What's the one hole/stain in Djokovic's resume?

Meles said:
Its a shame Djoko2015or16 never ran into Nadal in his prime years. 2008 and 2012 Nadal wins. Other years are really interesting. Nadal is an 800 pound Gorilla on clay. Nole checks in at 700 pounds. 90's Clay at 98 pound (weakling.)
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Lol at the last part :D
Agree,Nadal of 2008,2012,also 2007 and maybe 2010 are all too strong.
The other versions of Nadal in RG would
most likely lose if Djoko plays his best tennis there.
 
ForumMember said:
He had to wait for Nadal and Federer to go down to start winning.
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Easy big fella, eassssy...

latest
 
kishnabe said:
It easy to see Nadal level. 2014 and 2015 were bad, no?

Novak only beat a halfdal....Not saying he can't beat Peak Nadal...but he failed with plenty of good chances (2012,and 2013)
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Not taking RG off Nadal, in 2014 and in the final at that, was a stain imo.
He had a chance to redeem himself from 2013, and end Nadal's reign of final wins there.
2013 USO - being soundly beaten and Nadal taking over as hard court player of the year was also a stain, which stung even more after RG and Wimby losses that year.
.
 
Incognito said:
(2013) Nadal was a break ahead in the second set, squandered it. Breadsticked djokovic in the 3rd. He was serving for the match in the 4th set but choked. It should never had gone to a 5th set IMO.

(2014) Djokovic should have won this one. Nadal was really weak in this final. He had back pains and gassed out by the 4th set and was serving like crap.

(2012) without the rain, Nadal would have finished him in 3.
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Djoker was also weak in the final with a gastro bug, but still should have gone the distance with Nadal cramping etc.
 
DerekNoleFam1 said:
Not taking RG off Nadal, in 2014 and in the final at that, was a stain imo.
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His level was good enough IMO, but unfortunately he was sick already during the SF.

DerekNoleFam1 said:
2013 USO - being soundly beaten and Nadal taking over as hard court player of the year was also a stain, which stung even more after RG and Wimby losses that year.
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As far as I'm concerned, that was his most painful loss to Nadal. I can't really call one single match a stain, because he was a genuine mental midget for the whole season (2013 and a huge part of 2014 too). Djokovic who lost that final to Nadal in 4, would also lose to Federer two years later in 4 sets. I have no doubt about it.
 
VamosBamos987 said:
Novack GOAT.

No holes in resume.
Perfect forehand. Perfect backhand. Perfect serve. Flawless hair.

Best on clay. Best on grass. Best on hard. Highest peak on all surfaces. Best on wood court best on ice court. Etc.

Perfect house, wife, car, laugh, smile. Perfect eyes.

Can procreate better than Fed. Will have three sets of twins by 2017. Nadal has no wife, no kids. MUG.
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Come on, even you don't believe that. :)
 
Incognito said:
Well, djokovic is not the greatest of anything!

He's not the greatest on HC, far from the greatest on grass and clay.
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Yep. He's just the greatest at holding all four majors on three different surfaces at the same time. Nothing really special to brag about, you're right....
 
Hitman said:
Yep. He's just the greatest at holding all four majors on three different surfaces at the same time. Nothing really special to brag about, you're right....
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If Djokovic wins Wimbledon, he will equal Nadal's achievement. He is the first, and only male player to date, to win three consecutive Slam Tournaments on three different surfaces (clay, grass and hardcourt) in the same year (2010)
 
smash hit said:
If Djokovic wins Wimbledon, he will equal Nadal's achievement. He is the first, and only male player to date, to win three consecutive Slam Tournaments on three different surfaces (clay, grass and hardcourt) in the same year (2010)
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Djokovic has plenty of things to tick off by winning Wimbledon.
Join Borg, Sampras and Federer by threepeating at Wimbledon
Joining Borg, Nadal, Laver, Federer by doing a channel slam
Joing Nadal by winning three slams on three different surfaces in same calender year
First player in Open era to win 5 straight slams

All these things can be added to his already flourishing resume.
 
ForumMember said:
He had to wait for Nadal and Federer to go down to start winning.
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If Djokovic didn't have impressive 07 and 08 seasons then I would have been inclined to agree with you somewhat. But this simply is not true; Djokovic by 2008 was already the second best hard court player (better than Nadal, better than Murray etc) and was Federer's biggest rival on hard in those two years. It was only in 2010 when Nadal surpassed Djokovic on HC's, and that only lasted a few months. If Djokovic making the finals of the US Open and winning AO 08 was to do with Federer declining, than Nadal winning Wimbledon 08 was also due to Federer declining.


By the time Federer and Nadal were still in grand slam mode (07/08), Djokovic already had a slam, a WTF, a few masters titles, a US Open runner up, with SF showings at FO and Wimbledon. You make it sound like Djokovic didn't accomplish a god damn thing before 2011. Why?




The only thing Djokovic can do now is try to go a full season without getting beaten. Can't see anyone ever doing this. Not even Djokovic.
 
ForumMember said:
He had to wait for Nadal and Federer to go down to start winning.
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I'd say this is the one thing.

You could also point out that 7 of his grand slams have come from beating Andy Murray who historically been his lap dog.
It is not a major hole but when you start nitpicking its something to look at.
 
cknobman said:
I'd say this is the one thing.

You could also point out that 7 of his grand slams have come from beating Andy Murray who historically been his lap dog.
It is not a major hole but when you start nitpicking its something to look at.
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Well chances are he would've gone on to beat whoever knocked out Murray so I don't really understand what you're saying, especially as a Fed fan whose own "lap dog" was a worse player than Murray and who couldn't beat Roger in a major if his life depended on it, unlike AM who's done it twice.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Well chances are he would've gone on to beat whoever knocked out Murray so I don't really understand what you're saying, especially as a Fed fan whose own "lap dog" was a worse player than Murray and who couldn't beat Roger in a major if his life depended on it, unlike AM who's done it twice.
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You sound very defensive. Noted I put "nitpicking"

And if you are referring to Andy Roddick, Roger only beat him in 4 grand slam finals out of 17 titles.
That makes for 23.5% of his titles from his "lap dog".

Djokovic beat Andy Murray in 7 grand slam finals out of 12 titles.
That makes for 58.3% of his titles from his "lap dog".


So my point is valid when "nitpicking". :)
 
cknobman said:
You sound very defensive. Noted I put "nitpicking"

And if you are referring to Andy Roddick, Roger only beat him in 4 grand slam finals out of 17 titles.
That makes for 23.5% of his titles from his "lap dog".

Djokovic beat Andy Murray in 7 grand slam finals out of 12 titles.
That makes for 58.3% of his titles from his "lap dog".


So my point is valid when "nitpicking". :)
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Can you list those 7 Grand Slam finals? I can only think of 5. ;)
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Lol, I guarantee if Novak had beaten him during that period at RG, Nadal would no longer have been in his prime according to many on here.
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In fairness it is pretty plainly evident there was a huge drop off in Nadal's level in 2015 relative to the previous 8 years or so. He is now definitely in the clearly "past his prime" stage, regardless if he wins more majors somehow. Even in 2014 to some extent, although here obviously not too much if he was in the first 2 slam finals of the year, won one, and lost the other as a huge favorite.

Many Federer fans especialy act like Nadal was clearly past his prime on clay from 2011 onwards anyway, as a way to belittle Djokovic in comparision to Federer on the surface. So it doesnt neccessarily coincide with a Nadal loss.
 
cknobman said:
You sound very defensive. Noted I put "nitpicking"

And if you are referring to Andy Roddick, Roger only beat him in 4 grand slam finals out of 17 titles.
That makes for 23.5% of his titles from his "lap dog".

Djokovic beat Andy Murray in 7 grand slam finals out of 12 titles.
That makes for 58.3% of his titles from his "lap dog".


So my point is valid when "nitpicking". :)
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You are counting Djokovic's RG 15 semi win and USO 14 quarters win, among those five slam finals to get tha count of 7.

If you wish to do that, then Federer beat Roddick in W 03 and AO 07, I am sure they played quarters USO7 also. That makes it 7 times overall.

7/17 = 41%
 
Djokovic2011 said:
If you think about it, compared to every other tier 1 great of the Open Era, he doesn't really have one. Borg never won the USO, Sampras never won the French and was lacklustre on clay in general, Nadal never won the WTF and has a mediocre record indoors(not to mention one or two other things truth be told) and Federer's is obviously his poor H2H against Nadal. With Djokovic however, and especially now he's completed the Career Grand Slam, it's difficult to really pick one since he also has a winning H2H over all his main rivals and his resume as a whole looks so incredibly well balanced. I suppose some of you might say the Olympic gold medal but I'm not sure that's such a big deal given that it's only played once every four years and tennis as a sport has only been part of the event since the late 80s. I guess if I were really pushed to choose something it would be only winning one slam per season between 2012-14 since they were smack bang in the middle of his prime years but even that might be scraping the barrel considering it's a player's overall achievements that matter the most, not one specific time frame.

Thoughts?
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He has not won the Grand Slam.
 
Depends on what the goal is. In terms of overall career achievements, only Olympic Gold which is a really minor one. Cincy doesn't really count imo, he has won 8/9 Masters, is still very much capable of taking a Cincy in the future and he has made something like 5 finals which is good as well (not like he crashes out before the QFs every time).

If the current goal is being the one with the greatest achievements of all time, it's too soon to discuss. He's so far ahead at number 1 and the favourite for every title that anything he still misses can still be obtained. On the other hand, he is still behind in overall achievements to at least Federer, maybe Sampras and Nadal (although Djokovic has things going for him to compensate for two fewer slams). So I don't believe he is quite there yet. But I can't imagine him not winning at least two more slams, probably more.

Opposition is not great I guess, but I do agree it's not exactly a stain. I don't believe in players absolutely dominating when the field is tremendously amazing anyway, no matter who it is. I thought the 2012 field was really, really strong and no one really got a chance to utterly dominate that year, just to give an example.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
As soon as I saw an alert from you I knew exactly what it was gonna say. :D
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"Most traditionalists insist that the "Grand Slam" should refer only to winning all four titles in a calendar year, although the constitution of the International Tennis Federation, the sport's governing body, spells out that "players who hold all four of these titles at the same time achieve the Grand Slam"."
 
I honestly think that the biggest issue for him was the two lost years due to his serving and health issues in 09 and 10. I remember watching Djokovic in 07 and 08 he looked like a world beater could run all day. Then in another match he walking around huffing and puffing in the first few games of certain matches. Little did we know the allergy and respiratory issues were dietary and fixable. Also the serve experiment with Martin to add a Sampraseque first serve probably on its own cost Novak 1-3 slams in 09 and 10. The rest of his game was so good that despite frequent withdrawals and a WTA serve he managed to finish in the top 3 in the world. Halfway through 2010 he canned Martin and just went back to something that was more similar to the old motion. His serve numbers went through the roof and he was diagnosed with an allergic intolerance of gluten. I think that will be his biggest regret, the lost 2 years he had in 09 and 10 and the impact it had on people's perceptions of him. Other than that he has won everything but Cincy and most of the biggest events multiple times and has been number one 200 plus weeks.
 
socal1976 said:
I honestly think that the biggest issue for him was the two lost years due to his serving and health issues in 09 and 10. I remember watching Djokovic in 07 and 08 he looked like a world beater could run all day. Then in another match he walking around huffing and puffing in the first few games of certain matches. Little did we know the allergy and respiratory issues were dietary and fixable. Also the serve experiment with Martin to add a Sampraseque first serve probably on its own cost Novak 1-3 slams in 09 and 10. The rest of his game was so good that despite frequent withdrawals and a WTA serve he managed to finish in the top 3 in the world. Halfway through 2010 he canned Martin and just went back to something that was more similar to the old motion. His serve numbers went through the roof and he was diagnosed with an allergic intolerance of gluten. I think that will be his biggest regret, the lost 2 years he had in 09 and 10 and the impact it had on people's perceptions of him. Other than that he has won everything but Cincy and most of the biggest events multiple times and has been number one 200 plus weeks.
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Maybe these two years have been a blessing in disguise for him. Who knows whether it would be the year 2011 if weren't 09/10 in Novaks career. Through the lows has learned to fight and work hard on his game, fitness. Who knows that today he wouldn't be washed up like Nadal?
Imo ,he has a little to regret, has much more to be proud of:)
 
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