What was the main reason why Djokovic lost 6 of 7 matches vs. Nadal in 2012-13?

[jma22]

2011-2012= 7-0 Djokovic: 4hard, 2 clay , 1 grass
2012-2013= 6-1 Nadal: 5 clay, 2 hard
If Nadal's streak is clay skewed then Djokovic's streak is hard skewed too
Salty ********* strikes again

 

[nolefam_2024]

Same Nadal bots who are using these streaks spanned over 2 years with 7 month absence on Djokovic's best surfaces. The same Nadal bots don't accept DjokoSlam from 2015-16. Djokovic is the first man after Rod Laver to win 4 slams in a row. Nadal can Never do this.

 

[jma22]

Same Nadal bots who are using these streaks spanned over 2 years with 7 month absence on Djokovic's best surfaces. The same Nadal bots don't accept DjokoSlam from 2015-16. Djokovic is the first man after Rod Laver to win 4 slams in a row. Nadal can Never do this.

You're salty ******** fan troll who spend all day trying to discredit Nadal. Rafa rent free in your mind bro
I'm a Nadal fan who supports Rafa and respects and values Djokovic as one of the best of all time. That's the differnece

 

[nolefam_2024]

You're salty ******** fan troll who spend all day trying to discredit Nadal. Rafa rent free in your mind bro
I'm a Nadal fan who supports Rafa and respects and values Djokovic as one of the best of all time. That's the differnece

No need to respect Nole as one of the best of all time. Just accept him as goat.

 

[Third Serve]

No need to respect Nole as one of the best of all time. Just accept him as goat.

How very dogmatic.

 

[Quaichang]

Playing next 5 on clay? Really?

The clay courts definitely helped.

 

[fedfan24]

I don't need to try again. These cheap titles from 2017 to 2019 doesn't make clay court champ better than hc goat. Why does Rafa duck Nole all the time. Why is he always afraid. Nole played him 9 times at RG now. Why is there so much fear from Rafa.

what fear? Rafa was waiting at ao09,14,17,18,22 but djokovic was nowhere to be seen
same for uso 17 and 19, where was djokovic when Nadal made the finals?

even if we call 17 weak, so was 18 so it’s still 3>2 and 2>1 bud. 2019 uso was about same level as 2015

djokovic simply isn’t as good or consistent at hc slams as Nadal has been at rg which is why they’ve met more at the clay slam

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

2011-2012= 7-0 Djokovic: 4hard, 2 clay , 1 grass
2012-2013= 6-1 Nadal: 5 clay, 2 hard
If Nadal's streak is clay skewed then Djokovic's streak is hard skewed too
Salty ********* strikes again

Lol it’s not hard skewed it’s just the normal distribution of surfaces. You have 2 hard court slams vs 1 clay court slam, and 7 hard court masters vs 3 clay court slam. It’s expected to play double as much hard court matches.

 

[SonnyT]

Nadal dominates only one surface, clay. Djokovic dominates two surfaces, HC & grass.

Nadal last lost RG in '22, to Djokovic. Djoko last lost Wim in '17, and AO in '18, because of elbow injuries!

 

[mike danny]

2011-2012= 7-0 Djokovic: 4hard, 2 clay , 1 grass
2012-2013= 6-1 Nadal: 5 clay, 2 hard
If Nadal's streak is clay skewed then Djokovic's streak is hard skewed too
Salty ********* strikes again

There is no such thing as HC skewed when most of the tour consists of HC tournaments.

 

[jl809]

People wanting all H2Hs to reflect the distribution of the surfaces on the tour can fvck off.

Aside from the matchup issue, there’s a damn good reason why Fed’s H2H with Nadal is 16-24 and it’s nothing to do with their respective ability across surfaces

 

[mike danny]

People wanting all H2Hs to reflect the distribution of the surfaces on the tour can fvck off.

Aside from the matchup issue, there’s a damn good reason why Fed’s H2H with Nadal is 16-24 and it’s nothing to do with their respective ability across surfaces

Ok, then what is the reason?

 

[jl809]

Ok, then what is the reason?

they played 12 more times on Nadal’s best surface than on Fed’s best surface?

Someone might say “it’s on the player to get good at the surfaces which are most represented on the tour”, and that’s fair enough - but doesn’t change the fact that a H2H where the surface disparity is adjusted for is always better imo than one where it isn’t, especially as these disparities have changed over the history of the sport as slams have swapped surfaces etc. And more importantly, how misleading is that Fedal H2H to tennis casuals? Even on this site Ned fans always bang on about slam H2H

 

[mike danny]

they played 12 more times on Nadal’s best surface than on Fed’s best surface?

Someone might say “it’s on the player to get good at the surfaces which are most represented on the tour”, and that’s fair enough - but doesn’t change the fact that a H2H where the surface disparity is adjusted for is always better imo than one where it isn’t, especially as these disparities have changed over the history of the sport as slams have swapped surfaces etc. And more importantly, how misleading is that Fedal H2H to tennis casuals? Even on this site Ned fans always bang on about slam H2H

Fair point.

I'd say the main reason why the H2H is 24-16 is the 2013-early 2014 period when Fed's form was in the gutter and faced Nadal 5 times while Nadal didn't reciprocate in 2015-early 2016.

The H2H would be 19-15 without that and Basel 2015.

 

[jl809]

Lol it’s not hard skewed it’s just the normal distribution of surfaces. You have 2 hard court slams vs 1 clay court slam, and 7 hard court masters vs 3 clay court slam. It’s expected to play double as much hard court matches.

… which is hard skewed

 

[mike danny]

… which is hard skewed

But can it be called a skew when it's the vast majority of the tour?

 

[jl809]

But can it be called a skew when it's the vast majority of the tour?

That’s the issue though, the tour is hard skewed - which is unavoidable, but still not desirable
Would love a grass M1000 in our lifetimes

 

[ActualTennisPlayer]

… which is hard skewed

This is like complaining that the tour is not grass skewed or indoor skewed or complaining that there is no carpet or wood. It’s irrelevant for the discussion.

Normally nadal should face djokovic or Federer on the court surface equivalent to the distribution of court surfaces on the tour. If that does not happen then that raises questions.

 

[Texas Tennis Fan]

People wanting all H2Hs to reflect the distribution of the surfaces on the tour can fvck off.

Aside from the matchup issue, there’s a damn good reason why Fed’s H2H with Nadal is 16-24 and it’s nothing to do with their respective ability across surfaces

If you normalize the surface so it was not clay skewed, their won loss percentage would be much closer. It might be even or better since Nadal did not beat Federer off of clay since 2014. This is accentuated by the strategic missing of hardcourt tournaments when he has almost never missed clay slam or Masters 1000s for 18 years.

 

[nolefam_2024]

If you normalize the surface so it was not clay skewed, their won loss percentage would be much closer. It might be even or better since Nadal did not beat Federer off of clay since 2014. This is accentuated by the strategic missing of hardcourt tournaments when he has almost never missed clay slam or Masters 1000s for 18 years.

It might be closer but Nadal would still lead by a lot. That's the point. Non clay fed didn't own Nadal as he should and on clay Nadal totally owned Fed. That's how the rivalry is.

It's much better for Rafole vs Djokovic owns off clay and Nadal owns on clay. But off clay or on clay both didn't get owned so hard as fed got on clay.

 

[Mustard]

Simple. Nadal turned it around against Djokovic, especially in the biggest matches. There's a reason why Djokovic went out and got Becker as coach.

 

[Mustard]

If you normalize the surface so it was not clay skewed, their won loss percentage would be much closer. It might be even or better since Nadal did not beat Federer off of clay since 2014. This is accentuated by the strategic missing of hardcourt tournaments when he has almost never missed clay slam or Masters 1000s for 18 years.

Yawn. Nadal beat Federer at 2006 Dubai, and 2008 Wimbledon, and 2009 Australian Open. Oh, 2004 Miami too, and was very close at 2005 Miami.

 

[Holmes]

Nadal was tanking in 2011 to raise the interest in the ATP Tour. After WHUPPING Feddy for the better part of 5 years people got BORED and Nadal was quietly asked to boost a new rival by the ATP. In return, the ATP promised to change the hard courts to be MOLASSES slow.

Sounds like a GOOD deal to me.

Nadal was ALWAYS on the payroll...HELL how do you think Feddy won titles from 2006 onwards?