With the decline of adult tournaments, where do better rec players play?

J011yroger

J011yroger

Talk Tennis Guru
15-20 years ago everyone who was anyone played tournaments, and they were great, big draws at nice clubs with goodie bags and bagels, BBQ, Gatorade and beer.

Now leagues have taken over almost completely and it has to some degree hedged out both the young players and the better rec players.

Leagues are difficult to join for the young people because self rate guidelines put them too high.

For an advance player a league was a good way to play a few matches with a bunch of buddies, not the focus of your year.

If the 5.0 season is 6-8 matches over 2-3 months, and you play half of them that means your whole year is 3-4 matches?

40+ 4.5+ helps get some more matches in.

Are guys just playing with their friends?

I'm sure if there were better opportunities more folks would play.

J
 
Yes, tennis is not a team sport, in the olden days you stuck close to home and played at the nearest public courts, or if you had the means belonged to a heritage tennis club that may have been founded in the 1800's that gave honorary memberships to great players. For competition there were ladders with A,B, C, categories. Then, numbers replaced letters, computers, the USTA, and MONEY came into it--everyone gets a prize. The best players stay within their small circle at the clubs and the draws at Senior Tournaments shrink. There's a lot of money rolling around these days, cars and roads are better and you can drive miles to play a couple of sets at another club and make new friends-- about the only thing that hasn't changed is the price of tennis balls, some how they have remained at about a buck a piece, or even less--$5.00 for a nearly new racket at a garage sale or a thrift store and you're in the game--if you can find anyone to play with who's not texting.
 
Last edited:
tennis tom said:
Yes, tennis is not a team sport, in the olden days you stuck close to home and played at the nearest public courts, or if you had the means belonged to a heritage tennis club that may have been founded in the 1800's that gave honorary memberships to great players. For competition there were ladders with A,B, C, categories. Then, numbers replaced letters, computers, the USTA, and MONEY came into it--everyone gets a prize. The best players stay within their small circle at the clubs and the draws at Senior Tournaments shrink. There's a lot of money rolling around these days, cars and roads are better and you can drive miles to play a couple of sets at another club and make new friends-- about the only thing that hasn't changed is the price of tennis balls, some how they have remained at about a buck a piece, or even less--$5.00 for a nearly new racket at a garage sale or a thrift store and you're in the game--if you can find anyone to play with who's not texting.
Click to expand...
After 20, 30 or more yrs, just roll with it. Till the wheels fall off
 
J011yroger said:
15-20 years ago everyone who was anyone played tournaments, and they were great, big draws at nice clubs with goodie bags and bagels, BBQ, Gatorade and beer.

Now leagues have taken over almost completely and it has to some degree hedged out both the young players and the better rec players.

Leagues are difficult to join for the young people because self rate guidelines put them too high.

For an advance player a league was a good way to play a few matches with a bunch of buddies, not the focus of your year.

If the 5.0 season is 6-8 matches over 2-3 months, and you play half of them that means your whole year is 3-4 matches?

40+ 4.5+ helps get some more matches in.

Are guys just playing with their friends?

I'm sure if there were better opportunities more folks would play.

J
Click to expand...
Yeah, league has been great for many players, but it has contributed to the decline of tournaments which for some players means it's hard to get competitive play.
I think the hardest hit category is 5.0 singles players under 40:
* Can't play 40+ league, so the only league option for singles is 18+. Which is only 3 months of the year (at least here in Norcal).
* Can play 5.0 NTRP tournaments but the draws are woefully small plus half or more of the players are 4.5s.
* Otherwise the only option is Open, but then at least in my area you are more likely to get walloped by some D1 player than get a competitive match.
In other words, sucks to be Jolly :D

The flip side is that for me (middle aged 4.5) league gives me a lot of opportunity to play, and is much preferable to tournaments:
* I can play singles in both 18+ and 40+; in 18+ I get to play good (but not too good) young players, and then in 40+ 4.5+ I also get a crack at older 5.0s.
* I only have to play one match per day - tough for older players to do more than one singles in a day in a tournament
* Cheaper than tournaments, more convenient, etc
 
OrangePower said:
* Otherwise the only option is Open, but then at least in my area you are more likely to get walloped by some D1 player than get a competitive match.
In other words, sucks to be Jolly :D
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Woah, hey, I won 3 men's open tournaments last year and was 2-0 in 18+ 5.0+ singles this year.

You are right though that with only one singles line the 5.0 leagues usually have a 5.5-6.0 player in the singles spot. I just got lucky this year.

J
 
J011yroger said:
Woah, hey, I won 3 men's open tournaments last year and was 2-0 in 18+ 5.0+ singles this year.

You are right though that with only one singles line the 5.0 leagues usually have a 5.5-6.0 player in the singles spot. I just got lucky this year.

J
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Guess it depends on who the opens attract... I had a buddy playing in one in my area a couple months ago and he was telling me that about half the players in the 32 player draw were current active D1 players or recent HS grads about to head into a D1 program.

If you are winning those then you don't need our sympathy, ha!
 
In our local tournaments (there are 2 really good ones and a handful of ho hum tourneys each year) the Open draw is almost entirely 5.0 players as there is no 5.0 NTRP draw. Average age I would say is mid-thirties ....
 
No one mentioned the cost? It's sometimes ~$120 for doubles team. I don't know the cost breakdown and how much the usta takes, I don't mind it going to a charity/cause, but $100-120+ is bit much for sometimes 1 match, we all can't be J011 and get 4+ matches for our entry.

Used to be $35ish per player?
 
OrangePower said:
Guess it depends on who the opens attract... I had a buddy playing in one in my area a couple months ago and he was telling me that about half the players in the 32 player draw were current active D1 players or recent HS grads about to head into a D1 program.

If you are winning those then you don't need our sympathy, ha!
Click to expand...

I'm competitive in the normal men's opens, but I get my but whooped in the money ones. It's still fun to play against futures type players.

J
 
2ndServe said:
No one mentioned the cost? It's sometimes ~$120 for doubles team. I don't know the cost breakdown and how much the usta takes, I don't mind it going to a charity/cause, but $100-120+ is bit much for sometimes 1 match, we all can't be J011 and get 4+ matches for our entry.

Used to be $35ish per player?
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Normal ones are usually $50-75 here money ones and nationals are $100-120.

There's a money circuit here that splits the entry fees in half. Half goes to the courts and half goes towards the prize money so the more who enter the bigger the pot.

J
 
@J011yroger did you play college tennis? If so there is an ITA college alumni event this Thursday in NYC https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSeak80B5ZppC6UTXal5xmkctqs-PiLryiEj3PuWdFE38qsGfA/viewform ITA is starting new group for college alumni, and NYC is 1st meeting. Could be a way for former players to connect and arrange hits. Maybe with orgs like this and UTR, there will be more events for 5.0 level or even players could set up a challenge ladder. It is sad so many college players just stop playing once they graduate. There is a wide range of UTRs for college players from the lower D3s in the 9s to the 14+ at power programs so current college players would probably be interested in playing adults of similar level over breaks. When the 60-70% of good players go home to Europe et al in the summer, it can be hard for American college players to find good hits-esp on the weeks juniors are playing big tourneys.

Next summer consider playing the ITA summer circuit as those 50+ tourneys over 6-7 weeks are open to anyone who pays $60 for ITA summer membership-dont have to be former, current, or prospective college player. The large ones have multiple draws of 32 so the sub 10s might be in one draw, and the higher players in 1-2 draws. Some tourneys only attract one 32 draw so they may have 7s-13s playing together. However, the summer circuit plays 10 pt tiebreak instead of full 3rd; the tourneys tend to attract 2-4 star juniors, D3, MM players et al. The better college players obviously try to get in Futures
 
jcgatennismom said:
@J011yroger did you play college tennis? If so there is an ITA college alumni event this Thursday in NYC https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSeak80B5ZppC6UTXal5xmkctqs-PiLryiEj3PuWdFE38qsGfA/viewform ITA is starting new group for college alumni, and NYC is 1st meeting. Could be a way for former players to connect and arrange hits. Maybe with orgs like this and UTR, there will be more events for 5.0 level or even players could set up a challenge ladder. It is sad so many college players just stop playing once they graduate. There is a wide range of UTRs for college players from the lower D3s in the 9s to the 14+ at power programs so current college players would probably be interested in playing adults of similar level over breaks. When the 60-70% of good players go home to Europe et al in the summer, it can be hard for American college players to find good hits-esp on the weeks juniors are playing big tourneys.

Next summer consider playing the ITA summer circuit as those 50+ tourneys over 6-7 weeks are open to anyone who pays $60 for ITA summer membership-dont have to be former, current, or prospective college player. The large ones have multiple draws of 32 so the sub 10s might be in one draw, and the higher players in 1-2 draws. Some tourneys only attract one 32 draw so they may have 7s-13s playing together. However, the summer circuit plays 10 pt tiebreak instead of full 3rd; the tourneys tend to attract 2-4 star juniors, D3, MM players et al. The better college players obviously try to get in Futures
Click to expand...

Awesome!

I was hurt through college, started playing again at 25.

J
 
Obviously, I can't advise you, but I can ask a question.

Do they have tri-level in your area? I would think tri-level or something similar might help. I thought the idea of tri level was to be able to accommodate areas and levels where there aren't many players.
 
Cindysphinx said:
Obviously, I can't advise you, but I can ask a question.

Do they have tri-level in your area? I would think tri-level or something similar might help. I thought the idea of tri level was to be able to accommodate areas and levels where there aren't many players.
Click to expand...

Yea, one is 3.0/3.5/4.0 and one is 3.5/4.0/4.5.

I tried it once maybe 5 years ago. Didn't love it.

We have scads of players here. I'm just asking in general because it seems like there is nothing that they are really into so they all just play with their friends.

J
 
I gave up on leagues about a year ago now. I signed up for a Flex league and find I am doing most the booking and chasing after folks to play. Really I get decent matches and play with the juniors, high school, and college folks around the club anymore so I think I will just stick with that. And of course, random folks contacting me online when they come through AZ, or if I am out of state. That works well too.
 
tennis tom said:
Seems curling attracts a lot of hot babes, at least at the Olympic level.
Click to expand...
It's the awesome outfits
ept_sports_oly_experts-382897659-1266252221.jpg
 
J011yroger said:
15-20 years ago everyone who was anyone played tournaments, and they were great, big draws at nice clubs with goodie bags and bagels, BBQ, Gatorade and beer.

Now leagues have taken over almost completely and it has to some degree hedged out both the young players and the better rec players.

Leagues are difficult to join for the young people because self rate guidelines put them too high.

For an advance player a league was a good way to play a few matches with a bunch of buddies, not the focus of your year.

If the 5.0 season is 6-8 matches over 2-3 months, and you play half of them that means your whole year is 3-4 matches?

40+ 4.5+ helps get some more matches in.

Are guys just playing with their friends?

I'm sure if there were better opportunities more folks would play.

J
Click to expand...
In my area a lot of people just play with their friends. I play with a group of guys and we are all on different teams and are at different ratings.
There are only a few tournaments a year here (3-4) and there isn't much of a turn out.
 
The good players in our area all know each other, have various club memberships around the city and play against each other socially. They'll get their competition fix by entering Open level tourneys throughout the year and competing in various club championships.

Where I live the city leagues are mostly lower level women's leagues. Too much drama. The guys have basically figured out that formal leagues kind of suck and its more fun to play social matches with guys you know and then occasionally challenge yourselves in tournaments as they come up.

So my answer to anyone that wants to find people your level to play with, join a club.
 
In the ATL area, there are lots of UTR tournaments, and the upper brackets attract plenty of the better players. Mixing the best adults and juniors both helps reach critical mass as well as making things interesting.
 
J011yroger said:
15-20 years ago everyone who was anyone played tournaments, and they were great, big draws at nice clubs with goodie bags and bagels, BBQ, Gatorade and beer.

Now leagues have taken over almost completely and it has to some degree hedged out both the young players and the better rec players.

Leagues are difficult to join for the young people because self rate guidelines put them too high.

For an advance player a league was a good way to play a few matches with a bunch of buddies, not the focus of your year.

If the 5.0 season is 6-8 matches over 2-3 months, and you play half of them that means your whole year is 3-4 matches?

40+ 4.5+ helps get some more matches in.

Are guys just playing with their friends?

I'm sure if there were better opportunities more folks would play.

J
Click to expand...

I try to play a national or two, or a few Cat-II's if I can work it in. There are still a number of good players playing in these whether it is doubles or singles.
 
So, just learned that there is a completely different tennis scene than the one I have been living.

So went to local park that has 10 nice courts ... its opposite side of town from me so had never been there ... place is packed with people waiting for each court .... I have now found where all the 4.5+ players hang out ... seemed some college kids were hustling for money games and getting paid to hit. A bunch of mostly men playing tennis at much higher levels than I see around the clubs.
 
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