Which is the spiniest, 98in, 18/20 racquet?

cha cha

Professional
Must not be spin friendly then....

Alternatively it could be SO spin friendly that the spin pulled your ball down so hard that it hit the net
I hit quite flat.
On the other hand, it was an absolute dream to slice with. It is 20 frames later for me now, and I still have not found a better one for slice.
 

dr325i

G.O.A.T.
I’d suggest the 100 sq in Gravity Pro. Does everything well - crazy spin (combined with good technique), accuracy, feel…
Last guy I played (uses GP) completely threw me off initially with the spin and high bounces on HC…
The rest was a complete workout taking everything on the rise…
 
I’d suggest the 100 sq in Gravity Pro. Does everything well - crazy spin (combined with good technique), accuracy, feel…
Last guy I played (uses GP) completely threw me off initially with the spin and high bounces on HC…
The rest was a complete workout taking everything on the rise…
Thank you for your suggestion. In this regard, isn't it Speed pro a better choice, since I play only on clay?
 
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WYK

Hall of Fame
I'd try the Speed Pro and string it with 18G of your choice in the mid 50's to start.
I run a blade 18X20 with 18G tour bite. Plenty of spin and control.
 

cha cha

Professional
A tragic channel overall, but the two guys standing around him can actually play tennis, so I would take their word for it.

 

puppybutts

Semi-Pro
The new Blade v8. Most 18x20s tend to be more HH with higher swingweights to accommodate flatter hitters who like to drive through the ball more than apply spin. But the newest Blade 18x20 v8 has lighter SW and a little less HH than typical 98 18x20s, so I found its launch angle to be higher than my Strike 18x20 with easier access to topspin.

I would also try out the Head Radical Pro. It's 16x19 but the string pattern plays more dense and the frame plays more like a 97, it might hit what you're looking for. I almost switched to it but there were just a few rare off-center shots that felt too uncomfortable to me (most off-center shots were very tolerable).
 

abhi_trip

Rookie
For 100 sq inch rackets, nothing can beat the Prince Phantom 100X 18x20. It has a very HeadLight balance (9 pts HL), so you can get a lot of RPMs on your strokes in theory.
For 98 sq inch rackets, I'd look at the TF40 315. It's 7pts HL, so should be manoeuvrable enough to get good rotation on your strokes.
 
For 100 sq inch rackets, nothing can beat the Prince Phantom 100X 18x20. It has a very HeadLight balance (9 pts HL), so you can get a lot of RPMs on your strokes in theory.
For 98 sq inch rackets, I'd look at the TF40 315. It's 7pts HL, so should be manoeuvrable enough to get good rotation on your strokes.
Thank you for your suggestion. Regards,
 

Rosstour

Legend
Another vote for TF40 305. Best racquet I have ever used and my game has gone to new places at my advanced age. Can't recommend highly enough. Didn't get the crazy spin right off the bat but I've adjusted and now don't miss my old open pattern Warrior at all.
 

cortado

Professional
TW has an effect on spin? How?
Easier to manoeuvre the racquet, particularly in terms of 'brushing up'. So for example, I find it very easy to put a ton of spin and loop on the ball with my PS90, but harder to hit through the court. Whereas with my VCorePro97HD, it's very easy to hit through the court, but somewhat harder to put loop and spin on the ball.
 

d-quik

Hall of Fame
Easier to manoeuvre the racquet, particularly in terms of 'brushing up'. So for example, I find it very easy to put a ton of spin and loop on the ball with my PS90, but harder to hit through the court. Whereas with my VCorePro97HD, it's very easy to hit through the court, but somewhat harder to put loop and spin on the ball.
This sounds like a technique thing as TW only affects (literally) twisting. Spin is RHS which is mostly influenced by SW
 

Chezbeeno

Professional
Conversely you could look for a more closed 16x19? I find the new Radical to be a nice 16x19 that allows for good spin, but hits a really solid flat, accurate ball as well. It's quite dense in the middle of the string bed.
 

cortado

Professional
This sounds like a technique thing as TW only affects (literally) twisting. Spin is RHS which is mostly influenced by SW
I think twist-weight also influences the on-edge down-up manoeuvrability of the racquet. Same reason it's much easier to perform the service motion with a small head size racquet.
 

PrinceYonex

Rookie
Another vote for TF40 305. Best racquet I have ever used and my game has gone to new places at my advanced age. Can't recommend highly enough. Didn't get the crazy spin right off the bat but I've adjusted and now don't miss my old open pattern Warrior at all.
I’m not someone with loads of 18/20 experience. I played with the Head PT 2.0 for a year, very tight string pattern, laser like accuracy, I really loved that racquet, but not super spin friendly. I’ve played a bit with the TF40 305, which was much more forgiving overall, also much easier spin generation. Really lovely combination of soft forgiving feel, relatively easy spin for an 18/20, but still the controllable launch angle that you expect from that kind of string pattern.
(All that said, I’ve mostly moved back to my old Vcore pro 97s, which are 16/19- just a bit easier spin and depth and swing speed.)
 
Conversely you could look for a more closed 16x19? I find the new Radical to be a nice 16x19 that allows for good spin, but hits a really solid flat, accurate ball as well. It's quite dense in the middle of the string bed.
Thank you. This is actually very logical proposal. They are a lot of choices...
 

cortado

Professional
As in, hold the racquet so that the racquet face/string-bed is facing the net (not facing the floor). (In typical forehand position - racquet is out to your side not standing up vertically). Moving the racquet upwards (the beginning of the 'windshield wiper' motion) is easier with a low twist-weight racquet.
 

Aktajha

New User
As in, hold the racquet so that the racquet face/string-bed is facing the net (not facing the floor). (In typical forehand position - racquet is out to your side not standing up vertically). Moving the racquet upwards (the beginning of the 'windshield wiper' motion) is easier with a low twist-weight racquet.
That should be the third rotational axis weight. Swingweight is rotation perpendicular to the racket face, twist weight normal to the top of the racket (so rotation through the racket handle axis). The rotation you are talking about is normal to these two (and given the racket geometry I think closer to swingweight)

Edit: this article confirms that swingweight (Is) and this 3rd rotation (Iz) are correlated: https://link.springer.com/article/1... the racket,rotation about the principal axes.

In fact it states that Ix and Iz are similar. And as Is is just a moved moment of inertia (parallel axis) the Iz can be calculated if you know the center of mass of your racket (i.e. points HL)
 
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cortado

Professional
That should be the third rotational axis weight. Swingweight is rotation perpendicular to the racket face, twist weight normal to the top of the racket (so rotation through the racket handle axis). The rotation you are talking about is normal to these two (and given the racket geometry I think closer to swingweight)

Edit: this article confirms that swingweight (Is) and this 3rd rotation (Iz) are correlated: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12283-019-0303-8#:~:text=A racket has three moments,affect the racket in play.&text=These MOIs effect the racket,rotation about the principal axes.

In fact it states that Ix and Iz are similar. And as Is is just a moved moment of inertia (parallel axis) the Iz can be calculated if you know the center of mass of your racket (i.e. points HL)
Thanks. To be honest I don't understand the physics fully, I just know that my 90 is incredibly manoeuvrable and produces loads of topspin, but my 97 is much more stable but wants to create a flatter shot that penetrates through the court more.
 

WYK

Hall of Fame
You are just going to confuse folks, let alone the OP, with all that talk.
Generally speaking, the more mass and stability the racquet has, the more it can help you with spin, assuming you can swing it.

Orlin, there are a lot of models out there by Head, Wilson, Babolat, DUnlop etc that have both a 16X19 and an 18X20 version of a similar frame if you wish to see how the difference might work for you.
I assumed since you asked for a spinny 18X20 that you had experience with an 18X20 and wanted to stick with 18X20 mainly for control, and or, for the launch angle. 18X20 doesn't necessarily mean merely flat hitting, as some have noted. Many use an 18X20 because they can swing out more, and thus actually produce as much or more spin with more control than they would otherwise have with a more lively racquet. Most modern 18X20's can produce plenty of spin if you have the strokes, but some may give you more help in this aspect than others.
You can also try shaped, higher gauge strings in the 18X20 as well. I find Solinco strings in 18G give loads of spin in 18X20 patterns. MSV make a nice 17L string called Focus Hex that also has a bit of power for a poly in that gauge. Some 19g strings have loads of power and spin as well(but, I personally haven't gelled with many so can't suggest anything specific). I find Tour Bite soft gives a bit more power than the standard TB does in 18G, but similar spin. Several here have suggested HyperG in 18 as well, and say it lasts quite a while for it's gauge.
 

Aktajha

New User
Tennis physics is extremely complex, I have some interest in reading it, but my general observation for the layman is that personal testing and observation is probably the best try.

Especially topspin is still not completely understood, of course your swing path and speed matters, but also snapback of string comes into play, and this is related to many variables (string thickness, tension, pattern, density around the hitting point,..).

Wrt twist weight, as the dwell time of the ball on the racket is really short (~ ms), the ball is hardly influenced by the twist of the racket. But your arm is! So twist weight in combination with racket stiffness is a good measure for impact on your arm.
 

Aktajha

New User
You are just going to confuse folks, let alone the OP, with all that talk.
Generally speaking, the more mass and stability the racquet has, the more it can help you with spin, assuming you can swing it.

Orlin, there are a lot of models out there by Head, Wilson, Babolat, DUnlop etc that have both a 16X19 and an 18X20 version of a similar frame if you wish to see how the difference might work for you.
I assumed since you asked for a spinny 18X20 that you had experience with an 18X20 and wanted to stick with 18X20 mainly for control, and or, for the launch angle. 18X20 doesn't necessarily mean merely flat hitting, as some have noted. Many use an 18X20 because they can swing out more, and thus actually produce as much or more spin with more control than they would otherwise have with a more lively racquet. Most modern 18X20's can produce plenty of spin if you have the strokes, but some may give you more help in this aspect than others.
You can also try shaped, higher gauge strings in the 18X20 as well. I find Solinco strings in 18G give loads of spin in 18X20 patterns. MSV make a nice 17L string called Focus Hex that also has a bit of power for a poly in that gauge. Some 19g strings have loads of power and spin as well(but, I personally haven't gelled with many so can't suggest anything specific). I find Tour Bite soft gives a bit more power than the standard TB does in 18G, but similar spin. Several here have suggested HyperG in 18 as well, and say it lasts quite a while for it's gauge.
You are of course right, may be I should make a thread about physics outside of a racket advise topic.

For topspin you want high energy transfer to the ball, so that means high racket mass and speed. Combined with high string snapback, so very thin strings under high tension. And of course an open pattern, so why go for 18x20?
 

WYK

Hall of Fame
You are of course right, may be I should make a thread about physics outside of a racket advise topic.

For topspin you want high energy transfer to the ball, so that means high racket mass and speed. Combined with high string snapback, so very thin strings under high tension. And of course an open pattern, so why go for 18x20?
Much of the answer to your own question is in my previous post - 18X20 has good control, but generally less power than more open patterns. If you have the swing, you can generate plenty of spin with plenty of control. Some people prefer the launch angle - as I do. With thinner gauge strings, you can often get both control and spin with some added power. With an 18X20 pattern you can use up to 19g strings and expect them to last a bit longer than more open patterns, and have much better control doing it.
Some people generate plenty of their own power, so could use the control an 18X20 gives them. Slice is second to none on 18X20 frames, and they are a bit easier to control drop shots with.
I also find more control on my serves as well.
This is all assuming you have the swing to take advantage of the pattern.
 
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