Why Federer has more love, but Nadal has more followers on social network?

jm1980

G.O.A.T.
How much did Federer make from endorsement when he was Nadal's age? You are free to adjust it for inflation for the last 5 years which would be couple of hundred dollars maximum. That would be a fair comparison.

Edit: OK found it http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/athletes/tennis/roger-federer-net-worth/
http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/athletes/tennis/rafael-nadal-net-worth/

Federer made about $25 million from endorsement in 2009 whereas Nadal made $30 million in 2014 from endorsement. So there you go!
Endorsement money, much like prize money, increases at a rate much faster than inflation.

You have to look at players' endorsement money they get at the same time period otherwise the comparison is meaningless.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
...

A more scientific way to approach this is to look at endorsements, and Federer consistently kicks everyone's behind in that category. He pulled more endorsement money than Djokovic, Nadal, and Murray combined last year.
...
Do you think that Murray earned less than 1M dollars?

 

pame

Hall of Fame
If Federer was such box office why has A.Dhabi stopped inviting him to their exho?

Roger Federer Not Invited To Play Abu Dhabi In December
Written by: Staff on 21st November 2012

Organizers at the Abu Dhabi exhibition have delivered a backhanded slap to Roger Federer, failing to invite the four-time participant back for the fifth edition of their event between Christmas and New Years.

The Swiss who has won more in the sport than anyone who ever played was given a miss, allegedly due to the fact that only “former champions” were on the guest list this year for the multi-million dollar hit-and-giggle from December 27-29.

Not that the money really matters much to Federer, the top earner in all of tennis.

“The principle reason is that we are celebrating past champions and Roger, unfortunately, hasn’t won the event,” said tournament official Greg Sproule. “The Championship adores Roger and we cherish that friendship very much, but we are sticking to the theme of past champions. That was a very definitive, clearly cut decision.”

Delving below the surface might yield another, more commercial, conclusion. Federer is no longer welcome at the event due to his split this year from IMG, which just happens to run the well-paid exho earner for players keen to pay for their Christmas shopping.

Sproul, who happens to be one of IMG’s top men in the region, added: “The celebration of champions and the youth of the ATP, which we have in spades here with arguably the six hottest young players in the game, was our aim from the outset. These guys have more Grand Slam victories ahead of them rather than behind them.”

Those on court in the Gulf will include Novak Djokovic, Andy Murray and – reportedly – Rafael Nadal, who has not played in six months due to his knee injury.



Federer should not be particularly bothered with the Abu Dhabi snub after completing what promises to be a groundbreaking December exhibition tour of three South American countries where he has never set foot. No matter what the ticket price, those exhibitions in Brazil, Argentina and Colombia are guaranteed sellouts.
Bwahahahahaha! Gosh, this is a classic case of the suspect savvy of Nadal fans (well, maybe not Nadal fans, just of clayqueen). Quotes an article which has this passage:

"Delving below the surface might yield another, more commercial, conclusion. Federer is no longer welcome at the event due to his split this year from IMG, which just happens to run the well-paid exho earner for players keen to pay for their Christmas shopping."

clayqueen, you might be usefully advised to read past the headlines.
 

zep

Hall of Fame
Endorsement money, much like prize money, increases at a rate much faster than inflation.

You have to look at players' endorsement money they get at the same time period otherwise the comparison is meaningless.
Not really. The market has not expanded that much in the 4-5 years. Yes you can go and look other stars of Federer's age to see if there was such increase in the last 5 years. Let me know if you find anyone. Generally when a player does something important his stake increases. For example, Wawrinka will make more money after this year than he did before. For Federer that milestone was breaking Pete's record. It elevated him to a different level. Prize money is increasing at a gradual rate, like about 250K-300K per year at slams. Federer's endorsement money sky rocketed after he broke Pete's record. Otherwise he was paid pretty much the same amount Nadal is paid now, considering general increase and inflation. If Nadal manages to break or tie Federer's record in the next few years and decides to play on his stake will also increase similarly.
 

jhhachamp

Hall of Fame
Do you think that Murray earned less than 1M dollars?

Thanks for posting this. Federer still made nearly twice as much money as Nadal in endorsements during a time period when Nadal was much more successful in tennis (he won more than 3 times what Federer won in prize money during that same period).

Federer is much more popular than Nadal and this is clear proof. Social media numbers do not mean squat.
 

jhhachamp

Hall of Fame
Not really. The market has not expanded that much in the 4-5 years. Yes you can go and look other stars of Federer's age to see if there was such increase in the last 5 years. Let me know if you find anyone. Generally when a player does something important his stake increases. For example, Wawrinka will make more money after this year than he did before. For Federer that milestone was breaking Pete's record. It elevated him to a different level. Prize money is increasing at a gradual rate, like about 250K-300K per year at slams. Federer's endorsement money sky rocketed after he broke Pete's record. Otherwise he was paid pretty much the same amount Nadal is paid now, considering general increase and inflation. If Nadal manages to break or tie Federer's record in the next few years and decides to play on his stake will also increase similarly.
Federer has always made much more money than Nadal in endorsements. Age has nothing to do with it. Federer will continue to make more endorsement money than Nadal unless some sort of scandal (on the level of Tiger Woods) comes out and tarnishes his image. Until that happens, he will remain more popular and earn more in endorsement money.
 

smoledman

G.O.A.T.
Bwahahahahaha! Gosh, this is a classic case of the suspect savvy of Nadal fans (well, maybe not Nadal fans, just of clayqueen). Quotes an article which has this passage:

"Delving below the surface might yield another, more commercial, conclusion. Federer is no longer welcome at the event due to his split this year from IMG, which just happens to run the well-paid exho earner for players keen to pay for their Christmas shopping."

clayqueen, you might be usefully advised to read past the headlines.
Fed laughed all the way to the bank on those SA exos in 2012. He made something like $14 million from those hit-n-giggles. Eat that Abu Dhabi. What the hell is Abu Dhabi anyways except some piece of **** desert?
 

DerekNoleFam1

Hall of Fame
Federer is insanely popular amongst old people who tend to not be on social media.
Same with Nadal - have a look at ATP articles.
I have never supported either player, and was so glad when Novak came along, but Federer's peak was when social media was still in it's infancy, hence one major reason for the discrepancy.
 

Fedinkum

Legend
I am a Fed and and I dont tweet and dont follow Fed's FB. I watch his tennis and get his news on TT. That's Why.
 

clayqueen

Talk Tennis Guru
Bwahahahahaha! Gosh, this is a classic case of the suspect savvy of Nadal fans (well, maybe not Nadal fans, just of clayqueen). Quotes an article which has this passage:

"Delving below the surface might yield another, more commercial, conclusion. Federer is no longer welcome at the event due to his split this year from IMG, which just happens to run the well-paid exho earner for players keen to pay for their Christmas shopping."

clayqueen, you might be usefully advised to read past the headlines.
It doesn't matter what the conjecture is that he isn't being invited anymore. The bottom line is A. Dhabi doesn't need Fed to sell tickets, they can do without him.
 

clayqueen

Talk Tennis Guru
I am a Fed and and I dont tweet and dont follow Fed's FB. I watch his tennis and get his news on TT. That's Why.
I am a Nadal fan and I don't vote on the Fans' Fovourite thing because I know it's a stitch up. I don't know how the ATP can present him with the trophy every year with a straight face. The same goes for the sportsmanship award where Fed is the only player that the ATP nominates every year along with other nominees who stand no chance like Cilic and Niemnen or Ljubicic.
 
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zep

Hall of Fame
Federer has always made much more money than Nadal in endorsements. Age has nothing to do with it. Federer will continue to make more endorsement money than Nadal unless some sort of scandal (on the level of Tiger Woods) comes out and tarnishes his image. Until that happens, he will remain more popular and earn more in endorsement money.
You don't seem to understand the basic concept of brand building. Federer was established as a brand 3-4 years before Nadal. He came to prominence from 2004 whereas Nadal around 2007-2008, although he was winning RG before that. Both of their career earnings have been following a similar trend so far. Federer saw a huge jump after he beat Pete's record. I can bet anything if Nadal manages beat or even tie Federer's record of 17 slams he will also see a similar jump.
 

moonballs

Hall of Fame
I am a Nadal fan and I don't vote on the Fans' Fovourite thing because I know it's a stitch up. I don't know how the ATP can present him with the trophy every year with a straight face. The same goes for the sportsmanship award where Fed is the only player that the ATP nominates every year along with other nominees who stand no chance like Cilic and Niemnen or Ljubicic.
I guess nobody told you "things are decided by those who showed up" in social studies :)
 

jhhachamp

Hall of Fame
You don't seem to understand the basic concept of brand building. Federer was established as a brand 3-4 years before Nadal. He came to prominence from 2004 whereas Nadal around 2007-2008, although he was winning RG before that. Both of their career earnings have been following a similar trend so far. Federer saw a huge jump after he beat Pete's record. I can bet anything if Nadal manages beat or even tie Federer's record of 17 slams he will also see a similar jump.
I'm sorry, but you are wrong. I do understand the concept of brand building. Your post is a bunch of hypotheticals. Federer is more popular than Nadal and that is very unlikely to change anytime soon. Nadal's endorsement earnings are not guaranteed to follow the path of Federer's as he continues to get older. Unless some sort of major scandal occurs, Federer is going to end up making significantly more endorsement money in his career than Nadal.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
Thanks for posting this. Federer still made nearly twice as much money as Nadal in endorsements during a time period when Nadal was much more successful in tennis (he won more than 3 times what Federer won in prize money during that same period).

Federer is much more popular than Nadal and this is clear proof. Social media numbers do not mean squat.
Fed has longtime & lifetime deals with sponsors

December 30, 2012
How Much is Roger Federer Worth?

How much are these endorsement deals worth individually?
This is a tough question answer seen as though there’s so many but based on my research I have the following values:
2012 – Moët & Chandon – $6 million/year, contract worth $30 million over 5 years.
2010 – Mercedes-Benz – Unknown.
2009 – Credit Suisse – $2 million/year, contract worth $20 million over 10 years.
2009 – Lindt – Unknown, appears they’ve kept this deal under wraps. How very Swiss ;)
2008 – Nike – $10 million/year, contract worth $100 million over 10 years.
2008 – Jura – $2.3 million/year, contract woth $16 million over 7 years.
2007 – Gillette – $3 million/year since 2007. Unknown when it expires.
2007 – National Suisse – Unknown value, extended in 2012 for a further 4 years.
2006 – Wilson – $2 million/year, lifetime deal as he’ll be an ambassador once he retires.
2006 – Rolex – $1.5 million/year, contract worth $15 million over 10 years.
2006 – NetJets – Unknown value. NetJets is owned by Berkshire Hathaway aka Warren Buffet so it’s likely to be a few $$.
http://www.perfect-tennis.co.uk/how-much-is-roger-federer-worth/
 

Russeljones

G.O.A.T.
It confuses me. Here are some facts:

Federer clearly has more love. He has been voted the favorite tennis player for 12 years on a row. It happened even at his biggest slum years and Nadal biggest successful years like 2010 and 2013. This year every 2 out of 3 voters voted for him. It is insane and clearly show Federer is the most popular tennis player in the world. No doubt in my mind. In almost every match against every opponent in everywhere he always has more or at least equal support. I laughed hearing Simon (?) ask French do not support for Fed in Davis Cup final this year. Something can not happen with anyone else in the tennis world past or future.

But there are other facts. Nadal has more follower on Facebook (14.8 against 14.7 millions), on Twitter (6 millions against 2). There are reports about him being tweeted the most in some countries like China. And I asked myself why?

One reason I think is with recent success Nadal has appeared at paper headline much more than Federer and therefore people have more things to discuss about him then the walking dead Fed (joke). One more thing is Fed seems not care much about twitter he started to tweet very late and also very little. As the obvious cause he is tweeted much less than Nadal. Nadal has many new followers (fan girls/boys), but has much much less hardcore supporters. It seems Fed fans are obsessed with him both being perfect tennis player and with the records he is holding while Nadal fans seeing him like a human with many not perfect aspects. And Fed fan can not accept him not being the best at almost everything. And therefore Fed fan are eager to vote for him more than other fan base.
Forgive me if this is discussed already but there's also the demographics to "blame" for this apparent disparity. I suspect Federer's fans to be on average older and with higher disposable income. This group is less likely to engage on social media than younger people with less disposable income.
 
D

Deleted member 77403

Guest
Everyone is under the assumption that only fans and wellwishers are following them on the social media network. I am sure the haters are in full force, some wishing to find out when the next injury is, or when something happens that will cause a retirement.
 
What?! Rafa is looking to extend his presence???
Rafa is Telefónica’s global ambassador and the company is doing what every sponsor is doing - Telefónica uses Rafa's name/image to promote its business.
So, being a host on a show is part of the plan to ......... promote Telefonica's business?

:roll:
 

uliks

Banned
Do you think that Murray earned less than 1M dollars?

WOW Grigor Dimitrov, according to the ATP, the 3rd most popular tennis player globally, ranked behind only Nadal and Federer, aka the baby Fed, aka the new Godsick protege, aka the Sharapova boyfriend, aka the new Nike darling, aka the Bulgarian stallion, is nowhere to be seen on this list.

I certainly thought that this guy is way more marketable than Djokovic who according to TTW's Fed fanboys and Nadal fangirls, outside Serbia doesn't have fans, because basically nobody likes him :confused: I'm in shock. I'm shocked :shock:
 
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zep

Hall of Fame
I'm sorry, but you are wrong. I do understand the concept of brand building. Your post is a bunch of hypotheticals. Federer is more popular than Nadal and that is very unlikely to change anytime soon. Nadal's endorsement earnings are not guaranteed to follow the path of Federer's as he continues to get older. Unless some sort of major scandal occurs, Federer is going to end up making significantly more endorsement money in his career than Nadal.
Not sure what's your fascination with scandals. I don't have the numbers but it is safe to assume that Agassi probably made more money than Federer in the 2004-07 period, because he was the more established brand even though those were Federer's most successful years. It is not that hard to understand. Federer saw a major jump after 2009 when he crossed 14, it is a fact. Go check his numbers. He started earning more than he did in his peak years. Would Nadal see a similar jump if he happens to cross or tie 17 and decides to stick around? I am saying yes.
 

jm1980

G.O.A.T.
WOW Grigor Dimitrov, according to the ATP, the 3rd most popular tennis player globally, ranked behind only Nadal and Federer, aka the baby Fed, aka the new Godsick protege, aka the Sharapova boyfriend, aka the new Nike darling, aka the Bulgarian stallion, is nowhere to be seen on this list.

I certainly thought that this guy is way more marketable than Djokovic who according to TTW's Fed fanboys and Nadal fangirls, outside Serbia doesn't have fans, because basically nobody likes him :confused: I'm in shock. I'm shocked :shock:
For some reason they are propping up this guy as the next face of men's tennis. Here's an ATP article claiming Dimitrov is fifth most marketable athelete and the most marketable tennis player (yes, over Djokovic, Nadal, and Federer).

http://www.atpworldtour.com/news/tennis/2014/05/21/dimitrov-most-marketable.aspx

Very odd indeed.
 

uliks

Banned
For some reason they are propping up this guy as the next face of men's tennis. Here's an ATP article claiming Dimitrov is fifth most marketable athelete and the most marketable tennis player (yes, over Djokovic, Nadal, and Federer).

http://www.atpworldtour.com/news/tennis/2014/05/21/dimitrov-most-marketable.aspx

Very odd indeed.
Virat Kohli is second on that list. :lol: Who the hell is Virat Kohli? :confused: :roll:
And if Grigor Dimitrov is the next face of men's tennis, then God help us. Dark times are upon us indeed :(
 

jhhachamp

Hall of Fame
Not sure what's your fascination with scandals.
I don't have any fascination with scandals. My point is simply that scandals can have a large effect on a player's ability to earn endorsement money. Please do not try to change the subject again.

I don't have the numbers but it is safe to assume that Agassi probably made more money than Federer in the 2004-07 period, because he was the more established brand even though those were Federer's most successful years.
It's possible, but I won't assume that.

It is not that hard to understand.
It is not hard to understand that it is possible.

Federer saw a major jump after 2009 when he crossed 14, it is a fact.
What defines a "major jump"? A 20% increase from the previous year? 30%?

Go check his numbers. He started earning more than he did in his peak years.
I am not going to go check the numbers. You are making the claim that it is true; therefore, the burden is on you to show evidence to support your claim.

Would Nadal see a similar jump if he happens to cross or tie 17 and decides to stick around? I am saying yes.
Without knowing how much of jump Federer saw, this is a very difficult question to answer.
 

zep

Hall of Fame
I don't have any fascination with scandals. My point is simply that scandals can have a large effect on a player's ability to earn endorsement money. Please do not try to change the subject again.
When did I ever try to change the subject? You are the one keep harping on scandals.


What defines a "major jump"? A 20% increase from the previous year? 30%?



I am not going to go check the numbers. You are making the claim that it is true; therefore, the burden is on you to show evidence to support your claim.



Without knowing how much of jump Federer saw, this is a very difficult question to answer.
Read the thread properly before arguing, the link was shared a couple of pages back. Federer's endorsement money was $25 million in 2009. It increased significantly from 2010-2011 crossing 45-50 million. What do you think caused that change? His performance certainly was not better than his peak? Why does he earn much more now than he did in his peak?
 

smoledman

G.O.A.T.
Who cares about those stupid things. What I care is Federer has played the most beautiful tennis I've ever seen.
 

jhhachamp

Hall of Fame
When did I ever try to change the subject? You are the one keep harping on scandals.
I was only discussing scandals in the context of the existing conversations. You attempted to completely change the subject to be about me. I'm done talking about this.

Read the thread properly before arguing, the link was shared a couple of pages back. Federer's endorsement money was $25 million in 2009. It increased significantly from 2010-2011 crossing 45-50 million. What do you think caused that change? His performance certainly was not better than his peak? Why does he earn much more now than he did in his peak?
Found the links again here:

http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/athletes/tennis/roger-federer-net-worth/
http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/athletes/tennis/rafael-nadal-net-worth/

It looks to me like Federer's earnings have been increasing by a pretty consistent amount each year since 2006. I do not see the "major jump" you refer to in 2009.
 

newpball

Legend
It confuses me. Here are some facts:

Federer clearly has more love. He has been voted the favorite tennis player for 12 years on a row. It happened even at his biggest slum years and Nadal biggest successful years like 2010 and 2013. This year every 2 out of 3 voters voted for him. It is insane and clearly show Federer is the most popular tennis player in the world. No doubt in my mind. In almost every match against every opponent in everywhere he always has more or at least equal support. I laughed hearing Simon (?) ask French do not support for Fed in Davis Cup final this year. Something can not happen with anyone else in the tennis world past or future.

But there are other facts. Nadal has more follower on Facebook (14.8 against 14.7 millions), on Twitter (6 millions against 2). There are reports about him being tweeted the most in some countries like China. And I asked myself why?

One reason I think is with recent success Nadal has appeared at paper headline much more than Federer and therefore people have more things to discuss about him then the walking dead Fed (joke). One more thing is Fed seems not care much about twitter he started to tweet very late and also very little. As the obvious cause he is tweeted much less than Nadal. Nadal has many new followers (fan girls/boys), but has much much less hardcore supporters. It seems Fed fans are obsessed with him both being perfect tennis player and with the records he is holding while Nadal fans seeing him like a human with many not perfect aspects. And Fed fan can not accept him not being the best at almost everything. And therefore Fed fan are eager to vote for him more than other fan base.
Twitteraudit:

Nadal: 55%
F: 62%
Murray: 64%

Looks like Nadal has the most fake followers.

:grin:
 

moonballs

Hall of Fame
Rafa only played for half of 2014.

The thing is, we are just going round and round in circles about which one of them is more popular but there is no definitive way of counting. I would say Fed's popularity is historic based on past glory. Rafa's popularity transcends tennis. He is more loved by his fans as a person and for his achievements whilst Fed is admired mainly for his achievements.
What about 2013, which was Nadal's second most successful year? The stats I provided was actually from June 2013 to June 2014.

This is no one best method for measuring popularity but endorsement money is an objective measure. At least to folks who think capitalism, free market, by and large work.
 

The Green Mile

Bionic Poster
Nadal has had much more success than Federer in recent years, and I suspect has more younger fans in general.

I am of the belief that Federer is still more popular with Nadal coming in as second, with I am sure, majority of ATP and WTA professionals, commentators and whatnot. So many times I have heard players and commentators talk about the popularity of Federer, with Nadal coming in second.

I wonder when we will next see a tennis player that has the same popularity as Federer, or even Nadal......
 

jm1980

G.O.A.T.
How do they determine who is fake?
Educated guess:

About TwitterAudit

Each audit takes a random sample of 5000 Twitter followers for a user and calculates a score for each follower. This score is based on number of tweets, date of the last tweet, and ratio of followers to friends. We use these scores to determine whether any given user is real or fake. Of course, this scoring method is not perfect but it is a good way to tell if someone with lots of followers is likely to have increased their follower count by inorganic, fraudulent, or dishonest means.
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
Looks like you present the most fake data.
All of the top players have a percentage of fake followers, isn't that obvious? That is what PR firms are for. You didn't really think that all of Nadal's followers were real did you? That would be very naïve. That is why you have to take the social media followers thing with a grain of salt to some extent and can't rely on it as the ultimate predictor in which player is more popular. You have to look at a wide variety of things to determine the most popular player, not just social media, things like attendance at matches throughout the world, endorsement money made, fan favorite award, comments from commentators and journalists, etc.
 
Rafa has more social media fans cus of many reasons.He is younger, more beautiful and handsome (girls like it - im just being real) and he has more sucsess last few years when facebook and twitter gain more popularity.

On the other hand, Roger has more fans and is more popular in general cus he came into tennis(on big stage) few years after Sampras and Aggasi (i know he played more but im thinking while he played in his prime).People in that mid time (lets say 2002-2004) taught that we will never seen anything like Sampras or Andre again.In those years players like; Kurten,Ivanicesvic,Hewit,Johanson,Costa,Ferrero and Rodick were winning Grand Slams.I know they are not bad players at all, they are GS champions after all, but none of them is big star, none of them had ability to dominate tour for a longer time.
Then Roger showed up.With 22 he beated Philipusis and next year with 23 (2004 - first season as a GS champ) he beated some of those players i mentioned up there.Saffin, Rodick, Hewit were his victims in GS finals, he defeated them actualy very easy, Safin and Hewit in 3 sets, Roddick in 4.
None of them was eaven close to beat Roger.They all were good players, ATP tour in general maybe was heavier than today, but Roger didint have 1 ATG player, 1 great champ to fight with.
Im sure that for a ATG like Roger its more easier to beat 7 good players and win a GS then 6 "nothing special" players but 1 ATG and great champ.
This kind of situation was till 2007, when Rafa became competitive on all surfaces.In period 2004-2006 Roger (im not saying 2003, it was Rogers first slam year) Roger won 8 GS titles, (9 if we include 2007 AO) 9 in total with 2003 Wimbledon title.Thats 9 GS titles in period of 3,5 years.That was very impresive.In only 3,5 years since his first GS title and 25 years old Roger climbed on number 6 with numbers of GS titles ever, 3rd if we include only open era, behind Sampras and Borg.
Beside all of that he was playing agresive tennis, his tennis was just like that, he didint need any adjustments to win 3 out of 4.
People liked that and he got so many fans in that period of time.
Rafa actualy came in with his first GS when Roger had 4, and when Rafa got into his first non clay GS final Roger already had 7 and Rafa 2 Slams.When Rafa won his first non clay slam (2008 WB) Roger had 12 and Rafa 4.
It was hard to get some fans out of him.Im actualy very satisfied with this he has right now!
 

Vegito

Hall of Fame
I forgot to vote for Tomas Berdych as the favorite tennis player!

Are the percentages of votes of recent years in some site?
 
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Nadal has been more successful in the past few years and is thus as well or better known among casual fans who watch tennis a couple times a year. Federer is much more popular amongst people who watch frequently.
 

RF20Lennon

Legend
Because people on social media just 'like' stuff. If they see in the news that someone did something big they go like their page. They don't stick around for stuff like this. That's my guess.
 
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