Why did Mcenroe not win another major after 1984?

aman92

aman92

Legend
Probably been discussed somewhere but what exactly led to Mcenroe's steep fall after having one of the all time great seasons in 1984 when he was just 25? Was it just lack of motivation or the emergence and evolution of more more powerful players during that era? He reached the Wimbledon semifinals in 1992 at the age of 33 so it wasn't as if he was not capable but the failure to win another major and reach only 1 more major final (in 1985) has always been baffling to me.
 
He just wasn't the same after 84, and especially after 85 when he took a hiatus. I do think the power had an impact but it was one of those strange cases where 2 independent things conspired against him almost simulatenously. Put 84 Mac against the power aand there is no way he is not winning multiple slams. He was the sharpest, most confident, most brazenly aggressive player in history. My guess would be he got complacent after 84; didn't realise you can be knocked out of the 'zone' quite easily. The likes of Lendl etc only required a bit of crumbling of God Mac to be able to take the whole idol down.
 
Among other reasons (Tatum, high life, motivation etc.), Mac had always a bit of a technical problem on his groundies. He laid back, when hitting groundies and never really made a forward movement with his upper body, when going into the groundstrokes. He also had not much of a backswing and a very loose grip on his forehand side. Both things were exposed with the hard hitting of the new rackets. Even before, Mac with his style had it easier with the topspin of Borg, than the longer, deeper, hard shots of Connors. Larry Stefanki wrote about this problem and tried to correct that in the late 80s, when he coached Mac for a wile.
 
I just remember it being SO abrupt. He dominates 1984 (even with losing the FO final), and he's in a Slam final as late as the 1985 USO - where the is promptly dominated by Lendl whom he dominated the year before. [Note: This was the first Slam final I remember watching on TV.] Even with the straight set loss to Lendl at the 1985 USO, I never imagined this was the last we'd see of Slam-winning McEnroe.

In the years after his hiatus and before his retirement, he made a few Slam runs, but nothing that really made you feel like he was REALLY in the mix. Looking at his results in all his post-1985 Slams is always interesting -- who he lost to and the score. He did make 3 Slam SF and 3 QF after his hiatus - and of course got defaulted at the 1990 AO against Pernfors. If he didn't he might have won and might have beat Noah in the QFs so he would have another chance to matchup with Lendl. Oh well.
 
I heard someone say that he injured something (hamstring maybe?) and didn’t rehab it right and lost a half step which with his game took him out of contention.
 
he actually had a pretty good year in '85..
but i think the last tournament he really looked like his old self was the january '85 masters where he beat lendl in the final..
after that maybe his game trickled down a bit until fast forward from '86 on he didnt even look like he wanted
to be playing anymore half the time
 
Whisper said:
Mac peaked in 1984 - unlucky to not win calendar slam and even had a shot at 100% year undefeated. I've never seen a player drop their level as dramatically as Mac did in just 1 year. I think drugs and Tatum were the culprit. A real shame as imo he's the most talented player of all time.
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This is likely the biggest culprit for the inexplicable drop off in his prime - off court drama and distractions. Also, the subsequent ill-advised hiatus during which younger and physically stronger players who took fitness more seriously than he did (Edberg, Wilander, Becker, and Lendl as well) passed him by and he was never able to recover. He probably arrogantly assumed he'd easily dominate his opponents as before upon his return, but when that didn't happen his massive ego took a beating and he lost the fire and passion, petulant brat that he was. He could and should have achieved so much more with his insane levels of natural talent.
 
I think McEnroe had some pretty severe turmoil at that stage of his life. He just couldn't weather that storm. Quite frankly, no matter how tempting it is, it is EXTREMELY tough to be married to an actor/actress as an athlete. I'm not sure I've ever seen one last. Then you add in the drugs and partying... it just goes south really fast. Actors/actresses don't need to really be focused for long periods of time... whereas elite athletes have to be supremely focused... extremely structured and routine. It has to be a marriage made in hell.

One spouse is in between movies and wants to party, go to dinners, go on long vacations, go to galas, go to industry events, go to fundraisers. The other spouse is on the road 75% of the year, has to train constantly, has to be very regimented, has to coordinate strict schedules... and can't be bothered with anything except the sport. I can't even imagine it.
 
Whisper said:
Mac peaked in 1984 - unlucky to not win calendar slam and even had a shot at 100% year undefeated. I've never seen a player drop their level as dramatically as Mac did in just 1 year. I think drugs and Tatum were the culprit. A real shame as imo he's the most talented player of all time.
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That's new.. I didn't know he was involved in drugs so much that it affected his game. Might also explain his steep drop and loss in motivation.
 
big ted said:
he actually had a pretty good year in '85..
but i think the last tournament he really looked like his old self was the january '85 masters where he beat lendl in the final..
after that maybe his game trickled down a bit until fast forward from '86 on he didnt even look like he wanted
to be playing anymore half the time
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That's very true...it's not as clear cut as it seems. He was the favorite to win USO in '85. Blame Wilander for exhausting Mac in the semis. Really, '86, is when he took that first break, no? I recall him losing to Gilbert at the Masters and then he went on a hiatus. Breaks did not seem to help him. He was never the same when he came back. I also clearly recall him doing a lot of strength training in the late 80's, purportedly to help avoid injury and maybe give him a bit more upper body strength. None of that seemed like a plus...at least to me the ordinary viewer. He did not seem as quick to me.
 
McEnroe's 1985 didn't seem all that much worse than his 1984 for large parts of the year. He dominated early in the year (just like 1984), regressed a bit on clay, losing to Lendl on clay in Forest Hills and Dusseldorf (McEnroe had beaten Lendl in both in 1984), beaten by Wilander in straight sets in the French Open semi finals, and then was unexpectedly blown away by Curren in the Wimbledon quarter finals. In the North American hardcourt summer, normal service seemed resumed as McEnroe won Stratton Mountain and the Canadian Open, beating Lendl in the final of both. A warning sign in the first round of the US Open as McEnroe narrowly avoided defeat to Glickstein. In the US Open final against Lendl, McEnroe led in the first set, had set points, yet lost the set in a tiebreak. Lendl then surged in the second and third sets, and the tennis world changed.

McEnroe made a big mistake when he took 6 months off in 1986, mostly because the game was changing, in terms of the power and fitness, and McEnroe didn't really adapt to that as well as he'd have liked. His 1989 was pretty good, but that was as good as it got.
 
there is the power issue that some mention mac had to deal with but i think it was more him than
anything else external like the game passing him by.. players like wilander, mecir, edberg werent
exactly power players either but they did ok. and connors was #4 in the world in 1987
so he adjusted.... plus from '86 on he was losing to players like
gilbert, annacone, mayotte, rostagno, masur, woodforde, you name it.. (in addition to the top guys)...
so i dont think everyone just got suddenly better lol
 
The power issue didn't completely take over until the early 1990s. It started transitioning in 1983 or so when very few players used wooden racquets anymore. McEnroe in 1982 was still using a wooden racquet, and by 1984 was dominating with a graphite racquet, so he made that change. The Curren and Becker situations at 1985 Wimbledon seemed a bit different, but it was only for that tournament for a while. The power seemed to increase more and more in the years after that. There was the Lendl fitness factor, also. The big servers like Sampras and Ivanisevic, and big forehand like Courier's, seemed to solidify the power game.
 
Whisper said:
It was soon after that - some of the pre Wimbledon matches especially. 1984 was such a buzz we expected his genius to dominate for a few more years. Couldn’t believe his drop off in 1985, prob suffered a kind of PTSD when I saw him lol
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The losses to Lendl on clay, perhaps? In Forest Hills and Dusseldorf, I mean.
 
Mustard said:
The losses to Lendl on clay, perhaps?
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I don’t know if you were watching tennis at the time or just going off the results you read about, but the drop off in form was shocking for people who were really into tennis. To give you an idea what McEnroe was capable of have a look at the 1992 AO match v defending AO champ Becker. While not his 1984 form he did wind the clock back a bit for that match and taught Boris a lesson 64 63 75. It was an incredibly high quality match from both guys and everyone expected Becker to win. Mac just shut him out with an amazing array of shot making, angles you never see etc. It’s a real shame the tennis world missed out on what Mac could have been from age 25 to 30 - same with Borg I guess.
 
So many things combined.

Loss of motivation for awhile. It was almost hard to keep up after his amazing 84.

His personal problems, including his turbulent marriage at the time.

The advancement of the game to more of a power game. Not that he was incapable of handling power or anything of course, but it created more of a challenge to what he had been facing before. Harder for a serve and volleyer to play against the increased power in serving and off the ground, and in returning and passing shots. It created a new challenge at the net, and on your opponents serve games.
 
Whisper said:
I don’t know if you were watching tennis at the time or just going off the results you read about, but the drop off in form was shocking for people who were really into tennis. To give you an idea what McEnroe was capable of have a look at the 1992 AO match v defending AO champ Becker. While not his 1984 form he did wind the clock back a bit for that match and taught Boris a lesson 64 63 75. It was an incredibly high quality match from both guys and everyone expected Becker to win. Mac just shut him out with an amazing array of shot making, angles you never see etc. It’s a real shame the tennis world missed out on what Mac could have been from age 25 to 30 - same with Borg I guess.
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That is true, but by 92 he had years to get used to the power of people like Becker, and even Becker's power had been surpassed by players like Sampras by then. In 85 it was still a totally new thing to face that kind of power.

And by 92 he was long past his horrible marriage to Tatum, and the pressure was now totally off as he wasn't expected to win anything anymore, so he could play free. While after not winning a major title in 85, he was constantly putting pressure on himself to re prove himself it seemed, and that along with all the other issues he was dealing with. It was a tough combination.

I really wish he could have won the first set of the 85 US Open final. I think that might have given him the confidence to win the match. Also Lendl despite winning the 84 French, did not really break off the shackles mentally until winning that 85 US Open, so McEnroe getting ahead would have had a good chance. And had he won that it might have put his confidence back in place, and he could have been a real contender for slams for a years, even with all the things he was dealing with, and some of the changes in the game ongoing.
 
big ted said:
there is the power issue that some mention mac had to deal with but i think it was more him than
anything else external like the game passing him by.. players like wilander, mecir, edberg werent
exactly power players either but they did ok. and connors was #4 in the world in 1987
so he adjusted.... plus from '86 on he was losing to players like
gilbert, annacone, mayotte, rostagno, masur, woodforde, you name it.. (in addition to the top guys)...
so i dont think everyone just got suddenly better lol
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It wasn't the game getting better but different. Different can be challenging even if it isn't neccessarily better. Everytime there is a process of changing to the core elements of the game it is a challenge. I agree with you though. McEnroe just became a lot more vurnerable to all sorts of players due to issues with his own life and motivation more than his game.
 
Whisper said:
I don’t know if you were watching tennis at the time or just going off the results you read about, but the drop off in form was shocking for people who were really into tennis. To give you an idea what McEnroe was capable of have a look at the 1992 AO match v defending AO champ Becker. While not his 1984 form he did wind the clock back a bit for that match and taught Boris a lesson 64 63 75. It was an incredibly high quality match from both guys and everyone expected Becker to win. Mac just shut him out with an amazing array of shot making, angles you never see etc. It’s a real shame the tennis world missed out on what Mac could have been from age 25 to 30 - same with Borg I guess.
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Yeah, but Mac in '85, up until the USO was pretty strong....2 losses to Lendl on clay? So what? Sure, he was not the 1984 vintage, but he was kicking a## pretty much everywhere else. Including Lendl on hard courts. I felt that when he came back from that long break he was way off form. The serve lost it's snap for sure. There were some glimmers in '89-'92, but a shadow of what he was at his peak.
 
martinezownsclay said:
I really wish he could have won the first set of the 85 US Open final. I think that might have given him the confidence to win the match. Also Lendl despite winning the 84 French, did not really break off the shackles mentally until winning that 85 US Open, so McEnroe getting ahead would have had a good chance. And had he won that it might have put his confidence back in place, and he could have been a real contender for slams for a years, even with all the things he was dealing with, and some of the changes in the game ongoing.
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Totally agree. The USO final was really the turning point for Lendl where he got on top of the world and parked himself there for an extended stay.
 
big ted said:
i think if he didnt meet tatum he definitely would have won more grand slams
she was a bad influence lol
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This happens to many athletes and it seems quite often to tennis players. Once they meet a new woman or get married their performances drop noticieably. It doesn't mean their wives are bad influences but some of them seem to get off focus very quickly. It happened to Becker when he met his first wife (he admittd he skipped tournaments and slams), it happened to Edberg and to Wilander soon after they got married and they all were still young. It happened to Borg when he was close to retirement and it must have happened to Connors who went 4 years without winning a slam as soon as he married his wife. Stich married soon after his Wimledon victory and never even made it to a final there afterwards again. Other players like Lendl, Sampras and Agassi did handle it better but when they tied the knot soon after they weren't winning as much anymore. Agassi went through his worst phase during his first marriage between 1997 and 1998.

Another thing I think might have affected McEnroee was his own ego and lack of accepting some facts. I think it took him a long time to accept that he couldn't dominate other players anymore, he was battling 3 oponents at once: his oponents, the refs and his own ego. He was never able to make this transition mentally but you can see quite a difference in his demeanor when you compare his attitude from 1985-89 to the early 90s.
 
Mac came back very strong in 1986. Annacone played very well in the Open first round. (a game, he escaped a love40 with 4 aces.) Before that Mac played awesome against Becker in losing at Stratton. That hurt, because he played so well and knew Becker would only get better.
And then mac won three tournaments after the open.
His return was a triumph BUT he didn't qualify for the Masters.
But from 1987 on he NEVER contended. He lost a step and his serve tempo went off.
 
Drugs and partying probably had a lot to do with it. Also, players who grew up with graphite started winning Slams at a young age over older players who had switched from wood mid-career. Players also started working out more following the example of Lendl while McEnroe never liked working out.
 
jrepac said:
Totally agree. The USO final was really the turning point for Lendl where he got on top of the world and parked himself there for an extended stay.
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What people tend to forget is that in 81 and 82 Lendl Dominated McEnroe 7-0 to Lendl. It wasn't just at the US Open in 85 he worked out how to beat McEnroe.
 
Fitness played a larger role in the game and his touch oriented style just didnt have the same impact after the racket revolution. Also, he was such an A list celebrity that his focus wained and im sure his ego didnt allow him to accept the need to overhaul his game. Continental FH grip became the minority for example.
 
timnz said:
What people tend to forget is that in 81 and 82 Lendl Dominated McEnroe 7-0 to Lendl.
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That's not forgotten, is it? McEnroe couldn't cope with Lendl's power baseline game in 1981-1982 and January 1983, especially the big forehand (for the time). Connors, on the other hand, seemed to thrive on Lendl's power game in the same time frame in most of their matches. Lendl learned over time against Connors to hit the ball with less pace, more slice, move Connors around etc.

timnz said:
It wasn't just at the US Open in 85 he worked out how to beat McEnroe.
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McEnroe turned it around slowly against Lendl in 1983, after getting a prep talk from Don Budge. Budge told McEnroe to stop letting Lendl dictate the rallies, to use the serve and volley tactic a lot more and be aggressive off the ground. This turned the rivalry around from spring of 1983 to summer of 1985, with McEnroe winning the vast majority of matches against Lendl. Lendl did have to learn how to get the proper edge over McEnroe all over again, and the 1985 US Open final was the big turning point. Lendl's fitness was a big factor in my opinion, which had been a few years in the making.
 
At the same time the game was becoming faster, balls were flying with greater velocity and spin, physical fitness and strength training was becoming more important to players, J. McEnroe was simply getting older. Time passed him by.
 
medieval_remnant said:
Mac came back very strong in 1986. Annacone played very well in the Open first round. (a game, he escaped a love40 with 4 aces.) Before that Mac played awesome against Becker in losing at Stratton. That hurt, because he played so well and knew Becker would only get better.
And then mac won three tournaments after the open.
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i remember watching him in stratton i think it was his comeback tournament after 6 months. he seemed really uptight like he expected to win the tournament and the becker match went 7-6 in the third. there was a line call mac complained about in the TB about becker’s overhead going through the net but that’s it. i didn’t see the annacone match but that was surprising.. in an interview annacone said he was relaxed because players were coming up to him beforehand and telling him he’s not the same mcenroe as before and you dont have to play that perfect to beat him anymore.. but then he won those 3 tourneys at the end i think beating connors and edberg so he had his ups and downs.. in 87 i only remember his long inspired davis cup match with becker and him playing lendl in the USO qtrs where he got beaten pretty soundly. lendl said macs 1st serve was better than before but his 2nd serve just sits up or something like that.. he almost got defaulted the round before against zivojinovic.
 
Mustard said:
That's not forgotten, is it? McEnroe couldn't cope with Lendl's power baseline game in 1981-1982 and January 1983, especially the big forehand (for the time). Connors, on the other hand, seemed to thrive on Lendl's power game in the same time frame in most of their matches. Lendl learned over time against Connors to hit the ball with less pace, more slice, move Connors around etc.


McEnroe turned it around slowly against Lendl in 1983, after getting a prep talk from Don Budge. Budge told McEnroe to stop letting Lendl dictate the rallies, to use the serve and volley tactic a lot more and be aggressive off the ground. This turned the rivalry around from spring of 1983 to summer of 1985, with McEnroe winning the vast majority of matches against Lendl. Lendl did have to learn how to get the proper edge over McEnroe all over again, and the 1985 US Open final was the big turning point. Lendl's fitness was a big factor in my opinion, which had been a few years in the making.
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I think 2 things helped in 1983 1/ the strategy that you mentioned and 2/ changing to graphite frame in 1983.
 
late 1985, outstanding match, maybe their best. Exhibition, though, which allowed for less inhibited stroke production
Mustard said:
That's not forgotten, is it? McEnroe couldn't cope with Lendl's power baseline game in 1981-1982 and January 1983, especially the big forehand (for the time). Connors, on the other hand, seemed to thrive on Lendl's power game in the same time frame in most of their matches. Lendl learned over time against Connors to hit the ball with less pace, more slice, move Connors around etc.


McEnroe turned it around slowly against Lendl in 1983, after getting a prep talk from Don Budge. Budge told McEnroe to stop letting Lendl dictate the rallies, to use the serve and volley tactic a lot more and be aggressive off the ground. This turned the rivalry around from spring of 1983 to summer of 1985, with McEnroe winning the vast majority of matches against Lendl. Lendl did have to learn how to get the proper edge over McEnroe all over again, and the 1985 US Open final was the big turning point. Lendl's fitness was a big factor in my opinion, which had been a few years in the making.
Click to expand...
Ivan Lendl vs McEnroe Final - Antwerp 1985 - YouTube
 
timnz said:
What people tend to forget is that in 81 and 82 Lendl Dominated McEnroe 7-0 to Lendl. It wasn't just at the US Open in 85 he worked out how to beat McEnroe.
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This is true, but Mac flipped the script for awhile in 83-84, pretty much dominating Lendl, particularly on the faster courts. Earlier, it seemed like Mac could not handle his power, but I believe he changed some of his tactics and turned it around.
 
And the correct answer is he peaked and “life” was in the process of peaking for him. Celebrity, love, music was better than fighting Lendl.
 
Waves said:
And the correct answer is he peaked and “life” was in the process of peaking for him. Celebrity, love, music was better than fighting Lendl.
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I'm not sure he saw it that way. He was taking a break and tinkering with his game as well. Which did not seem to help.
 
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