Which streak was more impressive?

[BigThreeForever]

From 2008 to 2009, Nadal won five straight matches against Federer, all in Big Title finals, those being;
2008 Monte-Carlo Masters final
2008 Hamburg Masters final
2008 French Open final
2008 Wimbledon final
2009 Australian Open final

5–0 overall

From 2011 to 2012, Djokovic won seven straight matches against Nadal, all in Big Title finals, those being;
2011 Indian Wells Masters final
2011 Miami Masters final
2011 Madrid Masters final
2011 Rome Masters final
2011 Wimbledon final
2011 US Open final
2012 Australian Open final

7–0 overall

Similarities is that all matches were in Big Title finals, and both Nadal and Djokovic won three straight Grand Slam finals against their opponent. Another is that Nadal and Djokovic won matches on all three surfaces.

Differences is that Nadal beat Federer at his favorite Grand Slam, whereas Djokovic did not against Nadal, but did rack up two wins on clay, while also having two more victories than Nadal did during his win streak. Nadal also has the single most dominant match of the bunch at the 2008 RG final.

 

[RaulRamirez]

My slight lean, but didn't vote yet, is to Novak's streak, though obviously, both are amazing.

7 v 5, and three consecutive slams, as Rafa and Roger never met at the US Open, and Roger won the US08 in the middle of the streak. (Rafa almost made up for it with his insane Channel Slam.)

 

[BigThreeForever]

My slight lean, but didn't vote yet, is to Novak's streak, though obviously, both are amazing.

7 v 5, and three consecutive slams, as Rafa and Roger never met at the US Open, and Roger won the US08 in the middle of the streak. (Rafa almost made up for it with his insane Channel Slam.)

Another similarity. Federer won a major in the middle of the streak at the US Open, while Nadal did so at Roland Garros.

 

[Justshort]

Did Fed have "mono" in that period ?

 

[BigThreeForever]

Did Fed have "mono" in that period ?

No, believe he was cleared up by that point.

 

[Justshort]

No, believe he was cleared up by that point.

I am no expert in Federer's mono, but I've heard from his fans it was the main reason for his bad results in 2008 and 2009

 

[RaulRamirez]

Another similarity. Federer won a major in the middle of the streak at the US Open, while Nadal did so at Roland Garros.

Yes, that is true, but the slams were consecutive.

 

[BigThreeForever]

I am no expert in Federer's mono, but I've heard from his fans it was the main reason for his bad results in 2008 and 2009

From what I've read on here in past threads, his mono wasn't that severe though it may have messed up his training routines, and by time he knew he had it, it was basically over with.

 

[Third Serve]

I think Fed played better in most of those 2008 matches than Nadal in the 2011 matches, the lone dud being RG 2008. Two of them are some of the greatest matches ever and at least Hamburg 2008 is one of the pair’s better clay matches (the choke notwithstanding).

However, you do have to note that Djokovic’s streak is seven matches to Nadal’s five. That probably settles it even if a few of those matches were mediocre performances from Nadal.

 

[BigThreeForever]

I think Fed played better in most of those 2008 matches than Nadal in the 2011 matches, the lone dud being RG 2008. Two of them are some of the greatest matches ever and at least Hamburg 2008 is one of the pair’s better clay matches (the choke notwithstanding).

However, you do have to note that Djokovic’s streak is seven matches to Nadal’s five. That probably settles it even if a few of those matches were mediocre performances from Nadal.

The 2008 Hamburg final, 2008 Wimbledon final and 2009 Australian Open final were pretty epic indeed. The Djokodal streak also had some great matches, those being the 2011 Miami final and the 2012 Australian Open final. Can't forget to mention the third set of the 2011 US Open final.

 

[Hitman]

7 > 5

Come on....

 

[BigThreeForever]

7 > 5

Come on....

I agree, but everyone has their reasonings or personal opinions.

 

[Djokovic2011]

Y'all know who I'm going with on this one.

 

[Hitman]

I agree, but everyone has their reasonings or personal opinions.

I don't think reasoning can make up for two wins. You cannot even argue that these weren't strong versions of them either.


But, I'll add a little something to this.

Djokovic had never beaten Nadal in a final anywhere, Djokovic had never beaten Nadal on clay, Djokovic had never won a match in a slam against Nadal.....

 

[BigThreeForever]

I don't think reasoning can make up for two wins. You cannot even argue that these weren't strong versions of them either.


But, I'll add a little something to this.

Djokovic had never beaten Nadal in a final anywhere, Djokovic had never beaten Nadal on clay, Djokovic had never won a match in a slam against Nadal.....

Not to mention in those two victories against Nadal on clay, he was straight-setted. And at 4/7 events, Nadal was the defending champion, at Madrid, Rome, Wimbledon and US Open, and at 5/7 events he was No. 1.

 

[Hitman]

Not to mention in those two victories against Nadal on clay, he was straight-setted. And at 4/7 events, Nadal was the defending champion, at Madrid, Rome, Wimbledon and US Open, and at 5/7 events he was No. 1.

Nobody had ever beaten the world number one five straight times in the same season in finals.

Nobody had beaten another player in three consecutive slam finals.

This is a bit of a no-brainer, because Djokovic came out of nowhere to do the unthinkable....Nadal was making his move back in 2006 for Federer's spot, until he finally got it in 2008.

 

[BigThreeForever]

Nobody had ever beaten the world number one five straight times in the same season in finals.

Nobody had beaten another player in three consecutive slam finals.

This is a bit of a no-brainer, because Djokovic came out of nowhere to do the unthinkable....Nadal was making his move back in 2006 for Federer's spot, until he finally got it in 2008.

I agree, I just like seeing what people have to say in general and point out peculiarities. But yeah, the record for most defeats of a No. 1 in a season is still held by Djokovic in 2011 with 5 wins, though apparently Emerson did so in 1968 and Roche did so in 1969 with 5 wins each, but Djokovic did it with no defeats, so he has the record highest win percentage against a No. 1 in a season with also the most wins. Also, Nadal, as of now, is still the only man to have lost three consecutive Grand Slam finals.

 

[Hitman]

I agree, I just like seeing what people have to say in general and point out peculiarities. But yeah, the record for most defeats of a No. 1 in a season is still held by Djokovic in 2011 with 5 wins, though apparently Emerson did so in 1968 and Roche did so in 1969 with 5 wins each, but Djokovic did it with no defeats, so he has the record highest win percentage against a No. 1 in a season with also the most wins. Also, Nadal, as of now, is still the only man to have lost three consecutive Grand Slam finals.

Djokovic arriving in 2011 in the manner he did, was like Scot Hall arriving in WCW and shocking everyone.

And the nWo was formed..


A similar one was formed in tennis - Nole World Order

 

[Juice4080]

Djokovic arriving in 2011 in the manner he did, was like Scot Hall arriving in WCW and shocking everyone.

And the nWo was formed..


A similar one was formed in tennis - Nole World Order

I picture Novak strolling down the aisle at Stadium Court and telling Rafa "I had such a good time last week that i came back for more"

 

[UnforcedTerror]

Even if we take the last 5 encounters for Djokovic starting the 2011 clay swing, his streak is still much better

• 2011 Madrid Masters final
• 2011 Rome Masters final
• 2011 Wimbledon final
• 2011 US Open final
• 2012 Australian Open final

He utterly crushed Bull everywhere.

 

[Neptune]

7 > 5. Even if we assume a 60-40 favorite, there's only a 36% chance of extending from 5 to 7.

The 7:
2 HC, then 2 CC, then 1 GC, then 2 HC—perfect surface balance. Rafa was the defending champ for 4 (2 Slams, 2 Masters), while Nole was only defending one (AO12).

The 5:
3 CC, then 1 GC, then 1 HC—clay-skewed. Fed was defending 1 CC and 1 GC, while Rafa was defending 2 CC.

So, it's probably not a close call.

 

[Pheasant]

The surface must be considered in a big way. Nadal, especially by 2008, was a massive favorite on clay over Fed. So that’s 3 easy wins right there. Grass is likely 50/50, while Fed would be a slight favorite on hard courts at that stage od
Their careers.

So. Nadal over Fed 5 straight= .9 x .9 x .9 x .5 x .45= .164

Djoker over Nadal for 7 straight. Even then, I’d still give Djoker a .4 chance of taking out Nadal on clay, .8 on hard courts, and .5 on grass.

We get .8 x .8 x .4 x .4 x .5 x .8 x .8=.032

Djoker’s streak was about 1/5 as likely as Nadal’s; and ergo, more impressive.

 

[GrandSlam24]

Federer is irrelevant now. 20 Slams only. Weak Era.

 

[ChrisRF]

Another interesting similarity is that both streaks started on the winner's "home turf" (clay and hardcourt) and then later extended to the opponent's home turf(s) as well. It was like in a fictional story when someone establishes power within an own comfort zone, and then leaves it to also conquer the main opponent's bastion.

The difference is that when they finally came back "home", Djokovic remained on winning terms (two more hardcourt wins), while Nadal lost to Federer on clay in Madrid.

So, Djokovic is the winner here.

 

[NiCo515]

Not even close. Djokovic's 2011-12 streak vs Nadal is significantly more impressive, no matter how you slice it. Nadal coming into 2011 was viewed as finally having overtaken Federer as the undisputed best in the world. He was at the very peak of his game and was supposed to clean up that year and push for maybe the best tennis season ever, and then Novak completely blanked him in 7 straight finals, including multiple clay masters and 3 different slams. Rafa's 5 wins over Federer were more or less expected, with only Wimbledon and maybe the AO being in question.

 

[weakera]

7 was definitely the better streak, but it is interesting to note how Nadal's run over Federer, especially the Wimbledon/AO Finals, are so much more memorable and frequently discussed.

 

[gamelovergold]

Novak 7 wins against nadal was unexpected. Nadal win were also great but nadal was always closing on fedrer . Novak 2011 was sudden like lightining .3 consecutive slam finals and novak stopped rafa in all 3. It helped novak in 2023 as he passed rafa .

 

[Mustard]

Did Fed have "mono" in that period ?

He had mono in January-February 2008. It wasn't diagnosed until February. It cost him some training blocks that he normally did at that time, so his 2008 fitness would be slightly less than usual.

Federer was lucky that he didn't get the Ancic kind of mono, or worse the Soderling strain.

7 was definitely the better streak, but it is interesting to note how Nadal's run over Federer, especially the Wimbledon/AO Finals, are so much more memorable and frequently discussed.

Because Federer had an invincibility aura. People who remember that time know that the assumption from most people was that it was only a matter of time before Federer dominates everywhere, including on clay. Nadal had to work ridiculously hard to stop that happening, and even turn on the tables on Federer off of clay eventually. The annoying thing is that, ever since then, the people who don't like Nadal act like Nadal was always going to win on clay anyway, and they act like Federer didn't get lucky in having a lesser strain of mono than what other players did.

Nadal never quite had an invincibility aura in general, just on clay, even if he was in amazing form everywhere, such as mid 2008 or early-mid 2009. That just makes Nadal more epic really. He liked being an underdog and played into that narrative as much as he could, unlike Federer and Djokovic who wanted to be favourites and thought of as such. Nadal is seen as the greatest number 2 of all time, and didn't have as much time as number 1 compared to Federer and Djokovic, but Nadal still beat them both in the biggest matches the vast majority of the time.

 

[Mustard]

Not even close. Djokovic's 2011-12 streak vs Nadal is significantly more impressive, no matter how you slice it. Nadal coming into 2011 was viewed as finally having overtaken Federer as the undisputed best in the world. He was at the very peak of his game and was supposed to clean up that year and push for maybe the best tennis season ever, and then Novak completely blanked him in 7 straight finals, including multiple clay masters and 3 different slams. Rafa's 5 wins over Federer were more or less expected, with only Wimbledon and maybe the AO being in question.

Nadal in 2008 beat Federer in Monte Carlo, Hamburg, French Open and Wimbledon, and beat Djokovic in Hamburg, French Open, Queen's Club and Beijing Olympics. Nadal went from almost losing world number 2 to Djokovic in Hamburg, to being world number 1 in August. Nadal won 8 tournaments in 4 months in that period, something his rivals never did.

 

[johnmccabe]

Anybody read it as which steak was more impressive?

 

[Biotic]

Novak 7 wins against nadal was unexpected. Nadal win were also great but nadal was always closing on fedrer . Novak 2011 was sudden like lightining .3 consecutive slam finals and novak stopped rafa in all 3. It helped novak in 2023 as he passed rafa .

By the time Nadal crept up on Federer in 2008, the old man has already lost his aura of invincibility. It started way back in early 2007, when he lost two consecutive matches to Canas in IW and Miami, but hit really hard after he lost the 08 AO to the young upstart, and it went further downhill from there. He only salvaged the season later, winning USO. Everyone saw it coming, as for the first time since 2004, Federer was having a bit of a rough time with the field, with or without Nadal.

Novak's case is different. After reaching the lowest point of his career in 2010 (where he still managed staying inside Top 2 or Top 3, owning to his consistency and the unprecedented weakness of the field), he rose to the top of the rankings taking the world by storm. Nadal just came of the best season of his career, and was expected to continue pillaging the tour, but was stopped in his tracks. Djokovic went on to beat Nadal all across the globe, culminating in the superhuman 6 hour 2012 AO final.