Wilson PS85 discussion thread...

VGP

Legend
Well, I'll kick off a thread discussing my favorite (and now officially discontinued) frame, the Wilson PS85.

I hope fellow PS85 lovers will chime in and hopefully keep the discussion healthy!
 

VGP

Legend
I wish.

Seems like Wilson's eggs are in the k90 and kPS88, rather the Federer and Sampras baskets, at the moment!


______


Also, I hope people could post pics of their beloved frames. I never tire of seeing these frames. New......and well used (loved).
 

VGP

Legend
Nice.

Looks like you really love playing with your frame. You've got an interesting placement of lead tape..... :)

I'll have to get some pics of my frames up.

Either that or I'll try and find the ones that I've already posted on the board.
 

meowmix

Hall of Fame
Question for you guys. In the second make of the Wilson Graphite Matrix, did Wilson keep the same mold as the PS 85, just without the PWS? Because somebody on these boards just sent me a PS85 clone, and the two don't match up...
 

VGP

Legend
meowmix - sorry, don't know much about the Wilson Graphite Matrix at all. I've only seen the black one with the red and white striping. It was of a mold similar to the Wilson Reflex that had a narrower throat shape.

plasma - as for the differences between the Taiwanese and Chinese PS85s, the Taiwanese is the same shape as the SV with the same drill pattern since the plastic parts are easily installed for both. The Chinese PS85 (and there are differences depending on age) has a slightly wider throat shape and has different cosmetic differences. Plus it's hard to install the plastic parts of a Chinese PS85 onto Chicago/SV/Taiwanese.

Perhaps I'll take some time to delineate the differences that I know of.....unless someone else would like to.......
 

dunno

Rookie
Nice.

Looks like you really love playing with your frame. You've got an interesting placement of lead tape..... :)

I'll have to get some pics of my frames up.

Either that or I'll try and find the ones that I've already posted on the board.
Actually I bought this one used lol. But my other one cracked, so yeah I definitely play 'em. And the lead tape like that works awesome, the balance is barely changed since now it's 11pts headlight instead of the stock 10. But it plays so much better with the lead.
 

gsquicksilver

Semi-Pro
Question for you guys. In the second make of the Wilson Graphite Matrix, did Wilson keep the same mold as the PS 85, just without the PWS? Because somebody on these boards just sent me a PS85 clone, and the two don't match up...
actually no. it's not the same mold as the ps85. if you compare the two, the matrix has a narrower throat area than the ps85.
 

hoodjem

G.O.A.T.
I believe that Wilson is still making both PS 85 and PS 95 racquets. Someone posted pics of a whole bunch of both hanging on the wall of a Asian shop on TT a week or two ago.

They all looked brand new.

I was tempted, but I've moved on.
 

dunno

Rookie
I believe that Wilson is still making both PS 85 and PS 95 racquets. Someone posted pics of a whole bunch of both hanging on the wall of a Asian shop on TT a week or two ago.

They all looked brand new.

I was tempted, but I've moved on.
Yeah I saw, buy maybe they are just New Old Stock? Also you couldn't buy them online could you?
 

jayserinos99

Hall of Fame
I just picked up a Chicago today via trade (Pure Drive Cortex). It's strung up way too tight...I will probably string it up with gut at 53 lbs. I plan on keeping this one as a nice hit from time to time.
 
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VGP

Legend
Hey, it's a "classic" now.

At least it's not the kPS88. :)

Its discontinuation makes me feel old school. Or just plain old.
 

meowmix

Hall of Fame
Is it just me, or does one of those 6.0's have a bit more of a rounded throat than the others? (your last pic VGP)
 

VGP

Legend
Is it just me, or does one of those 6.0's have a bit more of a rounded throat than the others? (your last pic VGP)
If you mean by how convex the profile is along the edge, then yes it is more rounded. Not by much but still. It also reflected the flash more in the pic. The finish on the bottom PS85 is more "polished" there. That's where I place my non-dominant hand when holding the racket.
 

gymrat76

Banned
Hey VGP!
It is great that you started this thread!!

I see that you set up the lead tape at 3&9 and higher in the frame. Which location you found to be more efficient?

What strings do you prefer and what lbs?

I put lead at 3&9 exactly as yours (or as in the Sampras' racquet pics from Greg Raven site) but just one layer and at 66lbs. Two or more layers of lead and it will be too powerful (which requires that I go higher in tension and my stringer doesn't to doing so:)

Also, how would you compare the KPS88 to PS85 feel-wise?

Thanks! :)
 

dunno

Rookie
I never looked at his thread, I just played around with the weight at the throat and it worked!

That's not abuse, sometimes you gotta teach 'em work ethic. :D
 

gymrat76

Banned
I never looked at his thread, I just played around with the weight at the throat and it worked!

That's not abuse, sometimes you gotta teach 'em work ethic. :D
Really? Hmmm...let me check it out for myself, then...
If i remember right, these you are playing with are the 95sq inch ones, right? Not the 85 sq inch one, correct?
 

Mick

Legend
I never looked at his thread, I just played around with the weight at the throat and it worked!

That's not abuse, sometimes you gotta teach 'em work ethic. :D
they say the lines on a man's face give him character. maybe the scratches on a racquet give it character too :)
 

dunno

Rookie
they say the lines on a man's face give him character. maybe the scratches on a racquet give it character too :)
That's exactly what I think about my rackets, and my guitars too. :)

Really? Hmmm...let me check it out for myself, then...
If i remember right, these you are playing with are the 95sq inch ones, right? Not the 85 sq inch one, correct?
Yeah the 95, before the weighting it was good but took a very fast swing to get any power and not so much stability. But now it's nice. I actually only have 1 prostaff, my other one cracked but hopefully the Yonex RDS 001 mid will be as similar to my 6.0 95 as it's specs suggest.
 

gymrat76

Banned
That's exactly what I think about my rackets, and my guitars too. :).

Yeah same goes with karate/fight sports belts as well..the dirtier, older they are...better it is...and of course, goes with wines as well :)

but for the least, can you get a new grip? lol
 

dunno

Rookie
lol, I didn't have any more of those Head grips so I just used it till it was dead. Then I tried using the leather grip underneath and almost ripped my hands apart! Gosh I need more of those nice soft grips.

edit: wait you like dirty wine lol?!
 

Jaxon

Rookie
Did you abuse your baby??? :shock:

And I see that you been to Cauthen's threads lol..Good luck with finding the secret that The Establishment been hiding from us! hahahahahhahaha
lol it says to put weight there on unique lead tapes (not mr C's idea)... I first thought mr Cauthaun or something knew a great deal about racquets. But someone soon showed me that he's been *****ing around a lot of different forums saying that his ideas were robbed by companies. Whether it is a car shape, structure of a motor, or in this case racquet. Don't believe me I don't care but I can now see that he is nothing but a crazy old man.
 

dunno

Rookie
Yeah that is true, it says on the package to put lead at 3 and 9, and in order to preserve the balance of the frame you should put the same amount of lead at the throat.

But I actually put probably 6 times as much on the throat as I did at 3 and 9.
 

gymrat76

Banned
Are you being sarcastic?
Hey VGP, did you see my post with questions about your lead/string setups?
Am just curious which lead set up you like more (3&9 or upper hoop) and your choice of tension/strings...
Am curious, because, I am NOT able to enjoy PS85s for any tension less than 65lbs (with lead set up such as yours) Because, I find the frame to be too powerful..Look forward to hearing your thoughts...
 

VGP

Legend
gymrat76 - sorry, missed your post on the lead tape setups....

For some reason, I gravitated to different setups for the different PS85s. The upper hoop feels better on the Taiwanese because those frames feel denser than the Chinese ones. As they are, they're about 13.7 ounces, 8 points headlight. Since they're heavier at the stock weight, the twistweight feels like it would get sluggish at 3 and 9.

For the Chinese, they definitely feel less dense. "Hollow" is how some people like to call it, in comparison to Chicago/SV/Taiwanese. These frames need the added stability at 3 and 9. Those frames are 13.1 ounces, 6 points headlight. I'm not super fond of these frames and haven't taken the time to tweak them further. I may try adding weight at the handle.....

As for strings, I like solid-core single wrap synthetics like PSGO 16. I just like the firm feel of the stringbed. I feel like they flatten the ball real good. Right now, the Taiwanese frames are strung with a similar string, Alpha MXT Synthetic Gut 16. at 65 pounds reference tension.

The Chinese frames are setup with Gamma Natural Gut 16 main, PSGO 16 crosses at 65 pounds reference tension.

I know what you mean about stringing at 65 pounds or more......that's just where I've ended up over the years. Good for spin, decent pop with control for serves, great control for volleys.
 

Azzurri

Legend
I just cut the headguard portion off to only allow room for the grommets and string. It should make the racquets more HL. I will try it out Friday. Its a Taiwan model...its ok compared to my SV racquets. If my SV werent so PRISTINE I would play them...damn!
 

VGP

Legend
Curious to see how much different it plays for you....

How much did you decrease the weight and how much more headlight did you get it?
 

Azzurri

Legend
Curious to see how much different it plays for you....

How much did you decrease the weight and how much more headlight did you get it?
I did what Drakulie did on his new KPS 88. I will leave the leather grip on for now. I assume 5 grams from the head. not sure of the HL.
 

morten

Hall of Fame
I did what Drakulie did on his new KPS 88. I will leave the leather grip on for now. I assume 5 grams from the head. not sure of the HL.
I plan on trimming the bumper too, leaving the leather.. Tell me how it works out for you :)
 

Azzurri

Legend
I plan on trimming the bumper too, leaving the leather.. Tell me how it works out for you :)
will know Friday. I plan to continue to S&V as I have changed my game. I just don't have the stamina (as of now) to run and run around on the court. I have become so used to playing doubles over the years that now I am mostly a singles player...way different.
 

gymrat76

Banned
gymrat76 - sorry, missed your post on the lead tape setups....

For some reason, I gravitated to different setups for the different PS85s. The upper hoop feels better on the Taiwanese because those frames feel denser than the Chinese ones. As they are, they're about 13.7 ounces, 8 points headlight. Since they're heavier at the stock weight, the twistweight feels like it would get sluggish at 3 and 9.

For the Chinese, they definitely feel less dense. "Hollow" is how some people like to call it, in comparison to Chicago/SV/Taiwanese. These frames need the added stability at 3 and 9. Those frames are 13.1 ounces, 6 points headlight. I'm not super fond of these frames and haven't taken the time to tweak them further. I may try adding weight at the handle.....

As for strings, I like solid-core single wrap synthetics like PSGO 16. I just like the firm feel of the stringbed. I feel like they flatten the ball real good. Right now, the Taiwanese frames are strung with a similar string, Alpha MXT Synthetic Gut 16. at 65 pounds reference tension.

The Chinese frames are setup with Gamma Natural Gut 16 main, PSGO 16 crosses at 65 pounds reference tension.

I know what you mean about stringing at 65 pounds or more......that's just where I've ended up over the years. Good for spin, decent

Well o.k..I am glad I am not the only one who likes to string around 65ish!
Because, I just see a tendency among people to string even at lower poundage such as low 40's, and it is known that Federer used to string it low as well. For me, the racquet shined at 66lbs.
All 3 racquets I have are SVs. Two bumperless one bumpered. I bought a new Chinese back in 03' I believe (which had no collectible status like it is now back then:) and was definitely hollow as you said, lighter and less stable.

The bumpered one definitely has a much lighter swingweight. I like playing with the more stable bumperless ones.

As much as I love PS85s, the feedback it gives you, that joy of flat hitting and painting the sidelines with it, I think it requires a full 2-3 hrs per day 3-4 days a week in order to fully enjoy it -which I am not able to do so- so I do better with current frames better these days. Moreover PS6.0 85 shines with net game, so I need to improve that as well.
Happy Hitting!
 

VGP

Legend
I had posted a suggestion of the "evolution" of the Wilson PS85 earlier and was hoping someone would chime in, but since no one has.....

I'll start with what I know.

Thanks to an image I'm borrowing from joe sch at woodtennis.com.....that's where it begins:



I'll leave out buttcap code letters as that seems to lead to confusion and there is debate as to the accuracy of origin determination.

The Chicago PS85:

- original bright yellow and red pinstriping
- bumperless construction
- grip size sticker, recommended tension sticker "String at 65-70 lbs." and specification sticker "Weight/Oz. 11.6-12.3 Unstrung - Balanced 1.0-1.5 in. headlight" inside one side of the throat
- three separate raised throat grommets
- Fairway leather grip
- White butt cap with large red "W" - no registered trade mark symbol
- red primer seen at grommet drill holes and through scratches in the top black coat
- Buttcap code located below red "W"
- pinstriping and "Midsize" on both sides of throat
- Wilson Pro Staff nylon racket bag with strap, no grip venting

Transition to St. Vincent (early-mid):
- Addition of "St. Vincent W.I" sticker above red "W" of buttcap (these are easily lost)
- Recommended tension sticker lowered to "String at 55-65 lbs."
- transition from bumperless construction to addition of bumperguard

St. Vincent (mid-late):
- Stickers replaced in throat to decals that describe Wilson PWS on one side, recommended tension on the other (50-60 lbs.) and higher/lower tension recommendation for control/power
- black rectangular grip size sticker placed at the outside of the throat above the handle
- throat grommets are thinner
- these have either "Midsize" decal on both sides of throat or one side has "80% braided graphite/20% kevlar" decal
- addition of red registered trademark symbol at lower right of "W" on butt cap
- "Wilson Quality" hologram sticker at base of throat opposite grip size sticker. Serial number in bold black font

Transition to Taiwan (early):
- loss of red primer to grey primer
- Butt cap code location moves above red "W"
- all cap "TAIWAN" sticker placed below "W" on butt cap
- Fairway leather grip

Taiwan (later)
- pinstriping color darker in tint
- recommended tension decal now has recommendation for using Wilson syn gut
- "Wilson Quality" hologram sticker now has bar code and small dot-matrix print
- Fairway leather grip
- Racket bag looks similar to original, but has grid-venting for grip

Transition to China
- same as late Taiwanese, but has all cap "CHINA" sticker below "W" on butt cap (use of last stock I assume)

Chinese PS85 (early)
- New design with wider throat and one-piece throat grommet
- slightly different drill pattern as the old grommets no longer easily fit
- White primer
- "Italicized" Pro Staff logo
- larger "PWS" at sides of head
- brighter, wideer pinstriping
- Fairway leather and white butt cap
- Throat decal has specs and square with "6.0" swing index info
- Racket bag matches fonts on racket with "braided" image on face

Chinese (mid)
- use of "Pro Staff 6.0" in Garamond font at face of throat
- transition from use of Fairway leather to Wilson leather
- transition from white butt cap to black butt cap with red square and small white Wilson "W"
- Racket bag matches the fonts and graphics of frame

Chinese (late and last)
- transition to silver specification decal at insides of throat
- use of generic Wilson Pro Staff racket bag


It's late and that's what I remember being the major (and some minor) changes to the Wilson PS85 over the years.

I'm sure some corrections and/or additions are in order, please feel free to discuss.....
 

Thaychua

Rookie
Thank for taking the time and listing all that. It's very helpful for others and will provide a good source for reference.

Correct me, IIRC, some of the ealiest SV have 65-70 string tension as well i believe.
 

jayserinos99

Hall of Fame
I just picked up a Chicago today via trade (Pure Drive Cortex). It's strung up way too tight...I will probably string it up with gut at 53 lbs. I plan on keeping this one as a nice hit from time to time.
I didn't string up the Chicago with natural gut but with MSV Hex 18L mains, Gosen OG Sheep Micro 18 crosses at 50 lbs. Added a leather grip and some power pads too. Played like I thought it would; a nice controlled stringbed that pocketed the ball decently. I wouldn't use this as my main stick, but I would definitely just play with this frame when I'm in the mood to s&v all the time.
 

VGP

Legend
You're welcome.....

You're right Thaychua. I think the high recommended tension labels are on the earliest SVs.

I forgot to add that a lot of these characteristics "bleed over" from one period to the next as Wilson changed their production over.

But there are features that will not be found on one frame or the other.....for example:

- a Chicago or St. Vincent PS85 will not have 6.0 anywhere on the frame.

- a Chinese PS85 will not have bumperless construction

....you get the idea.
 

VGP

Legend
Thaychua - I remember you have a great collection of classic frames....

I hope you don't mind, but I'm quoting a post of yours from the picture thread. It looks like you arranged your PS85s in sort of chronological order....

 
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