WTF groups are set. It's clear that Rafa's chances at YE1 are now very low.

What will happen?

  • Medvedevious wins title then boasts he will be no 1 by FO

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    64

TheAssassin

Legend
Wishing now that Djokovic didn't mess up Cincy. He would have only needed to outperform Nadal by a small margin in London, but now he might have to go all the way. Doable since he won this even five times already but he is not untouchable anymore.
He made the prediction as the race was heating up, and then started using this as his avatar:



When he inevitably fell on his face, he started backtracking and claiming it was only what he hoped would happen.
Saying Nadal would throw Djokovic in the bin in Melbourne and then predictably disappearing from this place after the final was even better. :D
 
It’s gonna be close but I think novak will pull it off. He has the motivation to tie Pete for 5 year end no1 trophies and also tie fed in record 6th world tour finals crowns! A lot on the line!
 

Raphael Nadal

Professional
It’s gonna be close but I think novak will pull it off. He has the motivation to tie Pete for 5 year end no1 trophies and also tie fed in record 6th world tour finals crowns! A lot on the line!
The motivation of World Tour Finals crowns appears to be useless.....as Djokovic lost to Murray in straight sets in 2016 Final.....and lost to Zverev in straight sets in 2018 Final.
Motivation is only part of the equation :)
Same applies to the slam race, Djokovic has always been highly motivated by Federer's slam record.....but still finds himself 4 behind Federer and 3 behind Rafa.
It could be a question of talent.....as nobody would question Djokovic's work ethic and motivation level.
 
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kevaninho

Hall of Fame
The question is, will Fed be extra motivated to defeat Nole in the group stage, to try and help Nadal to the YE#1 ?

We all know he doesn't want Nole taking that record, whereas I don't think Nadal will get the opportunity after this, so its safer for him with Rafa taking it.
 

Raphael Nadal

Professional
The question is, will Fed be extra motivated to defeat Nole in the group stage, to try and help Nadal to the YE#1 ?

We all know he doesn't want Nole taking that record, whereas I don't think Nadal will get the opportunity after this, so its safer for him with Rafa taking it.
Rafa keeps coming back from injury rejuvenated, so there is a good chance Rafa will get the Sampras year-end-#1 record eventually.
Also, after Federer/Djokovic retire, what happens if the young stars are unable to have a clear-cut leader who wins 2 slams per year? Then Rafa will be able to continue getting the #1 ranking in the next few years by keeping his Roland Garros/Rome mantle each year..... and Rafa will probably be winning hardcourt titles too in the next few years :)
Based on what we are seeing now Rafa is more consistent than ever on hardcourt..... whereas Djokovic is not as consistent on hardcourt, and appears to be at the mercy of the young guns.
 
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Wishing now that Djokovic didn't mess up Cincy. He would have only needed to outperform Nadal by a small margin in London, but now he might have to go all the way. Doable since he won this even five times already but he is not untouchable anymore.

Saying Nadal would throw Djokovic in the bin in Melbourne and then predictably disappearing from this place after the final was even better. :D
Djokovic at least lost to a strong opponent in Cincinnati. Who really messed up is Nadal in Monte Carlo. Found the "right moment" to play some of his worst clay tennis ever.
 

TheAssassin

Legend
Djokovic at least lost to a strong opponent in Cincinnati. Who really messed up is Nadal in Monte Carlo. Found the "right moment" to play some of his worst clay tennis ever.
Well Djokovic lost early in both Indian Wells and Miami, his favorite Masters events. Pretty much two thousand points went down the drain. But I mentioned Cincy because he played ok there but lost the momentum against Medvedev too easily and quickly.
 

NoleFam

G.O.A.T.
Wishing now that Djokovic didn't mess up Cincy. He would have only needed to outperform Nadal by a small margin in London, but now he might have to go all the way. Doable since he won this even five times already but he is not untouchable anymore.

Saying Nadal would throw Djokovic in the bin in Melbourne and then predictably disappearing from this place after the final was even better. :D
I have conceded that he just got blitzed in Cincy. He just wasn't expecting Med to go into madman mode and start bashing second serve aces at will. He wasn't prepared for it.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
This is right, @UnderratedSlam. Now, I happen to agree with you that they ought to set the full schedule in advance and be willing to have the third day have two guys who are both at 0-2. Back in the day, they used to schedule it usually so that the top two in the group would play third.

But the explanation of how the schedule works that @jm1980 gives is exactly how the schedule does in fact work right now and for the last decade or more.
I agree with it to some extent. Nobody wants a 3rd round to be two guys at 2-0 and the other two at 0-2. But it's still annoying.
 

Pheasant

Hall of Fame
This is hilarious
What part is hilarious? Berrenttini showed the world that he is a massive long shot today. Djoker is clearly the massive favorite. Medvedev is a big hitter. Who else is a threat?

Oh wait.Maybe you are referring to Federer, the guy that was straight-setted by Zverev last year and lost to Goffin the previous year at the same event.
I would move for Federer to win it. But let’s be realistic. He is incredibly injury prone and his consistency is horrible these days.
 

Big_Dangerous

Talk Tennis Guru
The question is, will Fed be extra motivated to defeat Nole in the group stage, to try and help Nadal to the YE#1 ?

We all know he doesn't want Nole taking that record, whereas I don't think Nadal will get the opportunity after this, so its safer for him with Rafa taking it.
After his loss to Thiem, he pretty much has to win his next two matches to advance.
 

Big_Dangerous

Talk Tennis Guru
I see him as a heavy favorite against Thiem and a decent favorite against Federer. Don't see why it's likely he loses one match.
If he has little to play for against Fed, it's possible he might not push himself too hard to get the win. If he beats Thiem in straight sets, then that pretty much guarantees him the group, so it's like he really doesn't have to beat Fed. Kind of like what happened 4 years ago when Fed beat Djokovic in the group stage but then lost to him in the final.
 

TripleATeam

Legend
If he has little to play for against Fed, it's possible he might not push himself too hard to get the win. If he beats Thiem in straight sets, then that pretty much guarantees him the group, so it's like he really doesn't have to beat Fed. Kind of like what happened 4 years ago when Fed beat Djokovic in the group stage but then lost to him in the final.
It's still 200 points and a win over Federer. I don't see him getting demotivated.
 

Raphael Nadal

Professional
Only.

With a possible injury and a surface he dislikes, that is a tough goal to achieve.
Its not really, because Rafa is 25-2 on hardcourt this year, as his game is more suited to hardcourt than ever before.
And what happened before? :)
Rafa beat Federer in straight sets at 2013 ATP Finals, and Rafa beat Djokovic in straight sets at 2007 and 2010 ATP Finals.
Rafa beat Wawrinka in straight sets at 2013 and 2015 ATP Finals, and Rafa beat Murray at 2010 and 2015 ATP Finals.
Rafa did not play 2018, withdrew 2017, did not play 2016, did not play 2014, did not play 2012, did not play 2008.
Since 2010, Rafa has made the Final twice, despite only playing 2010, 2011, 2013, 2015 and withdrawing early in 2017.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
Djokovic
Federer
Thiem
Berrettini (hi, tennis_pro)

Nadal
Medvedevious
Tsetsefly
Zverev

This basically means that Djokovic and RF are in the semis already. That much is clear.

This means Rafa loses the semis - if he even gets there. His off-clay record vs Novak and RF has been pathetic since 2013/14. That certainly won't change at Rafa's weakest part of the season...

Since Djokovic is favourite to win WTF, he is very likely to be YE1.

As far as group duels, I believe we can all agree that we're VERY looking forward to:

Nadal - Medvedevious --- I believe the Russian now knows how to beat Rafa, and he has very good chances at doing it. By beating Nadal he will only strengthen his claim to break the Big 3 oligopoly.

Tsetsefly - Medvedevious --- Will 0-5 go to 0-6? Will Tsetse flip his lid again and "accuse" Medvedevious of being Russian (despite Tsetse's mother being Russian)? Will they hate each other even more after this match? To me, this is the most fun group match, from all 12 group matches.

Other interesting matches.

Federer - Thiem --- A chance for RF to decrease the 2-4 H2H lead Thiem has. He'll do it, of course.

Federer - Berrettini --- If RF loses a set to the Italian, will tennis_pro quit TTW? Very exciting.

Djokovic - Federer --- this match will happen twice, group stage and the finale. Or will Medvedevious act as Big 3 crusher and defeat another Big 3 legend after beating Rafa in the group stage?

Finally a WTF when the Big 3 are not the only favourites for the title.

And a question to the ATP:

WHY does the schedule not include Tuesday onwards?

Surely this being a group event they can easily write a schedule up until Friday?
So right and yet so wrong. :sneaky:
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
How are both Novak and Roger locks to make the semis but not Nadal?

Unless his injury is still hampering him, there's no way he doesn't win 2/3 vs his group of NextGens.
:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: Right on board the old Nadal never loses unless injured camp.:sneaky:
 

Cortana

Hall of Fame
Not necessarily. Depends on Nadal's success.
To be 100% sure that he gets it assuming Nadal loses at least 1 match till the final.

Winning the WTF undefeated vs. losing the final previously undefeated is only a 500 points difference. Not enough to compensate Nadals 540 points lead.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
To be 100% sure that he gets it assuming Nadal loses at least 1 match till the final.

Winning the WTF undefeated vs. losing the final previously undefeated is only a 500 points difference. Not enough to compensate Nadals 540 points lead.
I believe all the questions are being answered right now.

Nadal is in very poor form, is losing to Zverev badly. Playing like this, he'll barely win a match.

Just goes to prove - once again - that Rafa hates playing indoors. His worst match this year, perhaps.
 

TennisFan3

Legend
I believe all the questions are being answered right now.

Nadal is in very poor form, is losing to Zverev badly. Playing like this, he'll barely win a match.

Just goes to prove - once again - that Rafa hates playing indoors. His worst match this year, perhaps.
I've been saying that for days now. The WTF surface is the SINGLE WORST surface for Nadal on tour. Bar none.
Even a peak Nadal at 100% tennis, struggles here. The current version has no chance.
Nadal should NOT have played this tournament, especially while carrying an injury. Not only does he lose #1, but a potential chance at AO 2020 as well.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
I've been saying that for days now. The WTF surface is the SINGLE WORST surface for Nadal on tour. Bar none.
Even a peak Nadal at 100% tennis, struggles here. The current version has no chance.
Nadal should NOT have played this tournament, especially while carrying an injury. Not only does he lose #1, but a potential chance at AO 2020 as well.
I've suspected he'll under-perform, as usual, but this kind of awful form is very rare.

But after the battle, everyone's a general...
 

TennisFan3

Legend
But after the battle, everyone's a general...
That much I agree with. But in my defense, I've been saying since forever that Nadal sucks in this tournament.
The court doesn't take spin and his forehand is completely ineffectual. Really no point playing here any year for him. Especially not at 33.
He's just going to lose to everyone and that wouldn't happen elsewhere.
 
After the Zed loss, YE #1 is on Novak's racquet now if he wins this thing. Lets not forget though he has looked dominant in the last two WTF he played (2016 and 2018) and then got beat handily in both of those finals, so Rafa still has his chances to finish #1.
 

jm1980

G.O.A.T.
What if Nadal doesn't win a single match? Won't 3 RR wins and a SF loss cut it for Novak?
No, because the lead was originally 640 points. You don't get any points for just reaching the SF, so 3 RR wins would give Novak 600 points - 40 short of Rafa's total
 

Raphael Nadal

Professional
If Rafa loses all 3 matches, and Djokovic doesn't make the Final, then Rafa will finish #1 :)
Djokovic NEEDS to make the Final to have any shot at #1.
 

zvelf

Semi-Pro
Rafa keeps coming back from injury rejuvenated, so there is a good chance Rafa will get the Sampras year-end-#1 record eventually.
Also, after Federer/Djokovic retire, what happens if the young stars are unable to have a clear-cut leader who wins 2 slams per year? Then Rafa will be able to continue getting the #1 ranking in the next few years by keeping his Roland Garros/Rome mantle each year..... and Rafa will probably be winning hardcourt titles too in the next few years :)
Based on what we are seeing now Rafa is more consistent than ever on hardcourt..... whereas Djokovic is not as consistent on hardcourt, and appears to be at the mercy of the young guns.
Someone's dreaming hard, then woke up to a nightmare.
 

UnderratedSlam

Hall of Fame
Whaddaya know... Djokovic is in a gradual decline, after all. He won Wimby because RF wasn't ready to win it, he's getting injured at slams now, wins "only" one or two M1000s per year (which soon could be zero)... His delusions of breaking the slam record are becoming clear perhaps even to him as an unreachable goal. I've always said that the 2009/10 wasted seasons cost him the slam record. If he had won "just" one slam per 09 and 10, he'd have a chance, but...

Never will he be a clear-cut favourite for WTF again. Failing to win it for 3 seasons in a row after dominating the event for several years is pretty clear indication of that.

Now let's hope Thiem or a NextGenner wins WTF, so that NextGen-haters can have something to grumble about...
 
That much I agree with. But in my defense, I've been saying since forever that Nadal sucks in this tournament.
The court doesn't take spin and his forehand is completely ineffectual. Really no point playing here any year for him. Especially not at 33.
He's just going to lose to everyone and that wouldn't happen elsewhere.
to everyone?
 
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