Who will end up with a better career: Lleyton Hewitt or Dominic Thiem?

[Winners or Errors]

Thiem will win the numbers battle. Look at the era Hewitt had to play in after his rise to #1. Look at the era during which Thiem is likely to rise to #1. Barring the younger generation showing up, and I am hopeful but not counting my chickens, Thiem could be at the top by default in the race to the bottom.

 

[Jonesy]

Probably Thiem, but will have to see if Sinner doesn't start to peak sooner than he should.

 

[The Blond Blur]

I like Timmy, but his performance in his USO F should automatically disqualify him from winning more schlems. A 20 year old Rusty PISTOL WHIPPED PETE ROFLMAO

 

[tsurismo5]

I feel like they will both end up with similar careers. Hewitt was pretty much the in-between transitional number one between the Sampras/Agassi era and the Federer/Nadal era, I can definitely see something similar with Thiem being number 1 for one or two seasons in between the big 3 and the next gen.

Age-wise, they had very opposite stories. Virtually all of Hewitt's best accolades came by the time he was 21, an age where Thiem wasn't even a full timer on the ATP Tour yet. On the flip side, Thiem has only gotten better with more experience and will likely continue doing so going forward, while Hewitt at Thiem's current age had already been considered a washed-up player for quite some time.

Thiem certainly has more weapons than Hewitt did - stronger serve, forehand, backhand, and seems like a better athlete overall - but the Aussie did have that unwavering determination that made up for his lack of "natural talent." I think Hewitt's 2 slams, 2 WTFs, 2 YEN1s, 2 Masters, 30 titles, and 70% win rate is certainly an attainable amount for Thiem and then some when it's all said and done, but I guess we'll see in the future.

Can’t believe he only won 2 masters. 2002 and 2003 Indian wells. Those have to be two of the least talked about masters tournaments.

 

[mike danny]

Let Thiem surpass Roddick first before we talk about him surpassing Hewitt.

 

[mental midget]

I feel like they will both end up with similar careers. Hewitt was pretty much the in-between transitional number one between the Sampras/Agassi era and the Federer/Nadal era, I can definitely see something similar with Thiem being number 1 for one or two seasons in between the big 3 and the next gen.

Age-wise, they had very opposite stories. Virtually all of Hewitt's best accolades came by the time he was 21, an age where Thiem wasn't even a full timer on the ATP Tour yet. On the flip side, Thiem has only gotten better with more experience and will likely continue doing so going forward, while Hewitt at Thiem's current age had already been considered a washed-up player for quite some time.

Thiem certainly has more weapons than Hewitt did - stronger serve, forehand, backhand, and seems like a better athlete overall - but the Aussie did have that unwavering determination that made up for his lack of "natural talent." I think Hewitt's 2 slams, 2 WTFs, 2 YEN1s, 2 Masters, 30 titles, and 70% win rate is certainly an attainable amount for Thiem and then some when it's all said and done, but I guess we'll see in the future.

small point here but i wouldn't mistake a lack of huge weapons for a lack of 'natural talent'--hewitt played a certain style but could do anything on court, vastly under-appreciated net game/hands, obviously had exceptional timing and feel for passing/returns/lobs...a very talented if not physically imposing player.

 

[Poisoned Slice]

I feel confident enough that Thiem can win more after finally winning one.


@Stannis Baratheon

 

[NatF]

small point here but i wouldn't mistake a lack of huge weapons for a lack of 'natural talent'--hewitt played a certain style but could do anything on court, vastly under-appreciated net game/hands, obviously had exceptional timing and feel for passing/returns/lobs...a very talented if not physically imposing player.

Don't even know if Thiem wins more service games than Hewitt peak for peak anywhere but clay tbh. Thiem's serve and return are bang average.

 

[travlerajm]

small point here but i wouldn't mistake a lack of huge weapons for a lack of 'natural talent'--hewitt played a certain style but could do anything on court, vastly under-appreciated net game/hands, obviously had exceptional timing and feel for passing/returns/lobs...a very talented if not physically imposing player.

Youngest to ever win W doubles, age 19. End thread\

 

[Poisoned Slice]

I know Thiem is the Dominator, but I'm pretty sure I would have picked Hewitt to be the dominant male after he won Wimbledon. Didn't quite work out that way, did it, Jimmy?

''Not quite.''

I'll have to go with Thiem just because he has the time.

 

[erosblue]

Lleyton by a mile,no contest.Thiem has to finish two years as number 1,win two(real) slams,and learn to play when things are not working

 

[The Guru]

Let Thiem surpass Roddick first before we talk about him surpassing Hewitt.

You see that big of a gap between the two? I'm a Hewitt fan and I have to say I think Red Rick may have convinced me Roddick had the better career. I guess you can give him some bonus points for getting screwed over by the changes to tennis (I think he's far more successful without them) but as it is Roddick has a big edge in longevity and consistency to make up for the slam, YE 1, and WTFs.

 

[mike danny]

You see that big of a gap between the two? I'm a Hewitt fan and I have to say I think Red Rick may have convinced me Roddick had the better career. I guess you can give him some bonus points for getting screwed over by the changes to tennis (I think he's far more successful without them) but as it is Roddick has a big edge in longevity and consistency to make up for the slam, YE 1, and WTFs.

The Wimb 2009 title would have swung things in Roddick's favor, IMO, but as of now, gotta give the slight edge to Hewitt.

 

[Deleted member 758560]

You see that big of a gap between the two? I'm a Hewitt fan and I have to say I think Red Rick may have convinced me Roddick had the better career.

better career or better player?..if the former then it's deffo going to roddick

 

[BackhandDTL]

better career or better player?..if the former then it's deffo going to roddick

hewitt had no real weapons but atleast he had a brain and was mentally tough.

Roddick was just slap the serve and pray for the ace.

Im taking Hewitt. Roddick higher peak but that’s it

 

[El_Yotamo]

I feel confident enough that Thiem can win more after finally winning one.


@Stannis Baratheon

 

[Poisoned Slice]

The Juddernaut is taking things to a new level. He's looking scary. I know Ronnie wasn't on his game last week but I've rarely seen him take such a hiding. Having to steal a frame just to win one. I thought the Selby beating the week before was bad but Trump surpassed it.

 

[mike danny]

The Juddernaut is taking things to a new level. He's looking scary. I know Ronnie wasn't on his game last week but I've rarely seen him take such a hiding. Having to steal a frame just to win one. I thought the Selby beating the week before was bad but Trump surpassed it.

Since Ronnie lost the Crucible 2014 final, he hasn't been the same.

 

[Poisoned Slice]

Since Ronnie lost the Crucible 2014 final, he hasn't been the same.

Winning the world title this year was alright, no? Those final three frames against Selby was absolute peak Ronnie. The frame before we had the pundits and commentators all thinking Ronnie has chucked the towel in. About 1 hour later, Selby is accusing Ronnie of not hitting authentic snooker shots. Salty.

To be fair, Selby did show some of his jester side last week when he beat Ronnie. Doing his own little cue action speech.

 

[mike danny]

Winning the world title this year was alright, no? Those final three frames against Selby was absolute peak Ronnie. The frame before we had the pundits and commentators all thinking Ronnie has chucked the towel in. About 1 hour later, Selby is accusing Ronnie of not hitting authentic snooker shots. Salty.

To be fair, Selby did show some of his jester side last week when he beat Ronnie. Doing his own little cue action speech.

Selby has been a pain in the ass for old Ronnie, kinda like Djokovic for old Fed.

 

[mike danny]

Winning the world title this year was alright, no? Those final three frames against Selby was absolute peak Ronnie. The frame before we had the pundits and commentators all thinking Ronnie has chucked the towel in. About 1 hour later, Selby is accusing Ronnie of not hitting authentic snooker shots. Salty.

To be fair, Selby did show some of his jester side last week when he beat Ronnie. Doing his own little cue action speech.

Well, it took Ronnie 7 years, but he finally won Crucible again. Would be kinda cool if he managed to equal Hendry, but at this point passing him isn't happening.

 

[Poisoned Slice]

Selby has been a pain in the ass for old Ronnie, kinda like Djokovic for old Fed.

That's what made it so great. Being 0-2 h2h at world championship and having to win three frames in a row. I definitely thought he was done. But yeah, he had not really looked good at any world championship since the 2014 loss. Ronnie got it done for us in these demanding times.

 

[mike danny]

That's what made it so great. Being 0-2 h2h at world championship and having to win three frames in a row. I definitely thought he was done. But yeah, he had not really looked good at any world championship since the 2014 loss. Ronnie got it done for us in these demanding times.

This makes me hate the 2019 Wimb final even more. Damn Fed and his stupid chocking just when glory was knocking on the door.

 

[Linelicker]

Are you sure Thiem is still a thing after 2024?

Haha. Who knows with Rafa, really? Seems like no one loves tennis more than him and Roger. I honestly think they play for the love of tennis a lot more than the records. Only Djokovic has been very vocal about records. I think he feels he has more to prove than Rafa and Roger, which is probably true, at least in the public eye. His tennis achievements are phenomenal, of course.

 

[Linelicker]

This makes me hate the 2019 Wimb final even more. Damn Fed and his stupid chocking just when glory was knocking on the door.

I thought that would be a very deserved title. He was the better player up to that point.

 

[OldschoolKIaus]

I'm glad to remember prime and peak Hewitt. Awesome.

Thiem lol USO was hiliarious. ABZ crapped his pants.

 

[aldeayeah]

Thiem is on time's side

or was that the other way around

 

[Red Rick]

You see that big of a gap between the two? I'm a Hewitt fan and I have to say I think Red Rick may have convinced me Roddick had the better career. I guess you can give him some bonus points for getting screwed over by the changes to tennis (I think he's far more successful without them) but as it is Roddick has a big edge in longevity and consistency to make up for the slam, YE 1, and WTFs.

This is confusing me as I was thinking about this earlier this week and thought I'd probably just have to give it to Hewitt in temrs of career accomplishments.

 

[mike danny]

I thought that would be a very deserved title. He was the better player up to that point.

Well, his final glory moment is over. We'll just have to watch him struggle to win some smaller titles while GS glory is truly over.

 

[beard]

Hewitt is 0/8 against Federer at slams, so he is obviously extraordinary player, though competition, almost ATG...

Thiem? Just some Austrian choker...

 

[Phoenix1983]

There is nothing embarassing about ignoring Hewitt's career, it's not like we are talking about an all-time great.

If you're a true tennis fan, you'll know about many players' careers, irrespective of whether they're ATGs.

 

[The Guru]

This is confusing me as I was thinking about this earlier this week and thought I'd probably just have to give it to Hewitt in temrs of career accomplishments.

There was a thread a while back ranking all the under 5 slam guys and I remember you arguing for Roddick over Courier and Hewitt and being pretty convincing. Hewitt definitely has better accomplishments that's not particularly close.

 

[clout]

Also, I'm not saying Thiem is greater than Hewitt right now, but when it's all said and done. I don't think Hewitt's career stats are that difficult to match for Thiem if he can convert better in finals.

 

[AnOctorokForDinner]

There was a thread a while back ranking all the under 5 slam guys and I remember you arguing for Roddick over Courier and Hewitt and being pretty convincing. Hewitt definitely has better accomplishments that's not particularly close.

Roddick over Courier, ahahahaha.

 

[DSH]

Thiem has a long way to go to surpass the Australian's achievements but if he maintains that level over the next three years, his chances of doing so would increase considerably.

 

[GuyForget]

Thiem + it isn't even close, Hewitt had no weapons + no talent, just a grinder

 

[tonylg]

Thiem + it isn't even close, Hewitt had no weapons + no talent, just a grinder

One played the game on or just inside the baseline and was very adept at net. The other plays 10' behind the baseline.

 

[The Guru]

Roddick over Courier, ahahahaha.

I just remember him arguing that and being convincing. I won't make a call either way because I've watched like one Courier match in my life.

 

[NatF]

I just remember him arguing that and being convincing. I won't make a call either way because I've watched like one Courier match in my life.

Four slams to one though...

 

[AnOctorokForDinner]

Four slams to one though...

Yeah losing to Federer doesn't give you free hypothetical slams lol. Courier was clearly the better player in 3/4 basic facets: return, FH, BH; only serve goes to Roddick. Courier leads in movement as well. As for net game and extras, neither was known for that. Roddick isn't a mug but Courier is next level easily, demeaning his peak like that is pretty bad.

 

[zagor]

Four slams to one though...

Not just that, Courier is better when counting peak for peak than Roddick. Some of his FO runs are amazing. That he even made a Wimbledon final (and gave Pete a solid match) in an era when Wimbledon wasn't tailor made for CC specialists on top of all of his other feats is impressive.

For me, apart from the big 3 Courier is a clear cut above anyone in this era (yes, including ATG Murry). His biggest blemish is short peak but personally, I was always more impressed by peak play than in consistency of being a punching bag/ELO ratings.

 

[Patogen]

Hewitt is more talented, unlucky with injuries.

I'm not that sure Hewitt was inherently more talented. He had exactly two strengths -- legs and head.

He was fast and he could slide towards the ball even on hard courts. He was precocious. He had the focus and maturity to fight for every fifteen very few teenage/early twenties players possess. He hit the ground running with a winner mentality. Plenty of grit, plenty of resilience.

The rest of his repertoire couldn't really be considered weapons. Yes, he had good passing shots, yes, he had a good lob, yes, he had some finesse, but it's not like he was indescribably otherworldly, and the new string technology+slower courts rendered these qualities nearly useless once most top cats dropped the S&V nonsense. He was very, very limited, and that's why he got pushed from the baseline. As limited as he was, he tried to turn the tides via bulking up, which meant gaining weight, getting slower, becoming more prone to injuries.

Once he lost his legs, he was done as a major winner/contender.

I have never seen him display a tennis as impressive as I have seen Thiem. On the other hand, I saw him get squashed like a bug and completely annihilated. As in the 04 US Open finals.

I was a fan too, but by now, one should see how limited Lleyton was.

 

[AnOctorokForDinner]

I'm not that sure Hewitt was inherently more talented. He had exactly two strengths -- legs and head.

He was fast and he could slide towards the ball even on hard courts. He was precocious. He had the focus and maturity to fight for every fifteen very few teenage/early twenties players possess. He hit the ground running with a winner mentality. Plenty of grit, plenty of resilience.

The rest of his repertoire couldn't really be considered weapons. Yes, he had good passing shots, yes, he had a good lob, yes, he had some finesse, but it's not like he was indescribably otherworldly, and the new string technology+slower courts rendered these qualities nearly useless once most top cats dropped the S&V nonsense. He was very, very limited, and that's why he got pushed from the baseline. As limited as he was, he tried to turn the tides via bulking up, which meant gaining weight, getting slower, becoming more prone to injuries.

Once he lost his legs, he was done as a major winner/contender.

I have never seen him display a tennis as impressive as I have seen Thiem. On the other hand, I saw him get squashed like a bug and completely annihilated. As in the 04 US Open finals.

I was a fan too, but by now, one should see how limited Lleyton was.

Looking at this description you'd think Hewitt was Ferrer. Underrating his ball placing qualities, you are. Yes his lack of power hitting held him back in the new era even if he remained healthy for longer, but Thiem for all his power is much easier to force errors from, not being a great ballstriker himself. Can't see him outdoing prime Hewitt on hardcourts overall.

 

[Patogen]

Looking at this description you'd think Hewitt was Ferrer.

And your thinking would be spot on. He was Ferrer with slightly more finesse.

Not a coincidence that once Federer stopped approaching the net and began trading them from the baseline, he toyed with Hewitt just like he did with Ferrer.

Ball placing qualities went out of the window once Lleyton began getting pushed. Watch his AO04 match against Federer. He was able to strike a winner only until Roger let all the hell loose. Once Roger let go and really began hitting and placing it, Hewitt was merely hitting back to survive. Just like David.

 

[AnOctorokForDinner]

And your thinking would be spot on. He was Ferrer with slightly more finesse.

Not a coincidence that once Federer stopped approaching the net and began trading them from the baseline, he toyed with Hewitt just like he did with Ferrer.

Ball placing qualities went out of the window once Lleyton began getting pushed. Watch his AO04 match against Federer. He was able to strike a winner only until Roger let all the hell loose. Once Roger let go and really began hitting and placing it, Hewitt was merely hitting back to survive. Just like David.

Peak Ferrer could barely take a set off Big 3, let alone a match. Hewitt regularly took sets off prime Federer though he couldn't beat him. Even post-surgery/loss of speed Hewitt took sets off prime Djokovic as late as 2012 while Ferrer was busy losing to Fedalovic in straights all year, taking just one set off Djokovic in abnormal hurricane conditions which Noel hates.

Federer essentially plsced the ball as well as Hewitt with considerably greater power. Thiem is capable of such power but needs time to set it up and places the ball considerably worse, so Hewitt can expose this strongly off clay.

 

[mike danny]

And your thinking would be spot on. He was Ferrer with slightly more finesse.

Not a coincidence that once Federer stopped approaching the net and began trading them from the baseline, he toyed with Hewitt just like he did with Ferrer.

Ball placing qualities went out of the window once Lleyton began getting pushed. Watch his AO04 match against Federer. He was able to strike a winner only until Roger let all the hell loose. Once Roger let go and really began hitting and placing it, Hewitt was merely hitting back to survive. Just like David.

Hewitt being Ferrer is an ultimate joke.

Played Djokovic tougher in 2012 than Ferrer.

Actually beat Federer.

Achieved things that Ferrer would never achieve in any era.

 

[abmk]

And your thinking would be spot on. He was Ferrer with slightly more finesse.

Not a coincidence that once Federer stopped approaching the net and began trading them from the baseline, he toyed with Hewitt just like he did with Ferrer.

Ball placing qualities went out of the window once Lleyton began getting pushed. Watch his AO04 match against Federer. He was able to strike a winner only until Roger let all the hell loose. Once Roger let go and really began hitting and placing it, Hewitt was merely hitting back to survive. Just like David.

Hewitt > Thiem outside of clay. Period.
Hewitt >> Ferrer and its not even close.

I've seen AO 04 match vs Federer. You are not the only one.
The first 2 sets were hard fought and they split them (Hewitt taking the first and Federer the 2nd). Only 3rd set was bad from Hewitt. 4th set, it took one out of the world game from Federer to break Hewitt. Hewitt was fighting till the end.

Also watched Djokovic crush Ferrer in AO 13. Handled him in straights in AO 08 (including bagel) and in AO 12. Past his prime Hewitt took a set of Djokovic at the same AO - Ao 12.

Ferrer has a grand total of ZERO wins vs federer in 17 matches. Hewitt has many.

I was a fan too, but by now, one should see how limited Lleyton was.

propagandist with pathetic lie. Have some goddamn shame.
Also people aren't as stupid as you think.

 

[RS]

Overall yeah. Atleast he was a legitimate threat from 2012-13 before injury against prime Djokovic

Touche.

 

[Nadalgaenger]

Thiem

I hate it too.

What do you have against him?

 

[Nadalgaenger]

compare their ages when they first won their first slam

So I guess Fed not as good as dozens of others...