Wilson Pro Staff 6.0 85

VGP

Legend
Is it allowed to use a 2handed bhand with this frame??

;)


According to many people on this board, you're not even allowed to look a PS85.....unless you want to cast yourself into abject obsolescence.

I revel in its red and yellow black-backgrounded pinstripeyness!
 

Hooked

Rookie
Played a singles match with the PS85. 1st set I lost 6-4. Switched back to my oval beam, 100 sq. in. tweener and bageled the guy.

The 85 is a nostalgia item. Wake up folks.......

Sorry. Must have fallen asleep there. You are probably just not used to the smaller head size. If you were hitting in the middle, the results would not have changed as drastically. Spend more time with the PS85. Your game will only improve with time even if you only practice with it.
 

CDestroyer

Professional
Played a singles match with the PS85. 1st set I lost 6-4. Switched back to my oval beam, 100 sq. in. tweener and bageled the guy.

The 85 is a nostalgia item. Wake up folks.......

I agree with you 100%.

If Sampras, Edberg and Courier all use larger head sizes now that spin has greatly increased, it surely makes sense that the club player do the same.

Im sure Breakpoint and VGP and the other delusional goons that use that racquet are much better than the Hall of Famers.:twisted:
 

Hooked

Rookie
I agree with you 100%.

If Sampras, Edberg and Courier all use larger head sizes now that spin has greatly increased, it surely makes sense that the club player do the same.

Im sure Breakpoint and VGP and the other delusional goons that use that racquet are much better than the Hall of Famers.:twisted:

There are pros and cons to all size frames and everyone must decide what trade-offs they are willing to make to best suite their game. The biggest issue I have with some of these comments is that the smaller, heavier frames are some how "out of date" and that larger lighter frames are "modern." It is pretty simple physics; head size, weight, balance, swing weight and flexibility. They all affect every frame and bring with them a compromise on their respective spectrums (usually control versus power). To me a "modern" racquet is one that is not made out of wood.

Speaking of wood, Jim Courrier and other high profile former pros recommend that developing players use a wood frame to learn the game as it forces good tennis basics; footwork, setup, timing and so forth. I would argue that the PS85 and KPS88 are great racquets for player development too, as they are not as difficult to play as wooden frames, but do force players to pay closer attention to the tennis basics than most larger, lighter frames do. Some of the junk that people hit with these larger, lighter frames seems to be reinforcing poor habits; planted feet, half-swings, punch shots and baseline volleys just to name a few I see frequently. You may not enjoy playing with smaller, heavier frames but that doesn't mean you shouldn't understand and respect why others do.
 

VGP

Legend
I agree with you 100%.

If Sampras, Edberg and Courier all use larger head sizes now that spin has greatly increased, it surely makes sense that the club player do the same.

Im sure Breakpoint and VGP and the other delusional goons that use that racquet are much better than the Hall of Famers.:twisted:

Hmmm. Didn't know you had such a strong stance on my choice of frames.

Since spin has increased, "club players should do the same" to switch to a larger head size - like that's the only important variable. I've seen enough club players to know that it wouldn't matter what frame they have in their hands and what string they have in their frames.

I don't care what the HOFers use. Most of them get paid to have new gear in their hands when they show up on TV. For how I play and who I play against, me and my midsizes do just fine. To be clear, it's not even the PS85 that I use any more. It's the Wilson Graphite Force Midsize, the PS85's older, "junkier" cousin with tightly strung 15L gauge nylon. Plain and simple. You can ridicule me on that too.

Honestly, I go by my results and wallet make my decision on what I use. I've tried out "modern" frames and "modern" strings. The BLX90, the upcoming PS90. Dunlop 200g frames. The Babolat Aeropro Drive. Various 93s, 95s and 98s.....etc.

If I had the inclination and money to burn, I'd maybe switch to the Babolat Aeropro Drive, but side by side, I still enjoy, and play equally well, if not better, with my Graphite Force. I've actively tried to find something I enjoy better and haven't found it yet. To people in the real world, it's a non-issue. I'm a tennis nobody - as are 99.99% of people on this board and in the tennis playing world.

I just post about what I like and share my experiences. I like talking about the PS85 as I've used it for a long time, but I don't go around telling other people what they "should" be using.

The only people that should care to emulate what the pros are using are high-level juniors aspiring to be pros, collegiate players earning their keep on their team, and anyone that makes a living based largely, if not purely, on playing tennis.
 

pixy

New User
Hmmm. Didn't know you had such a strong stance on my choice of frames.

Since spin has increased, "club players should do the same" to switch to a larger head size - like that's the only important variable. I've seen enough club players to know that it wouldn't matter what frame they have in their hands and what string they have in their frames.

I don't care what the HOFers use. Most of them get paid to have new gear in their hands when they show up on TV. For how I play and who I play against, me and my midsizes do just fine. To be clear, it's not even the PS85 that I use any more. It's the Wilson Graphite Force Midsize, the PS85's older, "junkier" cousin with tightly strung 15L gauge nylon. Plain and simple. You can ridicule me on that too.

Honestly, I go by my results and wallet make my decision on what I use. I've tried out "modern" frames and "modern" strings. The BLX90, the upcoming PS90. Dunlop 200g frames. The Babolat Aeropro Drive. Various 93s, 95s and 98s.....etc.

If I had the inclination and money to burn, I'd maybe switch to the Babolat Aeropro Drive, but side by side, I still enjoy, and play equally well, if not better, with my Graphite Force. I've actively tried to find something I enjoy better and haven't found it yet. To people in the real world, it's a non-issue. I'm a tennis nobody - as are 99.99% of people on this board and in the tennis playing world.

I just post about what I like and share my experiences. I like talking about the PS85 as I've used it for a long time, but I don't go around telling other people what they "should" be using.

The only people that should care to emulate what the pros are using are high-level juniors aspiring to be pros, collegiate players earning their keep on their team, and anyone that makes a living based largely, if not purely, on playing tennis.

Where is the LIKE button so i can press it :)
 

klementine

Hall of Fame
VGP... excellent post.. articulate.. thoughtful... and most important.. respectful. (unlike some posters).

I might not agree with everyone but as is true most of the time ... it's not what you say.. but how you say it.
 

Hankenstein

Hall of Fame
I tried the new PS6.0 85 from 2011 batch and compared to a 1987 St Vincent-frame with same setup as the 2011 (strings, grips, tension etc) and the St Vincent feels a tad more solid, more crisp.

For my game, the PS 85 was not working well and I play much topspin with a western grip (wanted to buy an Eastern-grip but found no for sale,,, ;) ) I´m not a rookie or anything, I presume my NRTP is something similar to 6.0 (i have a decent national ranking here in Sweden) but I play so much better with a frame with bigger headsize. I also had one of my hitting partners, a guy ranked 50 in Sweden, try the racquet and he used to play with that frame when he was younger and he said it was nice and all, but that the frames of today gives much more help and equal power and control.

Sure, it´s not the scalpel-feeling in the +95 sq inch modern frames that it is in the PS 6.0 85, but overall, a modern frame feels (for me atleast) better in every category then the PS 6.0
 

mad dog1

G.O.A.T.
I tried the new PS6.0 85 from 2011 batch and compared to a 1987 St Vincent-frame with same setup as the 2011 (strings, grips, tension etc) and the St Vincent feels a tad more solid, more crisp.

For my game, the PS 85 was not working well and I play much topspin with a western grip (wanted to buy an Eastern-grip but found no for sale,,, ;) ) I´m not a rookie or anything, I presume my NRTP is something similar to 6.0 (i have a decent national ranking here in Sweden) but I play so much better with a frame with bigger headsize. I also had one of my hitting partners, a guy ranked 50 in Sweden, try the racquet and he used to play with that frame when he was younger and he said it was nice and all, but that the frames of today gives much more help and equal power and control.

Sure, it´s not the scalpel-feeling in the +95 sq inch modern frames that it is in the PS 6.0 85, but overall, a modern frame feels (for me atleast) better in every category then the PS 6.0

this is from Hankenstein's blog translated from Swedish to English using Google Translate:

What has Pete Sampras, Jim Courier, Roger Federer, Stefan Edberg, Chris Evert and Mary Pierce in common? Difficult, is not it! The common denominator for these players is that they all lirat with one of history's most classic tennis racket. Wilson Pro Staff 6.0 85

This amazing success bat saw light of the world the first time in 1982 in Illinois, specifically in the Wilsons River Grove factory. The first Pro Staff actually had a 110 square inch large face but realativ soon as it produced even in the 85 sq.inch and the entire 125 sq.inch. The bigger hit areas were phased relativit quickly out of production while the 85 sq.inch large clubface survived along with a 95 sq.inch big brother.
The player who made Pro Staff 6.0 85 best known is Pete Sampras, who throughout his active career retained the original design from 1983. Widely known is often hears that many pros are using an old design, but with modern painting, but Sampras was so delicate with his equipment that he is not accepted in other than original design. Pete was faktistk so sensitive that he even demanded that they used a minimal amount of paint as they painted the red Wilson logo on the strings, unless this was the balance of the racket wrong. Now we speak thus slightly half a gram in weight ...

From 1984 to 1991 made the Pro Staff frames in a factory in the Caribbean, specifically in St. Vincent & the Grenadines. Here was working extremely closely with their craft and they were competing internally over who received at least wrong with it the manufactures. It was therefore almost no limits were rejected in the production and quality was extremely good.
However, it was one thing that made them St. Vincent-made frames unique. In time, forms the cast frameworks in the worn and not quite closed tightly during the "baking" in the oven. That's why frame widths 18 mm instead of the original 17 mm. This seems in any case, Sampras was very important and when the factory closed in 1991 so he vacuumed (or rather some poor Wilson) Market at St. Vincent-made frames so that Sampras could sleep peacefully. Although Jim Courier did the same thing, but on their own, and in their garages learn there may be a couple of boxes new St. Vincent-frames.
On the various forums and auction sites around the world have these rackets have reached almost cult status and secondhand price is between 250 and up to $ 1,500 for Used bats .... Crazy! Wilson, however, realized that there was a pent-up need that guy all over the world want new Pro Staff 6.0 85's to play with and have therefore produced an edition of them again, according to the original recipe from 1982. The first edition came only to the U.S. and sold out in two days. Now they have released an edition and also the start to go into the reserve tank already, after only a few weeks of sales.
Course was a material guy that I just had to buy me a bunch of the new framework, mostly just to get to know the history. In order to compare with the original from the mid-80s, I had to borrow two pieces St. Vincent made Pro Staff 6.0 from 1987 by a good friend of mine. Happily and with half-broken wrist I went out into the valley in Taberg light gray rectangle with an emerging Wilson U.S. Open balls and began to feed baslinjeslag ....
First, we knew the original from -87. An overall very heavy bat, but most part of the weight sits at the bottom of the grip and therefore felt it is not particularly heavy when you swing it. The first meetings went on pure inspiration. BOOM BOOM BOOOOOOOOOOOM echoes in the hall when a day of exclusive eastern grip feeder straight before the event. The meeting is centered in the small sweetspoten and precision is like a scalpel in the hands of a skilled surgeon (get me right now, I'm not anything but a happy exercise, but when you meet the right with the Pro Staff 6.0 so fly ball exactly where you like)
Quickly switching to the newly framework and here you notice a difference immediately. Sure, weight, balance, etc. the same in the two frameworks, but the elderly are somehow more pure in feeling. The newly probably would all do well a little lead on the sides of the face in order to stabilize it against any miss-hits.
The test continues with regular exchanges between the generations and it is just that little bit little that separates them. Barely noticeable, but the older part is a little bit more stable in a sense. If it is that it has lost its original stiffness and better parry my little miss-hits, or if it is 18 instead of 17 mm wide frame, or if it is different for graphite / Kevlar materials 1987 to 2011 I do not know, but a small difference, it is in all cases.
Who is it one of these classics can fit into? Are you a baslinjegnetare as beaters before hand with an extreme Western grip which may Berasateguis forehand to act normal, and a Rear weight which had automatically made you a champion in Limbo that is not the Pro Staff 6.0 is for you. However, if you take the ball early, playing more traditional and hits the ball relatively flat and want to have good control, then these newly produced 6.0: or fit your game. Serve and Volley is ridiculously stable with this bat and the weight of the frame enables you to have a very heavy serve.
Will I continue to play with this framework? NO! I am unfortunately that limbo dancing dude who has a grip like Berasateguis and it feels not quite right with this racket ..
Well, that's right ... If anyone is hungry so I now have three pieces of these for sale. Two pieces completely new, even more stringent and a pc with a multi-stranded filaments late and in mint condition. Grip 4 at all three bat are.

MERRY CHRISTMAS!
 

Xfimpg

Professional
Hmmm. Didn't know you had such a strong stance on my choice of frames.

Since spin has increased, "club players should do the same" to switch to a larger head size - like that's the only important variable. I've seen enough club players to know that it wouldn't matter what frame they have in their hands and what string they have in their frames.

I don't care what the HOFers use. Most of them get paid to have new gear in their hands when they show up on TV. For how I play and who I play against, me and my midsizes do just fine. To be clear, it's not even the PS85 that I use any more. It's the Wilson Graphite Force Midsize, the PS85's older, "junkier" cousin with tightly strung 15L gauge nylon. Plain and simple. You can ridicule me on that too.

Honestly, I go by my results and wallet make my decision on what I use. I've tried out "modern" frames and "modern" strings. The BLX90, the upcoming PS90. Dunlop 200g frames. The Babolat Aeropro Drive. Various 93s, 95s and 98s.....etc.

If I had the inclination and money to burn, I'd maybe switch to the Babolat Aeropro Drive, but side by side, I still enjoy, and play equally well, if not better, with my Graphite Force. I've actively tried to find something I enjoy better and haven't found it yet. To people in the real world, it's a non-issue. I'm a tennis nobody - as are 99.99% of people on this board and in the tennis playing world.

I just post about what I like and share my experiences. I like talking about the PS85 as I've used it for a long time, but I don't go around telling other people what they "should" be using.

The only people that should care to emulate what the pros are using are high-level juniors aspiring to be pros, collegiate players earning their keep on their team, and anyone that makes a living based largely, if not purely, on playing tennis.

I may get flamed for resurrecting this post, but here goes...

Agree 100% with you; I play for fun, not for winning. If I win, it's a bonus. I care only about the pleasure the racquet gives me when I sweetspot it perfectly. This is why after 15 years of no tennis i tried a bunch of newer racquets and none of them matches the PS85 for pure hitting pleasure.
 
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Grinch

Rookie
I may get flamed for resurrecting this post, but here goes...

Agree 100% with you; I play for fun, not for winning. If I win, it's a bonus. I care only about the pleasure the racquet gives me when I sweetspot it perfectly. This is why after 15 years of no tennis i tried a bunch of newer racquets and none of them matches the PS85 for pure hitting pleasure.

Xfimpg -- Nobody flamed you, so I'll take my chances on being flamed ... It's more than 3 years since your last post here, but I can't resist re-resurrecting it after hitting with a friend last week. We spent our first 15 minutes warming up with a Wilson Jack Kramer and a Donnay Allwood Borg Superlight. We fought over who got more time with Borg's Allwood. After we put those wooden gems back in their museum cases, we spent the next 30 minutes ramping up the pace with a PS85 and a Max 200G. We actually considered playing a set with these, but we thought that might spoil the experience. There are actually some wackos like us who get pure joy from 20+ stroke rallies which end only in bragging rights and not a game score. He preferred the cut and thrust of Pistol Pete's PS85 sabre, while I preferred the flexible tenderness of Johnny Mac's foil. But we hit with both to appreciate how each racket forced us to adapt our strokes and footwork differently. Can't think of two more different swords made from the same material. Then we figured it was time to keep score, so we picked up our "normal" weapons, a Pure Aero and an EXO3 Tour 100, and played three sets. The older EXO3 beat the new Aero in the third set. We are both totally convinced that the warmup with the classics made us so much better at swatting those 100 sq inch magic wands. I fall in the middle of this endless debate -- I'm not good enough to consider playing a tournament with an archeological find (unless it's a woody tourney where everyone has to hit wood). But that doesn't mean we can't still have fun playing with them (and possibly learning something about my slowing footwork and decaying swing mechanics). Many thanks to everyone on this old post who inspired me to restore (strings and grips) and actually start playing (not competing) with many of my collectibles of various PS85s/90s', POGs and Longbodies, an old Prestige, old Radicals, Andre's ProOne, Jimbo's T2000, Arthur's Head Competition, and of course the woodies such as a the Rod's great Forte, the Allwood, Kramer, TadDavis, Kramer, Smith. Stay swinging, my friends.
 
What's the best way to compare this classic to today's rackets? I'll try using a car as an example

The mercedes C class from 1994 was a classic and something special. You could feel bumps on the road and at 160 tempo the engine was so loud that you could barely hear the radio on. The new c class is lighter, much more comfortable you drive on bad roads without noticing it the noise insulation is unbelievable you drive 180 and you don't notice it in the interior
 

Rally

Professional
I'm having a lot of fun with my reissues. Got my matched pair back in November, and I've been trying to play more and more over the last few months. They came in quite underspec annoyingly at 287 SW, 12 oz, 12.5 HL. I've added 2 grams of lead at 12 o clock (two 4" strips of 1/4" tape), and today I added 6 grams at 3 and 9 (four 6" strips of 1/4" tape). The racquet feels completely transformed after the 6 grams at 3 and 9. Before I still had exceptional feel, but the racquet felt a little gutless unless I was redlining. Rally balls were going in without a lot of bite, but as a tradeoff I had more precision on depth. After the 6 grams at 3 and 9, the racquet slaps almost as hard as my RF97, but it still swings as fast as my PS90s. My groundstrokes feel incredible, and I'm getting so much more pop and spin on my rally balls that I feel like I'm cheating. I'm having a little trouble dialing back the power when I'm going for low intensity warm up rallies because the PS85 still swings so freely, but when I'm playing with higher intensity it is just so much fun. The tradeoff is that I feel the extra weight a lot up at net and to a slightly lesser extent on overheads and serves. I feel a little tenderness in my wrist from trying to support the racquet weight for volleys. I think I need to hit the gym and work on my rotator cuff muscles so I protect myself from injury. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the unstrung swing weight after all the lead should be in the 304-305 range (2 * 3.3 SW from 2g at 12 and 1.8 * 6 from 6g at 3&9). I still have 16G Forten Sweet synthetic gut at 55 lbs in the mains (much looser now) which I'm guessing bumps up the SW by another 25 for roughly 330 SW, and I'll string it up with Luxilon 16G natural gut at 47 lbs in the mains and 16L Wilson Revolve at 44 lbs in the crosses which I think will bump up the SW by 30 for roughly 335 SW.

I'm considering reducing the weight at 3 and 9 by a gram, but I'm going to keep the weight the same for another 2 or 3 hours of hitting before I make any changes. Have you guys ever gotten close to or slightly beyond your originally perceived limit on weight/swing weight/twist weight, and were there any fitness changes you made to try to adjust to the weight?
 

morten

Hall of Fame
I'm having a lot of fun with my reissues. Got my matched pair back in November, and I've been trying to play more and more over the last few months. They came in quite underspec annoyingly at 287 SW, 12 oz, 12.5 HL. I've added 2 grams of lead at 12 o clock (two 4" strips of 1/4" tape), and today I added 6 grams at 3 and 9 (four 6" strips of 1/4" tape). The racquet feels completely transformed after the 6 grams at 3 and 9. Before I still had exceptional feel, but the racquet felt a little gutless unless I was redlining. Rally balls were going in without a lot of bite, but as a tradeoff I had more precision on depth. After the 6 grams at 3 and 9, the racquet slaps almost as hard as my RF97, but it still swings as fast as my PS90s. My groundstrokes feel incredible, and I'm getting so much more pop and spin on my rally balls that I feel like I'm cheating. I'm having a little trouble dialing back the power when I'm going for low intensity warm up rallies because the PS85 still swings so freely, but when I'm playing with higher intensity it is just so much fun. The tradeoff is that I feel the extra weight a lot up at net and to a slightly lesser extent on overheads and serves. I feel a little tenderness in my wrist from trying to support the racquet weight for volleys. I think I need to hit the gym and work on my rotator cuff muscles so I protect myself from injury. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the unstrung swing weight after all the lead should be in the 304-305 range (2 * 3.3 SW from 2g at 12 and 1.8 * 6 from 6g at 3&9). I still have 16G Forten Sweet synthetic gut at 55 lbs in the mains (much looser now) which I'm guessing bumps up the SW by another 25 for roughly 330 SW, and I'll string it up with Luxilon 16G natural gut at 47 lbs in the mains and 16L Wilson Revolve at 44 lbs in the crosses which I think will bump up the SW by 30 for roughly 335 SW.

I'm considering reducing the weight at 3 and 9 by a gram, but I'm going to keep the weight the same for another 2 or 3 hours of hitting before I make any changes. Have you guys ever gotten close to or slightly beyond your originally perceived limit on weight/swing weight/twist weight, and were there any fitness changes you made to try to adjust to the weight?
Personally i like lower swingweight more, yes 285-287 unstrung, i ordered specificly that in my matched pair, i have 7(!) Ps85s from before too, original(Taiwan, Chicago, China) that on some of them i have cut the bumper guards to get them right. I have a swingweight machine at home. I like the easy swing, and to me it is still stable at low swingweight.
 

Rally

Professional
Personally i like lower swingweight more, yes 285-287 unstrung, i ordered specificly that in my matched pair, i have 7(!) Ps85s from before too, original(Taiwan, Chicago, China) that on some of them i have cut the bumper guards to get them right. I have a swingweight machine at home. I like the easy swing, and to me it is still stable at low swingweight.
I struggle a little bit with keeping up my racquet head speed through contact and keeping the racquet stable through contact on every shot, so lower swing weights just don't work for me unfortunately. I like to think my strokes are long and smooth though, so I get a lot of value from 330-335 SW off the ground. I'm really trying to add S&V and an aggressive all-court volley game to my skillset, and that is probably why the higher SW is bothering me for the first time. The free power and spin from the higher SW makes my ground game lethal enough that I get much easier approaches, but my S&V or chip and charge feels worse because the racquet isn't as easy to maneuver. I'm hoping some dedicated rotator cuff and forearm time at the gym will make a difference, but like I said, I've never had this problem before so I don't know if I'm going about it the right way.
 

Rally

Professional
The reissues are on sale for $149.25 over the Labor Day weekend. If you haven't had the pleasure of hitting with the 6.0 85 yet, pick one up and fall in love with tennis all over again.
 
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