Nole Slam
Legend
That's good. I didn't want to vote so that vote can count as mine.I voted for Djoke!
Who's greater: Nole or Rafa?
- Thread starter Phoenix1983
- Start date
InsideOut900
Hall of Fame
It's not really about dismissing clay. But the H2H is unbalanced, so it's not an accurate enough measure to be taken into account.
It is the sole metric that counts particular instances over showing the full picture.
Or if you want the short version, 2 matches at AO and 8 matches at RG.
Phoenix1983
G.O.A.T.
Why not?
Nole Slam
Legend
If I vote for Djokovic, it's probably just bias. Half of the votes for Nadal or Djokovic came by their fans who didn't even want to think about this matter.
I could just vote equal.
Phoenix1983
G.O.A.T.
I see, yes we can note most of the obvious fanboys of the two players voting for their fave. (Lew a notable exception)
Hitman
G.O.A.T.
The way I see it, Rafa needs to win this coming RG, which I do believe he will win and quite convincingly, however, should the unthinkable happen and he doesn't win, then Djokovic is taking over and he will be taking over quickly.
alexio
Hall of Fame
he wanted to say raja.. but made a little mistake (those letters are bery close to each other on the keyboard, it's a common thing while typing pretty fast)Raga...
GabeT
Legend
I see them as roughly equal. Both have incredible achievements the other doesn’t. Nadal has a better record in clay and Novak in HC and grass which places Novak ahead in 2 of 3 surfaces and in a surface that represents 70% of the tour. But Nadal’s record in clay and the FO are something beyond anything Novak has accomplished.
ADuck
Hall of Fame
If you're a better player, you have a better capability of winning slams. So as it stands, Nadal is greater AND better player overall even when 70% of the tour is comprised of Novak's favorite surface. People think that argument should be a detriment to Nadal but actually it's a detriment to Novak. If Novak equals Nadal in slams then I will concede he is better as his achievements outside slams push him above.
only the best player is the no1! and nole has been no1 for 2 whole years longer than rafa. it is 50% longer than rafa has been. he has only 10% less slams and also lost the chance to take wimbl last year as a big favorite.
that and:
6 ye#1
2 golden masters
nole slam
atp best season, 2015
atp best year, w2015-rg2016
atp points record, 16950
h2h
ADuck
Hall of Fame
no.1 shows the best player over the past 52 weeks, it doesn't show who the best player is over an entire career.
but it clearly shows that rafa has been the best player for 4 years while nole has been the best for 6 years, during their respective careers. that is a significant margin.
the fact is that no one has been the best in the world longer than nole and that 5 other players have been the best in the world longer than rafa! and the 2 are basically the same generation!
ADuck
Hall of Fame
But Rafa is doing significantly better than Novak in years where they are not ranked no.1 by an even greater margin
ye#1: 6 vs 5 (20% more)
weeks: 320+ vs 209 (50+% more)
slams: 18 vs 20 (10% less)
WTF + OG: 5 vs 1 (400% more)
masters: 36 vs 35
masters: 9/9 x2 vs 7(6)/9
all 4 slams at the same time: 1 vs 0
h2h: 29 vs 27
ADuck
Hall of Fame
Aim of tennis is to win tournaments and Nadal has won more important ones, for me 2 slams + OG > 5WTF and 1 master
Aim of every sport is to be the best, and the best in tennis is no1 player!
ADuck
Hall of Fame
The best in specific events in which you win, yes.
Interesting comparison article from the BBC comparing the tennis GOATS. See: GOAT: Novak Djokovic closes Grand Slam gap on Rafael Nadal and Roger Federer - BBC Sport
Rafa is still greater, more slams and more titles won. The 4th US Open finally eliminated any argument that he's only great on clay. Although it's not quantiviable, Rafa also made a greater impact in terms of changing the game and perception of what a tennis player could be. His iconic rivalry with Fed still remains the most sacred entity within tennis for many fans, reaching out to non tennis fans as well.
Novak has the statistical greatness, but will he really be remembered or revered as fondly as Rafa or Fed when they all retire? I say no in this regard.
Of course he'll have to stay ahead of Novak in the slam race which is why this year's FO is his most crucial yet. If he can just keep pace with Novak for another two years then that should be good enough. Another win at Wimbledon and Australian would solidify his GOAT status but he must stay ahead of Novak.
Rafa must win at least the French this year, That is his most crucial priority.
Novak has the statistical greatness, but will he really be remembered or revered as fondly as Rafa or Fed when they all retire? I say no in this regard.
Of course he'll have to stay ahead of Novak in the slam race which is why this year's FO is his most crucial yet. If he can just keep pace with Novak for another two years then that should be good enough. Another win at Wimbledon and Australian would solidify his GOAT status but he must stay ahead of Novak.
Rafa must win at least the French this year, That is his most crucial priority.
Exactly when all is said and done, Rafa will be more revered that Djokovic will ever be, no matter how may slams he wins by.
