Wise 2086 + Ektelon or new electronic machine

bago94

New User
I want to move to an electronic constant pull stringing machine primarily for tension accuracy and consistency. I am debating whether to upgrade my existing stringing machine with the Wise 2086 Tension Head or buy a new machine. My assumption is that both options will be equivalent in terms of string tension accuracy and consistency.

I currently have a 30+ year old Ektelon Model H with a stand. It is in good working condition. It has a 2-point mounting system and glide bars with fixed clamps. To upgrade it, I would add the Wise 2086 (and possibly the foot pedal) for approximately $750-800.

The other option I am considering is to purchase a new machine with a stand. I prefer a linear gripper as opposed to a rotational gripper. The price range I’m considering is $2-3K. It looks like the Gamma XLT machine plus stand for $2500 would be a decent option. This system has a 6-point mounting system and swivel clamps. Another option looks like the Tourna 650 ES for about $2400.

The Gamma XLT machine appears to be more portable for car trips than my existing stringer or the Tourna, but I would only travel with it once or twice a year. I do not need to move it around my home. I assume it will be easy to maintain for many decades to come, given that it is relatively new.

On the other hand, upgrading my existing stringing machine is much less expensive in the short term, but the machine is already quite old and not made any longer. Everything is working fine at present, but replacement parts might be harder to come by in the future. It’s also a 2-point mounting system and glide bar clamps. However, I assume I would be able to buy another portable spring tension machine in the future (if needed) and use the Wise 2086 on it.

If I were to buy a new machine, I’m unsure where I could sell the Ektelon or for how much. I don’t really want two stringing machines taking up space in my house.

If I buy the Wise 2086, would I get better support/customer service (if something needed to be fixed) directly from the manufacturer or through a distributor like Tennis Warehouse? How long should I expect the Wise tension head to last? Are there an gotchas to be away of with the Wise and Ektelon?

If anyone has faced a similar decision and/or has a recommendation, please let me know.

Thanks!
 
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Warren S

New User
I have an Ektelon machine that started life as a model D. I bought the oversize upgrade kit a couple years later and have used it for the better part of 30 years. Bought a Wise for it and really like the way it works, also got a foot pedal and I would recommend that as well. I feel like there are enough parts for the Ektelon machine around so I don't worry about repairs. I have also considered a new machine, but I decided that if I do i'm going to look at either the Wilson Baiardo lite or the Ghost. Not sure how much longer i'll be stringing so still have some thinking to do. As far as selling a used Ektelon machine, I think they have a pretty good reputation so don't give it away.
 

graycrait

Legend
@bago94 , I have been in your shoes not long ago. I have a NEOS 1000. I keep looking at these latest greatest but I don't string for a Power 5 university and make no part of my living stringing. I got a Wise for the NEOS. With the NEOS I string a racket in about 25 minutes, with the Neos lockout I could do one in around 16 minutes from mounting to last tie off if I was in a rush.

Unless you have a need for speed and want to expand your stringing reputation through "perceived" quality what will the $3500+ machines get you? I've never had a hot chick tell me that I would be cooler with a Bairdo vs my NEOS. I strung for a D1 player for a year who asked me "who will string the magic string for me after I leave (17-2 dual doubles)?"

If you are stringing as a side hustle or as a primary income source, go big and market yourself. If you are hobbiest and you can rationalize the expense go for it, it won't be worse than the Ektalon. I have a friend who has 2 nice sports cars, one vintage one later model. I have seen him drive those ragtops 3 or 4 times. Normally I see him drive a plain jane sedan.
 

Soundbyte

Hall of Fame
Its true, a crank machine is a smarter investment. Like a car, a Camry will do. People will prefer other models.
For years I had a Alpha Crank, updated it to a Wise Tension head. Used that setup for probably a decade. Served me well, no complaints.

Upgraded a few years ago to a Tourna ES-700 (and considered others like the Alpha Ghost 2, Baiardo, etc). I love the machine. Its great. But is it a necessity? No, not at all. And I also string for myself and a few others now, where as for years when I was doing it for money I had the crank + Wise combo.

Get what fits in your budget. You'll be fine either way!
 

bago94

New User
@bago94 , I have been in your shoes not long ago. I have a NEOS 1000. I keep looking at these latest greatest but I don't string for a Power 5 university and make no part of my living stringing. I got a Wise for the NEOS. With the NEOS I string a racket in about 25 minutes, with the Neos lockout I could do one in around 16 minutes from mounting to last tie off if I was in a rush.

Unless you have a need for speed and want to expand your stringing reputation through "perceived" quality what will the $3500+ machines get you? I've never had a hot chick tell me that I would be cooler with a Bairdo vs my NEOS. I strung for a D1 player for a year who asked me "who will string the magic string for me after I leave (17-2 dual doubles)?"

If you are stringing as a side hustle or as a primary income source, go big and market yourself. If you are hobbiest and you can rationalize the expense go for it, it won't be worse than the Ektalon. I have a friend who has 2 nice sports cars, one vintage one later model. I have seen him drive those ragtops 3 or 4 times. Normally I see him drive a plain jane sedan.
I'm not concerned about stringing speed or the appearance of the machine. My priority is tension accuracy and consistency, and I'm trying to stay in the ~$2500 range (definitely below $3K).

Have you ever had an issue with the Wise? If so, how difficult was it to get repaired?
 

graycrait

Legend
@bago94 , I've only had my Wise a couple of years and haven't had any issues but I don't string many rackets. I'll bet there is a thread on what you are concerned with. From what I have read customer service with the Wise is not an issue. I did order a gizmo from Wise just because and shipping was fast.
 

jbaldas

New User
I added a Wise Series 12 to my Gamma Progression II 602FC in 2016. Have not had any issues at all. Any questions I had regarding Wise installation / operation were always responded to promptly and in full.
 

bago94

New User
Its true, a crank machine is a smarter investment. Like a car, a Camry will do. People will prefer other models.
For years I had a Alpha Crank, updated it to a Wise Tension head. Used that setup for probably a decade. Served me well, no complaints.

Upgraded a few years ago to a Tourna ES-700 (and considered others like the Alpha Ghost 2, Baiardo, etc). I love the machine. Its great. But is it a necessity? No, not at all. And I also string for myself and a few others now, where as for years when I was doing it for money I had the crank + Wise combo.

Get what fits in your budget. You'll be fine either way!
Thanks. If you don't mind saying, why did you choose to upgrade from the Alpha + Wise? What do you love about the Tourna that was missing from the previous setup?
 

Soundbyte

Hall of Fame
My setup did NOT have 360 rotation due to the Wise.

I also really really love the Xpider clamps on the Tourna machines. they're my favorite clamp style. I prefer them over the Ghost and Baiardo clamps.

I like the single knob adjustment for the side mounts, so I'm only turning 2 knobs to mount instead of 6.

Pulling speed is better and I prefer the mechanism on the tournament to the foot pedal with the Wise.

I had to service my Wise twice over the decade+ I had it, with the first service being essentially a complete refurbish of the unit. I was able to sell my old setup for $1000 when I upgraded, so it was moreso just me looking to upgrade my setup.
 

bago94

New User
My setup did NOT have 360 rotation due to the Wise.

I also really really love the Xpider clamps on the Tourna machines. they're my favorite clamp style. I prefer them over the Ghost and Baiardo clamps.

I like the single knob adjustment for the side mounts, so I'm only turning 2 knobs to mount instead of 6.

Pulling speed is better and I prefer the mechanism on the tournament to the foot pedal with the Wise.

I had to service my Wise twice over the decade+ I had it, with the first service being essentially a complete refurbish of the unit. I was able to sell my old setup for $1000 when I upgraded, so it was moreso just me looking to upgrade my setup.
Thanks for the additional context. That was helpful.
 

Soundbyte

Hall of Fame
Thanks for the additional context. That was helpful.
The other benefit of your current setup is, if you get the Wise and it needs servicing, you can pop the crank back on and keep going.

With a dedicated electronic machine, if it dies or needs servicing I'm out of luck.

Granted, it's rare for these machines to just suddenly break, but it's always a possibility.
 

waterhog

New User
I want to move to an electronic constant pull stringing machine primarily for tension accuracy and consistency. I am debating whether to upgrade my existing stringing machine with the Wise 2086 Tension Head or buy a new machine. My assumption is that both options will be equivalent in terms of string tension accuracy and consistency.

I currently have a 30+ year old Ektelon Model H with a stand. It is in good working condition. It has a 2-point mounting system and glide bars with fixed clamps. To upgrade it, I would add the Wise 2086 (and possibly the foot pedal) for approximately $750-800.

The other option I am considering is to purchase a new machine with a stand. I prefer a linear gripper as opposed to a rotational gripper. The price range I’m considering is $2-3K. It looks like the Gamma XLT machine plus stand for $2500 would be a decent option. This system has a 6-point mounting system and swivel clamps. Another option looks like the Tourna 650 ES for about $2400.

The Gamma XLT machine appears to be more portable for car trips than my existing stringer or the Tourna, but I would only travel with it once or twice a year. I do not need to move it around my home. I assume it will be easy to maintain for many decades to come, given that it is relatively new.

On the other hand, upgrading my existing stringing machine is much less expensive in the short term, but the machine is already quite old and not made any longer. Everything is working fine at present, but replacement parts might be harder to come by in the future. It’s also a 2-point mounting system and glide bar clamps. However, I assume I would be able to buy another portable spring tension machine in the future (if needed) and use the Wise 2086 on it.

If I were to buy a new machine, I’m unsure where I could sell the Ektelon or for how much. I don’t really want two stringing machines taking up space in my house.

If I buy the Wise 2086, would I get better support/customer service (if something needed to be fixed) directly from the manufacturer or through a distributor like Tennis Warehouse? How long should I expect the Wise tension head to last? Are there an gotchas to be away of with the Wise and Ektelon?

If anyone has faced a similar decision and/or has a recommendation, please let me know.

Thanks!

If you're stringing for income I'd spring for a new machine. Saving a few bucks makes little sense since improved features in higher end machines will pay off in a hurry. Also, having a 6-point mounting system is likely a de facto necessity in a commercial setting where the competition uses them.

If you're stringing mostly for personal use, family and friends, then replacing the crank on the Ektelon H with a Wise 2086 will give you accuracy and consistency. I have an Ektelon D and it's a workhorse that's built to last. I think a number of parts are interchangeable with the Prince NEOS 1000.

I also have a Gamma X-2 which I recently upgraded to a Gamma X-6FC (6-point fixed clamp) and replaced the drop weight with a Wise 2086. Price wise I could have bought a Gamma X-ELS, but went with the Wise because parts are available in the $50 range, from load cell to motor and circuit boards. It's a simple machine, probably the most widely deployed hobbiest electronic tensioner used in many corners of the world.

It's not all rosey in that after using the Wise for about a month, I find the lateral play of the tensioning head a bit much, sometimes interfering with the controller that affects constant pull. But it's ok for personal use and for the price can't be beat. However, if you're volume stringing I would recommend springing $3K (perhaps even $5K) to get a tournament grade machine.
 

hadoken

Professional
The Ektelon H will always have parts available since it's cousin the Prince NEOS 1000 is a workhorse in the tennis world. The WISE is a good product for home use and is accurate. Don't assume you will like stringing on a swivel clamp if you used the Ektelon this long....I had a Gamme 4000 (based on the older D model), switched to a Gamma 5003 and simply hated non-gravity swivel clamps and swapped for a NEOS 1000 and this is my permanent setup for home use. Expect a WISE to last about 10 years based on my anecdotal experience. I bought a used Wise in 2015 that was a few years old...I am not a heavy stringer and it broke last year. WISE said mine was too old to fix reliably. Personally I would probably import a Pros Pro tension head which go for ~$500 given the favorable FX these days just because I can't see myself dropping $800 on a WISE as a 'nice to have' for home use. But given your situation and budget, the WISE is probably the best bang for the buck.
 

bago94

New User
If you're stringing for income I'd spring for a new machine. Saving a few bucks makes little sense since improved features in higher end machines will pay off in a hurry. Also, having a 6-point mounting system is likely a de facto necessity in a commercial setting where the competition uses them.

If you're stringing mostly for personal use, family and friends, then replacing the crank on the Ektelon H with a Wise 2086 will give you accuracy and consistency. I have an Ektelon D and it's a workhorse that's built to last. I think a number of parts are interchangeable with the Prince NEOS 1000.

I also have a Gamma X-2 which I recently upgraded to a Gamma X-6FC (6-point fixed clamp) and replaced the drop weight with a Wise 2086. Price wise I could have bought a Gamma X-ELS, but went with the Wise because parts are available in the $50 range, from load cell to motor and circuit boards. It's a simple machine, probably the most widely deployed hobbiest electronic tensioner used in many corners of the world.

It's not all rosey in that after using the Wise for about a month, I find the lateral play of the tensioning head a bit much, sometimes interfering with the controller that affects constant pull. But it's ok for personal use and for the price can't be beat. However, if you're volume stringing I would recommend springing $3K (perhaps even $5K) to get a tournament grade machine.
Thanks for the feedback @waterhog. Could you please elaborate on what you mean by "the lateral play of the tensioning head...sometimes interfering with the controller that affects constant pull"?
 

struggle

Legend
Thanks for the feedback @waterhog. Could you please elaborate on what you mean by "the lateral play of the tensioning head...sometimes interfering with the controller that affects constant pull"?

I haven’t had this problem in ten years with a Wise12.

Also, their CS is fantastic, so any issues will be dealt with. They’re easy to contact via email or phone.
 

ryushen21

Legend
The WISE is a solid option and their customer service is excellent.

However, there is something about a purpose-built machine that should be considered. But, the 650-ES you mentioned has a rotational gripper. I would look at the Tourna 700-ES. It's a little more than your desired budget but definitely a solid machine.
 
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bago94

New User
Thanks for the information everyone. It seems like I'm not crazy to sink money into upgrading a 30-year old Ektelon with the Wise given my goal of better tension accuracy and consistency.

I appreciate the feedback. Thanks.
 

waterhog

New User
Thanks for the feedback @waterhog. Could you please elaborate on what you mean by "the lateral play of the tensioning head...sometimes interfering with the controller that affects constant pull"?
The tensioning head comprised of the gripper is driven by a motor that pulls it away from the racket frame to apply tension until a sensor (load cell) attached underneath it provides input to the computer that controls the motor to stop pulling when a target tension is reached. It's called constant pull since strings dilate after pulling, and when the load cell informs the computer that tension has decreased the motor pulls more to make up for the slack and hit the target tension.

The tensioning head has also side to side (lateral) movement which is not minor. I would say ballpark 2mm or thereabouts to either side. There are several threads on the forum where folks have experienced issues to varying degrees, some fixed with software updates. I can only speak to my experience using the Wise 2086 for about a month and stringing 16 or so rackets (personal use and family).

At first I thought that perhaps screws were not adequately tightened that hold the tensioning head to the 2086 body. There are threads on the forum that indicate that some lateral play is normal. The Internet being what it is, and that applies to whatever I share, I opened the backcover of the unit to check. There are no screws to tighten. Lateral movement is built in. I was able to find a patent from 2011 by Wise that showed schematics of the Wise 2086. Although it didn't speak directly to the lateral movement I could get a basic understanding (or so I think) of how the device works.

Basically, the target tension that we set, say 55 lbs, is what is called the set point. Most devices in the real world that require controllers (computers running control algorithms) to achieve a goal, from drones that hover effortlessly despite the kid operating it not being a helicopter pilot, output from O2 sensors in combustion engine vehicles being used as feedback to regulate how much fuel is injected into cylinders to manage power/fuel economy/pollution, electronic thermostats, etc. are in most cases controlled by what is called PID control. I'll skip the details but to say that to apply PID to a target domain -- in our case string tensioning to achieve a set point (constant pull) -- a bunch of parameters need to be tuned, in addition to domain specific considerations. Yes, undergrads in EE and Mechanical engineering learn about PID control, but only some will have the know how to build working controllers. Like old style performance tuning of race cars and motorcyles, it's both science/engineering and art.

When there is lateral movement, depending on string tension and geometry (how a grommet is aligned to the tensioning head), when the controller commands the motor to stop because it considers the target tension to have been reached, lateral movement can introduce perturbations that cause the controller to issue commands to the motor, typically to tension more. In my experience with the Wise 2086, this happens about 10-15% of the time, especially when tension is on the higher end, say 55+ lbs. For most rackets, I string hybrids with co-poly on the mains and I don't go over 50 lbs, hence it's a minor nuisance that I can deal with. If it mattered a lot I would probably temporarily switch to lockout mode when instability arises or hit the pause button. Whether this actually works I don't know because I haven't tried it.

Anyhow, if I were not a hobby stringer and doing it commercially, meaning D1 players and pro tournaments, I would not use the Wise 2086. Here I'm assuming that tournament grade stringing machines do not have the PID controller instability problems due to superior build and tuning of PID control by experts. I have never used a tournament grade stringing machine, so can't speak from experience. If it's for personal use, family and friends, and perhaps a clientele who are not overly demanding of the setup and wouldn't know if some mains or crosses are strung a few pounds tighter than the requested pull tension, it would not matter. It doesn't matter for me.

Let me be clear that, overall, I like the Wise 2086, and it's not just words but action since I chose to create a semi-Frankenstein stringer by marrying a Gamma X-6FC with a Wise 2086 even though for about the same money I could have bought a Gamma-ELS. But I'm not trying to paint a rosey picture but share my personal experience. Including suggesting that you consider tournament grade machines if you're stringing commercially.

So with the caveat that this is Internet advice, I would recommend considering a tournament grade machine as an option assuming they are superior in key respects to your Ektelon H with a Wise 2086 tensioner. However, it's difficult to go wrong purchasing a Wise 2086 since it's really a great deal for the money, it's portable to many crank and drop weight stringers, and I couldn't find any used ones when I bought mine new.
 
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bago94

New User
@waterhog Thanks for the detailed explanation. I'll read up more on the lateral movement before making a decision. Thanks for taking the time to provide feedback.
 

USMC-615

Hall of Fame
I'd slap a Wise 2086 v14 on that Ektelon Model H and call it a day...my two pennies anyhow.

A brand new Wise v14 can be had for $675.
 

bago94

New User
@USMC-615 I'm definitely leaning towards doing that. Where did you see it for $675? Is that for version 14 (2023)? The current price on the Tennis Head website is $749.
 

bago94

New User
In case others are interested, I asked Dan (from Tennis Head) about the lateral movement of the tensioning head, which was mentioned earlier. For what it’s worth, he reported that it is “normal and desirable to extend the life of the machine” and that it “keeps the stress on the string to a minimum.” He said that the latest version has less movement, but that it is “still part of the engineering of the product” and “not a mistake or design flaw.”

I also inquired about the status of the Parallax, which is the next generation of the Wise. Dan said that was still “at least 5 years” out.

Given all the information I’ve read and the helpful feedback from everyone here, it looks like the Wise is a solid choice for my needs (tension accuracy and consistency). It appears that the next significant level up in terms of quality would cost several thousand dollars more.

Thanks for all the feedback.
 

WYK

Hall of Fame
I currently have a 30+ year old Ektelon Model H with a stand. It is in good working condition. It has a 2-point mounting system and glide bars with fixed clamps. To upgrade it, I would add the Wise 2086 (and possibly the foot pedal) for approximately $750-800.


If I were to buy a new machine, I’m unsure where I could sell the Ektelon or for how much. I don’t really want two stringing machines taking up space in my house.


Thanks!

30+ years and it still hasn't proven itself?

I wouldn't sell it. It will be a huge regret.
 

Rabbit

G.O.A.T.
Pros and cons to everything, for me, it comes down to "want factor". What do I want more, my money or the thing in question. I have to say that since I acquired the Mighty Sensor, I do enjoy stringing more than I did with either of the NEOS (1000/1500) that I had. But...I let go of some coinage. I also had immediate buyer's remorse when it came in. That left after the 3rd or 4th string job.
 

ryushen21

Legend
Pros and cons to everything, for me, it comes down to "want factor". What do I want more, my money or the thing in question. I have to say that since I acquired the Mighty Sensor, I do enjoy stringing more than I did with either of the NEOS (1000/1500) that I had. But...I let go of some coinage. I also had immediate buyer's remorse when it came in. That left after the 3rd or 4th string job.
Similarly, I felt kinda bad asking my AD to buy us the 850-ES. That disappeared after assembly and I started stringing on it. There's just something about a purpose-built machine I tell ya.
 

waterhog

New User
In case others are interested, I asked Dan (from Tennis Head) about the lateral movement of the tensioning head, which was mentioned earlier. For what it’s worth, he reported that it is “normal and desirable to extend the life of the machine” and that it “keeps the stress on the string to a minimum.” He said that the latest version has less movement, but that it is “still part of the engineering of the product” and “not a mistake or design flaw.”

I also inquired about the status of the Parallax, which is the next generation of the Wise. Dan said that was still “at least 5 years” out.

Given all the information I’ve read and the helpful feedback from everyone here, it looks like the Wise is a solid choice for my needs (tension accuracy and consistency). It appears that the next significant level up in terms of quality would cost several thousand dollars more.

Thanks for all the feedback.

Based on using the Wise 2086 a couple of months, if tension doesn't stabilize and jumps around (usually 1-2 lb range) then what has worked for me in most cases is to pull the handle of the racket slightly and gently away from the tensioner. For around 2-4 seconds. This temporary "locking" of the turntable seems to allow the controller to converge to the target tension. Other methods I've tried such as turning off constant pull when oscillation happens didn't work.
 

WYK

Hall of Fame
As I discovered :)

Exactly - you've ruined that NEOS ;)

Seriously, I have such love for cranks. I just like the 100% feedback and control they give. It's like when I choose a racquet because of the feel vs the efficiency.
 
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