Why can't people like both Federer and Nadal?
- Thread starter tenniswriter
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F L O B B E R
Rookie
I'm a tennis fan 1st, and honestly like all of the "Big 4"... I tend to root for Federer in the head to head matches because he's a God amongst men for how long he has been able to play at such a high level and we are witnessing history every time he steps on the court.
Nadal's speed and focus impress the hell out of me. Seems like a genuinely good guy off the court.
Djokovic's all around game, service return, and 2HBH - off the court he also seems very likeable.
Murray - cuz damn the Brits need to get that Slam!
Nadal's speed and focus impress the hell out of me. Seems like a genuinely good guy off the court.
Djokovic's all around game, service return, and 2HBH - off the court he also seems very likeable.
Murray - cuz damn the Brits need to get that Slam!
Flash O'Groove
Hall of Fame
It's simply "yeah for my team".
When I first came to this site, I was tired of Fed and had no issue with Nadal. I was more of a Sampras guy (showing my age).
After seeing that many of Nadal's fanboys are snot nosed teens and preteens who excel at being disrespectful on anonymous internet web pages, I learned to appreciate Federer much more. I'm not sure how many actual snot nosed kids make all these pro Nadal anti-Fed posts (it could be one snot nosed basement dwelling loser for all we know), but it only took a few months for me to translate that into wanting Nadal to lose.
I know there are Fed fans who do the same thing, but the sheer shrill punk nature of the average Nadal fan is unprecedented..although some of the Djoker guys crawling out from under rocks are trying hard to catch up.
Nadal has become as easy to hate as Justin Bieber..not because he's a bad guy, but because his fans are so annoying.
That is well said. It is all the same for me. It has nothing to do whith Nadal winning so often in big matches and in preventing Fed to win the calendar Slam because, while I would have loved to see him win it, I didn't really minded when he Nadal prevented him to do so. It's only now after having readen so many threads from his fanboys that I just don't want him to win anything, if only to shut their mouth.
CDestroyer
Professional
Because Fed is like an Aston Martin. Stylish, classy, powerful, a smart machine.
Nadal is like a cheesy souped up Mustang, cheap, rough around the edges, fast but archaic design, unreliable.
Nadal is like a cheesy souped up Mustang, cheap, rough around the edges, fast but archaic design, unreliable.
Is Spanish your first language? The words education/educación are what is termed "false friends" in linguistics. That's why it's a bit misleading.
What you call his lack of education, I'd call insecurity. He does some inappropriate things when under pressure.
ViscaB
Hall of Fame
Like the man in your avatar... The irony is not lost on me.
augustobt
Legend
Portuguese, another latin-based language.
----
Guga a defensive pusher? What?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr0FCRA1AFI
ViscaB
Hall of Fame
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ViscaB
Hall of Fame
I just wanted to point out your double standards. I guess Kuerten is a fellow countryman.
augustobt
Legend
Sentinel
Bionic Poster
Now that we've bashed each other with the same arguments we've exhausted over gazillion threads, shall we move on the GOAT discussion. That;s highly overdue and it would be scandalous if we allowed a thread to reach 10 pages without getting into who is the real GOAT/h2h/OG/slam count etc
I really want the definitive answer to who the Greatest of all time tennis player is.
I really want the definitive answer to who the Greatest of all time tennis player is.
Wilander Fan
Hall of Fame
True but without Nadal, Fed probably retires in 2008-09 after getting married and after the 15th slam. Nadal has been the one pushing Fed on.
I really respect Rafa's game and will to compete, but I dont care for his personality. His gamesmanship, complaining, injury excuses, butt picking, and taking forever between points/serves really bugs me. I also think it has been harder for me to get behind him because I dont speak Spanish and I can barely understand what he is saying half the time.
I also think his uncle has tainted my perception of him. It seems like his uncle controls him to the point where he cant really express himself as an individual. His uncle also makes excuses to the press which I think is not his place.
I also think his uncle has tainted my perception of him. It seems like his uncle controls him to the point where he cant really express himself as an individual. His uncle also makes excuses to the press which I think is not his place.
OriginalHockeytowner
Rookie
I respect both as human beings equally, but I like Federer's game a lot more.
augustobt
Legend
That's a point that I strongly agree.
RogerRacket111
Semi-Pro
I do like both of them. But when they play against each other I have to take sides and I will take Roger. And If I had a choice I will Roger over Nadal because of the style of their games.
The-Champ
Legend
I hate Nadal because he prevented my idol fed from getting the calendar slam 3 times. I hate Nadal because he is the only player that has beaten my idol fed in a wimbledon final. I hate Nadal because he is 8-2 against my idol Fed in major matches. If fed had a H2H of 28-0 against Nadal, I wouldn't care about his fist pumping and time wasting. He would be then become my idol Fed's pigeon, not worthy to talk about. I love Rosol, Söderling and Djokovic 2011, but not the Djokovic of 2012 clay season.
LOL. Perfect.
I thought it was unanimously agreed upon that Hrbaty was the GOAT?
Same here. I like both of them. Roger for the elegance, craft and pure tennis skills that he brings. Nadal for the grit, the mental tenacity, temperament and sheer will to succeed. Its just that I love and adore Nadal a lot more, because of the sheer amazing things he can do on a tennis court that I will never be able to do. I can at least try to play like Federer, but there is no way I can even attempt shots that Nadal can hit.
Big_Dangerous
Talk Tennis Guru
I don't understand why there's so much speculation about Nadal juicing. It's not like he hits 140 mph serves, or 120 mph ground strokes. He just hits with a freakish amount of topsin, but that doesn't really require steroids, just a very spin friendly racket and a crazy forehand technique...
- game heavily based on athleticism/stamina
- regular breaks from competition for injury treatment
- links to fuentes, who is a doping doctor
- spanish government cover-up of operation puerto, expected 2 expose top spanish athletes from outside cycling
doping not just bout power. in fact, most doping more about stamina. look at skinny-ass dopers in cycling like rasmussen
I find this hard to believe. Roger has said (according to his website) that he enjoys learning languages. I would think he can at least understand what Rafa says.
beernutz
Hall of Fame
NEEDS MORE LOVE!
Wolfman Jack
Banned
That's pretty much it, brilliantly put.
The fact that all these Fedtrolls have come out of the woodwork and started resurrecting threads is because they were terrified of Nadal, and now that he seems to be down they thought it was a good opportunity to come out of their caves deep in the forest and start swinging their pathetic bats to the sky while grinning in ecstasy.
This ain't over.
TennisBatman
Semi-Pro
Great thread...
Not only is the Federer-Nadal rivalry one of the greatest in history, but it has also developed into one of the greatest friendships in history!!
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/SPORT/tennis/01/13/federer.nadal.rivalry.annacone/index.html
Not only is the Federer-Nadal rivalry one of the greatest in history, but it has also developed into one of the greatest friendships in history!!
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/SPORT/tennis/01/13/federer.nadal.rivalry.annacone/index.html
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Clarky21
Banned
That's pretty much it, brilliantly put.
The fact that all these Fedtrolls have come out of the woodwork and started resurrecting threads is because they were terrified of Nadal, and now that he seems to be down they thought it was a good opportunity to come out of their caves deep in the forest and start swinging their pathetic bats to the sky while grinning in ecstasy.
This ain't over.
This is true. Look at all the *******s that disappeared while Fed was struggling that are now back spewing their hot liquidy bs again. They will once again disappear when the going gets rough for Fed. These people are like clockwork they are so predictable.
smoledman
G.O.A.T.
I think you underestimate their resiliency. Now that Fed has his 17th slam, there are no more "hard" times.
Wolfman Jack
Banned
No, Clarky is correct. It doesn't matter how many slams Fed has as long as it looks like Nadal is having a good run and has a shot at it. That's how pathetic those goons are. Fed's achievements to them would go down the toilet as soon as Nadal surpassed them. That's where the night terrors and the diapers come in for them. LOL
Raging Buddha
Semi-Pro
According to you, Godnovak et al the place was dominated by Fed fans even then, was it not? So it seems that most people here actually remained despite being Federer fans rather than the other way around.
Raging Buddha
Semi-Pro
Would you name some of these recent Fed trolls, in that case? There's only been maybe one or two that I can think of in recent times, and they are nothing compared to many past and current Djoko/Rafatards eg. NSK aka. brickner damage aka. 6-1 6-3 6-0, GodNovak, Nadalfan89, nadalwon2012 aka. NADALWON, etc.
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Wolfman Jack
Banned
Of course. Everybody knows most people here support Fed (or at least the people with the big mouths, me and a couple other good people being the exception.)
The point is that Fed fans went into self-deprecating, lamenting, end-of-the-world doomsday scenario "Nadal sadly will surpass 16 GS" mode. LOL.
Now you guys are in the "Look at me, biatch, my Grandpa just won another trophy" mode.
Wolfman Jack
Banned
You and I know that's just one person with multiple accounts. LMFAO.
Think about the mood of Fed fans in recent history. It makes anyone cry. Now you're all ecstatic. The fact is Nadal has a better shot now than he did 6 months ago. Why? Because Djoker was the main threat in the way of Nadal to accomplish the feat, and Djoker has shown he can't keep the pace which saw him take all those GS finals last year from Nadal.
DeShaun
Banned
Because both win so often, the other guy's fan base may continually be questioning its values. You can back the one horse or the other. They are essentially different animals, however, running the same race.
One is a stalker with great turn of foot on the final two furlongs, letting others do the work of breaking headwinds for most of the race, then he sneaks up and overtakes the leaders who've tired from so breaking--they were sheltering the cunning tag-along the whole time without even realizing it, and now they can't do anything about him, about his energy reserves which are greater than theirs for his having faced less resistance in getting to this point, and now he slips by them just before hitting the tape, "Thanks boys. M'preciate all your hard work suckers"
This is Rafa.
Contrasted with Roger who is. . .I'm not even going to get into it. One player plays cunningly, guards his words carefully, and uses psyching on court quite a bit more than the other. A dissimulating courtier.
The other player is a proud natural leader of men, he is not sneaky nor does he hide himself nor guard his words. He is straight forward in his playing style and unabashedly candid with his opinions. A sort of man others willingly follow into battle.
So, when on or the other guy wins, it's tempting to conclude his personality which informs his playing style and may speak to his character was responsible in part for that win when it probably was but only to a very small degree...so maybe we hate the character that wins when it was only his tennis that got the job done.
One is a stalker with great turn of foot on the final two furlongs, letting others do the work of breaking headwinds for most of the race, then he sneaks up and overtakes the leaders who've tired from so breaking--they were sheltering the cunning tag-along the whole time without even realizing it, and now they can't do anything about him, about his energy reserves which are greater than theirs for his having faced less resistance in getting to this point, and now he slips by them just before hitting the tape, "Thanks boys. M'preciate all your hard work suckers"
This is Rafa.
Contrasted with Roger who is. . .I'm not even going to get into it. One player plays cunningly, guards his words carefully, and uses psyching on court quite a bit more than the other. A dissimulating courtier.
The other player is a proud natural leader of men, he is not sneaky nor does he hide himself nor guard his words. He is straight forward in his playing style and unabashedly candid with his opinions. A sort of man others willingly follow into battle.
So, when on or the other guy wins, it's tempting to conclude his personality which informs his playing style and may speak to his character was responsible in part for that win when it probably was but only to a very small degree...so maybe we hate the character that wins when it was only his tennis that got the job done.
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Raging Buddha
Semi-Pro
Point taken. I can safely say I was never like that, though it seemed to me that most prominent people were, before the Fed/Djoko Wimbledon match, incredibly despondent about Fed's chances, saying stuff like "being lucky to take a set" etc. In that match in particular, I was always confident about Fed's chances of victory due to it being on grass and Fed not seeming to play at his best in RG/Rome, though others were apparently accentuating the negative impacts of those losses immensely. But all of that is simply lack of confidence, really. I would still believe that they are genuine Federer fans, merely having attained a pessimistic outlook from not having a slam for 2 1/2 years.
For the last bit, well, what do you expect? We (Federer fans as a whole) have had relatively little to brag about for a very long time, and so when we finally have received a GS, many members may grow exuberant. I, personally, believe that I have stayed relatively the same (probably because of my optimism regarding his chances previously), though the ability to now be able to finally say something back to any arguments of Fed not being in his prime etc that I and several others have endured for several years is incredibly satisfying.
Raging Buddha
Semi-Pro
Bit about the mood I talked about last post. And sure, I never stated that Nadal fans have nothing positive to take out of this tournament. As can be said of Djokovic fans, too.
Wolfman Jack
Banned
Bullcrap. You know nothing about analogies. Rafa is Seabiscuit:
"Seabiscuit (May 23, 1933 – May 17, 1947) was a champion Thoroughbred racehorse in the United States. A small horse, Seabiscuit had an inauspicious start to his racing career, but became an unlikely champion and a symbol of hope to many Americans during the Great Depression."
Fed is more like Secretariat.
When describing Fed you forgot to mention he is a crybaby, but can't fault you for it, as it doesn't suit the heroic tone you wanted to establish with your silly propaganda piece.
Wolfman Jack
Banned
Excellent post, very genuine and honest. If only most other Fed fans were like you I wouldn't even be here, as there would be no point for it.
And the fact that you remained loyal and optimistic shows that you are a true fan and not a friggin troll (they surround us.)
By the way, clarky is just doing it with Nadal for jinxing purposes.
Nadal is agnostic, Federer is Roman Catholic. Need I say more?
Wolfman Jack
Banned
Well, actually I agree with what you said except the Djokovic part. Djoker needs to shape up now. I think defending USO will be crucial to him. If Nadal takes it, it will be like going back 2 years. If Fed wins it, it will be Armageddon. God help us all if that happens.
TennisBatman
Semi-Pro
Great analogy!
DeShaun
Banned
Oh, it's you again. Not very persuasive, but I want to avoid ad homs because that would be engaging you on your preferred turf. Why don't you go read some Aeschines to soften up your language? You clearly have interesting opinions but you also excel at alienating audience segments. You might actually be able to convert others to your way of thinking, if you could begin to demonstrate being somewhat more reasonable.
My point stands: Rafa is cunning and guarded, Roger is straightforward and open.
P.S. Six foot tall with wide-set hips, thick legs, and the most bulging biceps on tour does not exactly scream "small," nor does being 16 years old while notching a clay tour victory over the reigning FO champ Costa consist with having an "inauspicious start." So, it would seem that your analogy should come in for examination.
***I'm getting tired of these people who argue like children.
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Raging Buddha
Semi-Pro
Bolded bit doesn't exactly help your case here...
But for why I do not particularly like Nadal, it is principally because of his playing style. I, personally, enjoy Federer's style of play. I enjoy seeing winners, I enjoy shotmaking, I enjoy how little physicality he seems to employ. Nadal, on the other hand, seems to me to be a grinder. He plays defensively instead of offensively and he seems to make tennis a grinding game, which is not what I envision tennis to be. Thus, I do not find his playing style enjoyable.
Additionally, though this is a much smaller factor, I see Nadal using gamesmanship quite often, in particular his abundant MTOs, his rampant running around before the start of a match and the time he takes before a point in order to slow the pace of a match down. Federer does not do any of these things, so essentially Deshaun's point is one which I would agree with. Obviously, though, that is still all a matter of perception. You as a Nadal fan probably would find faults with Federer's demeanour that I do not and do not mind the reasons for which I stated I dislike Nadal in return.
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Wolfman Jack
Banned
That's typical propaganda talk. "Cunning", "guarded", etc. You could have added "has shifty eyes and is potentially a Commie."
You are missing the analogy. The part about being "small" is not part of my analogy because it's not bolded.
As to the inauspicious start to his career, you don't see the similarities? Nadal was pronounced a one-trick clay pony by the world at large, and when he won Wimby, then they said he couldn't win on hard. Then, after AO, they said he would never win USO. That's my point, son. He was the underdog like Seabiscuit was, and like Seabiscuit he offered hope to many people tired of the dominating antics of Fed (Oh, how easy it is to be the GOAT when you are surrounded by mugs, and how sad it is when you are dethroned by a "pusher without talent.")
As for your "arguing like children" remark, I fail to see how I do so. My reasoning is based on sound logic, even if you don't agree with the way I have to express my thoughts.
You are biased just like I am, and I'm fine with it. Just don't ignore the truth and attempt to discredit Rafa with that cr@p.
Seabiscuit was "cunning and guarded" too by the way, as he liked to start slow and then beat his rivals on the last stages of the races. Thank you for adding to my excellent analogy.
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Wolfman Jack
Banned
Exactly. For example, I see Fed as lacking in courage and mental strength. The crying is simply the cherry on top. And it's not just the crying, it's the manner in which he cried. If you see Fed's video from AO 09 and then Murray's video from Wimby 12, you can clearly see Fed has a more desperate, puerile manner of crying, almost like a girl that can't believe she lost her Barbie. I am being honest, although I suppose I could tone down the way I'm expressing this.
I can see some of the reasons why you don't like Rafa have some merit, but the point is that they don't contribute squat to his success, whether you like it or not. Rafa's success is based on amazing physical ability, talent, and persistence. The same way Roger's bad habit of downplaying the ability of his rivals when he loses due to arrogance, Rafa has also negative personality traits. Neither of these two are Mother Theresa, but that's not the point.
Wolfman Jack
Banned
Good for you. I'm a fan of Fed's game too, but I support Nadal. I'm a Seabiscuit type of guy.
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