Which draw was weaker - Wimbledon 2017 or Wimbledon 2021?

[weakera]

Damn! Misclicked
@weakera Can ya enable vote changing?

sure thing my guy

 

[abmk]

Delpo was way better than anything Fed faced in AO 18 Fed was poor in the final vs cilic

Delpo was sh*te after a set (due to being tired) in USO 17 semi. which world are you in? he was sick at the start of the Thiem match. Just about recovered towards closing stages of 2nd set and managed to win the match. Then tough 4-setter vs fed. he was physically done after a set vs Nadal.

Cilic in AO 18 final was way better than delpo of USO 17 semi. Not even remotely close.

Fed played good in AO 18 final except for a stretch from up a break in the 4th set to start of 5th set.

Apart from that stretch, fed wasn't broken even once and broke 6 times (only lost 2nd set TB because Cilic took it to him and edged it out)

 

[DIMI_D]

Delpo was sh*te after a set (due to being tired) in USO 17 semi. which world are you in? he was sick at the start of the Thiem. Just abou recovered and managed to win. Then tough 4-setter vs fed. he was physically done after a set vs Nadal.

Cilic in AO 18 final was way better than delpo of USO 17 semi. Not even remotely close.

Fed played good in AO 18 final except for a stretch from up a break in the 4th set to start of 5th set.

Apart from that stretch, fed wasn't broken even once and broke 6 times (only lost 2nd set TB because Cilic took it to him and edged it out)

Yes I know he was tired after a couple of sets, he is still better quality player at that level vs cilic tho

 

[abmk]

Yes I know he was tired after a couple of sets, he is still better quality player at that level vs cilic tho

He was tired after set1.
Nadal played in great in set 2 and would've won that set anyways.
But if delpo was not tired, that set 2 would be closer and nadal would have an actual challenge from set 3 onwards.

Delpo is the better player overall, but way worse than Cilic when tired like that.

I mean djoko is way better player than wawa, but doesn't prevent Wawa from beating him in slams, does it?

 

[abmk]

Federer played at a higher level than Djokovic did but after the first few games of that '17 Wimbledon final Cilic was about as much use as an ashtray on a motorbike.

Cilic was mediocre, but he did try to an extent in the 3rd set. That's why it was 6-4.
I'd just say Berr was better, I was just trying to explain where @InsideOut900 might be coming from.

 

[mike danny]

Neither draw was great.

But match by match:

Dimitrov > Garin
Raonic > Fucsovics
Berdych = Shapovalov
Berrettini > Cilic

 

[Linelicker]

Neither draw was great.

But match by match:

Dimitrov > Garin
Raonic > Fucsovics
Berdych = Shapovalov
Berrettini > Cilic

I think Berrettini = Cilic

Cilic faced a very good version of Federer, while Djokovic was not good in that final.

 

[abmk]

Neither draw was great.

But match by match:

Dimitrov > Garin
Raonic > Fucsovics
Berdych = Shapovalov
Berrettini > Cilic

berdych > Shapo by a significant distance:

re the Berdych match in Wim 17 @BackhandDTL :

Berdych was broken only twice and broke federer once.

Berdych hit 31 winners, forced 56 errors from federer and committed 19 UEs.
so basically 87 winners+FEs to only 19 UEs.

Granted wimbledon is lenient with UEs, even with margin for some more UEs, but those are fine stats.

He was 1/6 on BPs ( federer saving most of those)
While Federer was 2/9 on BPs (berdych saved most of those with clutch play)

http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/scores/stats/1602ms.html

From the mouth of Berdych himself :

"I think I played really good tennis throughout the whole tournament. But, unfortunately, I faced a guy who is playing by far the best tennis right now.”

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...mas-berdych-wimbledon-semi-final-match-report

from BBC:

There were just three breaks of serve over two hours and 18 minutes, two for Federer, who hit 53 winners to Berdych's 31 in a high-quality contest.

http://www.bbc.com/sport/tennis/40609718

Shapo hit 40 winners, forced 49 errors from djoko and committed 35 UEs
so basically 89 winners+errors forced to 35 UEs

contrast to berdych's 87 winners+errors forced to only 19 UEs (against a significantly better opponent in 17 fed)

Shapo broke once and was broken thrice
Berdych broke once and was broken twice - against a significantly better federer in WIm 17 semi than Djoko of Wim 21 semi

Berdych didn't choke like Shapo did either.

 

[zagor]

That came out of nowhere.

It did? Let's consider the OP and his motivation for the thread.

Or do you honestly believe if I (or any other Fed fan) would have made a thread about Nadal's 2017 USO draw for example, that Nadal fans wouldn't take shots at Fed in said thread?

 

[zagor]

Both incredibly weak the same with US 17 and AO 18

Novak and Fed won a slam while not facing a single top 25 player too? When? It's news to me.

 

[DIMI_D]

Novak and Fed won a slam while not facing a single top 25 player too? When? It's news to me.

Who cares about rank depends on the quality of the player. Thiem and Fed will be so low pretty soon they will always be a better calibre player than most of the field. Same as Stan he is what in 70s rank wise

 

[NatF]

Delpo was way better than anything Fed faced in AO 18 Fed was poor in the final vs cilic

lol no. Delpo wilted after one set, Berdych in 2018 probably played better than anyone Nadal faced at the USO at the USO in 2017 - which is saying something.

 

[DIMI_D]

Novak and Fed won a slam while not facing a single top 25 player too? When? It's news to me.

By the way Novak, Fed etc were all in the draw and Fed lost to a tired delpo in QTRs..

 

[DIMI_D]

lol no. Delpo wilted after one set, Berdych in 2018 probably played better than anyone Nadal faced at the USO at the USO in 2017 - which is saying something.

Delpo was tired from theim but still beat Fed next round makes a lot of sense right

 

[DIMI_D]

Yes I did see the game I know he was gassed by the second but somehow his conditioning is nadals fault. He still smashed Fed in 4 when he is suppose to be more tired after the 5 set match

 

[DIMI_D]

He was tired after set1.
Nadal played in great in set 2 and would've won that set anyways.
But if delpo was not tired, that set 2 would be closer and nadal would have an actual challenge from set 3 onwards.

Delpo is the better player overall, but way worse than Cilic when tired like that.

I mean djoko is way better player than wawa, but doesn't prevent Wawa from beating him in slams, does it?

Yet he still beat Fed in quarters after the Thiem match convincingly I might add

 

[onefineday]

2021.
By some way.

 

[NatF]

Delpo was tired from theim but still beat Fed next round makes a lot of sense right

I think he was ill versus Thiem, still good enough to beat Bad'Back'erer but then basically had nothing after one set against Nadal. Let's call a spade a spade, irrespective of rankings, name etc...from the QF onwards Nadal's opponents collectively managed one decent set between them. That's poor. Federer's AO 2018 draw was poor as well, especially with Chung in the SF but Cilic was clearly better than anyone Nadal played and Berdych was better as well.

 

[BVSlam]

They're both weak, but Fed was playing relatively better in 2017 than Djokovic in 2021 and would have been difficult to beat anyway. Berrettini isn't worse than anything from 2017 (played a better final than Cilic at least), but the rest is hopeless (Anderson wouldn't have been, but in 2021 he poses no threat anymore, at least Raonic won four matches before facing Fed so he had a little bit of form at least).

The Fucsovics-Shapo combo was weaker than Raonic-Berdych, who were experienced, still posting good results at that point in their careers and both beat Federer at Wimbledon before. Shapo in general is an unfocused joke. His main fame comes from randomly beating Nadal in a summer HC Masters (honestly, who hasn't at some point?) and being on social media a lot, plus hype from the ATP because they needed to create a post-Big 3 story.

 

[Deleted member 762343]

Obviously Wimbledon 2021 one.

Federer Wim 17 final vs Djokovic Wim 21 final who wins?

Hard to tell because Djokovic would have smelled blood against Federer and played better than he did against Berrettini. Unlike Fedal, Djokovic regularly struggles with motivation issues and he tends to lack motivation when he's not playing one of his two biggest rivals, which leads to him performing at a lower level.

 

[abmk]

Yet he still beat Fed in quarters after the Thiem match convincingly I might add

what he said.

I think he was ill versus Thiem, still good enough to beat Bad'Back'erer but then basically had nothing after one set against Nadal. Let's call a spade a spade, irrespective of rankings, name etc...from the QF onwards Nadal's opponents collectively managed one decent set between them. That's poor. Federer's AO 2018 draw was poor as well, especially with Chung in the SF but Cilic was clearly better than anyone Nadal played and Berdych was better as well.

 

[abmk]

By the way Novak, Fed etc were all in the draw and Fed lost to a tired delpo in QTRs..

delpo wasn't tired in the QFs. he got tired after the 2 matches vs Thiem+Fed and 1 set vs Nadal.
Novak wasn't in the draw.
USO 17 was missing 4-5 top 10 players IIRC

 

[augustobt]

One of the draws has Berrettini listed, as a FINALIST. That's an easy pick.

 

[mike danny]

One of the draws has Berrettini listed, as a FINALIST. That's an easy pick.

In fairness he did play a stronger final than Cilic, but Fed would have whooped him as well anyway. Their 2019 match was a comedy.

 

[RS]

berdych > Shapo by a significant distance:



Shapo hit 40 winners, forced 49 errors from djoko and committed 35 UEs
so basically 89 winners+errors forced to 35 UEs

contrast to berdych's 87 winners+errors forced to only 19 UEs (against a significantly better opponent in 17 fed)

Shapo broke once and was broken thrice
Berdych broke once and was broken twice - against a significantly better federer in WIm 17 semi than Djoko of Wim 21 semi

Berdych didn't choke like Shapo did either.

How would you rate Berdych out of 10?

 

[dapchai]

How would you rate Berdych out of 10?

I don't know about him, but I would rate his wife 11/10.

 

[RS]

I don't know about him, but I would rate his wife 11/10.

?

 

[weakera]

delpo wasn't tired in the QFs. he got tired after the 2 matches vs Thiem+Fed and 1 set vs Nadal.
Novak wasn't in the draw.
USO 17 was missing 4-5 top 10 players IIRC

Cringe

 

[Nadal_King]

Wimby 2021 draw is a joke literally no one player looked to be having everything to beat djokovic. I know some will say nadal Ao 22 was similar but there he played Medvedev which just makes 5 times tougher since he is so good on Hc. Coming to Federer vs Djokovic then Federer 2017 was amazing didn't lost a set there and I believe he wins this in 4

 

[ForehandRF]

I don't know about him, but I would rate his wife 11/10.

Words of wisdom

 

[dapchai]

Words of wisdom

Too bad @RS didn't get it

 

[zagor]

By the way Novak, Fed etc were all in the draw and Fed lost to a tired delpo in QTRs..

And? Fed had a back injury and Novak had an elbow injury.

You still didn't give examples of slams won by Fed or Novak where they didn't face a single top 25 player.

 

[DIMI_D]

And? Fed had a back injury and Novak had an elbow injury.

You still didn't give examples of slams won by Fed or Novak where they didn't face a single top 25 player.

Doesn’t matter about ranking like I said matters the opponent like when goran won Wimbledon as a WC

 

[RS]

I'd say Federer in 4 sets.

Federer Wim 17 final vs Nadal Wim 18 SF?

 

[T007]

Berdych played very well debate incoming

Yes he forced djokovic to take 6 months off out of nowhere

 

[T007]

Doesn’t matter about ranking like I said matters the opponent like when goran won Wimbledon as a WC

Lol That 2017 draw was the easiest ever.

 

[T007]

2017 Berdych VS 2021 Shapovalov.

Berdych is appreciated here, while Shapovalov is underrated.

No doubt, Shapovalov is mentally weak. But his serve, groundstokes and shot-making are dangerous. Berdych was playong good in 2017, but not at his best.

Plus the Cilic factor. Injured as he was in the WB 2017 final, while Berrettini was healthy and even won a set against Novak.

Berrettini had a strap wrapped around his thigh and also called for some treatment after 3rd set.

Berrettini could only win a set because djokovic choked despite serving for the set.

 

[RS]

2017 Berdych VS 2021 Shapovalov.

Berdych is appreciated here, while Shapovalov is underrated.

No doubt, Shapovalov is mentally weak. But his serve, groundstokes and shot-making are dangerous. Berdych was playong good in 2017, but not at his best.

Plus the Cilic factor. Injured as he was in the WB 2017 final, while Berrettini was healthy and even won a set against Novak.

Berdych in 5.

 

[T007]

What rating could be for a near retirement player ?

Few years ago that near retired player bageled Nadal.

 

[DIMI_D]

Lol That 2017 draw was the easiest ever.

You can only play who’s infront of you tired delpo still beat Fred LOL

 

[spottishwood]

You can only play who’s infront of you tired delpo still beat injured Fred LOL

Fixed it for you

 

[NeutralFan]

Few years ago that near retired player bageled Nadal.

Berdych was not near retired player in 2015 and Nadal was in his worse form. Berdych beat your hero Fed in 2010 and 2012 in slam lol. Nadal never faced such humiliating defeat in his own slam

 

[spottishwood]

Nadal never faced such humiliating defeat in his own slam

As a matter of fact, he did. RG'09. Both matches were 4 setters, the winner reached the finals, and lost in straights.

 

[T007]

Berdych was not near retired player in 2015 and Nadal was in his worse form. Berdych beat your hero Fed in 2010 and 2012 in slam lol. Nadal never faced such humiliating defeat in his own slam

Defeat to Soderling in 2009 is a sweet one Indeed for Rafa and his fans in his best Slam.

Berdych was a top 10 player at that time and he was better than shapovalov in 2021. Federer was clutch in saving BPs that day.. Or else that match could have gone to 4 or 5 sets.

 

[NeutralFan]

As a matter of fact, he did. RG'09. Both matches were 4 setters, the winner lost in the finals in straights.

Well, Berdych beat him twice Soderling beat him only once and player in the context is Berdych not Soderling if you play semantic than Ukranian Journeyman defeated Fed on grass in second round at Wimbledon. Tell me if Nadal ever faced such humiliating defeat?

 

[NeutralFan]

Defeat to Soderling in 2009 is a sweet one Indeed for Rafa and his fans in his best Slam.

Berdych was a top 10 player and he was better than shapovalov in 2021. Federer was clutch in saving BPs that day.. Or else that match could have gone to 4 or 5 sets.

Ukranian journeyman says hi if you wanna really talk about humiliating defeat at his own slam

 

[T007]

Berdych was not near retired player in 2015 and Nadal was in his worse form. Berdych beat your hero Fed in 2010 and 2012 in slam lol. Nadal never faced such humiliating defeat in his own slam

I mean who loses to steve darcis in straight sets that too in 1st Rd after winning FO. Infact that year was Nadals 2nd best in his career.

 

[NeutralFan]

I mean who loses to steve darcis in straight sets that too in 1st Rd after winning FO. Infact that year was Nadals 2nd best in his career.

Losing Darcis to his worst slam is still not as worse as losing to Ukranian journeyman at his best slam

 

[spottishwood]

Well, Berdych beat him twice Soderling beat him only once and player in the context is Berdych not Soderling if you play semantic than Ukranian Journeyman defeated Fed on grass in second round at Wimbledon. Tell me if Nadal ever faced such humiliating defeat?

Your game is too boring and repeatable.Played on TTW since ages. Let's play other way this time. Losses at worst slam.

 

[T007]

Ukranian journeyman says hi if you wanna really talk about humiliating defeat at his own slam

I understand your frustration but if i will show you the list it will be very tough for you to digest.

Berdych has beaten all members of the big 3 so losing to him is not a shame.

But losing to Darcis,Muller,Brown is very disturbing as they have never beaten any other top guys