Which pro athlete retirement was the most emotional for you?

optic yellow said:
I would say their history of antagonism dates back to when Caesar used Gaul as a launching point for campaigns against the Britons.
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Caesar was a Roman. There were actually very close linguistic and cultural ties between the Britons and the Gauls (both Celtic peoples). British tribes sent help to the Gauls during Caesar's invasion which was one reason why he attempted to invade Britain too.

The historical antagonism between England and France actually dates back to 1066 when William, Duke of Normandy invaded England and seized its crown. As a major French landholder he was constantly at odds with the French king and his successors all inherited this antagonism which became increasingly more nationalistic as time wore on.
 
TimHenmanATG said:
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Don't recognize this.


You simply can't defend this, mang:

zinedine-zidane.gif


This is bona fide ''violent conduct'', as per the laws of the game:

www.thefa.com

Law 12 - Fouls and Misconduct

IFAB Laws of the Game
www.thefa.com www.thefa.com
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That gif makes it look a lot more violent than the video I watched. Obviously I understand it's a red card according to the rules, I just think it's less dangerous of a play than many slide tackles you see throughout the course of an average game.
 
Can experience all sorts of emotions if you watch the Zidane gif while playing one of your favorite music albums. Would recommend. (y)
 
I will definitely get emotional when Andy finally calls it quits and also when any of the Big 3 retire especially Fed.

Most shocking retirement for me was Ash Barty's right after becoming the first Australian to win the home Slam in 44 years. Did anybody see that coming???
 
Mainad said:
They are definitely more partial to Italian food (eg. pasta especially pizza). :cool:
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Food is one of those things which racists and xenophobes tend to conveniently ignore.

It's ironic, in a way, as sharing and enjoying food from a variety of different cultures should make people introspect and consider our broader position as human beings...
 
TimHenmanATG said:
Food is one of those things which racists and xenophobes tend to conveniently ignore.

It's ironic, in a way, as sharing and enjoying food from a variety of different cultures should make people introspect and consider our broader position as human beings...
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The trouble with many English xenophobes is that they tend to forget the foreign origins of many of the things they enjoy eg. food. Ultra nationalistic British monarchists, for instance, tend to forget the immigrant origins of the royal family when complaining against foreign immigrants.
 
Mainad said:
The trouble with many English xenophobes is that they tend to forget the foreign origins of many of the things they enjoy eg. food. Ultra nationalistic British monarchists, for instance, tend to forget the immigrant origins of the royal family when complaining against foreign immigrants.
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House of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha <3
 
Mainad said:
Caesar was a Roman. There were actually very close linguistic and cultural ties between the Britons and the Gauls (both Celtic peoples). British tribes sent help to the Gauls during Caesar's invasion which was one reason why he attempted to invade Britain too.
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That is true, he did not even attempt to conquer Britain, only forced them replace their leader (chieftain?) with someone friendlier to him.

The historical antagonism between England and France actually dates back to 1066 when William, Duke of Normandy invaded England and seized its crown. As a major French landholder he was constantly at odds with the French king and his successors all inherited this antagonism which became increasingly more nationalistic as time wore on.
Click to expand...
Other factors I understand here are that there was a clear divide between Norman elites and Anglo-Saxon non-elites and how Angevin kings typically treated England as a source of revenue for continental ambitions which engendered popular contempt for perceived foreign (French) overlordship.
 
optic yellow said:
Don't recognize this.
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It's Asterix and Obelix. The premise of the comicbooks was that they were the only village in Gaul that hadn't been invaded by the Romans.

optic yellow said:
That gif makes it look a lot more violent than the video I watched. Obviously I understand it's a red card according to the rules, I just think it's less dangerous of a play than many slide tackles you see throughout the course of an average game.
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Don't forget that a lot of Italians, Spaniards, South Americans, etc. generally writhe around on the ground even with minimal contact.

Materazzi certainly ''made a meal of it'', but that shouldn't detract from the egregious nature of Zidane's conduct.
 
TimHenmanATG said:
It's Asterix and Obelix. The premise of the comicbooks was that they were the only village in Gaul that hadn't been invaded by the Romans.
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Will look these up. Sound like they might be funny.

Don't forget that a lot of Italians, Spaniards, South Americans, etc. generally writhe around on the ground even with minimal contact.
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Disgusting anti-footballers the lot of them.

Materazzi certainly ''made a meal of it'', but that shouldn't detract from the egregious nature of Zidane's conduct.
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I was tuning his reaction out when evaluating lol.
 
Mainad said:
The trouble with many English xenophobes is that they tend to forget the foreign origins of many of the things they enjoy eg. food. Ultra nationalistic British monarchists, for instance, tend to forget the immigrant origins of the royal family when complaining against foreign immigrants.
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Even a meal as quintessentially British as fish and chips originated from Sephardic Jews who emigrated from Portugal a few centuries ago.

I think I'm just flabbergasted with how people have this logical disconnect between a country or culture's food and their opinions of that country/culture.
 
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TimHenmanATG said:
Even a meal as quintessentially British as fish and chips originated from Sephardic Jews who immigrated from Portugal a few centuries ago.

I think I'm just flabbergasted with how people have this logical disconnect between a country or culture's food and their opinions of that country/culture.
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How did the British consume their fish beforehand?
 
optic yellow said:
How did the British consume their fish beforehand?
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Goodness only knows.

I think that a lot of people take for granted that a lot of fruits, vegetables, wheat, etc. originate from the ''New World'', so have only been part of European cuisine comparatively recently...
 
Pete. Wins the USO with serve and volley against his greatest rival where it all started for him, hugs his rival, then runs into the stands to kiss his wife in front of everyone, to share the win with her for all her enduring of the press during his slump. GOAT retirement in tennis.

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Cashman said:
lol, people get emotional over athletes retiring?
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The guys are covered in money after their retirement but people have them as references and symbols of an era, which forms a very emotional bond for them.
:D
 
optic yellow said:
That is true, he did not even attempt to conquer Britain, only forced them replace their leader (chieftain?) with someone friendlier to him.
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I think he would have liked to but had bitten off more than he could chew with Gaul and wanted to pursue political ambitions back in Rome.

optic yellow said:
Other factors I understand here are that there was a clear divide between Norman elites and Anglo-Saxon non-elites and how Angevin kings typically treated England as a source of revenue for continental ambitions which engendered popular contempt for perceived foreign (French) overlordship.
Click to expand...

I think the essential point was that owning so much land in France (first the Normans then added to by the Plantagenets) yet theoretically subjects for it all of the French king who was determined to reclaim it all inevitably led to dynastic conflict between the two crowns which eventually broadened out into full scale nationalistic wars and left a legacy of permanent mistrust between the two countries for future generations.
 
TimHenmanATG said:
Italian defenders are notorious for their unpublicised ''tactics'' (Chiellini is a current example of this).

As I mentioned previously, he played several seasons for Juve, so he must have been fully au fait with how Italians play the game.

You simply can't defend how Zidane acted. It wasn't a case of him ''defending his family's honour'', but moreso of someone who couldn't handle the pressure.

Don't romanticise a moment where a vaunted player acted extremely unproffesionally...
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Well first you are nobody to tell me what to do or not and second I don’t really get what you want to tell me here. Was it unprofessional and stupid to risk the WC title over an insult? Sure. But Materazzi deserved this and more, and I really liked that Zidane stood to what he did and didn’t apologize but at the same time fully accepted the consequences and apologized to his country and teammates. Whether or not other Italian players had insulted his sister or mother on the pitch during his time at Juve is pure speculation on your part, if it had happened I wouldn’t be surprised if he had acted similarly.
 
Mainad said:
I think he would have liked to but had bitten off more than he could chew with Gaul and wanted to pursue political ambitions back in Rome.
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You mean he had to go back to Gaul to stabilize it and then wanted to go to Rome to capitalize on the pretige of having added Gaul to the empire? As I understand it that is what truly fueled his rise to power.

I think the essential point was that owning so much land in France (first the Normans then added to by the Plantagenets) yet theoretically subjects for it all of the French king who was determined to reclaim it all inevitably led to dynastic conflict between the two crowns which eventually broadened out into full scale nationalistic wars and left a legacy of permanent mistrust between the two countries for future generations.
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So the fundamental issue was that one man was both King of England and sworn vassal to the King of France?
 
optic yellow said:
You mean he had to go back to Gaul to stabilize it and then wanted to go to Rome to capitalize on the pretige of having added Gaul to the empire? As I understand it that is what truly fueled his rise to power.
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That's correct.

optic yellow said:
So the fundamental issue was that one man was both King of England and sworn vassal to the King of France?
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That's correct. The English king was in feudal subjection to the French king for his French territories. The French kings played this up for maximum effect in order to provoke the English king into defaulting on his feudal obligations so the French king could then confiscate his French territories and re-unite them to the French crown. Eventually this led to the Hundred Years War when Edward III got round the problem by claiming the French crown for himself. English kings continued to use the title 'King of France' up until 1801!
 
Mainad said:
That's correct.
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Yes then just makes sense to force a stooge on the Britons to temporarily a remove potential source of instability that is difficult to respond to while focusing on Italy. It really is absurd thinking about the amount of land they tried to control with ancient era technology. Such a delicate juggling act.

That's correct. The English king was in feudal subjection to the French king for his French territories. The French kings played this up for maximum effect in order to provoke the English king into defaulting on his feudal obligations so the French king could then confiscate his French territories and re-unite them to the French crown. Eventually this led to the Hundred Years War when Edward III got round the problem by claiming the French crown for himself. English kings continued to use the title 'King of France' up until 1801!
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Oh that's right I remember reading about this! They were sticklers about certain feudal ceremonies that were part of the contract, but extremely humiliating for a king to perform for another king, in the hopes one of the Plantagenet would be proud enough to refuse so they could use it as a pretext to claim his land. This was a ceremony performed I think upon succession to the office?
 
NonP said:
Bird's own range was clearly superior to LBJ's and even Kobe's, but he lags well behind both as an athlete. And his man-to-man D was nothing to write home about, either. So still below Bryant and James.
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This is exactly why he is one of my favorite players. His lack in athleticism he made up for with his great skills, and anticipation. He was clearly a better rebounder and passer than Kobe and all in all quite versatile as a player (would almost certainly have been the fifth player to reach a quadruple double hadn’t he sat out the whole fourth quarter in that game against Utah). He was also very clutch during the Celtic’s title runs, even though overall his numbers tend to slightly go down in the playoffs. Agree with you on his “not so great” man-to-man D.
NonP said:
Kobe comes close but I can't see even him trashing his mentors and rivals in a HoF speech - many sitting right in front of him! - while everyone is kissing his ass.
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Even if I am a fan of his, I think the title of biggest egomaniac goes to Wilt. In next to all his interviews he is constantly praising himself and his achievements some of which most likely exaggerated. His whole book “a view from above” is basically a sole page-after-page bragging about all kind of stuff he allegedly did with a lot of jabs against former rivals. Also when he and Jordan were bickering about who is the GOAT he - according to other players - had the last word and all in all seemed to be more invested in those discussions. Agree though that rivaling Jordan as an egomaniac he never came close to his psychopathic competiveness. On the contrary, Wilt wasn’t really competitive as for a large part of his career he did not care about team success but only about individual stats (this was a guy who was scolding team mates for missed shots not because of losing the game but because that meant he had fewer assists).
 
BorgTheGOAT said:
This is exactly why he is one of my favorite players. His lack in athleticism he made up for with his great skills, and anticipation. He was clearly a better rebounder and passer than Kobe and all in all quite versatile as a player (would almost certainly have been the fifth player to reach a quadruple double hadn’t he sat out the whole fourth quarter in that game against Utah). He was also very clutch during the Celtic’s title runs, even though overall his numbers tend to slightly go down in the playoffs. Agree with you on his “not so great” man-to-man D.

Even if I am a fan of his, I think the title of biggest egomaniac goes to Wilt. In next to all his interviews he is constantly praising himself and his achievements some of which most likely exaggerated. His whole book “a view from above” is basically a sole page-after-page bragging about all kind of stuff he allegedly did with a lot of jabs against former rivals. Also when he and Jordan were bickering about who is the GOAT he - according to other players - had the last word and all in all seemed to be more invested in those discussions. Agree though that rivaling Jordan as an egomaniac he never came close to his psychopathic competiveness. On the contrary, Wilt wasn’t really competitive as for a large part of his career he did not care about team success but only about individual stats (this was a guy who was scolding team mates for missed shots not because of losing the game but because that meant he had fewer assists).
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It is very well possible though that Wilt Chamberlain was indeed the GOAT. I know many argue against him because he only won 2 titles, but I think an individual GOAT cannot be judged on team titles, at least not mainly. On the contrary, if he had all those stats in weaker teams, then it's even more impressive IMO.

It's also interesting that in the beginning of his career he was by far the GOAT scorer and rebounder, while later in his career it's said he was bored and just focused on other statistics. :-D Sounds absurd, but with him such things are actually possible.

And it's said that in his legendary 100-points-game he missed his final throw on purpose because to him 100 just sounded nicer. He was a really interesting character, and some people are somehow still likable while being arrogant. In that sense he was a bit like Muhammad Ali. It's really strange, I mostly dislike it when people are arrogant, but with Wilt and Ali it's almost like you see them talking and WANT to hear them bragging.

By the way, was he also bragging about sleeping with 2000 women in his book? ;)
 
ChrisRF said:
It is very well possible though that Wilt Chamberlain was indeed the GOAT. I know many argue against him because he only won 2 titles, but I think an individual GOAT cannot be judged on team titles, at least not mainly. On the contrary, if he had all those stats in weaker teams, then it's even more impressive IMO.
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He actually has a good case imho. He even led the league in assists one year which is unheard of for a center. His title count in a Teams sport as such is only to some extent relevant, otherwise Russel would be the undisputed GOAT. Wilt won two and was the key player in those championship winning teams which should be enough on paper, had he always given his best and only fell short against well better teams. However, in his case one could at least partly blame him for being too focused on individual stats and sacrificed the team success for this, which actually can be a knock on him in the GOAT debate. Nevertheless, as an individual player he was ahead of Russel and the best player of his era. To this day he holds by far the most NBA records.
ChrisRF said:
By the way, was he also bragging about sleeping with 2000 women in his book?
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Actually even 20,000, which considering he was 55 at the time the book was written and assuming he started at 15, means he slept with 1.4 women per day for 40 years. Not sure if true but theoretically possible for a NBA star.
 
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BorgTheGOAT said:
He actually has a good case imho. He even led the league in assists one year which is unheard of for a center. His title count in a Teams sport as such is only to some extent relevant, otherwise Russel would be the undisputed GOAT. Wilt won two and was the key player in those championship winning teams which should be enough on paper, had he always given his best and only fell short against well better teams. However, in his case one could at least partly blame him for being too focused on individual stats and sacrificed the team success for this, which actually can be a knock on him in the GOAT debate. Nevertheless, as an individual player he was ahead of Russel and the best player of his era. To this day he holds by far the most NBA records.

Actually even 20,000, which considering he was 55 at the time the book was written and assuming he started at 15, means he slept with 1.4 women per day for 40 years. Not sure if true but theoretically possible for a NBA star.
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Yeah right, 20,000. Here he talks about some of those outlandish claims about him:

I think he is mainly joking, but likes it when people think it could be true. The 20,000 women thing is almost definitely a wild exxageration, and even Wilt himself doesn't act like he defends it seriously (which is a rare thing for him). Another thing is, it is said there once almost was a boxing fight between him and Muhammad Ali. Again it's hard to tell if this was ever seriously considered.

At least they also joked about such a fight:
 
ChrisRF said:
think he is mainly joking, but likes it when people think it could be true. The 20,000 women thing is almost definitely a wild exxageration, and even Wilt himself doesn't act like he defends it seriously (which is a rare thing for him).
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In this interview with Conan I agree that he makes it look like he was joking, but this might also be because he got a lot of backlash after he made this claim in the book. In the book itself he seems to be dead serious, even goes a little more in detail telling that his “record” in one night was sleeping with 15 women at a party he attended. Anywho, I think it is safe to say both these statements are exaggerated.
Another claim of his where I don’t low how true it is, is the one about bench pressing 600 lbs, which he also tells in the Conan interview you sent. Wilt’s built with his long arms and smaller chest is all but ideal for bench pressing, this being said he was freakishly strong, even Arnold himself admits it:

www.google.com

Arnold Schwarzenegger On Wilt Chamberlain’s INSANE Strength | #shorts

Follow For Content ⬇️⬇️⬇️Instagram: @HenryJHoopsTikTok: @HenryHoops
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Wilt Chamberlain picks up a guy so effortlessly it looks like hes on strings

Wilt and comedian Red Buttons in 1976 at the roast of Muhammad Ali. Wilt is about 40 years old.
www.google.com www.google.com

www.google.com

The Strength of Wilt Chamberlain - Part Two

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