lesson

The way I've heard it described is that the coach should be playing just a little bit better than the student to force the student out of their comfort zone. If the coach plays too much better, the student won't learn much; he'll be in the panic zone.

 

[ChaelAZ]

But whether your coach is a complete coach/guy who needs guidance/or a hitter - all can be valuable. Just make sure you are getting what you pay for.. Don't pay Rick Macci prices and get junior college hitters..

Very much agree. Interestingly, we just hired a new boys/girls HS coach to help with my sons team and we are all meeting this morning to hit. The head coach hired him so I haven't met him yet, but he's a 5.0+ player with college pedigree. The head coach is an excellent, experienced coach, but isn't a high level player himself, so having a high level players, even if less experienced, is going to help push the kids and I think will make a good blend overall. So it all has value as mentioned above, but you need to figure out what is needed and where/how.

Good thread.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

If your coach is beating you badly like ttps/ny, you may want to take a second look.

For the record, I never even saw my coach's A game after 40 lessons. Nor his B or C game.
He always played slightly above my level, so the hitting was productive.
NYTA was the one who wanted a sample of the A game. That is a match, not a lesson.

 

[OnTheLine]

I have greatly appreciated my coach's dedication. I only take 1 maybe 2 private lessons per month, sometimes I need a tune-up on a stroke (like when I mis-placed my forehand in the spring) sometimes it is to learn something new.

He has always asked for my match schedule for home matches. He comes by and watches for about 10-15 minutes and takes notes. He brings those notes to our next lesson and we drill on what didn't work in match play. Sometimes that is a stroke, but lately it is more on point construction and strategy patterns. Lots of serve plus 2, which I find exceptionally helpful.

I have offered to pay for his time when he does come and watch, but he refuses and says that is part of his job as a professional.

 

[Notirouswithag]

I have greatly appreciated my coach's dedication. I only take 1 maybe 2 private lessons per month, sometimes I need a tune-up on a stroke (like when I mis-placed my forehand in the spring) sometimes it is to learn something new.

He has always asked for my match schedule for home matches. He comes by and watches for about 10-15 minutes and takes notes. He brings those notes to our next lesson and we drill on what didn't work in match play. Sometimes that is a stroke, but lately it is more on point construction and strategy patterns. Lots of serve plus 2, which I find exceptionally helpful.

I have offered to pay for his time when he does come and watch, but he refuses and says that is part of his job as a professional.

I like to do that with some of my clients too. It's a huge moral booster for them when you surprise them and show up to watch. Sometimes they ask me to come if I'm not doing anything and I say yes, the smile on their face is priceless. I love to watch them and if I can I sit there for support, unless they ask me to spot anything that needs improving.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

That is a true pro.
How far does the coach have to drive to watch your match?

My coach did something similar.
He set up a match between me and a fellow coach's student.
We played a set, and both coaches watched.
He was able to give detailed feedback like where to stand for ROS.

An alternative I have used is to film a match and have the coach watch it.

 

[OnTheLine]

Wow, that is great. How far does the coach have to drive to watch your match? That is a true pro.

Only for "home" league matches ... at the facility where he is a full-time tennis pro ... he might have to walk from court 2 to court 22 though .. that is quite a hike! But he has also stayed after or come early depending on the time.
But I do see that other full-time pros at the same club don't do that ... this one is invested in his craft for sure!

 

[thomas daniels]

I have greatly appreciated my coach's dedication. I only take 1 maybe 2 private lessons per month, sometimes I need a tune-up on a stroke (like when I mis-placed my forehand in the spring) sometimes it is to learn something new.

He has always asked for my match schedule for home matches. He comes by and watches for about 10-15 minutes and takes notes. He brings those notes to our next lesson and we drill on what didn't work in match play. Sometimes that is a stroke, but lately it is more on point construction and strategy patterns. Lots of serve plus 2, which I find exceptionally helpful.

I have offered to pay for his time when he does come and watch, but he refuses and says that is part of his job as a professional.

Sounds like he is a great tennis coach, I'm happy to hear that too!!

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

I am only split stepping on my approach shot.
Otherwise, I am running straight thru the volley, and crashing the net.
This makes it very easy to pass me or lob me.
So, I am working on stopping once the approach shot is hit back.

For all other shots, I think split step should be avoided unless you're 5.0+

Don't agree. While not all 4.0 players split step regularly, a very high % of competitive 4.0 players do so. From my experience all but a few 4.5 players will split step for most situations. One excellent way to make the transition from 3.5 to a 4.0 level of play is to master split step timing on most of your shots. Executing the SS for an approach is a good start. Next step is to master it for ROS. From there, it should not be all the difficult to develop the habit for most shots hit by your opponent.

 

[ronnie]

Pick a shot you keep messing up in matches.
Spend half the lesson working on that shot.

You are paying. He is your employee for that time.

I find it is CRITICAL to be able to "manage" your coach,
and make sure the time is spent to your liking.

If he suggests a drill that is not perfect, change it.

I am currently working on approach shots and split stepping for the volley put away.
One coach just fed a ball mid court and then hit another new ball for me to volley.
I did not like this, and asked him to move back to the baseline and actually hit back my approach shot for a more realistic split step timing.
The next coach I worked with, I said up front, this is how I want the drill to work.

everything you do on court with the coach must be relative to a game situation or it doesn,t make sense.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

Don't agree. While not all 4.0 players split step regularly, a very high % of competitive 4.0 players do so. From my experience all but a few 4.5 players will split step for most situations. One excellent way to make the transition from 3.5 to a 4.0 level of play is to master split step timing on most of your shots. Executing the SS for an approach is a good start. Next step is to master it for ROS. From there, it should not be all the difficult to develop the habit for most shots hit by your opponent.

The split step should not only not be avoided, it should be embraced.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

I am only split stepping on my approach shot.
Otherwise, I am running straight thru the volley, and crashing the net.
This makes it very easy to pass me or lob me.
So, I am working on stopping once the approach shot is hit back.

For all other shots, I think split step should be avoided unless you're 5.0+

Check out the match starting at 13:45:

They not only are constantly split-stepping but also bouncing around in between split-steps. That's how high-level players move. The higher the level, the better the footwork. You watch lower-level players, they do similar things, just not as well or as fluidly.

It's not "you don't need good footwork like the split-step until you reach level X".