Who was the tougher match up for Djokovic on grass between Federer and Nadal?

Thoughts?

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    81
NatF said:
It was good aside from the Kiefer portion...
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To be honest, I don't remember the Kiefer match. I know the scoreline and everything but I missed it at the time.

I remember Kiefer being a tricky customer, nice all-court game.
 
zagor said:
To be honest, I don't remember the Kiefer match. I know the scoreline and everything but I missed it at the time.

I remember Kiefer being a tricky customer, nice all-court game.
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Kiefer often caused Federer problems, pretty fearless. Efficacy in early rounds is less important than Federerer winning every round from the 4R to the F in straights though, which is my point. Djokovic being actually 0-2 down against Anderson is the easy counter to the Kiefer example. Not that I think 2005 Fed routines 2015 Djokovic, but I think the match probably resembles their 2012 match more than any of the others.
 
Hitman said:
All we know is that someone will need to be super dominant in their 20s and 30s to overtake Djokovic as the king of the mountain.

The target is 25 slams, which no able bodied player, man or woman has ever achieved up to this point. And that is if Djokovic doesn't pull out another slam before he retires.
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It's going to take a mighty effort to reach him. I expect some of his records to fall but I don't expect it to happen soon. It took 30+ years for some of Jordan and Gretsky's records to fall.
 
NoleFam said:
It's going to take a mighty effort to reach him. I expect some of his records to fall but I don't expect it to happen soon. It took 30+ years for some of Jordan and Gretsky's records to fall.
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It will probably take some time but I think the slam record is going at some point.

His records across the board including his non slam achievements and weeks at number 1 will be harder to catch though. 428 weeks at number 1 will be a nightmare in particular.
 
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NoleFam said:
It's going to take a mighty effort to reach him. I expect some of his records to fall but I don't expect it to happen soon. It took 30+ years for some of Jordan and Gretsky's records to fall.
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It will take a super freak of the likes we have not seen before to do it, those aren't some above average numbers.
 
NatF said:
Kiefer often caused Federer problems, pretty fearless. Efficacy in early rounds is less important than Federerer winning every round from the 4R to the F in straights though, which is my point. Djokovic being actually 0-2 down against Anderson is the easy counter to the Kiefer example. Not that I think 2005 Fed routines 2015 Djokovic, but I think the match probably resembles their 2012 match more than any of the others.
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Anderson made the Queens final in 2015 (losing to Murray), grass was his best surface, and he was dangerous at Wimbledon from 2015-2018. I don't see how that's an easy counter to Nicolas Kiefer on grass...
 
Hitman said:
It will take a super freak of the likes we have not seen before to do it, those aren't some above average numbers.
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Yea and already Alcaraz is saying the pressure is getting to him and he's just getting started. That's why records are hard to break, especially in tennis, because of the long term intense focus it takes, how difficult it is mentally, and the rigorous physical aspect of the sport. So I think Djokovic will keep his records for quite a while.
 
RS said:
It will probably take some time but I think the slam record is going at some point.

His records across the board including his non slam achievements and weeks at number 1 will be harder to catch though. 428 weeks at number 1 will be a nightmare in particular.
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The Slam record and weeks at #1 record will probably be the two hardest (out of the most important ones anyway) to break imo. It took him until he was 36 to reach 24.
 
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I think 24 is not safe and I also think it's not easy.

Used to read about the best stats in wiki long time ago and mc 24 used to be so big number that no one would expect to reach it.

Serena is also big name. And she was able to bulldoze her way to 23. You have to keep this in mind. Serena reached 23 at age 35. Djokovic 24 at 36. It's very possible for some player to reach 25. But it would be in mid to late 30s. So right now sinner and raz are 10+ years behind.
 
NoleFam said:
Yea and already Alcaraz is saying the pressure is getting to him and he's just getting started. That's why records are hard to break, especially in tennis, because of the long term intense focus it takes, how difficult it is mentally, and the rigorous physical aspect of the sport. So I think Djokovic will keep his records for quite a while.
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Agree.

I will go on record and say that no record is ever truly safe, because if it has happened once before, why can it not happen again.

But it will take some truly unique rare players to take ownership of these records. It may not happen in our lifetimes, so we may never know though.

24 slams is insanely freakish, to be able to stay on top for that long takes a special player to topple. Who knows when that player will be born.

Alcaraz needs to win one of the next two slams, or he actually falls behind Nadal at the same age, and Nadal came second to Djokovic, so yes, the pressure is always on.
 
NoleFam said:
The Slam record and weeks at #1 record will probably be the two hardest (out of the most important ones anyway) to break imo. It took him until he was 36 to reach 24.
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A player can gain ground over Novak if they pile up the slams in teen years and early to mid 20s. I don't think a player will win at rate Djokovic did in there 30s in a while.

But that being said they still need to win a decent amount of slams in there 30s.
 
nolefam_2024 said:
Serena is someone completely forgotten. She reached 23 as well. It is possible for a player to reach 25 yes.
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I haven't forgotten her and usually separate women sports from men's sports in comparisons but yes she also dominated until her mid 30s.
Hitman said:
Agree.

I will go on record and say that no record is ever truly safe, because if it has happened once before, why can it not happen again.

But it will take some truly unique rare players to take ownership of these records. It may not happen in our lifetimes, so we may never know though.

24 slams is insanely freakish, to be able to stay on top for that long takes a special player to topple. Who knows when that player will be born.

Alcaraz needs to win one of the next two slams, or he actually falls behind Nadal at the same age, and Nadal came second to Djokovic, so yes, the pressure is always on.
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24 Slams is crazy but the record could have arguably been put out of reach imo. The pandemic really slowed him down for a couple of reasons as we know. He could easily be at 26 instead of 24 right now if it weren't for that. But yes, records are meant to be broken. I expect someone to seriously challenge it one day and maybe break it but it's going to take someone very special, and I don't expect it to happen soon.
 
RS said:
A player can gain ground over Novak if they pile up the slams in teen years and early to mid 20s. I don't think a player will win at rate Djokovic did in there 30s in a while.

But that being said they still need to win a decent amount of slams in there 30s.
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Well Alcaraz actually has a great start but it's the amount of effort to continue that into your 30s which is going to make it so hard, especially since he's already talking about how it's getting to him. They do need to dominate into their 30s I think to reach it though.
 
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NoleFam said:
I haven't forgotten her and usually separate women sports from men's sports in comparisons but yes she also dominated until her mid 30s.

24 Slams is crazy but the record could have arguably been put out of reach imo. The pandemic really slowed him down for a couple of reasons as we know. He could easily be at 26 instead of 24 right now if it weren't for that. But yes, records are meant to be broken. I expect someone to seriously challenge it one day and maybe break it but it's going to take someone very special, and I don't expect it to happen soon.
Click to expand...

Agree. We all might not be around to see it.
 
NoleFam said:
I haven't forgotten her and usually separate women sports from men's sports in comparisons but yes she also dominated until her mid 30s.

24 Slams is crazy but the record could have arguably been put out of reach imo. The pandemic really slowed him down for a couple of reasons as we know. He could easily be at 26 instead of 24 right now if it weren't for that. But yes, records are meant to be broken. I expect someone to seriously challenge it one day and maybe break it but it's going to take someone very special, and I don't expect it to happen soon.
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Lmao. The pandemic totally ruined the already weak tour, and brought the weakest era in history. Yet Djokovic fans are complaining about something. :rolleyes:
 
StrongRule said:
Lmao. The pandemic totally ruined the already weak tour, and brought the weakest era in history. Yet Djokovic fans are complaining about something. :rolleyes:
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Well the fact that a pandemic caused Wimbledon to be canceled for the 1st time since WWII will always be brought up, but no one is really complaining. Why would they when he still broke the Slam record? You've been saying the tour is weak since 2014 in your Youtube days. I would have found a new sport by now.
 
NoleFam said:
Well the fact that a pandemic caused Wimbledon to be canceled for the 1st time since WWII will always be brought up, but no one is really complaining. Why would they when he still broke the Slam record? You've been saying the tour is weak since 2014 in your Youtube days. I would have found a new sport by now.
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Wow, I didn't know you've been following me so seriously for years. :unsure:
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Surely I can't be the only one who's always found the spats between @NoleFam and SR thoroughly entertaining haha. :D(y)
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His eyes light up when he sees me in a thread so he can pick another fight. :laughing:

jack-nicholson.gif
 
Djokovic2011 said:
NoleFam's a great guy and I think TTW is all the better with him being here. :) And yes, I'd be saying the same thing even if he wasn't a fellow Djokovic fan.
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He is good in the sense that at the beginning his claims look funny. But when you repeat the same BS for the 10000000'th time... It becomes boring at some point.
 
NoleFam said:
Like repeating the Djokovic Open 10000000 times? That was a real whopper. Lol.
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That's not writing BS, that's writing the name of the tournament. When you mention something, doesn't it make sense to call by its name? :unsure:

If you invent some non existent name, people will get confused.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
This was the very first thing I thought of too lol. How many times over the next few weeks will we be hearing about DO do you think?! :laughing:
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When I mention a tournament, I have to use its name, otherwise how will you know what tournament I'm talking about? Can't believe I have to explain this simple thing to two adults.
 
StrongRule said:
That's not writing BS, that's writing the name of the tournament. When you mention something, doesn't it make sense to call by its name? :unsure:

If you invent some non existent name, people will get confused.
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Your RG trolling has been hilarious. I will give you that at least.
Djokovic2011 said:
This was the very first thing I thought of too lol. How many times over the next few weeks will we be hearing about DO do you think?! :laughing:
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Oh it's coming and many times. It's still too early for the 2025 campaign.
 
NoleFam said:
Well the fact that a pandemic caused Wimbledon to be canceled for the 1st time since WWII will always be brought up, but no one is really complaining. Why would they when he still broke the Slam record? You've been saying the tour is weak since 2014 in your Youtube days. I would have found a new sport by now.
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Do you have GoatNo1 on your ignore list?
 
hoodjem said:
Djokovic and Nadal met four times on grass. Nadal won the first two meetings. Their first match on grass was in the 2007 Wimbledon semis, Djokovich won the first set but retired in the third set down 4-1. Their second meeting was at 2008 Queen’s Club final, two straight sets for Nadal. Djokovic won the latter two matches: in four sets in the 2011 Wimbledon final, and five sets in the 2018 Wimbledon semis. So, against Nadal on grass Djokovic won seven sets in four matches.

Djokovic and Federer met four times on grass, also. Fed won their first match in the 2012 Wimbledon semis in four sets. Djoker won the last three meetings. All three of these were Wimbledon finals: two were five setters, one was a four setter. So, against Federer on grass Djokovic won ten sets in four matches.
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Here’s my entire post. I don’t have a side.
nolefam_2024 said:
Ok entire ttw community is idiot only your side is correct.

Including but not limited to , one of the matches is bo3.
One of the match was ended abruptly due to retirement.

7 sets in four matches.
10 sets in four matches which were exactly similar. No difference.
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I believe you leapt to a conclusion that I did not offer.

I just put the information out there.
Interpret it as you wish.
 
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