Which GOAT candidate had the toughest competition

Which GOAT candidate had toughest competition

  • Total voters
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egn said:
00-01 Sampras
02-04 Agassi
05-06 Nadal
07-on Nadal Djokovic...

hmmmmm
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What are you suggesting? That old man Sampras and Agassi are Federer's main rivals during 2000-2004 period? Is that the best competition you can come up with for Federer?:lol:
 
NatF said:
I think you need to consider both to be objective. Federer has declined clearly since when he was dominating and has still won 5 slams (almost as much as Novak). I think he'd have a big edge on Murray and Djokovic (aside from 2011) prime for prime.

I think 03-07 competition is underrated due to 2006. That year was weak but the other years were actually pretty strong, 04-05 especially. I'd also say that 07 was certainly a stronger year than 2010 which Nadal dominated. Novak was better in 07 and Nadal was better in 07 than Federer in 2010 IMO and for the sake of argument I'll say Nadal/Federer were equal overall. In 08, Djokovic was very strong but Federer suffered from mono and was having bad losses to everyone. Even this year Nadal hasn't faced Murray and Djokovic has been losing to lots of people up till this Asian swing, albeit not in the slams. So I think there's a tendancy to look at the names not the form when evaluating the competition.
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I agree 2004 and 2007 were decent years. 2003 was as well. I dont feel 2005 was as strong as you do. The Australian Open was a great event, but after that it was downhill. The only high point of the French Open was the Fedal semifinal and a better than expected final between Nadal and a highly inspired/doped Puerta, but this was the first year the lack of depth of the clay field for years to come would become evident. The bottom 4 once you reached the quarterfinal stage was Puerta, Canas, Davydenko (then unknown), and Robredo. Wimbledon was extremely weak. The only good match was the Federer-Hewitt semifinal and maybe the Roddick-Grosjean quarterfinal. Roddick and Hewitt (especialy Roddick) were much weaker than they had been in 2004, even though their results were close to the same. Roddick became a serve and push type player, and was very lucky to somehow make the finals of Wimbledon playing that way. and to somehow roughly mantain his ranking. He would never be the same player he was in 2003-2004 for any sustained period ever again. This was the first year Hewitt became frequently injured and missed various parts of the year. After the Australian Open, Safin incurred an injury that would end his career as a top player. The rise of Nadal was great for the game, but he went 6-3 in non RG slams, with a round of 16 his best. 2006 was even weaker than 2005 of course.

I think 2008 was a very strong year. Djokovic was on fire most of this year, and it was his best year by far until 2011 and beyond. Federer wasnt his best, but still played an amazing Wimbledon final in losing to Nadal, and a great U.S Open to win, and many other strong events. That he ended the year #2 over on fire Djokovic (even if I disagreed with that ranking) shows he was still formidable. This was the year of Murray's rise to being a contender too. In the second half of the year he was great. Davydenko was a force by now, and played very well in many events, especialy the WTF where he was in the final. Del Potro's rise to being a top 5 player occured this year, even though he took it up another level in 2009, and Cilic emerged and was an exciting and promising young talent at the time.

2010 was less strong I agree, but one interesting thing is people often complain here it is always the big 3 or 4 in the finals and semis. Yet in a year like this which was marked by people like Soderling (for the 2nd straight time) and Berdych putting on inspired runs to the finals taking big scalps, preventing the monotnous big 4 dominance, it seems to be used to deem it is a weaker year.



I think prime Federer would have a relatively easy time with Murray in slams considering Murray couldnt beat Federer in a slam until 2013. I dont think he would have it so easy vs Djokovic though, except on grass where I agree he would rout prime Djokovic. From 2008 to 2010 when neither player were totally in their primes, Djokovic more than held his own vs Federer with a close to .500 record, and in slams was 2-2. At the U.S Open and YEC I would favor Federer to win the majority of the time, but they would have well contested matches nonetheless. At the Australian and French it would be close to a toss up, and I would slightly favor Djokovic at the Australian Open perhaps. The guy has a decent shot to end up with about 6 Australian Open titles remember, and his two comprehensive beatdowns of Federer, prime or not, indicate a very challenging foe on those courts.

Even if you dont think Djokovic is a tough opponent for Federer though, he definitely is one for Nadal, even on clay he is a difficult opponent for Nadal. So Nadal having to face him at the height of his powers during his own biggest window for winning potential slams, in addition to having face Federer for so many years previously to that, is no way an easy situation.

You are probably right if you think I placed Nadal and Federer too far apart in competition in my original list though. They are probably closer than I had them upon further analysis. In Nadal's case it should probably also be factored that the clay field from 2005-2008 was very weak, and is where 4 of his slams came from as well.
 
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LOL @ people isolating individual years and claiming they were weak.

This "2006 was a weak yearrrrr" garbage.

In 2006, Federer had to beat Nadal in the Wimbledon final (tougher than 05 Roddick), an on-fire Roddick in the US Open final (tougher than last-hurrah Agassi), and prime-Davydenko in both the AO and the USO, plus had to go through the dangerous earlier rounds quintet at Wimbledon (Gasquet-Henman-Mahut-Berdych-Ancic) which was the most difficult draw he faced in any of his 7 Wimbleton titles.

But because Hewitt began falling off, and we saw Baghdatis catch fire and make a big run at the AO, this means it was a "weak year"...reemerging right when Federer/Nadal were tearing it up, after the 01-03 transitional era had seemingly ended. How'd that happen? :rolleyes:
 
illusions30 said:
I agree 2004 and 2007 were decent years. 2003 was as well. I dont feel 2005 was as strong as you do. The Australian Open was a great event, but after that it was downhill. The only high point of the French Open was the Fedal semifinal and a better than expected final between Nadal and a highly inspired/doped Puerta, but this was the first year the lack of depth of the clay field for years to come would become evident. The bottom 4 once you reached the quarterfinal stage was Puerta, Canas, Davydenko (then unknown), and Robredo. Wimbledon was extremely weak. The only good match was the Federer-Hewitt semifinal and maybe the Roddick-Grosjean quarterfinal. Roddick and Hewitt (especialy Roddick) were much weaker than they had been in 2004, even though their results were close to the same. Roddick became a serve and push type player, and was very lucky to somehow make the finals of Wimbledon playing that way. and to somehow roughly mantain his ranking. He would never be the same player he was in 2003-2004 for any sustained period ever again. This was the first year Hewitt became frequently injured and missed various parts of the year. After the Australian Open, Safin incurred an injury that would end his career as a top player. The rise of Nadal was great for the game, but he went 6-3 in non RG slams, with a round of 16 his best. 2006 was even weaker than 2005 of course.

I think 2008 was a very strong year. Djokovic was on fire most of this year, and it was his best year by far until 2011 and beyond. Federer wasnt his best, but still played an amazing Wimbledon final in losing to Nadal, and a great U.S Open to win, and many other strong events. That he ended the year #2 over on fire Djokovic (even if I disagreed with that ranking) shows he was still formidable. This was the year of Murray's rise to being a contender too. In the second half of the year he was great. Davydenko was a force by now, and played very well in many events, especialy the WTF where he was in the final. Del Potro's rise to being a top 5 player occured this year, even though he took it up another level in 2009, and Cilic emerged and was an exciting and promising young talent at the time.

2010 was less strong I agree, but one interesting thing is people often complain here it is always the big 3 or 4 in the finals and semis. Yet in a year like this which was marked by people like Soderling (for the 2nd straight time) and Berdych putting on inspired runs to the finals taking big scalps, preventing the monotnous big 4 dominance, it seems to be used to deem it is a weaker year.



I think prime Federer would have a relatively easy time with Murray in slams considering Murray couldnt beat Federer in a slam until 2013. I dont think he would have it so easy vs Djokovic though, except on grass where I agree he would rout prime Djokovic. From 2008 to 2010 when neither player were totally in their primes, Djokovic more than held his own vs Federer with a close to .500 record, and in slams was 2-2. At the U.S Open and YEC I would favor Federer to win the majority of the time, but they would have well contested matches nonetheless. At the Australian and French it would be close to a toss up, and I would slightly favor Djokovic at the Australian Open perhaps. The guy has a decent shot to end up with about 6 Australian Open titles remember, and his two comprehensive beatdowns of Federer, prime or not, indicate a very challenging foe on those courts.

Even if you dont think Djokovic is a tough opponent for Federer though, he definitely is one for Nadal, even on clay he is a difficult opponent for Nadal. So Nadal having to face him at the height of his powers during his own biggest window for winning potential slams, in addition to having face Federer for so many years previously to that, is no way an easy situation.

You are probably right if you think I placed Nadal and Federer too far apart in competition in my original list though. They are probably closer than I had them upon further analysis. In Nadal's case it should probably also be factored that the clay field from 2005-2008 was very weak, and is where 4 of his slams came from as well.
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hewitt was still at his best in 2005. he had his best slam results ever that year.

the most interesting events IMO were AO and USO. federer going through nalbandian, hewitt and old agassi (still playing good tennis) does seem tougher than nadal's draws until the finals of the USO's he won
 
the point is 2004-2005 and 2007 were both much more decent years than 2006. the top 4 at the end of 2004 was Federer, Roddick, Hewitt and Safin and at the end of 2005 was Federer, Nadal,Roddick and Hewitt. both years had a pretty good top 4. Hewitt and Roddick were good enough to mintain their place in the top 4. unfortunately safin fell and nadal replaced him. but still nadal was a much better player than any of the guys that were about to enter top 4 in 2006

In 2006 Blake and Davydenko entered the top 4. These guys were good players but IMO nowhere near the top 4. They were top 10 material but def not top 4. It was because off hewitt and roddick falling otherwise the top 4 for 2006 would have probably remained the same as in 2005.

Then came 2007 and the competition improved. Djokovic arrived and he began to be a threat on hardcourts (reaching the later stages of the majority of the HC tournaments he entered) and consistent on both clay and grass. He reached the top 3 and began to beat both Federer and Nadal. He had a strong chance of reaching 3 Grand Slam finals without Nadal.
The great battles between Federer, Nadal and Djokovic made it a much stronger year than 2006. Clay and grass season were all Federer-Nadal and the American HC season was Federer-Djokovic.
The top 4 got better. Federer,Nadal and Djokovic were the top 3 and Davydenko finished in the top 4 once again. His results IMO in both 2006 and 2007 make him a much better top 4 player than Blake.

Bottom line is Federer's era was not the strongest but it was decent. I enjoyed it a lot and probably others have as well.
The great battles between Federer,Hewitt,Roddick,Safin,Nalbandian and even old Agassi were great to watch in 2004-2005. 2006 could have been the same had Hewitt ,Roddick and Safin not fallen off the radar.
In 2007 Federer,Nadal and Djokovic had great battles and the fact that Federer beat on fire Nadal at W and on fire Djokovic at USO made it a much better year than 2006.
 
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mike danny said:
the point is 2004-2005 and 2007 were both much more decent years than 2006. the top 4 at the end of 2004 was Federer, Roddick, Hewitt and Safin and at the end of 2005 was Federer, Nadal,Roddick and Hewitt. both years had a pretty good top 4. Hewitt and Roddick were good enough to mintain their place in the top 4. unfortunately safin fell and nadal replaced him. but still nadal was a much better player than any of the guys that were about to enter top 4 in 2006

In 2006 Blake and Davydenko entered the top 4. These guys were good players but IMO nowhere near the top 4. They were top 10 material but def not top 4. It was because off hewitt and roddick falling otherwise the top 4 for 2006 would have probably remained the same as in 2005.

Then came 2007 and the competition improved. Djokovic arrived and he began to be a threat on hardcourts (reaching the later stages of the majority of the HC tournaments he entered) and consistent on both clay and grass. He reached the top 3 and began to beat both Federer and Nadal. He had a strong chance of reaching 3 Grand Slam finals without Nadal.
The great battles between Federer, Nadal and Djokovic made it a much stronger year than 2006. Clay and grass season were all Federer-Nadal and the American HC season was Federer-Djokovic.
The top 4 got better. Federer,Nadal and Djokovic were the top 3 and Davydenko finished in the top 4 once again. His results IMO in both 2006 and 2007 make him a much better top 4 player than Blake.

Bottom line is Federer's era was not the strongest but it was decent. I enjoyed it a lot and probably others have as well.
The great battles between Federer,Hewitt,Roddick,Safin,Nalbandian and even old Agassi were great to watch in 2004-2005. 2006 could have been the same had Hewitt ,Roddick and Safin not fallen off the radar.
In 2007 Federer,Nadal and Djokovic had great battles and the fact that Federer beat on fire Nadal at W and on fire Djokovic at USO made it a much better year than 2006.
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You enjoyed watching Federer beating Roddick and Hewitt because you are a Federer fan. For me it was the most boring period watching tennis. I want to watch unpredictible tennis matches not Federer's matches. Good thing is it didn't take long for the emergence of Nadal and Djokovic to make tennis matches exciting again.
 
Kenshin said:
You enjoyed watching Federer beating Roddick and Hewitt because you are a Federer fan. For me it was the most boring period watching tennis. I want to watch unpredictible tennis matches not Federer's matches. Good thing is it didn't take long for the emergence of Nadal and Djokovic to make tennis matches exciting again.
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it was boring for a lot of tennis fans. Federer vs Hewitt or Federer vs Roddick or Federer vs Baghdatis were all so predictable. This is why Nadal vs Federer finals were hyped so much because it wasn't as predictable
 
illusions30 said:
I agree 2004 and 2007 were decent years. 2003 was as well. I dont feel 2005 was as strong as you do. The Australian Open was a great event, but after that it was downhill. The only high point of the French Open was the Fedal semifinal and a better than expected final between Nadal and a highly inspired/doped Puerta, but this was the first year the lack of depth of the clay field for years to come would become evident. The bottom 4 once you reached the quarterfinal stage was Puerta, Canas, Davydenko (then unknown), and Robredo. Wimbledon was extremely weak. The only good match was the Federer-Hewitt semifinal and maybe the Roddick-Grosjean quarterfinal. Roddick and Hewitt (especialy Roddick) were much weaker than they had been in 2004, even though their results were close to the same. Roddick became a serve and push type player, and was very lucky to somehow make the finals of Wimbledon playing that way. and to somehow roughly mantain his ranking. He would never be the same player he was in 2003-2004 for any sustained period ever again. This was the first year Hewitt became frequently injured and missed various parts of the year. After the Australian Open, Safin incurred an injury that would end his career as a top player. The rise of Nadal was great for the game, but he went 6-3 in non RG slams, with a round of 16 his best. 2006 was even weaker than 2005 of course.
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At the masters level Nadal was very good in 2005. Hewitt despite any injuries competed well for most of the year in the slams. His match at the USO with Federer was a really good match. Agassi made the finals of the USO and had an extremely high quality match with Blake in the quarters. Roddick fell off after Wimbledon but in general 2005 was still strong if maybe a little patchy. You had outstanding performances in most of the slams. I'm glad we agree about 2004 especially, underrated year IMO.

2006 was weak compared to what came before it, but I do think it's exaggerated slightly. A Baghdatis style run to the finals has happened in virtually every era and he was playing amazing to get there. Despite not filling his potential he's shown glimpses of how he did it since. Nadal was strong on clay and played a good Wimbledon final (albeit not great), Federer also went through several good grasscourters to get there including; Berdych, Henman, Gasquet and Ancic. In the second half of the year Roddick came back to good form.

I think 2008 was a very strong year. Djokovic was on fire most of this year, and it was his best year by far until 2011 and beyond. Federer wasnt his best, but still played an amazing Wimbledon final in losing to Nadal, and a great U.S Open to win, and many other strong events. That he ended the year #2 over on fire Djokovic (even if I disagreed with that ranking) shows he was still formidable. This was the year of Murray's rise to being a contender too. In the second half of the year he was great. Davydenko was a force by now, and played very well in many events, especialy the WTF where he was in the final. Del Potro's rise to being a top 5 player occured this year, even though he took it up another level in 2009, and Cilic emerged and was an exciting and promising young talent at the time.
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2008 was a good year, although Federer's form for most it brings it down in my estimation. He was really bad for alot of it. He had some good performances but his level dropped so dramatically due to mono it almost makes me hate 2008 tennis wise lol. Federer was good in the Wimbledon final for the last 3 sets, he was choking abit at first. Don't blame him after the FO.

Djokovic was very strong though I agree. And Federer put together a strong USO run. I don't think the difference between Nadal of 2007 and 2008 was so great though. At the AO I think the difference between them was meeting an on fire opponent a round later in 2008. Nadal put in a very strong Indian Wells performance in 2007 demolishing Roddick. On clay Nadal was insane but on grass his 07 and 08 performances were very similar.

2010 was less strong I agree, but one interesting thing is people often complain here it is always the big 3 or 4 in the finals and semis. Yet in a year like this which was marked by people like Soderling (for the 2nd straight time) and Berdych putting on inspired runs to the finals taking big scalps, preventing the monotnous big 4 dominance, it seems to be used to deem it is a weaker year.
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I deem it a weaker year because the top guys weren't playing their best at all throughout the year. Nadal was excellent ofcourse but Federer slumped badly after the AO. Soderling was incredible in the FO semi but at Wimbledon Federer was poor nearly losing to Falla! Infact Federer was abit injured. Murray dropped off after his AO loss and Djokovic didn't make the finals of a masters, was serving terribly and didn't beat a top 10 player until the USO. Del Potro was also injured after a steller 2009. It was similar to 2006 where the guys from previous years dropped off or were injured.

I think prime Federer would have a relatively easy time with Murray in slams considering Murray couldnt beat Federer in a slam until 2013. I dont think he would have it so easy vs Djokovic though, except on grass where I agree he would rout prime Djokovic. From 2008 to 2010 when neither player were totally in their primes, Djokovic more than held his own vs Federer with a close to .500 record, and in slams was 2-2. At the U.S Open and YEC I would favor Federer to win the majority of the time, but they would have well contested matches nonetheless. At the Australian and French it would be close to a toss up, and I would slightly favor Djokovic at the Australian Open perhaps. The guy has a decent shot to end up with about 6 Australian Open titles remember, and his two comprehensive beatdowns of Federer, prime or not, indicate a very challenging foe on those courts.
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We agree on Murray so I'll skip straight to Djokovic. Peak Federer IMO would beat every version of Djokovic at the USO apart from 2011 which would be a toss up. At the masters level they'd trade wins with Federer taking the majority IMO (again aside from 2011). However looking at Djokovic in the 2012 and 2013 finals where he very patchy. I think peak Federer would be too much for him.

At the AO I think they'd be fairly even. It took a while for Djokovic to get his head together there. Federer would easily beat 2009/2010 Djokovic at the AO in any of his runs there. 2008 and 2011-2013 would be very tough for Federer. I think they'd trade wins, lots of tough matches. I expect Federer's longevity would aid him in a series of matches there depending on how Novak ages.

Even if you dont think Djokovic is a tough opponent for Federer though, he definitely is one for Nadal, even on clay he is a difficult opponent for Nadal. So Nadal having to face him at the height of his powers during his own biggest window for winning potential slams, in addition to having face Federer for so many years previously to that, is no way an easy situation.
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I do think Djokovic is a tough opponent, though mainly I see him as tough in 2007-2008, 2011-2012 form for the most part. I don't rate Djokovic of 2010 or 2013 for the most part. Too many early losses IMO. I guess I'm just of the opinion that going through a draw of even, Blake, Davydenko and Roddick at the USO is atleast as hard as essentially just 2010 Djokovic.

You are probably right if you think I placed Nadal and Federer too far apart in competition in my original list though. They are probably closer than I had them upon further analysis. In Nadal's case it should probably also be factored that the clay field from 2005-2008 was very weak, and is where 4 of his slams came from as well.
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I think it needs to be factored if you think Federer had worse competion at his peak that means he has had harder competion post prime. Which is actually a worse time to have tough competition anyway...
 
The_Order said:
04-07 is where Fed racked up his slam titles. He was doing so beating the likes of an old Agassi, Hewitt and Roddick for the most part.

To even consider comparing them to Fed and Djokovic is a joke. The reason Fed and Novak have only 1 RG between them is because of Nadal.
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Anyone can play that game the reason Hewitt and Roddick aren't 4+ champs is because of Federer. Agassi was still very good in 2004, much better than some of his earlier years even in 2005 he had some very good performances. And yes peak Roddick and Hewitt aren't much worse than a Djokovic who has been up and down all year. The joke is looking at Djokovic's performances where he plays one crap set for every good set then saying he's better than Hewitt and Roddick of Wimbledon 2004 for example. Especially in 2010, peak Roddick, Hewitt and Agassi >> Djokovic of 2010 by far.

Hewitt only won Wimbledon in one of the weakest draws ever and Roddick only played well in the final in 09 (which is out of the time frame I'm discussing) and in 04 (probably would've won it too if the rain delays didn't save Fed's arse). In the 05 WIM final he was rubbish, in 06 and 07 he didn't even make it.
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Roddick was very good at Wimbledon 2007 too despite losing before facing Federer. Gasquet played one of the matches of his life (tied with that FO match this year versus Wawrinka). Hewitt's draw is irrelevent, I wouldn't say it was much worse than Murray's this year for example. The fact is he's a very good grasscourter. Even now past his prime he gives Novak all he can handle and beats Del Potro. He also has wins versus Sampras and Federer on grass.

So out of all the WIM majors Fed won from 04-07, Roddick was a threat in 1 match. Hewitt the same, only in 05 WIM he was a threat. The rest forget it.

On grass they are tougher than Fed and Novak on clay? LOL don't forget to include Soderling at RG too you clown.

Nadal has always been Federer's biggest threat at Wimbledon.
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Well you do like ot ommit Nadal from Federer's competition don't you? Hewitt was good at Wimbledon 2004 and 2005. In 2006 Federer had to go through, Gasquet, Henman, Berdych and Ancic before he even made it to Nadal. And in 2007 he beat Nadal playing one of his top 2 performances on grass ever. So yes considering Nadal and all the other top players Federer has beaten on grass, his competition is better than Nadal's on clay.

Nadal's competition on clay is pathetic. Outside of Federer and Djokovic who is there really? Soderling who beat Rafa and Federer in back to back years but not once showed up in the final. Federer who wasts 15+ break point chances at the FO in 07. Djokovic of 2012 who would have gone down meekly in straights if not for the rain and needed Nadal to choke in order to go 5 this year.

Yeah tough era...

Sod + Fed + Novak @ RG is MUCH tougher than Hewitt + Roddick + grandpa Agassi on grass. LOL Agassi wasn't even existent at WIM from 04-06.
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I never said Agassi was Federer's grass competition. You're essentially putting words in my mouth then laughing at it. A bit sad no?

Nadal + Hewitt + Roddick > Sod + Fed + Djokovic


Ferrero who was fresh off losing to Guccionne? He only got there because of an incredibly laughable draw, go look who he beat to get to that SF, I'd fancy my chances of making it with that draw :lol:
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The Ferrero who made the finals of the USO and who actually played decent in the semi's though not great. And Djokovic losing to Dimitrov and Berdych before RG is in good form or having to save match points against Tsonga and Seppi in 2012? Or the Novak who lost to Isner in Cinncinati.

weren't so tough, but his final opponent was the toughest opponent for him. Novak played very well in 2010 final and in 2013 he was all over Nadal, had he won one of those BP at 4 all in the third, he would've won the match.
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Agassi in 05 was about as good as Djokovic this year. 2 good sets and 2 bad ones. Difference being Federer had to go through Hewitt and Nalbandian to get there. In 2010 Djokovic played well but no better than his earlier runs at the USO and plenty of opponents Federer faced were as good. Plus he actually had tougher draws to get to the final.

I've already highlighted Fed's weak WIM competition, his greatest threat was a clay court specialist. Stop bringing up post 04-07 era because Fed's winning ways dried up from 08 onwards. He won majors, but nowhere near as easily. Only 2 Wimbledons since 07 and one of them his draw was weak to the final and then Roddick choked big time in that match. Should've had a 2 sets to love lead.
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Federer's grass competition > Nadal's clay court competition, Federer's hardcourt competition >> Nadal's clay court competition. Deal with it. One missed volley and Roddick choked big time? How many bad errors has Federer made in his matches with Nadal, how many times has he mentally lost it. Past his prime Federer has won as many Wimbledons as peak Nadal has in the last 5 years :oops: Nadal is a clay court specialist? Fact is on second week grass Nadal is extremely strong, you can thank the slowing of the courts.

Federer's won 5 majors, he'd probably have 10+ from 08-now if he'd been peak.

Federer had only ever beat Nadal twice to win a major. Hasn't done it in 6+ years.

Nadal has had to beat Federer to win 7 of his majors. And post 2010 Novak to win another 3. That is a GOAT candidate and an all time great playing at their highest level for the most part to win 10/13.
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Nadal needed to be on his best surface and Federer's worst to win most of those matches. As for Novak playing at his highest level LOL! FO 2012 and 2013 were not Novak's highest level. Nor was the USO 2013 apart from 2 sets. Massive exaggeration. When Djokovic played at his highest level he won 7 matches in a row. We haven't seen that level for a long time. Nadal has taken advantage of all time greats who've been slumping for his most dominant years. Sorry if I don't find that more impressive than dominating less celebrated players that were actually playing at their peaks.

Fed showed up all right. He was desperate to win it he hired that Jose guy to help him. He used the wrong strategy, he tried to go to the net more often and against one of the best passing shot makers in history on a surface like clay that was suicide, especially given Nadal's form. You could say no one showed up against Nadal in that tournament because he destroyed everyone, even Novak got smashed until Nadal let his concentration slip in that third set.
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After the 2nd set Federer didn't want to be there. You're essentially saying Nadal is so good on clay no one would be tough competition for him. But that doesn't apply for Federer? Double standards.

And you can take who you want, the fact is Federer + Novak + Sod + Murray > Hewitt + Roddick + old Agassi + Ferrero and whoever else you want to throw in from 04-06.
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Why limit it to 04-06? Why not 07? Because you don't want to admit Federer won 3 slams facing a strong Nadal and a better Djokovic than 2010? Nadal has faced Murray in over 2 years anyway. Federer won double slams in 2009 anyway, not fair to remove that from Federer's era. Federer has faced every player Nadal has had to face in slams and more except for himself. So his competition is just as strong. It's simple. The fact that he had to face them post prime just adds to it. When Nadal is 30 I doubt he'll have such strong players blocking his road to slams considering the state of the younger generation.
 
Kenshin said:
You enjoyed watching Federer beating Roddick and Hewitt because you are a Federer fan. For me it was the most boring period watching tennis. I want to watch unpredictible tennis matches not Federer's matches. Good thing is it didn't take long for the emergence of Nadal and Djokovic to make tennis matches exciting again.
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i enjoyed watching safin beat federer despite being a fed fan. i enjoyed other great matches like hewitt vs nalbandian AO 2005 and roddick vs safin AO 2004. i enjoyed a lot of matches in that era not only federer's. so please stop saying i enjoyed that era bc i am a federer fan. i actually enjoyed a lot of matches which federer lost
 
This poll result so far shows just how vastly overrated Nadal is on this forum. The guy defeated a grass court specialist and a hard court specialist for all of his titles at the French Open. At least Federer was beating grass court specialists in Roddick, Murray and Hewitt for most of his Wimby titles. Which great clay court specialist did Nadal beat to win any of his RG titles? Oh, that's right, Ferrer. LOL!

And let's not forget about his cake US Open draws, with a tired out of sorts Djokovic waiting in the final. Heck, even old man Agassi played better in the 2005 final than Novak did in the 2010 and 2013 finals. The guy is the most overrated player ever.
 
Who Am I? said:
This poll result so far shows just how vastly overrated Nadal is on this forum. The guy defeated a grass court specialist and a hard court specialist for all of his titles at the French Open. At least Federer was beating grass court specialists in Roddick, Murray and Hewitt for most of his Wimby titles. Which great clay court specialist did Nadal beat to win any of his RG titles? Oh, that's right, Ferrer. LOL!

And let's not forget about his cake US Open draws, with a tired out of sorts Djokovic waiting in the final. Heck, even old man Agassi played better in the 2005 final than Novak did in the 2010 and 2013 finals. The guy is the most overrated player ever.
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This is a Nadal forum so get use to the votes are base on feeling/emotion rather than reasoning. Unfortunately neutral fans doesn't vote.
 
TMF said:
This is a Nadal forum so get use to the votes are base on feeling/emotion rather than reasoning. Unfortunately neutral fans doesn't vote.
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I am not voting simply because I don't feel that any of the people in the poll deserve one.
 
Who Am I? said:
This poll result so far shows just how vastly overrated Nadal is on this forum. The guy defeated a grass court specialist and a hard court specialist for all of his titles at the French Open. At least Federer was beating grass court specialists in Roddick, Murray and Hewitt for most of his Wimby titles. Which great clay court specialist did Nadal beat to win any of his RG titles? Oh, that's right, Ferrer. LOL!

And let's not forget about his cake US Open draws, with a tired out of sorts Djokovic waiting in the final. Heck, even old man Agassi played better in the 2005 final than Novak did in the 2010 and 2013 finals. The guy is the most overrated player ever.
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I agree with you on this. I don't think it means much to take on prime Federer and prime Djokovic and overcome them on grass and HC slams.
 
Backspin1183 said:
I agree with you on this. I don't think it means much to take on prime Federer and prime Djokovic and overcome them on grass and HC slams.
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Did I even mention Wimbledon 2008 and AO 2009? I think these two were mighty impressive wins from Nadal.

I was only talking about his weak clay completion and his cake US Open draws. Nole in 2010 was subpar. His win over Federer in SFs after almost 4 hours was his first top ten win of the season, so he was just happy to be in the final, not to mention he was obviously tired after playing the second SF against Federer that lasted almost 4 hours, whereas Nadal plays Youzhny in the afternoon one. Lol!

Nole of this year in the final, expect for the 2nd set and a bit of the 3rd set played almost at the same level as he did in 2010 which was arguably his worst season since he became a top player.

Am I making sense to you or not? Probably not as you are a Nadal lover and a Federer hater, but at least I tried.
 
mike danny said:
the point is 2004-2005 and 2007 were both much more decent years than 2006. the top 4 at the end of 2004 was Federer, Roddick, Hewitt and Safin and at the end of 2005 was Federer, Nadal,Roddick and Hewitt. both years had a pretty good top 4. Hewitt and Roddick were good enough to mintain their place in the top 4. unfortunately safin fell and nadal replaced him. but still nadal was a much better player than any of the guys that were about to enter top 4 in 2006

In 2006 Blake and Davydenko entered the top 4. These guys were good players but IMO nowhere near the top 4. They were top 10 material but def not top 4. It was because off hewitt and roddick falling otherwise the top 4 for 2006 would have probably remained the same as in 2005.

Then came 2007 and the competition improved. Djokovic arrived and he began to be a threat on hardcourts (reaching the later stages of the majority of the HC tournaments he entered) and consistent on both clay and grass. He reached the top 3 and began to beat both Federer and Nadal. He had a strong chance of reaching 3 Grand Slam finals without Nadal.
The great battles between Federer, Nadal and Djokovic made it a much stronger year than 2006. Clay and grass season were all Federer-Nadal and the American HC season was Federer-Djokovic.
The top 4 got better. Federer,Nadal and Djokovic were the top 3 and Davydenko finished in the top 4 once again. His results IMO in both 2006 and 2007 make him a much better top 4 player than Blake.

Bottom line is Federer's era was not the strongest but it was decent. I enjoyed it a lot and probably others have as well.
The great battles between Federer,Hewitt,Roddick,Safin,Nalbandian and even old Agassi were great to watch in 2004-2005. 2006 could have been the same had Hewitt ,Roddick and Safin not fallen off the radar.
In 2007 Federer,Nadal and Djokovic had great battles and the fact that Federer beat on fire Nadal at W and on fire Djokovic at USO made it a much better year than 2006.
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Roddick didn't fall off the radar, he finished 6th in 2006. It was the slow start to his season that caused him to slip, which was largely the result of misfortune. He played an absolutely on-fire Baghdatis in the 4th round at the AO (people forget how well Baghdatis played that tournament as he went through Roddick, Ljubicic, and Nalbandian and started out up a set and a break on Federer) and then Baby Murray at Wimbledon.

The main loss in 2006 was Hewitt, with the wear and tear catching up to him. Safin's only real tournament of note in 2005 was winning the Australian Open. He was not able to maintain that level after that.
 
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