Win an ATP Title, Then Lose Your Next Match

stringertom

Bionic Poster
The staff scrambles to make a nice fresh space for Soonwoo Kwon after losing from ahead to Guido Pella 1R IW. This was not expected due to the Korean’s solid play two weeks ago at Nur-Sultan. He moves from Maiden Title club to WATLYNM despite looking solid in the first set of the 1-6 6-3 6-4 loss.
 
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Big_Dangerous

Talk Tennis Guru
Has the lodge made accommodations for teenage sensation and US Open champion, Emma Radacanu? Lost her first match since winning in New York to Sasnovich in the desert.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Has the lodge made accommodations for teenage sensation and US Open champion, Emma Radacanu? Lost her first match since winning in New York to Sasnovich in the desert.
Nope. No WTA, no junior slams, no Challengers, no dubs. ATP250 or above.

Good seeing you again! Chat and I update you? Vice versa of course too.
 

Big_Dangerous

Talk Tennis Guru
Nope. No WTA, no junior slams, no Challengers, no dubs. ATP250 or above.

Good seeing you again! Chat and I update you? Vice versa of course too.
Guess the game changed a bit, although I still feel we should include WTA at least.
Sure! Send me a message and let me know how you’re doing
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Was just joking around given the current economic climate and staff shortages everywhere.
Can we not discuss this further? I offered a solution. Do it or don’t do it. I have already asked the mods to add “Win an ATP Title…” specifically to the thread title to avoid confusion.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
The WATLYNM staff will be on high alert due to the possible guests arriving from either St.Petersburg or Vienna:

St. Petersburg:

Karatsev gets a bye but will face either Millman or WC Yshai Oliel (ISR) in his first match.

Vienna:

Jannik Sinner has a tall task in front of him when he immediately faces 6’11” Reilly Opelka in 1R action.

Also in Vienna, IW champion Cam Norrie has work to do in 1R when he takes on the veteran Marton Fucsovics.
 

Pmasterfunk

Hall of Fame
I know the thread is ATP only, but seeing Raducanu down a set and a breakpoint made me wonder if the lodge offered any special services or packages to players who lose 2 matches after winning a title, and if there are any notable examples of that.

Norrie canceled his stay with an emphatic second set performance against Marton Fucsovic. Sinner and Karatsev remain on lodge watch.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
The end of The Race for Karatsev came in a brutal fashion at the hands of a former WATLYNM guest, John Millman. 3&2 was totally unexpected.

We at the Lodge will take every step necessary to offer a soft landing from this unexpected result.
 

Checkmate

Legend
The end of The Race for Karatsev came in a brutal fashion at the hands of a former WATLYNM guest, John Millman. 3&2 was totally unexpected.

We at the Lodge will take every step necessary to offer a soft landing from this unexpected result.

Was it really unexpected?

He was playing in the final of Indian Wells(MD) after reaching R16 in Singles, jetlagged came to Moscow and won 8 consecutive sets but a lot of grinding in the Khachanov and Cilic match.

He was a toast here. Watched the first few rallies and I knew he had little chance here unless he radically changes the game-plan.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Was it really unexpected?

He was playing in the final of Indian Wells(MD) after reaching R16 in Singles, jetlagged came to Moscow and won 8 consecutive sets but a lot of grinding in the Khachanov and Cilic match.

He was a toast here. Watched the first few rallies and I knew he had little chance here unless he radically changes the game-plan.
At 3.95-1.25, I’ll stand by my “unexpected” description. Did you place a small bit of smart money on your estimate of how bad his chances really were?
 

Checkmate

Legend
At 3.95-1.25, I’ll stand by my “unexpected” description. Did you place a small bit of smart money on your estimate of how bad his chances really were?

Not but I had watched the Khachanov - Milman baseline grindwar last week and had a good idea of how this match would proceed.

Was really not sure how much Karatsev had in his legs but first few games confirmed my estimation.
 

Pmasterfunk

Hall of Fame
@stringertom I realize my previous post seemed to imply that I wanted a special allowance for Raducanu a non-ATP player in case they lost a second match after winning a title, and I apologize for the confusing wording. What I actually meant is whether the Lodge would offer extras amenities to players on a 2-match (or more) losing streak after winning a title, like Karatsev has just (sadly) done. Extras like, I dunno, unlimited use of the gym, free pay-per-view TV, an appointment with a psychiatrist... stuff like that.

Does anyone know of other notable multiple-match losing streaks after winning a title?
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
@stringertom I realize my previous post seemed to imply that I wanted a special allowance for Raducanu a non-ATP player in case they lost a second match after winning a title, and I apologize for the confusing wording. What I actually meant is whether the Lodge would offer extras amenities to players on a 2-match (or more) losing streak after winning a title, like Karatsev has just (sadly) done. Extras like, I dunno, unlimited use of the gym, free pay-per-view TV, an appointment with a psychiatrist... stuff like that.

Does anyone know of other notable multiple-match losing streaks after winning a title?
You win a title, you lose your next match, you stay until you play again. No long term stays.
 

Big_Dangerous

Talk Tennis Guru
@stringertom I realize my previous post seemed to imply that I wanted a special allowance for Raducanu a non-ATP player in case they lost a second match after winning a title, and I apologize for the confusing wording. What I actually meant is whether the Lodge would offer extras amenities to players on a 2-match (or more) losing streak after winning a title, like Karatsev has just (sadly) done. Extras like, I dunno, unlimited use of the gym, free pay-per-view TV, an appointment with a psychiatrist... stuff like that.

Does anyone know of other notable multiple-match losing streaks after winning a title?

Wildly liberal use of the mini bar would also be an amenity offered at my hotel.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Karatsev is probably running on empty after winning Sydney and now needing a fifth set if he intends to bunk on his own tonight.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
every warm up event to a slam is a trap.
It varies with the player and the surface.

On clay, Wawrinka made a habit of playing Geneva the week before RG. His results after he won Geneva twice in a row were SF and Final. He also would play Chennai on HC before AO and won both in 2014 with only 8 days between the final and 1R.
 

kevin qmto

Hall of Fame
It varies with the player and the surface.

On clay, Wawrinka made a habit of playing Geneva the week before RG. His results after he won Geneva twice in a row were SF and Final. He also would play Chennai on HC before AO and won both in 2014 with only 8 days between the final and 1R.
yeah highly dependent on the player. I remember how Mischa Zverev looked great at Eastbourne 2018, people were talking how he'd really put together an excellent run of grass form and thought he might do QF's or better at Wimb... cut to 4 days later - 1st rd loss.
 
Also depends on how much the player values a tournament win. Obviously, for a top player it's not great to win a 250 but have that tank their performance in the slam.

But, like, Kokkinakis? Do you think he'd rather win Adelaide and then lose R1 at the Australian Open, or skip Adelaide and then lose R2 of the australian open to Nadal? I think he'd strongly prefer the title.
 

Purestriker

Legend
Also depends on how much the player values a tournament win. Obviously, for a top player it's not great to win a 250 but have that tank their performance in the slam.

But, like, Kokkinakis? Do you think he'd rather win Adelaide and then lose R1 at the Australian Open, or skip Adelaide and then lose R2 of the australian open to Nadal? I think he'd strongly prefer the title.
What’s the money difference? The one that pays more is what Kok would want more.
 
Losing AO 2R givees 154K, losing 1R gives 103K, so a difference of 51K. Winning gave him 43K according to atptour.com. So advantage to Australian Open by 8k, though it's close.

On the other hand, winning the 250 gave him 250 ATP points, whereas a 2R loss would only give him 45 points. That extra 200 points means a lot in terms of getting direct entry to tournaments for the rest of the year (including getting him in to the top 100 so he can get direct entry to the other Slams - this got him up to 103). If those 200 points make a difference between him getting or not getting into one slam over the next year, that would make it worth it monetarily as well as ranking as well as prestige-wise.
 

stringertom

Bionic Poster
Also depends on how much the player values a tournament win. Obviously, for a top player it's not great to win a 250 but have that tank their performance in the slam.

But, like, Kokkinakis? Do you think he'd rather win Adelaide and then lose R1 at the Australian Open, or skip Adelaide and then lose R2 of the australian open to Nadal? I think he'd strongly prefer the title.
He was quoted as saying winning his hometown tournament put him over the moon. There’s no doubt he went all in to achieve that dream. As a result, he was obviously running on fumes vs Hanfmann yesterday. He leaves Melbourne on a slight downer but 2022 has been overall very kind to him.
 
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