One footnote. If one has a look at the Lendl-Mac-match at Antwerp in post Nr. 43, its hard to comprehend, that those events are still not counted and completely ignored by the ATP. Those were real hard fought tournaments, not predetermined exhibitions, great draws, great prize money, fine international tv coverage, great matches. I think, Ivan won it 5 or more times, at last winning the overall Diamond Racket, which had great worth in itself.
Why did Mcenroe not win another major after 1984?
- Thread starter aman92
- Start date
I suppose since these events were technically not "open" the ATP chose not to count them. And there were many of them in the late 70's through late 80's. As you note, some were quite competitive and were 'big money'. I suppose the demand for such events just petered out (in the US at least). Yet, the Seniors Tour flourished in the mid to late 90's...which was a glorified exhibition in itself....perhaps because folks were drawn to the nostalgia factor (Connors, Borg, Mac)
big ted
Legend
well we can talk about lendl/mac all day and lendl did improve and overtake him but after '85
lendl wasnt even macs problem anymore it was a whole heap of players... he lost in GS tourneys early
on a regular basis and when he did play lendl it was usually in an earlier round.. so i think it was his own
undoing.. probly watched too many lakers games with jack nicholson among other things lol ..
i do remember mary carillo saying when mac moved to LA she didnt think it was that good for his tennis career
lendl wasnt even macs problem anymore it was a whole heap of players... he lost in GS tourneys early
on a regular basis and when he did play lendl it was usually in an earlier round.. so i think it was his own
undoing.. probly watched too many lakers games with jack nicholson among other things lol ..
i do remember mary carillo saying when mac moved to LA she didnt think it was that good for his tennis career
His serve was not the same when he came back, IMHO. And, he was a bit bulkier and a step slower, it seemed.
He was losing to guys he shouldn't have been....even Connors got a few wins off him in the late 80's.
Lendl was far too strong for him at that point, not to mention Becker and the others.
Sampras taking him out in the USO semis in '90 felt like the final nail in the coffin.
Mike Bulgakov
G.O.A.T.
Kevin McEnroe wrote a positively reviewed novel inspired by his upbringing and his grandmother's (Tatum's mom) struggles with drugs and Hollywood.
:max_bytes(150000):strip_icc():focal(511x0:513x2)/tatum-oneal-1-1024-9b6598914a8f47b1b86637608c59cf04.jpg)
Kevin McEnroe on His Mom Tatum O'Neal: I Thought She Was Choosing Drugs Over Us
Kevin McEnroe, the son of actress Tatum O'Neal and John McEnroe, speaks about his anguish over his mom's drug use and how he learned to forgive her.
Review: ‘Our Town’ by Kevin Jack McEnroe
Conflict-of-interest disclosure: I’m incapable of an impartial assessment of the “Town” in this book’s title. I fell in love with Los Angeles when I moved here three years a…
www.chicagotribune.com
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Thanks for the flashback....I was there that day....one of the most insanely dramatic matches I've seen. Kind of forgotten as it was a 1st rounder, but yeah, there was a "WTF is wrong with Mac?" vibe there. To go down to the wire like that against a journeyman was totally shocking.
BringBackWood
Professional
It was great when he exposed Murray's one dimensional game with great flair in the Davis Cup
medieval_remnant
Rookie
What did you notice about Mac's game when he wasn't playing his best?
Hard Court
Semi-Pro
it was a little of everything. First, he did not serve quite as good as he used to. Very good, but not great. His serve, return of serve, and groundstrokes often seemed a little off as well. He played really well in 1985. He beat Lendl two weeks in a row between Wimbledon and the US Open. Even after he lost to Lendl, it didn't seem like he not going to a top player anymore.
Then he took some time off. The "self-imposed sabbatical" as the announcers constantly called it. When he came back, he was for whatever reason not the same, at least not with any consistency. Some days he seemed almost as good as he once was. Other times he looked mediocre.
Then he took some time off. The "self-imposed sabbatical" as the announcers constantly called it. When he came back, he was for whatever reason not the same, at least not with any consistency. Some days he seemed almost as good as he once was. Other times he looked mediocre.
Vincent-C
Legend
I remember Vic Braden in Tennis mag predicting a relatively short time at the top for JMAc; showing how his
margins for error were almost impossibly small. I'd like to find that article again.
Mustard
Bionic Poster
McEnroe's mentality in late 1985 at the Australian Open wasn't very good. He barely beat "his pigeon" Leconte, and then got bagelled in the fifth set by Zivojinovic. Then came January 1986 when Gilbert beat McEnroe at the Masters for the only time in 14 career matches between them, causing McEnroe to take a disastrous 6 month break from tennis at the worst possible time in terms of changing technologies.
GRASScaraz
Hall of Fame
His game was too one dimensional
sandy mayer
Semi-Pro
Mac lost motivation. He lost a little bit of speed due to a hamstring injury. His serve lost a little pop. These factors, and the improvement of others was enough for Mac to stop winning slams. For Mac to keep winning slams he needed to sustain the level of 84. If he had Lendl's determination he would have done it.
I'd be interested in seeing that article myself because I don't remember Braden, or anyone else, saying anything like that. You tell me in September of 1984 that this will be Mcenroe's last GS title, and not due to any major injury, I tell you that you're crazy.
recreationalplayer
Semi-Pro
Rocky marriage to a short lived Hollywood Star, exposure to a fast crowd in Hollywood and Southern California which really wasn't for him. Becoming a step slow for serve and volley while the game was transitioning to a baseline power game and inability to adjust his game. Racquets and strings? Maybe, Pete Sampras and Edberg did very well w/a small pro staff and natural gut is still used in a hybrid set up.
dip in serving consistency is the #1 thing for me, followed by his ability to quickly get to net. Even when rallying, he was good at those hit early, short backswing approach shots...he'd catch 'em on the rise and rush the net. He wasn't able to do that the way he used to.
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
‘It Was Absurd What I Did..’- ‘Superbrat’ John McEnroe Reveals Dangerous Cocaine Stint to Sustain Marriage With Hollywood Actress Tatum O’ Neal
John McEnroe had a failed marriage due to his addiction to cocaine and marijuana. In his documentary, he elaborates on what went wrong.
www.essentiallysports.com
A brain is a terrible thing to waste!
GuyForget
Professional
Did he visit Borg’s cave?
GuyForget
Professional
<rimshot>
medieval_remnant
Rookie
I remember that article. Braden said he rolled his forearms too much on groundstrokes which demanded sustained exquisite timing
Off court issues was the beginning of the end for Mac.
For me as well, but 2 people here say they saw it. I saw Braden do tv on many Mcenroe matches and don't recall anything like that.
His forehand was unusual....kine of like a slap-roll....but it could be ridiculously effective. Particularly when he caught the ball early on an approach shot. Scarily good, unorthodox stuff.
Vincent-C
Legend
Gene Mayer once responded to criticisms of JMac's FH by saying it was "perfect" for what he was trying to do- which was mainly
"getting to the net as quickly as possible".
sounds about right
GuyForget
Professional
i read Tatum hit the heroin eventually so he got custody
he did. You know its bad when they take the kids away from their mom
bigbadboaz
Semi-Pro
That's great - and maybe he's just trying to lavish public praise on her - but a player's career is ultimately his responsibility and his alone. It's a sad statement that he thinks which woman he met when was the deciding factor in self-destructing so quickly.
But hey, it's really about maturity. Even with the right spouse, maybe the 25-year-old him was never going to stay engaged.
But hey, it's really about maturity. Even with the right spouse, maybe the 25-year-old him was never going to stay engaged.
they get married and have kids and not so single minded anymore. Connors went through that for a bit. Meddy is another one....didn't his wife just have another child?
ttwarrior1
Hall of Fame
he liked to snort coke with mel purcell. Said what i said
hoodjem
G.O.A.T.
The ‘84 loss to Lendl in the FO final completely haunted, demoralized, and drained him of his powers. After that he was a man in a deep, dark hole he could never get out of.
Just kidding. It’s more likely that he slipped a notch after taking time away and that other players stepped up.
But the loss did haunt him.
Just kidding. It’s more likely that he slipped a notch after taking time away and that other players stepped up.
But the loss did haunt him.
GuyForget
Professional
and Mel Bernstein
serengetisunset
Rookie
McEnroe was 25 in 1984 - which was sort of the cut off mark for leading players of that decade for winning slams, due to depth of competition and margins being very, very slim. Edberg won his last slam at 26, Becker at 28, Wilander at just 24(after winning three in '88, a very Mac like burnout story right after hitting his peak), Pat Cash won his one and only slam at 22 before Achilles tendon injury ravaged his career, etc. Only Lendl bucked the trend, going strong till he was 30, winning a slam and holding the #1 ranking at that age.
I believe McEnroe's problem was partly mental - he himself has said that once you reach the top, the only way left is downwards. The pressure of having to live up to expectations after that insane level in 1984 against a packed field probably did him in.
I believe McEnroe's problem was partly mental - he himself has said that once you reach the top, the only way left is downwards. The pressure of having to live up to expectations after that insane level in 1984 against a packed field probably did him in.
Dane_is_Finnish_OJ
Hall of Fame
What was happening to technology in 1986? Everybody (Lendl, Becker, Edberg, Wilander, Noah etc.) played with the same rackets as they did in 1985. If he took the break in 1983, it would be a different matter. The big switch came in 1984.
medieval_remnant
Rookie
Really? What years?
Mustard
Bionic Poster
Look at 1986 compared to the early 1990s. Look at 1986 compared to 1983. There's a clear difference.
Connors at 29 won Wimby, then USO that same year when he turned 30 (1982), also regaining the #1 ranking. Then won USO again in 1983 at age 31 and then a final Wimby final in 1984. Lendl at ages 29 and 30 picked up 2 AOs. Then it was a ghost town for elders until Agassi rebounded.
Pheasant
Legend
McEnroe was still great in 1985. He was world #1 heading into the USO final with a stellar 61-5 record. But then, he was dismantled in that final to relinquish world #1 forever, which was a very sad day. Lendl had a stellar 14-4 record vs the top-5 in 1985. But to Mac’s credit, 3 is those 4 losses were to McEnroe. Otherwise, Lendl was 11-1 vs the rest of the top-5, which includes:
3-1 vs Wilander
2-0 vs Becker
6-0 vs Connors
I don’t feel too badly about Mac’s 74-8, .902 1985 season. However, that 1985 USO championship loss to Lendl hurt a lot. I felt that Mac was done for good winning slams after that loss.
I was wrong when I had the same exact feeling after Federer lost to Nadal in the 2008 Wimbledon final. I had a strong feeling that Federer would be stranded at 12 slam titles; especially since youngsters Murray and Djokovic kept improving. Thankfully, I was wrong with that prediction.
3-1 vs Wilander
2-0 vs Becker
6-0 vs Connors
I don’t feel too badly about Mac’s 74-8, .902 1985 season. However, that 1985 USO championship loss to Lendl hurt a lot. I felt that Mac was done for good winning slams after that loss.
I was wrong when I had the same exact feeling after Federer lost to Nadal in the 2008 Wimbledon final. I had a strong feeling that Federer would be stranded at 12 slam titles; especially since youngsters Murray and Djokovic kept improving. Thankfully, I was wrong with that prediction.
