Will Djokovic end up as Open Era Hard court GOAT?

[DjokovicForTheFO]

Whoever ends up with more hard court slams, the one thing we can safely say is that both of these guys dominated a surface with an incredibly high level of competition, not a surface with easy cakewalk draws on top of no competition. Hard court is a surface you have to be playing day in and day you, you cannot take long breaks from the tour to do well here year after year.

 

[mike danny]

Whoever ends up with more hard court slams, the one thing we can safely say is that both of these guys dominated a surface with an incredibly high level of competition, not a surface with easy cakewalk draws on top of no competition. Hard court is a surface you have to be playing day in and day you, you cannot take long breaks from the tour to do well here year after year.

Yep agree. As it looks right now, Federer and Djokovic will end up as the top 2 HC players of all time

 

[Chanwan]

Extrapolate? You know how many uso titles Federer, Sampras, Agassi, Lendl won after hitting 27? ONE. Just one. Djokovic already turned 27, by stats he should win just ONE more USO. not that great. Two USOs wont be enough to be hc GOAT.

the thing is, they all had great young players competing against them.
So far, Djoko's main competition is as old or older than him and that'll probably be true for at least another year or two, maybe even longer.
And people are competing better in their late 20's, early 30's than they used to.
As of now, I don't see why Djoko can't be a contender for every slam he plays in the next 4-5 years.

I don't see Djoko surpassing Fed's HC records, but I certainly don't consider it outside the realm of possibility.

 

[Fiji]

the thing is, they all had great young players competing against them.
So far, Djoko's main competition is as old or older than him and that'll probably be true for at least another year or two, maybe even longer.
And people are competing better in their late 20's, early 30's than they used to.
As of now, I don't see why Djoko can't be a contender for every slam he plays in the next 4-5 years.

I don't see Djoko surpassing Fed's HC records, but I certainly don't consider it outside the realm of possibility.

nole will soon be a father. That is a disadvantage as we have seen in the past few decades in tennis.

 

[Chanwan]

Please pay attention to this fact before answering here.

I know, I know. But it ain't working. We can argue, but it'll always be civil between Djoko and Fed fans. I think there are very few Fed fans, who doesn't like Djoko as well.

 

[Chanwan]

nole will soon be a father. That is a disadvantage as we have seen in the past few decades in tennis.

it may turn out to be, who's to say? But what do you say to the general argument, I was making?
Imo, Novak will be one of the favorites in the HC slams for the next 2-3 years, maybe more, and a contender for another 2-3 years.

 

[agreed]

There are many great djoko fans. No one cares about the desperate fed legacy glory hunting fools who think djoko gave up and will let the tour dominate Aussie open and us open. He was an emotional mess during the clay seasons since 2011 and was unfocused during the plan to have a baby and after a close relative and friend's deaths. coaching ups and downs drained him since Todd martin's debacle. he overtrained and got injured, but he still got through with hard court wins, masters cup & a small clay season with a wrist injury.

Federer was beaten by many journeyman since 1999 and he will continue to lose to journeymen. Roddick, safin & hewitt aren't his limited, constantly technique-deficient & injured, hapless punching bags anymore. Although, he loved comparing nadal to roddick. How pathetic and desperate as his fanboys.

the only thing he suffered was an ex-coach's death a decade ago. $40 million from sponsors rolled in when he was beaten 50 times by nadal, Murray and djokovic. The Swiss watch didn't count his losses.

22 year old Weak era clowns crashed out of 1st rounds of slams
and lost 2 set leads just like federer did at Wimbledon.

Djoko gets through pain in 4th rounds of slams.

Fed loses to journeymen and proudly bragged that he
laughed at his loser pal dick's 16 injuries "joke" and nadal's losses.
Sportsmanship award winner and hardcourt dominator fed, you know...

so don't cry for fed and his inflated number of slams and losing record
Vs. 3 guys by 2015. Vote desperately for your fed and hate his owner djoko.
See who the real arrogant nutsos are voting for fed in droves, quickly.

Hope no one mock's fed's injuries and boast about those losses to djoko, as you did about djoko...... fed fan boys. fed thinks he's too old to dominate after having a poor 5 set record & needing easy journeyman slam draws. In true fed fashion, he brags about dominating the tour when djoko was injured in 2011.... Clown fed.

 

[Boom-Boom]

Djokovic will not surpass Federer or Sampras on HC.

Yep that's for sure. He's already 27.

 

[veroniquem]

I have said since 2007 that Djoko was the only active player who could challenge Fed's records on hard. Now Fed has 9 slam titles on hard and 6 WTF titles. Djoko is already 27 and nowhere close to those stats but he's making top 5 on hc which is already a fantastic achievement.

Hard court titles overall: 1- Federer: 53
2- Agassi: 46
3- Connors: 43
4- Sampras: 36
5- Djoko: 34
(Those do not include carpet, which is not fair to guys like Lendl, McEnroe and Connors since lots of events were played on carpet instead of hard in their time. If you combine hc + carpet, the tally becomes quite different indeed and Fed would be nowhere near #1...)

The slam tally is also partial to recent times since USO was played on hard only from 1978 and AO from 1988:

1- Federer: 9
2- Sampras: 7
3- Agassi: 6
4- Djoko and Lendl: 5
(All of those players won both slams on hard)

YEC (was played on carpet before hc):

1- Federer: 6
2- Lendl and Sampras: 5
3- Nastase: 4 (3 of which on carpet)
4: Becker, McEnroe, Djoko: 3

For (current) masters, I included Paris indoor even though it was played on carpet in the 90s:

1- Agassi: 14 (+ 2 Paris indoor)
2- Fed: 15
3- Djoko: 14
4- Sampras: 8 (+ 2 Paris)
5- Murray: 9

(Note that Agassi and Fed are the only 2 players to have won all 6 masters on hard/carpet)

Winning % on hard (does not include carpet):
1- Connors: 82.7
2- Lendl and Djoko: 82.6
3- Federer and Laver: 82.5
4- McEnroe: 81.1
5- Sampras: 80.4
(only category where Djoko has passed Fed and of course it could change with aging)

I don't see a way to reasonably predict that Djoko will surpass Fed at this point (except most likely in master titles). It is not impossible but he's still far enough that one cannot say that it's likely either.
The main question for now is how close he will get over the next 5 years or so.

 

[agreed]

Dude. That was 2013 when he did all that. Since then the only HC title he won was Doha this year, where there weren't any top 10 players in the draw.

After that he lost early at IW and lost convincingly at Miami. And didn't win the AO.

And if you bring up beating 32 year old Fed in straights for the first time in a non clay slam, well it does not prove anything,since Fed is not even in his 2012 form anymore. And Rafa was expected to win that match.

You, like nadal fanatics, enjoyed the djoko injury losses but feel so much adoration for fed's courage despite his playing little Davis cup for 6 years, losing badly in Olympics & having no weapons against journeymen.

It was not shocking when claycourters bothered fed at the us open.
Andreev had only a forehand to tire fed and fed required break point saves with ball bashing, as usual. Not ballet plié and volleys.

He was as weak as Roddick was when he Was down 1-3 in the 5th set vs. verdasco and yet, 'tough era Roddick' was ranked top 5. GOAT. :twisted:
Even roddick told fed to forget about his losing records but the fed turkey enjoyed his own lameness & criminal shoving attempt on legend djoko!

Fed unpleasantly lost in 2007 to level 3 players and the McEnroe brothers panicked hysterically. How bratty! To forget their self-deficiencies, they prayed over fed and grabbed his shoulder during practice sessions.

 

[monfed]

Nole has another 5 HC slams in him, 3 USO(incl 2014) + 2 AO so maybe he can equal/surpass Fed's HC slam tally. I think he'll end with 8. Fed might pick up another AO/USO, who knows.

 

[Jam]

yes I agree roughly with Monfed. I think Djokovic will probably have around 8 and be pretty much level with Sampras. Not within the realms of possibility that he wins 9 or even 10 but at the moment it's likely Fed will retain the HC crown. Djokovic isn't getting younger and has Murray, Nadal, Wawrinka and future young players to contend with. It's very likely that Murray and Nadal will win again, Wawrinka is difficult to predict but on current form could do, while people like Berdych could finally step up as could Raonic, Dimitrov, Jancowicz, Nishikori and Isner. The competition is becoming a bit harder as the others are gradually improving and Djokovic is now 27.

And never say never against Federer. He could still win one.

 

[THUNDERVOLLEY]

Seems like a certain member--using another name--is trying to cheerlead for Djokovic by starting this thread.

 

[SpicyCurry1990]

Seems like a certain member--using another name--is trying to cheerlead for Djokovic by starting this thread.

Naw, Im just new, been lurking for a while. I used to post mainly on another Tennis forum, but the conversation moves very slowly there so I came over here. Was just genuinely interested in this conversation.

 

[uliks]

I'm leaning towards YES. He needs only one USO now IMO, to overtake Federer as HC GOAT...

 

[NatF]

No doubt now. Djokovic owns HC's.

 

[user]

Yep agree. As it looks right now, Federer and Djokovic will end up as the top 2 HC players of all time

If there was any doubt at the time you wrote this, it's gone now. And Djokovic still has some unfinished business at the USO.

 

[xFedal]

I have said since 2007 that Djoko was the only active player who could challenge Fed's records on hard. Now Fed has 9 slam titles on hard and 6 WTF titles. Djoko is already 27 and nowhere close to those stats but he's making top 5 on hc which is already a fantastic achievement.

Hard court titles overall: 1- Federer: 53
2- Agassi: 46
3- Connors: 43
4- Sampras: 36
5- Djoko: 34
(Those do not include carpet, which is not fair to guys like Lendl, McEnroe and Connors since lots of events were played on carpet instead of hard in their time. If you combine hc + carpet, the tally becomes quite different indeed and Fed would be nowhere near #1...)

The slam tally is also partial to recent times since USO was played on hard only from 1978 and AO from 1988:

1- Federer: 9
2- Sampras: 7
3- Agassi: 6
4- Djoko and Lendl: 5
(All of those players won both slams on hard)

YEC (was played on carpet before hc):

1- Federer: 6
2- Lendl and Sampras: 5
3- Nastase: 4 (3 of which on carpet)
4: Becker, McEnroe, Djoko: 3

For (current) masters, I included Paris indoor even though it was played on carpet in the 90s:

1- Agassi: 14 (+ 2 Paris indoor)
2- Fed: 15
3- Djoko: 14
4- Sampras: 8 (+ 2 Paris)
5- Murray: 9

(Note that Agassi and Fed are the only 2 players to have won all 6 masters on hard/carpet)

Winning % on hard (does not include carpet):
1- Connors: 82.7
2- Lendl and Djoko: 82.6
3- Federer and Laver: 82.5
4- McEnroe: 81.1
5- Sampras: 80.4
(only category where Djoko has passed Fed and of course it could change with aging)

I don't see a way to reasonably predict that Djoko will surpass Fed at this point (except most likely in master titles). It is not impossible but he's still far enough that one cannot say that it's likely either.
The main question for now is how close he will get over the next 5 years or so.

Novak is 1 slam away from tying Fed. 1 More USO could tie it and for some he would be the hc Goat.

 

[mattosgrant]

Well if he wins the U.S Open and WTF this year it is already very close.