tennis tom
Legend
Do you play with Kellogg?
When was the day your had "arrived" as a tennis player ?
- Thread starter TimeToPlaySets
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tennis tom
Legend
When chicks wanted to sleep with me for access to my stroke production.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
Bill? No, I just work for him in tournaments at his club. He usually plays doubles with the head pro, Conan.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
Are they geriatric-care nurses?
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tennis tom
Legend
I don't get strokes--I give them.
Sorry to hear about your 3.0 game style above--if you get a good coach he should be able to get you to 3.5 within 8 years of twice daily lessons--then hit 10 million practice balls.
To what?
sredna42
Hall of Fame
I got near "arriving" 2 years ago, started to come close to beating some very good players, and i was able to pull myself up to get just a glimpse of the next level up, but its been all downhill since then. Can barely rally, can't beat anyone, can barely even get a serve in.
tennis tom
Legend
When I could hit a no-look redirect winner.
WestboroChe
Hall of Fame
I would never say I have arrived but....
Today I played a round robin at the club and the first set I won in singles 6-1. We had some time to play some more and I was up 4-1 before we switched. It was one of those rare times where every shot is playing to its potential. I hit slices moonballs and some hard flat shots. Everything was clicking.
I then proceeded to a doubles set where my partner and I were completely outmatched and lost 6-0.
Today I played a round robin at the club and the first set I won in singles 6-1. We had some time to play some more and I was up 4-1 before we switched. It was one of those rare times where every shot is playing to its potential. I hit slices moonballs and some hard flat shots. Everything was clicking.
I then proceeded to a doubles set where my partner and I were completely outmatched and lost 6-0.
TimeToPlaySets
Legend
Injuries ?
sredna42
Hall of Fame
I have had a shocking injury run actually but i think its mostly in my head. Carrying my work/life stress onto court, slowly but surely losing all clarity out there.
WalterSlovotsky
New User
There were lots of days that could have been that day, but at the time they didn't feel like it as there was always the next target. Winning an age level tournament, winning playing up, winning a college match, etc. There was always someone better, always ways to improve and move up.
Then the day came when the next step was a step too far. It is a hard day when you realize your best achievements are behind you. And now it that day will never come, and all I can do is slow the decline and know that my game will never be as good as it once was.
So yeah, I don't think I will ever arrive as a tennis player. But i will never stop playing.
Then the day came when the next step was a step too far. It is a hard day when you realize your best achievements are behind you. And now it that day will never come, and all I can do is slow the decline and know that my game will never be as good as it once was.
So yeah, I don't think I will ever arrive as a tennis player. But i will never stop playing.
TimeToPlaySets
Legend
Yes, that must be hard, but we accept decline in all facets of life, and adapt.
Pickleball?
Pickleball?
WalterSlovotsky
New User
Hah! Not likely. Maybe golf.
Dude, golf sucks even compared to pickleball... golf is more expensive per hour of play than tennis... less accessible on the average... and even more technically difficult than tennis (though not as athletically difficult - if that makes sense). Looking back, I wish that I had taken up tennis in my 20s instead of the thousands of dollars and hours I wasted on a golf game that never got any better than a 25+ handicap. If I had found tennis in my 20s, after I stopped playing college baseball, there's a very good chance that I would be lamenting my decline from the ranks of 4.5, now 5 months from age 50, rather than wondering if I'll ever reach 4.0... screw golf... play pickleball. All your tennis pals will eventually be there, and I am sure I'll probably play it once my knees tell me to quit tennis - either that or I'll get back into fishing...
OnTheLine
Hall of Fame
I agree on the wish that I had taken up tennis seriously in my 20s .... post college-soccer. Instead I went into taekwondo and got myself really banged up with some permanent injuries competing in black belt tournaments for 15+ years. If I am knocking on 4.0 after 3 years back at 50yo ... imagine I would be currently fighting to maintain 4.5 now instead.
HOWEVER, in terms of aging as I am about a year ahead of you .... I want to be part of the group I see at the club every day. All in their 70s, 80s or 90s ... they play every single day ... the level of play is no longer that great, but they are playing and laughing and then grabbing coffee or a bite afterwards. Every.Single.Day. I want to be them in 20-30 years.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
I see what you are getting at, but though I want to be on the court like the tennis elders you talk about, I do NOT want to become like them. I want to be constantly challenged by a younger crowd and continue playing singles and not turn into cynical people with the same old jokes and grievances.
Haha, OK, fair point - I don't know if I'll want to do this in 20 years, but it's as safe a bet as any - I sure as hell won't be golfing though...
I do hope for you that this comes true though!
OnTheLine
Hall of Fame
Why are they cynical with old jokes and complaints? I didn't say that, have no reason to know it could possibly be true.
Although I would like to think that I can still play at a decent level and still play singles deep into my 80s .... I would like to simply still be able to play ... that would be lovely.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
Reality is that you have to find people who will want to play with you. It is not only about skills. Bob (real name) at my club who is 80+ told me nobody wants to play with him once they know his age (even though he looks younger, some remarks can trip him up). I told him not to think that way and drove him to a public court one day to play with him because he was not willing to come to the club as too many memories of his younger days were there. We played, and I convinced him to get back and he is showing up again. Don't assume that players will be willing to play with you when you are older, even those your age. For example, I prefer to play with younger folks as they are fun to be with.
TimeToPlaySets
Legend
Golf is levels easier than tennis.
It is not even a comparison.
You can get to a +10 within a few summers. (mid 80s, which is like 4.0 tennis)
Which is like one or two years of tennis.
Takes most people 10 years to get to 4.0 in tennis
Golf = checkers
Tennis = chess
Oh man you and I are just going to have to agree to disagree on that one I think... for me, golf was MUCH more technically difficult to get a handle on than tennis has been. The athletic requirements of golf, I found to be a pittance compared to the athletic requirements of tennis, but the technical skill components of hitthg a golf ball straight with reasonable power are much harder for me to manage than hitting a tennis ball where I want to with power - even though the golf ball is stationary.
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TimeToPlaySets
Legend
One can get decent at golf (mid/low 80s) without taking a single lesson.
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TimeToPlaySets
Legend
"arrive" is subjective.
Thanks for adding zero to this thread though
Thanks for adding zero to this thread though
navigator
Hall of Fame
Well, opinions regarding posts are also subjective. So, you're welcome!
Your attitude toward older people sounds very cynical.
tennis tom
Legend
There you go again, derailing another thread with your AGEIST bombs. Maybe the elders you refer to are not "cynical" but wiser. You're very hung up on "youthism"--but then again you live in kali, where it's against the law to grow old. You needn't worry about becoming an "old fart" as you refer to seniors in in your previous post, since in ten years **** sapiens won't exist due to climate change, according to the iminent weather forecaster AOC--I'm sure she has a lot of background in her field studying tree ring dating and glacial recessions and progressions over the millenia. BTW, senior age group tennis begins at 35, so Roger is a senior. They should change the term for Senior Age Group tennis to "Masters Tennis", like swimming and running name the five year age brackets-- maybe that term will make it more palatable for those who are ageing adverse. Ever consider the juniors, since so many once-men are competing and winning against women these days--why not crash the junior tournies?--you're as young as you feel after all.
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TimeToPlaySets
Legend
Suresh has a point. Very few older people develop their game. In fact, I've never seen an older male taking a lesson. And they mostly play doubles with the same 3 guys. And he's right, they recycle the same jokes and stuff. They are the definition of stagnant mediocrity. The worst is the old guy who is hyper competitive, yet does not have the strokes to back it up. Decades of playing tennis and you still have 3.0 strokes? They just look foolish to me.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
Worst is when they crack dirty jokes and then accuse each other of being dirty old men.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
Stagnation is a big issue. That is why I like to have a variety of partners to play with.
tennis tom
Legend
Sureshi needs to sign up for a Senior Age Group tournament in his age category and test his mettle against his peers, like the one he volunteered at LGBTC, instead of denigrating "old farts" and idolizing his juniors. There won't be much talking--if any--just a handshake at the end.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
I am only doing the clenched fist knuckle touching these days at the end of the match. I don't like to shake sweaty unhygienic palms.
tennis tom
Legend
You know your opponent's "sweaty unhygienic palms" are handling those fuzzy little balls that YOU are handling and storing in your pockets?--maybe you need to open a new can of balls before each of your serves.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
BTW, do you know where women put those spare balls?
tennis tom
Legend
If you don't it might be time for your annual eye exam. I do know a woman who stores them between her ample cleavage--warm balls travel faster.
BTW, there are lady's panties now that have two pockets to store spare balls, so as not to be dependent on partners to hold the third one.
sureshs
Bionic Poster
I knew two women like that.
TimeToPlaySets
Legend
Walked off the court today, and the granny on the next court was paying my some sort of compliment.
I bet she's never seen people hit a tennis ball like that. Or even a real kick serve
Rec parks are full of 2.5 dinkers who never learned (90% of all tennis players)
I bet she's never seen people hit a tennis ball like that. Or even a real kick serve
Rec parks are full of 2.5 dinkers who never learned (90% of all tennis players)
r2473
G.O.A.T.
When you play against a hard hitter, it makes both players look good.
What I want to know is, did anyone ask if you had played college tennis after watching you the next day. Against the guy with the dink serve?
TimeToPlaySets
Legend
No way.
The dink server guy makes me look like I've ever played tennis before.
Junking is king.
The dink server guy makes me look like I've ever played tennis before.
Junking is king.
r2473
G.O.A.T.
When you look like a college level player against a player like that, THEN you’ve arrived
TimeToPlaySets
Legend
See post #22
I thought I arrived as a player when instead of writing tomes on how much I had improved, I mustered enough courage to accept @rogerroger917 challenge to play him. I did get bageled. So I am not sure anymore though.
thehustler
Semi-Pro
I can't resist. I'm a high 4.0 low 4.5 and these comments make me laugh. Tennis and all sports for that matter are about finding your opponents weakness and exploiting them. You seem like a lot of players I face, they love pace but once you throw in a slice, change the pace they break down. A hard low level serve? Num num. I'll just absorb your pace and put it somewhere randomly each time keeping you off balance. I've played many guys work harder strokes, serves, etc. and beat them. I remember playing a guy in usta years ago. Beautiful 1hbh. Looked just so pretty. I beat him 2 and 3. I was just a scrappy kid who got everything back. We shook hands and then he proceeded to obliterate his expensive racket against the net post. I applaud your confidence but even I know I can't beat everyone and that none of them will give a crap about how my strokes look.
TimeToPlaySets
Legend
Great post, but not sure of your point.
Yup, I play with several 4.0 junkers and I love their style.
Best players out there. Pushing is king.
I have added lots of junk into my game, and love it.
I love playing against junk and slice, and I have worked a ton on slices and drop shots.
Give me a weak floater ball, however, and I will take control of the point.
Most adult rec players should not use advanced strokes and are better off pushing.
However, if you play every day, and maintain good fitness, big strokes are the way to go.
I would love to see a video of yours.
A low 4.5 pusher/junker is a seriously talented player.
The only downside to your game is that you've never played high level tennis.
A pusher only experiences half of tennis and never constructing points and playing offense.
I played a 4.0 pusher recently, and steamrolled him 2 and 3.
I was on offense on every point. Hitting him wide, attacking approach balls, and volleying at the net.
I play tennis to play high level tennis, not to win. That said, winning is a by-product of high level tennis.
Someone with offense can hang with a 4.5, while a pusher will be crushed by a real 4.5
For example, pusher will never make the progression this guy made
3 years of work and he's past 99% of rec hackers who never learn to hit hard and play advanced tennis
And 1HBH is ugly. Such a weak stroke. No clue why anyone would use it.
When I face 1HBH, I crush balls to the BH side, and they rarely ever come back. 1HBH is a massive liability
Yup, I play with several 4.0 junkers and I love their style.
Best players out there. Pushing is king.
I have added lots of junk into my game, and love it.
I love playing against junk and slice, and I have worked a ton on slices and drop shots.
Give me a weak floater ball, however, and I will take control of the point.
Most adult rec players should not use advanced strokes and are better off pushing.
However, if you play every day, and maintain good fitness, big strokes are the way to go.
I would love to see a video of yours.
A low 4.5 pusher/junker is a seriously talented player.
The only downside to your game is that you've never played high level tennis.
A pusher only experiences half of tennis and never constructing points and playing offense.
I played a 4.0 pusher recently, and steamrolled him 2 and 3.
I was on offense on every point. Hitting him wide, attacking approach balls, and volleying at the net.
I play tennis to play high level tennis, not to win. That said, winning is a by-product of high level tennis.
Someone with offense can hang with a 4.5, while a pusher will be crushed by a real 4.5
For example, pusher will never make the progression this guy made
3 years of work and he's past 99% of rec hackers who never learn to hit hard and play advanced tennis
And 1HBH is ugly. Such a weak stroke. No clue why anyone would use it.
When I face 1HBH, I crush balls to the BH side, and they rarely ever come back. 1HBH is a massive liability
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thehustler
Semi-Pro
I don't consider myself a pusher or a junker. I think of myself as someone who finds a way to beat someone by figuring out what they don't like and exploit it.
I'll never post a video, I have zero time to do that and videos just don't really show what's really happening or help one really understand what a person is doing unless you were the opponent in the video. Tennis can look really easy to someone watching it on tv, but to get to that level, to do what the pros do is hard. I remember a long time ago watching Allen Iverson play basketball on tv. I knew he was fast, but I was fast too. Then I saw him in person. I then realized I'm fast, but I'm not that fast.
I don't think people are better off pushing. I think you should really go for it and see what you're capable of. That's how I'm improving myself. I know what I can do at the level I'm at and be ok, but I want to know what I can really do. I want to be able to show my son how it's never too late to learn something new, that you can always get better. I'm willing to suffer in a match if it means in future matches I've fixed what I wanted and that particular thing can't be broken down anymore.
I've played one guy who was a 5.0 at one point. I think age and injuries knocked him down to 4.5, but a solid 4.5. He has the shots. I know if I don't hit my shots properly then he'll clobber them back, so it forces me to play better. We barely get to hit, but I think he's up in sets like 2 - 1. I should've won another, but we were both gassed from previous sets against other opponents and he just adjusted to the heat better than I did. I'm now playing against some guy who was a top level junior years ago. He played against Sharapova at the Bolleteri Academy years ago. He hasn't played in a while, but I can tell that when he rounds into form he'll be a huge challenge which I enjoy.
I see a lot of players at lower levels, not even pushers who struggle to construct points. It's fun to watch. They serve, you float a return deep, they maybe hit a decent ball back, you put it back into place and they overhit the next shot because they're so jumpy about hitting a winner instead of making maybe one more good shot to get an even better shot. I've done points where I'll hit to someone's backhand several times in a row until I get that shot I can hit into the forehand corner. They may get a forehand that they've been dreaming about the entire point, but it's going to be overhit because they're so excited and I can either let it go or just hit an open court volley.
I'm not sure why anybody at the rec level uses the 1HBH either. I've found if I put extra spin on my shots to kick the ball up high they struggle getting shots back and it gives me such a huge advantage. It's just like the Rafa strategy for years against Fed and it really does work at the lower levels.
I think as a rec player you should try to have as many shots as possible, but at least have a weapon or two at your disposal. I see a lot who just don't develop certain areas of their games and it's amazing. Same issues each time, same results each time.
I'll never post a video, I have zero time to do that and videos just don't really show what's really happening or help one really understand what a person is doing unless you were the opponent in the video. Tennis can look really easy to someone watching it on tv, but to get to that level, to do what the pros do is hard. I remember a long time ago watching Allen Iverson play basketball on tv. I knew he was fast, but I was fast too. Then I saw him in person. I then realized I'm fast, but I'm not that fast.
I don't think people are better off pushing. I think you should really go for it and see what you're capable of. That's how I'm improving myself. I know what I can do at the level I'm at and be ok, but I want to know what I can really do. I want to be able to show my son how it's never too late to learn something new, that you can always get better. I'm willing to suffer in a match if it means in future matches I've fixed what I wanted and that particular thing can't be broken down anymore.
I've played one guy who was a 5.0 at one point. I think age and injuries knocked him down to 4.5, but a solid 4.5. He has the shots. I know if I don't hit my shots properly then he'll clobber them back, so it forces me to play better. We barely get to hit, but I think he's up in sets like 2 - 1. I should've won another, but we were both gassed from previous sets against other opponents and he just adjusted to the heat better than I did. I'm now playing against some guy who was a top level junior years ago. He played against Sharapova at the Bolleteri Academy years ago. He hasn't played in a while, but I can tell that when he rounds into form he'll be a huge challenge which I enjoy.
I see a lot of players at lower levels, not even pushers who struggle to construct points. It's fun to watch. They serve, you float a return deep, they maybe hit a decent ball back, you put it back into place and they overhit the next shot because they're so jumpy about hitting a winner instead of making maybe one more good shot to get an even better shot. I've done points where I'll hit to someone's backhand several times in a row until I get that shot I can hit into the forehand corner. They may get a forehand that they've been dreaming about the entire point, but it's going to be overhit because they're so excited and I can either let it go or just hit an open court volley.
I'm not sure why anybody at the rec level uses the 1HBH either. I've found if I put extra spin on my shots to kick the ball up high they struggle getting shots back and it gives me such a huge advantage. It's just like the Rafa strategy for years against Fed and it really does work at the lower levels.
I think as a rec player you should try to have as many shots as possible, but at least have a weapon or two at your disposal. I see a lot who just don't develop certain areas of their games and it's amazing. Same issues each time, same results each time.
rogerroger917
Hall of Fame
It was a fun match. Thanks for the effort to meet up.
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TimeToPlaySets
Legend
What happened ?
BounceHitBounceHit
Legend
You are playing the wrong one hand backhand players. Please don’t throw me in that there pick on my BH briar patch!
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