Who had tougher competition: Federer 1st 10 Grand Slam Finals or Djokovic's last 10 Grand Slam finals?

[McEnroeisanartist]

Who had tougher competition: Federer 1st 10 Grand Slam Finals or Djokovic's last 10 Grand Slam finals?

Federer's Opponents (Ranking and Grand Slams won at time of match)

Philippoussis 48 0
Safin 86 1
Roddick 2 1
Hewitt 5 2
Roddick 4 1
Agassi 7 8
Baghdatis 54 0
Nadal 2 1
Nadal 2 2
Roddick 10 1

Djokovic's Opponents (Ranking and Grand Slams at time of match)

Thiem 5 0
Nadal 2 20
Medvedev 4 0
Tsitsipas 5 0
Berrertini 9 0
Medvedev 2 0
Krygios 40 0
Tsitsipas 4 0
Ruud 4 0
Alcarez 1 1

 

[alinefx]

its obvious the last few years made the supposed 2004-07 look like a monster in comparison

 

[legcramp]

Now do after 20 grand slams.

 

[Omega_7000]

Who had tougher competition: Federer 1st 10 Grand Slam Finals or Djokovic's last 10 Grand Slam finals?

Federer's Opponents (Ranking and Grand Slams won at time of match)

Philippoussis 48 0
Safin 86 1
Roddick 2 1
Hewitt 5 2
Roddick 4 1
Agassi 7 8
Baghdatis 54 0
Nadal 2 1
Nadal 2 2
Roddick 10 1

Djokovic's Opponents (Ranking and Grand Slams at time of match)

Thiem 5 0
Nadal 2 20
Medvedev 4 0
Tsitsipas 5 0
Berrertini 9 0
Medvedev 2 0
Krygios 40 0
Tsitsipas 4 0
Ruud 4 0
Alcarez 1 1

Federer by a country mile!

Djokovic had the good fortune to play against younger players the likes of Dimitrov, Nishikori, Raonic etc. and then the likes of Kyrgios, Zverev, Thiem, Berrettini etc. with all his contemporaries (Murray, DelPo, Wawrinka etc.) injured and out of the way.

 

[topher]

It’s crazy Rafa was mocked relentlessly for getting Berrettini in a slam semifinal in 2019.

The bar has been lowered rapidly. Watch your head, Carlos!

 

[mike danny]

It’s crazy Rafa was mocked relentlessly for getting Berrettini in a slam semifinal in 2019.

The bar has been lowered rapidly. Watch your head, Carlos!

Well, since tennis constantly evolves, obviously the next step was to get him in a final.

 

[topher]

Well, since tennis constantly evolves, obviously the next step was to get him in a final.

If Berrittini isn’t winning the CYGS by 2030, we’ll know evolution is debunked. Checkmate, Darwin!

 

[DSH]

It’s crazy Rafa was mocked relentlessly for getting Berrettini in a slam semifinal in 2019.

The bar has been lowered rapidly. Watch your head, Carlos!

Nadal faced Berrettini but Djokovic faced the "chicken legs" Sinner.

 

[Third Serve]

Fed pretty easily even if Alcaraz wins tomorrow. I’m not quite sure how this could still be a topic of debate but here we are.

 

[AnOctorokForDinner]

The difference grows larger with each passing slam in these sad times.

 

[jondice]

Gosh. When you see it printed out like that, you have to say Fed had it much tougher.

 

[soldat]

Federer definitely had it way easier. Each successive generation gets stronger, and Djokovic played tougher opponents in each slam, if you want to do a proper analysis you would have to analyze all 7 matches played in each of the 10 grand slams, instead of just the final opponent.

 

[AnOctorokForDinner]

Federer definitely had it way easier. Each successive generation gets stronger, and Djokovic played tougher opponents in each slam, if you want to do a proper analysis you would have to analyze all 7 matches played in each of the 10 grand slams, instead of just the final opponent.

Typical blank statement with no proof.

If you add pre-final opponents into the mix, Fed's comp is even further ahead...

 

[nolefam_2024]

Now that list is updated to add Medvedev and removed Thiem.

So compare

Philippoussis 48 0
Safin 86 1
Roddick 2 1
Hewitt 5 2
Roddick 4 1
Agassi 7 8
Baghdatis 54 0
Nadal 2 1
Nadal 2 2
Roddick 10 1


Vs


Nadal 2 20
Medvedev 4 0
Tsitsipas 5 0
Berrertini 9 0
Medvedev 2 0
Krygios 40 0
Tsitsipas 4 0
Ruud 4 0
Alcarez 1 1
Medvedev 3 1

Djokovic played slam champs in 3 of his finals. He actually lost 2 of these finals. And one final was vs Nadal zoning.

Federer played 8 slam champs in his finals. His worst finalists are worse than Djokovic's worst finalist but he had less of them.

Overall Djokovic had a bit easier than Federer in finals.

 

[Neptune]

Big3 in slam
Matches played:
Fed 429, Rafa 357, Nole 409
top5 played:
Fed 55(12.82%), Rafa 47(13.16%), Nole 63(15.40%)
top10 played:
Fed 99(23.08%), Rafa 77(21.57%), Nole 100(24.45%)

 

[nolefam_2024]

Big3 in slam
Matches played:
Fed 429, Rafa 357, Nole 409
top5 played:
Fed 55, Rafa 47, Nole 63
top10 played:
Fed 99, Rafa 77, Nole 100

Exactly

Federer may have slightly stronger early opponents than Nole now but Djokovic had way stronger opposition in his youth than fed ever did. If balanced out for both.

 

[Neptune]

Exactly

Federer may have slightly stronger early opponents than Nole now but Djokovic had way stronger opposition in his youth than fed ever did. If balanced out for both.

Not to mention the Nole-Rafa same side on clay, Nole-Fed same side nonclay, and other draw rigging.
It stand out that Rafa benefit the most with so fewer top10 matches and 8 nonclay slams.

 

[nolefam_2024]

Not to mention the Nole-Rafa same side on clay, Nole-Fed same side nonclay, and other draw rigging.

There is a record of Nole and fed playing 5 straight USO finals.

Nole has also played vs Rafa in QF and semis of RG a combined 7 times.

This final stat is bs.

 

[Neptune]

There is a record of Nole and fed playing 5 straight USO finals.

Nole has also played vs Rafa in QF and semis of RG a combined 7 times.

This final stat is bs.

check my sig.

 

[nolefam_2024]

check my sig.

Exactly. So this is pure propaganda.

 

[BeatlesFan]

Gosh. When you see it printed out like that, you have to say Fed had it much tougher.

Oh, that can't possibly be. I keep reading here (from people who started watching tennis in 2015), that Federer dominated a "weak era."

 

[Neptune]

Exactly. So this is pure propaganda.

The slam rigging so far have not blocked Nole (although the gap should have been wide without), but causing Fed to lose the race to Rafa, without rigging Fed would be ahead of Rafa.

 

[Neptune]

Oh, that can't possibly be. I keep reading here (from people who started watching tennis in 2015), that Federer dominated a "weak era."

don't invite embarrassment to Fed

 

[nolefam_2024]

The slam rigging so far have not blocked Nole (although the gap should have been wide without), but causing Fed to lose the race to Rafa, without rigging Fed would be ahead of Rafa.

I don't know if that made such a difference though. But to OP, the final is not always the most important match. When only 1 player is on your level, which for Djokovic it was mostly either fed or Rafa, you have to take him as the final. Like Wimbledon 2018. And who cares if the finalist is Anderson.

Nadal 2013 had finalist Ferrer. But he had already beaten Nole who was world number 1 and mc champ.

 

[Neptune]

I don't know if that made such a difference though. But to OP, the final is not always the most important match. When only 1 player is on your level, which for Djokovic it was mostly either fed or Rafa, you have to take him as the final. Like Wimbledon 2018. And who cares if the finalist is Anderson.

Nadal 2013 had finalist Ferrer. But he had already beaten Nole who was world number 1 and mc champ.

There is match up issue in tennis, e.g. 2008-11 on outdoor HC:
Fed owns Davy, Davy owns Rafa, Rafa owns Fed
How easy it is to rig draws?

Also Nole Fed are top2 in OE HC, and Davy is Rafa's mater on HC
How about put all 3 of them on the other side of the slam draw?

 

[Third Serve]

this statement would already have been true back in 2019 and it’s only gotten weaker since then

 

[Neptune]

this statement would already have been true back in 2019 and it’s only gotten weaker since then

I thought Fed plays 1500+ instead of 10 matches in his remarkable career?

 

[Neptune]

Fed first 10 vs Nole last 10 slam finals:

Fed 90% 9-1
opponent average rank 9
opponent average Elo 2217

Nole 70% 7-3
opponent average rank 4
opponent average Elo 2245

 

[Turning Pro]

Fed has better peak versions of the opponents (peak Safin, excellent Agassi, 2004 Wimby Roddick, prime Hewitt who lost to the eventual Slam champion about 6-8 times in a row.) Nadal, Safin and Agassi would beat all on that Djokovic list of opponents more often than not except prime Alcaraz, and maybe Peak Thiem and Med.

This is vs Djokovic's set of unremarkable players besides Oldal which is way inferior to prime/peak Nadal where he went 2>1 over Djokovic on Hc and should have beat him in Wimby 18 besides that roof debacle/farce.

 

[fedfan24]

Who had tougher competition: Federer 1st 10 Grand Slam Finals or Djokovic's last 10 Grand Slam finals?

Federer's Opponents (Ranking and Grand Slams won at time of match)

Philippoussis 48 0
Safin 86 1
Roddick 2 1
Hewitt 5 2
Roddick 4 1
Agassi 7 8
Baghdatis 54 0
Nadal 2 1
Nadal 2 2
Roddick 10 1

Djokovic's Opponents (Ranking and Grand Slams at time of match)

Thiem 5 0
Nadal 2 20
Medvedev 4 0
Tsitsipas 5 0
Berrertini 9 0
Medvedev 2 0
Krygios 40 0
Tsitsipas 4 0
Ruud 4 0
Alcarez 1 1

That second list .

 

[Jonesy]

Now do after 20 grand slams.

Let's wait until Fed reaches 24 so we can compare.

 

[Holmes]

this statement would already have been true back in 2019 and it’s only gotten weaker since then

I wonder what conclusion a comparison of each of their first 10 slam finals would yield.

 

[The Sinner]

The difference grows larger with each passing slam in these sad times.

Good times ahead…what with Sinner, Alcaraz & Rune soon to enter prime.

 

[jondice]

Oh, that can't possibly be. I keep reading here (from people who started watching tennis in 2015), that Federer dominated a "weak era."

Fed did dominate a weak era. Novak just dominated an even weaker era.

So the player who won the most slams from 2008-2014 is clearly the GOAT. (Not sure who that is.)

 

[RF-18]

Who had tougher competition: Federer 1st 10 Grand Slam Finals or Djokovic's last 10 Grand Slam finals?

Federer's Opponents (Ranking and Grand Slams won at time of match)

Philippoussis 48 0
Safin 86 1
Roddick 2 1
Hewitt 5 2
Roddick 4 1
Agassi 7 8
Baghdatis 54 0
Nadal 2 1
Nadal 2 2
Roddick 10 1

Djokovic's Opponents (Ranking and Grand Slams at time of match)

Thiem 5 0
Nadal 2 20
Medvedev 4 0
Tsitsipas 5 0
Berrertini 9 0
Medvedev 2 0
Krygios 40 0
Tsitsipas 4 0
Ruud 4 0
Alcarez 1 1

Thiem > Philipoussis
Nadal > Safin
Medvedev > Roddick
Hewitt > Tsitsipas
Roddick >Berrettini
Medvedev > Agassi
Kyrgios > Baghdatis
Nadal >Tsitsipas
Nadal > Ruud
Alcaraz > Roddick

 

[Milanez82]

Thiem > Philipoussis
Nadal > Safin
Medvedev > Roddick
Hewitt > Tsitsipas
Roddick >Berrettini
Medvedev > Agassi
Kyrgios > Baghdatis
Nadal >Tsitsipas
Nadal > Ruud
Alcaraz > Roddick

Its debatable if Nadal's 06 grass level at Wimbledon was better then Tsitsipas 21 clay level at RG.

If not for an easy draw, Rafa never makes that final.

 

[RF-18]

Its debatable if Nadal's 06 grass level at Wimbledon was better then Tsitsipas 21 clay level at RG.

If not for an easy draw, Rafa never makes that final.

Yea probably. Either 6-4 or 7-3 advantage for this era.

 

[RS]

Its debatable if Nadal's 06 grass level at Wimbledon was better then Tsitsipas 21 clay level at RG.

If not for an easy draw, Rafa never makes that final.

Nadal would beat him if they played

 

[NatF]

Thiem > Philipoussis
Nadal > Safin
Medvedev > Roddick
Hewitt > Tsitsipas
Roddick >Berrettini
Medvedev > Agassi
Kyrgios > Baghdatis
Nadal >Tsitsipas
Nadal > Ruud
Alcaraz > Roddick

LOL

Djokovic fans have cornered the market on **** takes.

 

[RS]

LOL

Djokovic fans have cornered the market on **** takes.

Roddick Wim 04 should be over Med for pick 3 but what of the rest is a terrible terrible take?

 

[NatF]

Roddick Wim 04 should be over Med for pick 3 but what of the rest is a terrible take?

Agassi > Med as well.

He also agreed that 2021 Tsits > 2006 Nadal.

 

[RS]

Agassi > Med as well.

He also agreed that 2021 Tsits > 2006 Nadal.

I see this as a Agassi in 4 or Med in 5 type thing but even if the former is more likely it would be debatable but not terrible?

Wasn't sure on his Tsits vs Nadal stands but he did go Nadal originally. Think that was 23 vs 06 though opon checking a 2nd time.

 

[NatF]

I see this as a Agassi in 4 or Med in 5 type thing but even if the former is more likely it would be debatable but not terrible?

Wasn't sure on his Tsits vs Nadal stands but he did go Nadal originally.

The Roddick take was terrible enough for the whole list.

 

[RF-18]

LOL

Djokovic fans have cornered the market on **** takes.

Nothing outrageous about that list. You are just mad I rate Medvedev above Roddick and talking about poor takes you say Agassi over 21 Med USO who lost 1 set the whole tournament and won the title? Don't talk about **** takes when you have plenty. Just see it as a different opinion.

 

[NatF]

Nothing outrageous about that list. You are just mad I rate Medvedev above Roddick and talking about poor takes you say Agassi over 21 Med USO who lost 1 set the whole tournament and won the title? Don't talk about **** takes when you have plenty. Just see it as a different opinion.

Yesterday I saw a Djokovic fan claim 2006 USO Fed was a weak run from him form wise. So yeah you guys are the kings of trash takes. Medvedev's draw was an absolute joke, as well - a sadly common occurance in this dumpster fire of an era your favourite has been milking. The Agassi that turned on finals Sunday played obviously better than Medvedev against a vastly superior opponent...and BTW only an idiot would rank pretty much any Medvedev over 2004 Wimbledon Roddick but especially one that lost in straight sets LOL.

 

[Neptune]

Medvedev's draw was an absolute joke, as well - a sadly common occurance in this dumpster fire of an era your favourite has been milking.

What a joke, mess up your mind in just one sentence.

 

[RS]

The difference grows larger with each passing slam in these sad times.

You caused trouble by bumping this up.

 

[Neptune]

You caused trouble by bumping this up.

The clueless can not stop shooting itself in the foot.

 

[GoatNo1]

Now that list is updated to add Medvedev and removed Thiem.

So compare

Philippoussis 48 0
Safin 86 1
Roddick 2 1
Hewitt 5 2
Roddick 4 1
Agassi 7 8
Baghdatis 54 0
Nadal 2 1
Nadal 2 2
Roddick 10 1


Vs


Nadal 2 20
Medvedev 4 0
Tsitsipas 5 0
Berrertini 9 0
Medvedev 2 0
Krygios 40 0
Tsitsipas 4 0
Ruud 4 0
Alcarez 1 1
Medvedev 3 1

Djokovic played slam champs in 3 of his finals. He actually lost 2 of these finals. And one final was vs Nadal zoning.

Federer played 8 slam champs in his finals. His worst finalists are worse than Djokovic's worst finalist but he had less of them.

Overall Djokovic had a bit easier than Federer in finals.

so
nole had 8 top5, 9 top10 and 10 top40 players
fed had 5 top5, 7 top10, 8 top50, and 10 top100 players

and somehow you calculate that noe easier!?!?

 

[Neptune]

so
nole had 8 top5, 9 top10 and 10 top40 players
fed had 5 top5, 7 top10, 8 top50, and 10 top100 players

and somehow you calculate that noe easier!?!?

opponent average rank
Nole 4
Fed 9
Not even close, what a joke.