What type of mortgage?

raiden031

Legend
I'm looking to buy a house in a few months and was wondering if there are any economically savvy people in here that could give me advice.

BACKGROUND

I would be a first time buyer who has limited money to put towards it. My father-in-law offered to pay closing costs, which I'm estimating to be $8-10K. In addition I could probably swing no more than $7K out of my pocket. I'm looking at the price range in the upper 200s. That should buy me a 20 year old townhouse in need of repairs here in good ole Maryland.

Whatever I buy, I would like to live there for at least 10 years. I have good credit and consider myself conservative with money and don't like taking risks. I work in the IT industry as a government contractor where I have already gotten laid off once in my 3 year career. It could very well happen again if we are not awarded a contract in the next month. So job stability is almost nonexistent. The good thing is that there is alot of demand for people in my field so it shouldn't be hard finding another job if it happens again.

I have been doing some research and came to the conclusion that the only decent mortgage to get is a 30 year fixed. That way I don't have to worry about interest rates skyrocketing or having to re-finance by getting an terest-only balloon mortgage.

My questions are:

1) What is the best way to get around the fact that I have almost nothing to put towards a down payment? I know there are things like mortgage insurance and 80/20, but which is prefered?

2) Is 30 year fixed really the best way to go for my situation?
 
Well, I'm certainly not an expert.

The 30 year fixed is very conservative, and not a bad bet at all. If you can afford it, you might look into a 15 or 20 year fixed as well. You have to pay a little more each month, but you get the house paid off much earlier (obviously) and you pay a LOT less TOTAL because of reduced interest payments. And, when you go to sell the house you'll end up with a lot more money in your pocket.

With an Adjustable Rate Mortage you'll pay at a lower interest rate up front, but it can go up.

If you think you may be selling the house in 5 years or so, you can go for an ARM that remains fixed for the first 5 years and then adjusts. That way you'll be paying at a lower rate, and selling about the time the rate would go up.

Also, if at all possible, you want to avoid PMI. You need to put down at least 20% of the cost to avoid PMI, but if you don't that will really effect how much you have to pay monthly. If it means skrimping and saving a bit longer to build up your down payment, it's worth it.

That's about all I know, or at least all that comes to mind at the moment.

Good luck.
 
Here's my experience:

1) Get the 30-year fixed. It's nice if you can get 15 or 20 year fixed but seriously, unless you have lots of money to spare to pay a couple hundred extra every month, I suggest 30. In fact, did you know you can pay off a 30-year fixed in 17 years if you make one extra monthly payment every year? Ask your mortgage officer!

2) To avoid PMI, you can do 2 things:
-Put 20% downpayment OR
-Take a 80%+10% loan and put down 10%

The 80% loan will be a regular mortgage loan. The 10% is a "sideloan" with a slightly higher interest rate. Mine was 6.25% for regular, and 8.25% for the "sideloan". But I only had to put 10% down,including the closing costs etc. Just focus on paying off the "sideloan" if you want to and have extra cash lying around.

Those were my options. Try not to take the ARM as you may have read, ppl are having HELL because of it. Mortgage rates right now are low, they're as low as you're gonna be getting. Fix it. I have seen numbers where the lowest ever was around 5-6% while the highest....16-18%.

And don't forget about property taxes/ESCROW fees. Mine is factored into the monthly payments so I don't have to set aside funds for those. Works for me.
 
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I'm looking to buy a house in a few months and was wondering if there are any economically savvy people in here that could give me advice.

BACKGROUND

I would be a first time buyer who has limited money to put towards it. My father-in-law offered to pay closing costs, which I'm estimating to be $8-10K. In addition I could probably swing no more than $7K out of my pocket. I'm looking at the price range in the upper 200s. That should buy me a 20 year old townhouse in need of repairs here in good ole Maryland.

Whatever I buy, I would like to live there for at least 10 years. I have good credit and consider myself conservative with money and don't like taking risks. I work in the IT industry as a government contractor where I have already gotten laid off once in my 3 year career. It could very well happen again if we are not awarded a contract in the next month. So job stability is almost nonexistent. The good thing is that there is alot of demand for people in my field so it shouldn't be hard finding another job if it happens again.

I have been doing some research and came to the conclusion that the only decent mortgage to get is a 30 year fixed. That way I don't have to worry about interest rates skyrocketing or having to re-finance by getting an terest-only balloon mortgage.

My questions are:

1) What is the best way to get around the fact that I have almost nothing to put towards a down payment? I know there are things like mortgage insurance and 80/20, but which is prefered?

2) Is 30 year fixed really the best way to go for my situation?

You will want to commit suicide if you get an ARM. Especially with the econonmy in the state it is right now, I personally think that would be an uneeded stress.

30 year fixed is a fine way to go. If you do not have 20% down you will have to pay PMI, which is mortgage insurance. The gist of it is that you are a greater risk without 20% down so they charge you an additional insurance premium to cover the risk.

There a few mortage companies that will charge you more points and waive the PMI. Your closing costs seem extremely high, unless you are planning on paying a few points.

I would not get a 15 year in your situation if you are concerned about income. You can accomplish the same thing with a 30 year by paying it down.
 
Jesse, what is the typical closing cost? That is the number I was told about based on the price range I'm looking at (275-300K).

So it looks like I am going to have to get PMI. A 20% DP is out of the question (~55-60K) or even 10% is out of the question. I just got married and am working on a master's program. I haven't saved a dime in the past 6 months. Its just been impossible. How much can I expect PMI to add to a mortgage each month? Is the PMI tax deductable?
 
Raiden,

I work in the mortgage industry and it seems that you should look into a 30 yr. fixed. Tell your loan officer that you want to break the loan down into an 80/20 to avoid the PMI. This is breaking the amount into two loan payments the first is 80% and the second is 20% of the value of the house. The first is usually 6.25-6.5% and the second will be roughly 8-11 %. There are a lot of factors that go into the equation. But this seems like you best possible solution in you case. Good luck on the house.
 
"Mortgate rates drop for 4th straight week".

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061207/bs_nm/mortgages_rates_dc_1

I once read a snipet by suze oremnan that said it was better to roll the PMI into the cost of the loan than to get a second mortgage. I wish i had done that cuz the cost of my 2nd went up dramatically with all the fed funds rate increases, and its going to still be pretty high until they lower it several times. Right now the discount for hybrid loans, like 5-year, 7-year, and 10-year fixed arms is pretty low. But any discount is worthwhile if you are not planning on staying in the place longer than the term of the fixed interest rate.

If you know you are going to stay forever (or don't plan to but might change your mind later) do the 30-fixed. If you know its temporary do an ARM with term fixed interest rate.
 
Thanks for starting this thread raiden. I am in your same boat. Looking to buy, and no way will I be able to put down 20%. I will probably be buying an apartment at The Ft. Lauderdale Tennis Club.

I will probably be doing what Juice23 said. Unless any of you mortgage wizards out there lead us to something new.
 
My advice is to rent. After five years of double-digit growth, the metro area housing market is currently experiencing a correction, which could well continue into the coming years. I think you would be taking on a significant financial risk by buying a home now.

If you stay in your home for 10+ years as you plan, then perhaps it doesn't matter so much. But imagine you buy a home now for 300K without downpayment and a year later you are moving to California or have to sell for some other reason, and it turns out the market price of your home has declined by 10%. Out of nowhere, you'd be 30K in debt (ignoring closing costs and the little principal you would have paid off in the first year on a 30-year mortgage).

You have probably read this article that appeared in the Post back in July, but here it is again:

After 5 Years of Growth, Home Prices Drop
Inventories Swell in Parts of D.C. Region


By Tomoeh Murakami Tse
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, July 26, 2006; A01



In what may be the most telling sign yet that the real estate market here has shifted downward, median prices of homes in several parts of the Washington area have declined when compared with the same time last year.

In Loudoun County, for example, the median price of homes sold dropped 1.2 percent last month, compared with June 2005, according to Metropolitan Regional Information Systems Inc., the area's multiple listing service. In Fairfax County, prices fell by half a percent in May and a tenth of a percent in June. And in the District, the decrease was 0.8 percent in March and 1.2 percent in May, compared with the same months last year, even though prices in the District in June were higher than the year before. The median is the point at which half of the houses cost less and the rest more.

The declines are small, and certainly not universal. Prices continue to rise in some areas, most notably Prince George's County, where houses are still relatively inexpensive. But the drops are significant because they mark the first time in half a decade that home prices have fallen in a 12-month span, illustrating just how much the real estate landscape has changed after five years of double-digit growth in home prices.

The areas with declines have some things in common: swelling numbers of houses for sale, slowing sales and lots of new houses on the market. In Loudoun, where developers have put up acres of new subdivisions in recent years, nearly 5,000 properties are for sale via the multiple listing service, which includes mostly resale homes. That compares with 1,800 a year ago. Homes there now take an average of 75 days to sell, compared with 21 days a year ago. In the District and Fairfax County, the number of unsold homes and time on the market has also increased, boosted by a large supply of condominiums.

What's happening is part of a national trend in which regional markets that led the country during the boom are seeing prices flatten or decline as the number of unsold homes on the market mushrooms. Yesterday, the National Association of Realtors reported that the inventory was up last month, to a 6.8-month supply, based on a seasonally adjusted annual sales rate of 6.62 million units. In June of 2005, the inventory was 4.4 months, the sales pace 7.27 million. The median price of existing U.S. homes was up 0.9 percent in June, compared with the same time last year.

The question for many local buyers and sellers is whether the small declines foreshadow big price reductions in the months ahead.

Economists are split. One view is that any declines will be insignificant or temporary because of job growth and the strength of the local economy.

"Could it be a 5 percent drop in prices? Could it be 10 percent? Whatever it is, it will be short-lived, because demand is right there on the sidelines," said David A. Lereah, chief economist of the National Association of Realtors.

But others see a steeper, prolonged downturn in prices because of overbuilding in some areas, speculative buying and a run-up in prices that has outpaced affordability. Prices, they added, have actually declined more than the multiple-listing service statistics indicate because sellers have been offering such incentives as help with closing costs.

Peter Morici, an economist at the University of Maryland, said prices could drop 10 percent by the end of the year, and perhaps by 20 percent "by the time it's all over."

The market will take months to shake out, because too many sellers have not accepted that their houses are not worth as much as they had thought, said Mark Zandi of Moody's Economy.com. "The market can't complete its correction until that happens."

Zandi sees Washington area home prices declining over the next six to 12 months by an average of 10 percent, with the condo market experiencing larger price drops. The good economy, he said, is "not enough to save the market from this housing correction."

The possibility of falling prices seems to have made many home-shoppers hold off on buying, despite rising interest rates. After all, even a minor correction could mean that houses cost tens of thousands less. For home sellers, that means much hand-wringing as they start to slash prices below what neighbors got just a year ago.

Scott and Shirley Porter of Ashburn had no choice but to cut the asking price for their townhouse -- there are just too many others for sale nearby. From their back yard, they can see three for-sale signs across the street. Out front, more neighbors are selling. Around the corner, there are four more.

"The townhouse right next to us sold for $462,000, and it was on the market for three days," Scott Porter said last week.

But that was last year. The Porters put their end-unit on the market last month for $458,000. That was right at the middle of other townhouses for sale in the neighborhood, he said.

But in no time, the Porters, who both work in the District and want to reduce their commutes, found that their place had ended up at the top of the price scale after neighbors reduced their prices. So they lowered theirs, too, to $435,000.

"It's amazing how much the prices have come down," said Scott Porter, 45. "You feel like you've missed the bus."

Neighbors Sheila and Chris Boyce, who are moving to Arizona, put their three-bedroom, 2 1/2 -bath unit up for sale in March for what they thought was a competitive $445,000. They have since reduced it to $437,000 -- still $42,000 more than the $395,000 they paid two years ago. After costs, they would not be making nearly as much profit as they had imagined, even if they get their new price.

"We weren't trying to get rich on it or anything," said Sheila Boyce, 32. "We thought it would be a lot more. Not hundreds of thousands, but at least something to put away."

Even in areas where the prices haven't gone below 2005 levels -- at least on paper -- they are clearly moving at a different speed. Prince William County, for example, last month posted a 1.8 percent increase in median home price, compared with the same time last year. That compares with a 31 percent jump from June 2004 to June 2005.

For George and Susan Garrigan of Woodbridge, simply cutting the price on their home of 28 years no longer seemed enough. There are 112 detached houses for sale in their Lake Ridge neighborhood. Forty have been on the market for more than 100 days; 114 townhouses are also for sale.

Never mind that two similar nearby houses -- split-level, built in the early 1970s on quarter-acre lots -- sold for $50,000 more last summer. Or that they pulled their house off the market after two price reductions this spring brought no bidders.

Yesterday afternoon, the Garrigans came back with a new lure: the brand-new Toyota Corolla sitting in the driveway, free with the purchase of their house.

"I feel it's a wonderful deal for a family not to have that car payment," said Susan Garrigan, 66.

"We think we'll be more visible," said George Garrigan, 70, when asked why he did not simply cut the asking price by $17,000. "Everybody's dropping the price. So you're still in the same pool of houses. There's nothing that says, 'Hey, look at my house twice.' Or 'Look at my house once.' "

Because of the slowing market, their retirement home in Front Royal will not feature the "dream furniture" that she had hoped for, nor the rooftop observatory that he wanted. But that's okay, they said.

"We're realistic and we're moving forward," Susan Garrigan said. "We have to take our knocks. We can't change reality."

© 2006 The Washington Post Company
 
My wife and I were very lucky to buy our home before the real estate market exploded. We purchased our house for $180K (which was the average price in our area at the time) and now it is supposedly worth near $400K. Given that, this is what we did:

We only had a few thousand dollars in savings to put down on the house and cover closing costs. We started looking in December, which is typically a buyer-friendly time of year because sellers still have kids in school, the holidays are around, and the weather sucks so people aren't looking at real estate. Anyway, the particular house that we purchased happened to have been on the market for a couple months and the sellers were in the process of building another home, so they were motivated. We got them to agree to pay half of the closing costs, and we did an 80/20 loan (which is where 80% of the purchase amount is covered by a first mortgage, and remaining 20% of the loan is covered by a second mortgage/home equity loan). The advantage of an 80/20 is that you do not have to put any money down and there is no PMI insurance. The downside is that your overall interest rate can be higher. In our case, the primary mortgage was a 30 year fixed at 6.75% interest and the second was a 15 year interest only (at 8.75%) with a balloon. Bottom line, we walked into the house with only paying about $1,500 to $2,000 out of pocket. Three years later, after the equity had risen, we ended up refinancing the 80/20 loans into one 30 year fixed at 5.9%, and it has worked out very well for us.

Again, I believe we were very lucky to get into the house at the time we did. Our property values have soared and interest rates dropped since we bought, so everything worked out great for us. I shudder when I look at the values of an average house in our area (and most of the country) now. I feel sorry for people like my sister, who is 5 years younger than me and was not in a position to buy a house before the rise in prices. Old bungalow homes in the area where she rents now are going for $400K+, which is totally ridiculous. In one sense, I think prices will probably start to drop because the economy seems to have hit a saturation point, but unfortunately, they probably won't go down to pre-2000 levels. However, on the other hand, if you plan on purchasing a home and staying there for a long term, then it's hard to see how you can end up losing. Just don't fall for agent or broker hype and stretch beyond a monthly payment you can reasonably handle... you'll need the extra money for home maintenance and quality of life essentials (like tennis equipment!). We qualified for a loan in the $250K range at the time, but did not want to commit that much of our monthly income out... and we are glad we made that decision.
 
some things to also keep in mind.

Are you in a high real estate tax environment. Be careful, the day you close the property will be reassessed and if the prior owner's assessed value was way below what they sell it to you for, be prepared for a very dramatic increase in the real estate taxes.

The last home I purchased, the real estate taxes shot from $6,500 to $13,000 per year over night.

The other is don't just look at interest rate. Some mortgages will require high escrow balances. I once purchased a home with a great rate only to find out that the lender required a very high escrow balance, so I spent the first 2 years making high payments to have enough escrow on hand at year end to meet their requirements. Watch that.

And watch for what's included. Some places make you pay for trash pickup and nickle and dime you a lot, others its included since you are a resident of the community or homeowners association.

Some homeowners associations hit you with absurd common charges. Just keep your eyes wide open for everywhere that you can get nickled and dimed because what the broker tells you "$1,100 a month and it can be yours..." is only the beginning.

At this time you should do a complete rent vs. buy analysis with all cash flows being considered for the duration of the time that you plan to own the home including your rate of increase in income, assumptions about interest rates if your money sat in various interest bearing accounts or instruments versus your home, and as a homeowner you will have costs associated with owning a home, "Sears, Home Depot, Lowes, plumbers, carpenters, little fixit rip-off specialists, cha-ching cha-ching".
 
some things to also keep in mind.

Are you in a high real estate tax environment. Be careful, the day you close the property will be reassessed and if the prior owner's assessed value was way below what they sell it to you for, be prepared for a very dramatic increase in the real estate taxes.

The last home I purchased, the real estate taxes shot from $6,500 to $13,000 per year over night.

The other is don't just look at interest rate. Some mortgages will require high escrow balances. I once purchased a home with a great rate only to find out that the lender required a very high escrow balance, so I spent the first 2 years making high payments to have enough escrow on hand at year end to meet their requirements. Watch that.

And watch for what's included. Some places make you pay for trash pickup and nickle and dime you a lot, others its included since you are a resident of the community or homeowners association.

Some homeowners associations hit you with absurd common charges. Just keep your eyes wide open for everywhere that you can get nickled and dimed because what the broker tells you "$1,100 a month and it can be yours..." is only the beginning.

At this time you should do a complete rent vs. buy analysis with all cash flows being considered for the duration of the time that you plan to own the home including your rate of increase in income, assumptions about interest rates if your money sat in various interest bearing accounts or instruments versus your home, and as a homeowner you will have costs associated with owning a home, "Sears, Home Depot, Lowes, plumbers, carpenters, little fixit rip-off specialists, cha-ching cha-ching".

I found that the rate for my county adds up to like 1.33% of the assessed value. And it has the statement "Real Property is assessed at 100% of market value". So if I buy a house for $275K, I am going to be paying over $3,600 per year or $300/month in property taxes.

I've looked alot at the rent vs. buy scenario and because I have found a location I want to spend many years at, buying is obviously the better choice. If there was any chance I was going to leave in less than 3-5 years I wouldn't even bother. The only worry is my lack of a decent emergency cash fund in case I temporarily lose my income. This is because I can't find job stability as a government contractor. Or the possibility of falling into a situation where I have to sell when the house is worth less than I owe.
 
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