Will Nadal be GOAT if he wins 4 slams in a row?

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Shady_Sawyer

Rookie
If Nadal wins AO 2011, he has the non calender slam or 4 slams in row something which Federer could never do in his career. Will Nadal become the GOAT or atleast a top 3 GOAT contender along with Laver and Federer if he wins AO 2011?
 
No. Still to early in his career to top Fed. If he wins 4 or 5 in a row, that's a great thing to have on his resume. But it still won't make up for the fact that Fed is at 16 majors and he''ll be at 10 or 11. It'll be years before Rafa has a real chance to pass Fed for GOAT status, if ever.
 
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Justin Side said:
No. Still to early in his career to top Fed. If he wins 4 or 5 in a row, that's a great thing to have on his resume. But it still won't make up for the fact that Fed is at 16 majors and he''ll be at 10 or 11. It'll be years before Rafa has a real chance to pass Fed for GOAT status, if ever.
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I dont think numbers matter a whole lot. People put Laver right up there with Federer as a GOAT contender and not Sampras eventhough Sampras has better numbers than Laver when it comes to slams. Its coz Laver has won 4 slams in a row twice and he has won on all surfaces at his time. Nadal could also win 4 in a row and has slams on all surfaces. Nadal would definitely be a top 3 or top 2 GOAT contender in the least.
 
Are you kidding?. Isnt he already a GOAT?

In any case, there is no accepted universal definition of GOAT. Most people however seem to accept Tennis_monk's GOAT definition as GOLD standard. Using that bench mark, while winning 4 slams in a row has weightage, it is equally important to have highest number of slams than any other player.
 
No, needs to catch Fed in total number; for instance he could win 6 in a row, but if that's all he ever won, I would still vote Fed. If he ties Fed in slams, I would give him the edge r/t head-to-head.
 
He'd need to dominate the tour the same way Federer did from 04-07 as far as I'm concerned. The number of Majors just seemed like yet another example of shifting the goalposts once Federer won his French Open.

Winning a 4th Major in a row would be a great start.
 
Hood_Man said:
The number of Majors just seemed like yet another example of shifting the goalposts once Federer won his French Open.
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I remember the necessity (coupled with the possibility of curse) of Federer passing the 14 number so that he can surpass Sampras had long been talked about before he won the French... Even though when Federer won the French he definitely had the advantage, I think the full recognition came when he won Wimbledon for a 15 afterwards.
 
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If Rafa wins 5 in a row then it means he'll have 11 slams by his 25th birthday. That makes Federer's 16 slams a non-issue because obviously Rafa would have plenty of time to pass that record simply by racking up Roland Garros titles thereafter. And even if he got 14 or 15 he still would be considered better than Federer because of winning 5 consecutive slams (that'd be the Open Era record for consecutive slams). And also the head2head with Federer is 14-7 and 6-2 in slams.
 
nadal_slam_king said:
If Rafa wins 5 in a row then it means he'll have 11 slams by his 25th birthday. That makes Federer's 16 slams a non-issue because obviously Rafa would have plenty of time to pass that record simply by racking up Roland Garros titles thereafter. And even if he got 14 or 15 he still would be considered better than Federer because of winning 5 consecutive slams (that'd be the Open Era record for consecutive slams). And also the head2head with Federer is 14-7 and 6-2 in slams.
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Completely irrelevant in the "GOAT" debate. He has ways to go. he needs to convincingly establish himself as an all surface player. Which would mean, consistently reaching finals at AO and USO. He's done very well at both Wimbly and of course Roland Garros, but he needs to establish himself more on hc, which includes indoor. So, he has a while to go, but I believe he will get there.
 
If he wins 5-6 consecutive majors everyone in media, comentators, etc will deam him the GOAT. Certainly total majors is not relavant, otherwise Roger is 100% not even close to being GOAT.
 
Shady_Sawyer said:
If Nadal wins AO 2011, he has the non calender slam or 4 slams in row something which Federer could never do in his career. Will Nadal become the GOAT or atleast a top 3 GOAT contender along with Laver and Federer if he wins AO 2011?
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Do you consider Serena as GOAT because she has a Serena Slam?

Some people already think Nadal is a top 2 GOAT contender, some don't. Either way, winning 4 slams in a row makes no difference, other than adding to his overall slam total.

nadal_slam_king said:
If Rafa wins 5 in a row then it means he'll have 11 slams by his 25th birthday. That makes Federer's 16 slams a non-issue because obviously Rafa would have plenty of time to pass that record simply by racking up Roland Garros titles thereafter. And even if he got 14 or 15 he still would be considered better than Federer because of winning 5 consecutive slams (that'd be the Open Era record for consecutive slams). And also the head2head with Federer is 14-7 and 6-2 in slams.
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11 slams by age 25 is no guarantee of anything other than 11 slams :-)

I would agree that Nadal would be likely to get some more, but who knows how many he will end up with, and indeed, who knows how many Fed will end up with. When both their careers are over, we will know.

If they end up with the same number, I would give the edge to Nadal because of olympic singles gold, masters shields, and h2h. To me those things are worth 1.5 slams. So even if Nadal ends up with 1 slam less than Fed, I would give GOAT to Rafa. But if Fed ends up 2 or more slams better, Fed keeps GOAT.
 
nadal_slam_king said:
If Rafa wins 5 in a row then it means he'll have 11 slams by his 25th birthday. That makes Federer's 16 slams a non-issue because obviously Rafa would have plenty of time to pass that record simply by racking up Roland Garros titles thereafter. And even if he got 14 or 15 he still would be considered better than Federer because of winning 5 consecutive slams (that'd be the Open Era record for consecutive slams). And also the head2head with Federer is 14-7 and 6-2 in slams.
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Lol at 16 slams being a "non-issue." Yeah, 5 grand slam titles on top of 2 more consecutive grand slam titles is just a given, no?

Anyway, realistically, the only way Nadal would be GOAT in my eyes by the end of 2011 is if he goes 84-0 in sets in grand slams and reaches an even higher level than before by adding a new element to his game, such as playing silent, flattening out more and owning on hard courts like never before, or some other improvement like the faster serve. Seriously, though, if he played silent, I would become a much bigger fan.
 
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The media and general population would deam him "GOAT", no one can agree on the criterion. As a result you can't say what makes GOAT, many opinion on who the GOAT is.
 
Nadal will have to win a calender slam and be at 17+ slams by the time he retires for the debate to end. Otherwise you will still have haters and "Yeah, but..." arguments.
 
grimmbomb21 said:
Nadal will have to win a calender slam and be at 17+ slams by the time he retires for the debate to end. Otherwise you will still have haters and "Yeah, but..." arguments.
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That would only be here, these people don't live in reality. They don't talk like this in the real world either, unless they get beat up a lot and play a lot of video games LOL
 
Winning 4 in a row is great but is it better than having 5 or 6 not in a row?

I would take the bigger number of slams though the attention he would get would be extreme.
I don't even want to think about the trolls and all past trolls who ever lived overloading the internet.
 
Another poster said this, but I will as well: While Nadal does have titles at both hardcourt majors, he's only made the final one time in each of those majors. While I will never be one to say this, some people could argue that those titles were a fluke if he never makes it to another final or a win, especially the USO since he didn't face (in my mind) a truly difficult opponent till the final.

After all, Federer does have 3 finals to back up his Roland Garros win, and it could be very convincingly argued that Nadal is the only thing standing in his way of 21 or more majors. Realistically, Federer has performed at a very high level no matter the tournament, and consistently high levels at all tournaments. Nadal has never shown Federer's level of hardcourt dominance with the grass dominance, and near dominance on clay (hell, the guy was the second best clay court player for 2-3 years, only ever being stopped by Nadal himself, so realistically no Nadal= total Federer domination for 3-4 years)

Nadal has shown a serious ability to dominate on clay, but not any other surface (he's successful at wimbledon but doesn't always back that up at queens, though Federer most definitely does at Halle)

In my mind, Nadal has to dominate, and show consistenly top tier results for several years to come. This was his best year, I think, in terms of w/l ratio, and I believe that Federer's had two or three seasons with a higher ratio.. So while Nadal's performance in the majors mirrors that of his Rival, Federer dominated the whole season in a way that Nadal hasn't, and may never, do.
 
If he wins AO next year, ballerina can quit this sport immediately, because the question of who's the GOAT will be closed for good.
 
It'd be nice too see him win in Melbourne in the new year. Especially if he plays like he did at the 2009 AO or the 2010 US. Or, even better :shock:

GOAT it does not make him, though. But it doesn't hurt :lol:
 
nadalbestclass said:
Completely irrelevant in the "GOAT" debate. He has ways to go. he needs to convincingly establish himself as an all surface player. Which would mean, consistently reaching finals at AO and USO. He's done very well at both Wimbly and of course Roland Garros, but he needs to establish himself more on hc, which includes indoor. So, he has a while to go, but I believe he will get there.
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To me this is the heart of the debate. Look at both players on each surface. Obviously Rafa is the better clay court player. But would any tennis expert make the argument that Rafa is a better grass or hard court player than Federer? Even past his prime, I would argue Federer has a better game on grass and hard court. Rafa needs to win more hard court majors to be in the discussion for greatest of all time and even then, he would be hard-pressed to be considered better than Roger on grass and hard courts in his prime. I love Rafa but he's not there quite yet...even if he wins AO 2011.
 
R0NIN said:
To me this is the heart of the debate. Look at both players on each surface. Obviously Rafa is the better clay court player. But would any tennis expert make the argument that Rafa is a better grass or hard court player than Federer? Even past his prime, I would argue Federer has a better game on grass and hard court. Rafa needs to win more hard court majors to be in the discussion for greatest of all time and even then, he would be hard-pressed to be considered better than Roger on grass and hard courts in his prime. I love Rafa but he's not there quite yet...even if he wins AO 2011.
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I see what you are saying, but Nadal would first have to approach the slam count. I also believe Rafa has the tools to establish himself as an awesome player on grass. If Nadal's slam count gets very close to Fed's +/- 1-2 slam titles, then absolutely H2H will matter but he's at 9 right now, and that's significantly far from 16(?). Of course consistently making finals at Majors and Masters events is also a big factor. I think next year can be a wonderful year for him, and really help him catch up. To some people of course Fed will always be the greatest, but if we are looking at numbers, then it will make a big difference. Also, I think WTF titles are KEY. They show that you can perform well against the top 8 people on the tour, rubbishing claims about "easy" slam wins. Just my opinion.
 
nadalbestclass said:
I see what you are saying, but Nadal would first have to approach the slam count. I also believe Rafa has the tools to establish himself as an awesome player on grass. If Nadal's slam count gets very close to Fed's +/- 1-2 slam titles, then absolutely H2H will matter but he's at 9 right now, and that's significantly far from 16(?). Of course consistently making finals at Majors and Masters events is also a big factor. I think next year can be a wonderful year for him, and really help him catch up. To some people of course Fed will always be the greatest, but if we are looking at numbers, then it will make a big difference. Also, I think WTF titles are KEY. They show that you can perform well against the top 8 people on the tour, rubbishing claims about "easy" slam wins. Just my opinion.
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The H2H will only come into account if he actually come close to reproducing not only the number, but the diversity of Federer. If he wins another 5 RG, then that means absolutely nothing. He would have 14 slams which would look great, but no one in their right mind would say wow he is better than Federer if he has 9 RG, 2 Wim, 1 AO, and 1 USO.
 
No.
Rafa has to overtake Fed´s number of majors titles.
If he wins the calender grand slam but still has less GS titles than Fed, he´s NOT.
He needs to win more majors in his career than Fed otherwise he´ll never be the GOAT in my book.

Even though it´s hard to tell at this stage of his career if he´s going to do that.
But I think if he stays healthy he can do it because he´s also still pretty young.
 
Jchurch said:
The H2H will only come into account if he actually come close to reproducing not only the number, but the diversity of Federer. If he wins another 5 RG, then that means absolutely nothing. He would have 14 slams which would look great, but no one in their right mind would say wow he is better than Federer if he has 9 RG, 2 Wim, 1 AO, and 1 USO.
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First, I don't see him winning a RG every year for the next 5-6 years. Secondly, if that were to miraculously happen, it would show a RIDICULOUS amount of dominance on a single surface, which is really quite awesome. Winning that many slams on a single surface itself compensates for a "lack of diversity". Fact is that if he won 9 USOs and a mixed bag with the rest, there would be less complaining(not saying by you necessarily). People are constantly discounting clay, don't know if it has to do with Nadal or a general dislike for the surface. Finally, if he manages to dominate RG in that way, there is no doubt in my mind that his wins at Wimbly/USO/AO will not remain at the number they are right now.

Also, your number add up to 13 slams, significantly far from Roger's number. He would have to have 15 at least.
 
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Shady_Sawyer said:
If Nadal wins AO 2011, he has the non calender slam or 4 slams in row something which Federer could never do in his career. Will Nadal become the GOAT or atleast a top 3 GOAT contender along with Laver and Federer if he wins AO 2011?
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He cannot win 4 slams in a row at the moment.

He missed Cincinnati.
 
nadalbestclass said:
First, I don't see him winning a RG every year for the next 5-6 years. Secondly, if that were to miraculously happen, it would show a RIDICULOUS amount of dominance on a single surface, which is really quite awesome. Winning that many slams on a single surface itself compensates for a "lack of diversity". Fact is that if he won 9 USOs and a mixed bag with the rest, there would be less complaining(not saying by you necessarily). People are constantly discounting clay, don't know if it has to do with Nadal or a general dislike for the surface. Finally, if he manages to dominate RG in that way, there is no doubt in my mind that his wins at Wimbly/USO/AO will not remain at the number they are right now.
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While I will agree that people do underestimate clay, there still isn't as much competition on it as there is hard court. No I don't think 9 at any one event will overshadow a lack of accomplishments at the other slams. Nadal must make it to many more HC Finals to even be considered top tier. In fact, winning 9 RG would more or less prove that Nadal is a clay courter who has had patchy success on hard court.
 
Jchurch said:
While I will agree that people do underestimate clay, there still isn't as much competition on it as there is hard court. No I don't think 9 at any one event will overshadow a lack of accomplishments at the other slams. Nadal must make it to many more HC Finals to even be considered top tier. In fact, winning 9 RG would more or less prove that Nadal is a clay courter who has had patchy success on hard court.
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Exactly! And why isn't there? If HC is superior to clay, as so many on these boards claim, why is it that with so much competition on HCs people are not able to dominate on clay? I am not attacking you btw, like I said, if he somehow won 9 RG that would still leave 6-7 distributed among the rest. Plus, I stick by my final point, that if he were to win another 4(?) RG he will also be winning at the other slams. I expect his performance at Wimbledon to improve as well.
 
dlk said:
No. He needs to pass Fed in slams, which he will do.
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But he has to do it without relieing on RG.

If he ends up with 10-11 RG's wins and only 5 or 6 other grandslam wins I think that will make him the best ever on clay but not even close to the GOAT.

-Steven
 
nadalbestclass said:
Exactly! And why isn't there? If HC is superior to clay, as so many on these boards claim, why is it that with so much competition on HCs people are not able to dominate on clay? I am not attacking you btw, like I said, if he somehow won 9 RG that would still leave 6-7 distributed among the rest. Plus, I stick by my final point, that if he were to win another 4(?) RG he will also be winning at the other slams. I expect his performance at Wimbledon to improve as well.
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The reason there are more formidable opponents on HC is that there are many more HC. There isn't an easily accesible clay court near me at all. But believe me I wish there was. It would be great to see some Americans with the ability to construct a point.
 
stevenwags987 said:
But he has to do it without relieing on RG.

If he ends up with 10-11 RG's wins and only 5 or 6 other grandslam wins I think that will make him the best ever on clay but not even close to the GOAT.

-Steven
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I don't think he'll get 10 RG w/o winning at least 10 of the others.
 
Pushmaster said:
I don't think Nadal has to pass Federer, just tie him. Nadal's winning head to head record against Federer would still give him the GOAT.
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He has a winning recored against him because they would only compete on clay for the longest time.

If Nadal was "good enough" to have made more finals with Federer on HC's while Fed was on his 3-4 year riegn of tennis, im pretty sure everyone would agree that Fed would be the one with the winning recored against Nadal.

Simple fact is that Federer was good enough to make finals against Nadal on clay, and Nadal was not good enough to make the finals against Federer on hardcourt.

-Steven
 
If he wins the AO it’ll be one more open era record that he’s accomplished that Fed couldn’t.

If Nadal doesn’t pass him in the slams mark, I would still put him as the GOAT *if* he can substitute by doing the following:

Winning the gold medal again at the 2012 olympics
Winning Miami and Cinnci to complete his sweep of all the Masters Titles.

I’m different than most however. Most look strictly at slam results only. Since pro tennis is played for more than 8 weeks of the year, I like to look at the whole body of results. Masters events are pretty tough.
 
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