Who is better/greater? Wawrinka or Kuerten?

[RogerFederer007]

Different types of career though - Kuerten is an early bloomer who prime was cut short by injuries while Wawrinka find success later in his career.

GS: 3 vs 3. Wawrinka won at AO, RG and USO when Kuerten titles came exclusively at RG. Stan also has an extra GS final.
Master: 1 vs 5.
YEC: 0 vs 1
Career high: 3 vs 1 (Plus an year-end No.1 in 2000)
Total titles: 16 vs 20.

What do you think?

 

[MichaelNadal]

Wolverinka fuhsho.

 

[Im(moral) Winner]

So 4/5 out of those stats favor Kuerten

 

[Red Rick]

Kuerten.

It's not even remotely close.

 

[MichaelNadal]

Kuerten.

It's not even remotely close.

Gustavo didn't have to beat Nadal and Ultron for his slams.

 

[Deleted member 307496]

Gustavo didn't have to beat Nadal and Ultron for his slams.

But he did beat Pete and Andre back to back to win the WTF.

 

[Lew II]

Wawrinka of course, he is the 4th player with most slam titles in a nearly 20 years timespan.

 

[Red Rick]

Gustavo didn't have to beat Nadal and Ultron for his slams.

Cause that was some peak Nadal stuff.

Wawrinka has a good matchup with Djokovic. That's all there is to him. Everything else about him is overrated. Fed fans love him cause he beat Djoko, Djoko fans hype him cause otherwise it's hard to swallow that Wawa beat him.

Apart from when he plays Djokovic, Wawrinka is nothing special.

 

[Poisoned Slice]

Add me to the Kuerten bandwagon.

 

[Lew II]

Cause that was some peak Nadal stuff.

Wawrinka has a good matchup with Djokovic. That's all there is to him. Everything else about him is overrated. Fed fans love him cause he beat Djoko, Djoko fans hype him cause otherwise it's hard to swallow that Wawa beat him.

Apart from when he plays Djokovic, Wawrinka is nothing special.

Since 2013 he is 12-5 in slams against top-10 not named Djokovic, losing only to the Big4.

 

[BGod]

Kuerten 3 Slam runs past quarterfinal. Says it all in favour of Wawrinka. Plus the epic 5 set losses like 2013 AO for Stan.

Let's talk about Kuerten's #1 year though, 2000. In context probably weakest YE #1 and Wawrinka has two WTF semifinal finishes.

Overall it's Wawrinka with 3 different Slams and more deep runs.

 

[Deleted member 307496]

Kuerten 3 Slam runs past quarterfinal. Says it all in favour of Wawrinka. Plus the epic 5 set losses like 2013 AO for Stan.

Let's talk about Kuerten's #1 year though, 2000. In context probably weakest YE #1 and Wawrinka has two WTF semifinal finishes.

Overall it's Wawrinka with 3 different Slams and more deep runs.

Yep, beating Agassi and Sampras back to back is real weak dude.

You probably think Rafter is better than Kuerten though.

 

[RogerFederer007]

Kuerten 3 Slam runs past quarterfinal. Says it all in favour of Wawrinka. Plus the epic 5 set losses like 2013 AO for Stan.

Let's talk about Kuerten's #1 year though, 2000. In context probably weakest YE #1 and Wawrinka has two WTF semifinal finishes.

Overall it's Wawrinka with 3 different Slams and more deep runs.

I would say that Sampras 1998 year-end no.1 was weaker.

 

[Devin]

Kuerten for me, but he could be really streaky at times... so was Stan though. But Kuerten was able to Muster up some masters on fast hard courts (Cincy), get YE #1, and win the WTF. Ha, get it?

 

[cdik]

Guga, sure thing. Hi's much brighter and impressive.

 

[NatF]

Kuerten. Guy was YE #1.

Another guy who's prime was cut short my injuries - total opposite to Wawrinka who is a very late bloomer.

 

[zuluzazu]

What

Kuerten. Guy was YE #1.

Another guy who's prime was cut short my injuries - total opposite to Wawrinka who is a very late bloomer.

What about slam distribution about which most fans keep harping about?

 

[NatF]

What

What about slam distribution about which most fans keep harping about?

New user complaining about most fans already?

The YE #1 is a huge deal for me and like I said Kuerten was done in by injuries at 25, Wawrinka won his first at what 28/29?

 

[Deleted member 742196]

Gustavo didn't have to beat Nadal and Ultron for his slams.

Cause that was some peak Nadal stuff.

Wawrinka has a good matchup with Djokovic. That's all there is to him. Everything else about him is overrated. Fed fans love him cause he beat Djoko, Djoko fans hype him cause otherwise it's hard to swallow that Wawa beat him.

Apart from when he plays Djokovic, Wawrinka is nothing special.

Might mean something when a Nadal fan also says Wolvarinka, no?

But seriously, Waverinka is the only guy that ever hit priming/peaking Djokovic off the court. Nobody does that. Not Federer, not Nadal, not even Tower of Tandil.

Might have been a brief window, credit to him for finding a window virtually nobody else did in two decades.

P.S.
I really dislike the “match up” reasoning. Sure Nadal is/was a great match up against Fed but he also needed to execute. Full credit to these guys for their wins.

 

[zuluzazu]

New user complaining about most fans already?

The YE #1 is a huge deal for me and like I said Kuerten was done in by injuries at 25, Wawrinka won his first at what 28/29?

Maybe I have started replying just a few days ago but I have been following this whole forum for years.

 

[NatF]

Maybe I have started replying just a few days ago but I have been following this whole forum for years.

Sure thing

 

[Deleted member 742196]

Maybe I have started replying just a few days ago but I have been following this whole forum for years.

There was a tsunami which recently hit Indonesia, which was bad. What seismic event unfolded that had you see the meaning of life?

 

[Deleted member 307496]

There was a tsunami which recently hit Indonesia, which was bad. What seismic event unfolded that had you see the meaning of life?

I still remember the impact that 2004 tsunami had on the entire world, let alone a singular population.

 

[Sport]

Wawrinka obviously. People voting for Kuerten are trolling.

They are tied in Grand Slams (3 = 3), but the distribution gives Wawrinka a clear edge. Kuerten only won RG. Mr. Wawrinka won RG, the USO and the AO.

 

[RogerFederer007]

I could see prime Kuerten win at least 1 more RG from 2002 to 2004. Kuerten is not entirely a clay court specialist though, won TMC 2000 (beating Agassi and sampras back to back), also won 2001 Cincinnati Master with a brutal draw. At that time he was world No.1 and could be the favorite for the Us Open.

 

[Deleted member 307496]

Wawrinka obviously. People voting for Kuerten are trolling.

They are tied in Grand Slams (3 = 3), but the distribution gives Wawrinka a clear edge. Kuerten only won RG. Mr. Wawrinka won RG, the USO and the AO.

 

[Im(moral) Winner]

Agassi hadn't won the YEC since 1990

 

[Deleted member 307496]

Agassi hadn't won the YEC since 1990

Agassi hadn't made a Wimbledon final prior to 1999 after 1992.

 

[Im(moral) Winner]

Agassi hadn't made a Wimbledon final prior to 1999 after 1992.

True. Was very lucky to win it in 1992 as well.

 

[Deleted member 307496]

True. Was very lucky to win it in 1992 as well.

But doesn't it prove Agassi was the only baseliner in existence with the ability to win on fast grass?!?!

 

[Deleted member 742196]

I still remember the impact that 2004 tsunami had on the entire world, let alone a singular population.

In Canada a few people get caught in an elevator it makes the local news. I started spending gobs of time in Asia after my thirties. Earthquakes, typhoons, tsunamis, volcanos, shoot even traffic jams that can go on for days. It’s amazing how government and citizenry manage to be so accustomed to such things.

You look at spots like Bali or Phuket today that were deeply affected by that 2004 Tsunami and you wouldn’t even know such an event happened. Developers continue build 5 star resorts by the sea, locals continue to operate their businesses, vacationers flock to the same exact spots where hundreds died.

I wonder if it’s a good or bad thing?

 

[Deleted member 307496]

In Canada a few people get caught in an elevator it makes the local news. I started spending gobs of time in Asia after my thirties. Earthquakes, typhoons, tsunamis, volcanos, shoot even traffic jams that can go on for days. It’s amazing how government and citizenry manage to be so accustomed to such things.

You look at spots like Bali or Phuket today that were deeply affected by that 2004 Tsunami and you wouldn’t even know such an event happened. Developers continue build 5 star resorts by the sea, locals continue to operate their businesses, vacationers flock to the same exact spots where hundreds died.

I wonder if it’s a good or bad thing?

Well, you can't change what's already happened. The best thing to do would be to move forward and continue to foster growth and prosperity.

Of course the families and friends of those who unfortunately perished in these events will always hold onto the memory of the lost souls.

 

[RogerFederer007]

In fact I think Wawrinka is overachieved. Guy should not have more GS than Hewitt, Safin or even Roddick IMO.

 

[Deleted member 742196]

Well, you can't change what's already happened. The best thing to do would be to move forward and continue to foster growth and prosperity.

Of course the families and friends of those who unfortunately perished in these events will always hold onto the memory of the lost souls.

Undoubtedly.

I supposed that’s why I chose that gif above. The new user said he decided to contribute to the forum after years of inactivity. It reminded me of an earthquake or volcano that suddenly comes around. In that moment most people would panic but the experienced ones would calmly grab their tea or coffee.

Is the new user this guy?

Or this guy?

 

[Deleted member 307496]

Undoubtedly.

I supposed that’s why I chose that gif above. The new user said he decided to contribute to the forum after years of inactivity. It reminded me of an earthquake or volcano that suddenly comes around. In that moment most people would panic but the experienced ones would calmly grab their tea or coffee.

Is the new user this guy?

Or this guy?

Well you have to live through such an experience to know how to react. It says he is 19 years old, perhaps he hasn't encountered such an event before?!?!

Hey wait a minute, how long has he been following this forum if he's only 19? Was he 12 years old stalking posts about Fedr/Nadl?

 

[Deleted member 742196]

Well you have to live through such an experience to know how to react. It says he is 19 years old, perhaps he hasn't encountered such an event before?!?!

Hey wait a minute, how long has he been following this forum if he's only 19? Was he 12 years old stalking posts about Fedr/Nadl?

Good question !!!!!

Maybe its altogether a different kind of seismic event?

This guy:

That probably does make most sense when you think about how this forum works.

 

[zuluzazu]

Well you have to live through such an experience to know how to react. It says he is 19 years old, perhaps he hasn't encountered such an event before?!?!

Hey wait a minute, how long has he been following this forum if he's only 19? Was he 12 years old stalking posts about Fedr/Nadl?

Yes you are right. I started watching tennis in 2007 and started watching this forum in 2013.

 

[Deleted member 742196]

Yes you are right. I started watching tennis in 2007 and started watching this forum in 2013.

That’s great but what about the original question? What event made you decide to switch from passive observer to regular contributor?

P.S.
Welcome to the forum by the way.

 

[RogerFederer007]

I have read this board since around mid-2010 but recently I decided to post something. My English is a joke that is the main reasons why I hesitate to join.

 

[zuluzazu]

That’s great but what about the original question? What event made you decide to switch from passive observer to regular contributor?

P.S.
Welcome to the forum by the way.

See when I was 14 I was afraid of posting anything on the net. But when I went to high school, here in India we enter a rat race to get into colleges where we are not supposed to engage in any distractions. A bit complicated. Now that I am in college and moreover its my holidays so I thought replying in this forum will be a fun pass time.

 

[slice bh compliment]

My two favorites since nastase, Mac, clerc, Noah, becker, edberg, and Pete. Much love and respect for both.

Similar stats.
Same utter pleasure and joy to the world as we watch and imitate their backhands.
Both clutch servers, neutral returners, fiery competitors.... and basically unbeatable on the right day.
Both rock(ed) the croc (pre-peak Stanley, and present day Guga).
Both popular worldwide, especially in France.

if this were some sort of inter-era competition....
My head says Stan. He is imitable.
My heart Guga because of his touch around the net, his general bonhommerie and connection with the sporting public. And his love for the sea.

Let's look at head to heads against the great RF.
Kidding.

Tough one. Toss-up in my house. The girls say Guga. My boys say Stan.
What must Stan and Guga think of this thread topic?

 

[Deleted member 742196]

See when I was 14 I was afraid of posting anything on the net. But when I went to high school, here in India we enter a rat race to get into colleges where we are not supposed to engage in any distractions. A bit complicated. Now that I am in college and moreover its my holidays so I thought replying in this forum will be a fun pass time.

Sounds good. Also, awesome username. What in the world is zuluzazu??????

Some folk like ABCD want to be first in the telephone directory, others perhaps want to have the last word.

Might that be it?

 

[zuluzazu]

Sounds good. Also, awesome username. What in the world is zuluzazu??????

Some folk like ABCD want to be first in the telephone directory, others perhaps want to have the last word.

Might that be it?

Zulu is the nickname of my sister and zazu is my nickname

 

[thrust]

Wawrinka obviously. People voting for Kuerten are trolling.

They are tied in Grand Slams (3 = 3), but the distribution gives Wawrinka a clear edge. Kuerten only won RG. Mr. Wawrinka won RG, the USO and the AO.

True, but I think that court speeds were much different in Kuerten's day than today. Stan was lucky that Nadal was injured in their AO final and so was Novak, to a lesser degree, in the USO final. Stan was near incredible in the FO final vs Novak, who also played very well in that final. I must admit though that I always thought Gustavo was a more likable person than Stan.

 

[Deleted member 742196]

Zulu is the nickname of my sister and zazu is my nickname

Kewl. Makes an interesting username all the more richer.

Have fun with the forum zuluzazu. One quick way of making friends in here is to find a bone of contention and argue it. Doesn’t matter what that bone is. Call Federer a sissy. That’s usually a dependable one.

 

[Red Rick]

Might mean something when a Nadal fan also says Wolvarinka, no?

But seriously, Waverinka is the only guy that ever hit priming/peaking Djokovic off the court. Nobody does that. Not Federer, not Nadal, not even Tower of Tandil.

Might have been a brief window, credit to him for finding a window virtually nobody else did in two decades.

P.S.
I really dislike the “match up” reasoning. Sure Nadal is/was a great match up against Fed but he also needed to execute. Full credit to these guys for their wins.

I don't discredit his wins.

But people treat him like he's better than he is based on less than 1% of his matches.

 

[Deleted member 742196]

I don't discredit his wins.

But people treat him like he's better than he is based on less than 1% of his matches.

Whenever the term “matchup” is used as part of the reasoning it’s venturing in that direction Rick. None of these guys were born with their tennis. They laboured their entire lives over it. And in those wins they executed, which in the era of the Big 4 doesn’t tend to happen with much frequency.

 

[ibbi]

I think that if all the slams in Guga's era played as similar to Roland Garros as they do in Stan's era, then this probably wouldn't be a close debate.

 

[Enceladus]

Wawrinka though has a better GS distribution, while Kuerten won only on RG, but I rank Kuerten higher, owning a WTF title and reaching No. 1 and YE1 (2000).

 

[Badabing888]

Reaching year end no.1 favours Guga. Stan never reached number 2 let alone 1 in the world.