Young upset with PMac

[guernica1]

The problem with your analogy is that Venus Williams despite her first match drubbing had shown the type of game it would take to dominate women's tennis if only for a few years.

Donald Young's game has shown nothing really except feel. Feel alone cannot get you very far in the men's game unless you have unreal amounts of it like Santoro. I've heard him compared to Marcelo Rios but honestly Rios was stronger, faster, hit a lot harder, and had a much better serve, not to mention he had an aura about him during his heyday.

 

[The tennis guy]

unorthodox approaches (not playing junior tennis at all like venus and serena or having dual careers as a junior and tour pro via wildcards) alway seem unorthodox (just a fancy word for crazy) UNTIL, 20 grand slams later, everyone has to finally admit that "wow, once again, billy jean king was right - being a champion is not about taking the conventional road but rather, the road less traveled".

You don't know what you are talking about. Donald Young is not taking unconventional approach. A lot of top juniors play both junior and ATP events either by wild card to main draw or wild card to qualify. Both Murray and Monfil had played both junior slams and ATP slam at the same time recently. The difference is other top junior at least offered resistent againt pros, won a set or two, even matches. DY has not been even close to win a set, and he took most wild cards than any other top junior from the past.

That's fact, not criticism. If you don't like it, win a set at least for god's sake.

 

[sandiegotennisboy]

This forum is filled with arm chair analysis.

i remember watching a 14 year newly turned pro, venus williams, playing all-time great steffi graf at the manhattan beach women's tournament in california years ago. she was routed by graf 6-1, 6-4. you could see that she had a lot of potential but venus was very erratic and raw.

after the match, her "crazy" father said he was pleased with how well venus played? the press had a field day complaining that venus was "all-hype", hadn't even played any junior tennis before turning pro, didn't deserve any wildcards, and implied that she was only getting them because she was black.

fast forward ten years

donald young turns pro at 15 and like the williams family, takes a somewhat unothodox approach to developing his career by, continuing to play the juniors while simultaneously accepting wild cards into top atp events only to get stomped on. his "crazy" parents say that they are pleased with what he's learning, that just the experience alone of his one-sided losses is great preparation for his future tour career, and that they are not worried about him taking a beating to his confidence.

likewise, everyone complains that he shouldn't be accepting wildcards because he doesn't deserve them and like venus, imply that he is only getting them because he's black.

the moral of the story is, noone can predict with any degree of accuracy, how everything will turn out for donald young.

unorthodox approaches (not playing junior tennis at all like venus and serena or having dual careers as a junior and tour pro via wildcards) alway seem unorthodox (just a fancy word for crazy) UNTIL, 20 grand slams later, everyone has to finally admit that "wow, once again, billy jean king was right - being a champion is not about taking the conventional road but rather, the road less traveled".

whatever. he doesnt have a weapon that stands out. ie roddicks forehand, gasquet's backhand, venus' athleticism, bagdahtis' athleticism, etc etc (this is so boring i can go on forever). his results are mediocre. and like i said on an earlier post, his management sux for wanting him to enter those pro tourneys so he can get a beatdown. what value does it have when you cant even win a decent amount of games. after maybe hmm, the 5th strait set loss he had, they maybe wouldve thought, "hmm, maybe he should play the challengers instead?"

dont give me the drama about venus. everyone who saw her as a 15 yr old knew she got IT. the IT factor. young doesnt.

 

[Jonas]

The problem with your analogy is that Venus Williams despite her first match drubbing had shown the type of game it would take to dominate women's tennis if only for a few years.

Donald Young's game has shown nothing really except feel. Feel alone cannot get you very far in the men's game unless you have unreal amounts of it like Santoro. I've heard him compared to Marcelo Rios but honestly Rios was stronger, faster, hit a lot harder, and had a much better serve, not to mention he had an aura about him during his heyday.

Again, Young is only 16.. It's not fair to compare him to Rios at this time, although there games are very similar.
I doubt Rios was as good as Young at 16 either.

 

[Jonas]

Young breeezed through his semi-final match at the easter bowl today and will be playing the final tommorow.
6-3 6-0 over C. Bowles/

 

[Bones08]

Young breeezed through his semi-final match at the easter bowl today and will be playing the final tommorow.
6-3 6-0 over C. Bowles/

Exactly, he's just destroying these other, bigger/stronger teenagers so easily, he's played one 3 setter in this huge tournament, and he's breezed through the doubles draw!

 

[J-man]

Young breeezed through his semi-final match at the easter bowl today and will be playing the final tommorow.
6-3 6-0 over C. Bowles/

see donald keep up the juniors carrer and then foucs on the ATP. i'm not going to take donald sersiously until he becomes the #1 junior boys player in the world again.

 

[Jonas]

see donald keep up the juniors carrer and then foucs on the ATP. i'm not going to take donald sersiously until he becomes the #1 junior boys player in the world

Uh, Donald finished last year ranked as the #1 18 year old in the world at age 16.
I don't know why I feel the need to defend Donald, but for some reason I just do.

 

[Bones08]

Uh, Donald finished last year ranked as the #1 18 year old in the world at age 16.
I don't know why I feel the need to defend Donald, but for some reason I just do.

Keep Doing It, as you can see some people don't know their stuff when it comes to Donald. Let alone how he's been called Chocolat Drop, and other things at Tournaments!

 

[J-man]

Uh, Donald finished last year ranked as the #1 18 year old in the world at age 16.
I don't know why I feel the need to defend Donald, but for some reason I just do.

oh crap i meant get back sorry he's sitting right now at #5 (whcih isn't bad ethier)

 

[Babblelot]

" 'He's won everything.' " - Ilona Young

"However, Young is playing those and going far into those tournaments, although he hasn't won a title yet."

Ok, I'm confused...anyone else? Seems to be a little bit of denial going on there.

Rated PG

There is a place for this crap in professional tennis. The place for parental guidence is called the WTA.

 

[tennisjunkiela]

he doesnt have a weapon that stands out. ie roddicks forehand, gasquet's backhand, venus' athleticism, bagdahtis' athleticism, etc etc (this is so boring i can go on forever).

dont give me the drama about venus. everyone who saw her as a 15 yr old knew she got IT. the IT factor. young doesnt.

hindsight is 20/20!

it's very easy now to say that "everyone who saw venus as a 15 year old knew she had IT" because she now has 5 grand slams under her belt. but the real fact is, venus and her family were subjected to the same exact criticisms that donald young and his family are being subjected to now!

at least donald has been the #1 junior in the world, at only age 16. venus, on the other hand, played virtually no junior tennis. the criticism was that although she might be athletic and fast, she wouldn't be mentally tough under pressure since she hadn't had any experience playing in pressure situations since she was only practicing against her kid sis serena.

thank god venus and serena's "crazy" father didn't listen to "conventional wisdom" for his unique daughters. and i commend donald young family for doing what they think is best for their unique son. conventional wisdom only works for conventional persons, not unique talents.

if the legendary john mcenroe and nick bolletteri both say that donald young's "great feel" will make him a great champion one day, i have much more confidence in their assessments than i do the arm chair analysts on this board. besides, the greats alway have a special insight in recognizing major talents way before the crowd (the posters on this board). which is why navratilova picked kutneskova to play doubles with her long before kutneskova won the us open. likewise, navratilova recognized sharapova's potential when she was only 5.

but as the quote above, "everyone who saw sharapova as a 5 year old knew that she had IT" right!

 

[sandiegotennisboy]

hindsight is 20/20!

it's very easy now to say that "everyone who saw venus as a 15 year old knew she had IT" because she now has 5 grand slams under her belt. but the real fact is, venus and her family were subjected to the same exact criticisms that donald young and his family are being subjected to now!

at least donald has been the #1 junior in the world, at only age 16. venus, on the other hand, played virtually no junior tennis. the criticism was that although she might be athletic and fast, she wouldn't be mentally tough under pressure since she hadn't had any experience playing in pressure situations since she was only practicing against her kid sis serena.

thank god venus and serena's "crazy" father didn't listen to "conventional wisdom" for his unique daughters. and i commend donald young family for doing what they think is best for their unique son. conventional wisdom only works for conventional persons, not unique talents.

if the legendary john mcenroe and nick bolletteri both say that donald young's "great feel" will make him a great champion one day, i have much more confidence in their assessments than i do the arm chair analysts on this board. besides, the greats alway have a special insight in recognizing major talents way before the crowd (the posters on this board). which is why navratilova picked kutneskova to play doubles with her long before kutneskova won the us open. likewise, navratilova recognized sharapova's potential when she was only 5.

but as the quote above, "everyone who saw sharapova as a 5 year old knew that she had IT" right!

well those old people you were talking about---it's so easy for them to say made up stuff like "i knew he/she had potential when he/she was still a fetus"...blah blah blah...."used to walk to school when there was 4 ft of snow" blah blah

and oh yeah, there's nothing like FEEL to get you those ATP W's. that's gonna win you slams for sure...yup, nothing like feel when you cant even get a decent rally going....

 

[Babblelot]

hindsight is 20/20!

thank god venus and serena's "crazy" father didn't listen to "conventional wisdom" for his unique daughters. and i commend donald young family for doing what they think is best for their unique son. conventional wisdom only works for conventional persons, not unique talents.

You slay me, tj.

Hmmm... I'm not sure what you're getting at when applying the descriptive adjective, "unique", to each of these individuals. So I thought that maybe you can help me out by telling me which of the following players listed below are also unique talents, and why?

Martina Navratilova
Steffi Graf
Andre Agassi
Arthur Ashe
Jimmy Connors
Roger Federer
Althea Gibson
Pete Sampras
Ilie Nastase
Bjorn Borg
Rod Laver

Thanks in advance.

 

[Pancho]

I agree with McEnroe, Young should stick to the bush leagues. There are better players that should take wildcards not Young. Young is not the teen phenom the media claim he is.

When comparing teen phenoms, Young way behind others like Micheal Chang in terms of ages. Chang beat ATP players when he was 15. When Chang was 15, Chang became the youngest player to win a main draw match at the US Open when he defeated Paul McNamee in four sets in the first round. A month later he reached the semi-finals at Scottsdale, Arizona to become the youngest player to reach the semi-final stage of a top-level professional tournament. He won his first top-level singles title in 1988 at San Francisco, aged 16 years and 7 months. Young has yet to catch up to Chang - Young has yet to win a set in the ATP tour.

Bottom line: Young is NOT the teen phenom. He is no Serena or Venus either.

 

[tennisjunkiela]

I agree with McEnroe, Young should stick to the bush leagues.

well, i agree with the other mcenroe (john) that doanld young has great hands that will make him a champion. given what john mcenroe has accomplished, let just say that i value his opinion much more than patrick's.

 

[Bones08]

well, i agree with the other mcenroe (john) that doanld young has great hands that will make him a champion. given what john mcenroe has accomplished, let just say that i value his opinion much more than patrick's.

I agree with a lot that you say!

 

[Rob_C]

DY isn't being offered wildcards, his parents are pressuring his agent to pressure the TD's to give him wildcards, that's a big difference.

DY did not win everything as a Junior and he did not dominate. He had to add a tournament in the last week of the season to clinch the #1 spot. He's only won one Junior Slam, Australia (Monfils won 3 in one year and might have won the 4th if not for a knee injury). DY has played a few Futures tournaments earlier this year making 1 semi and 2 quarters. He has not won a Challenger level match this year.

His development has been rushed and screwed up because of his parents egos. They need to stop pressuring their agent (who sadly doesn't have a pair big enough to stand up to them), and let DY play Futures tournaments where he belongs. They also need to swallow their pride and follow the example that Scoville Jenkins is setting, that's how you develop a tennis player.

The only reason he had to 'add' a tournament to clinch the year end No.1 ranking was because Cilic also decided to 'add' that same tournament to try become year end No. 1. If they had both stopped playing after the Orange Bowl, Young would have been No. 1. Cilic found out that if he played that extra tournament and earned enough pts in singles & doubles, he could overtake DY in the rankings. DY found out that Cilic entered the tournament, and what was still possible for the year end outcome and decided to enter the tournament to get more points also. Cilic didn't get enough pts anyway, cause he had to win the singles for that tournament to count & he lost in the semis.

I think DY's scheduling is just fine, and I don't think Sco Jenkins approach is all that exemplary. He's playing futures & challenegers because thats what his ranking allows him to do. After he gets his ranking up high enough to get direct acceptance he won't need WCs. He gets the occasional WC, and, like DY said, I dont know anybody who wouldnt take the WC if offered. I dont see Sco Jenkins, or anyone else, turning down any WC if they were offered.

Now should Jenkins be getting more WCs, probably, but dont blame that on DY.

 

[Bones08]

Great Post!

 

[superman1]

Look, the guy puts so much work in and has so many people behind him that it's just a matter of time before he starts winning on the pro circuit. It's not a lack of talent, it CAN'T be, this kid has been hyped for years and we're all sick of hearing of him, there must be a reason for it. But you can't succeed in men's tennis these days with just talent. You also need quite a bit of strength to be able to handle the pace that these guys deliver. Young just needs to keep growing and getting stronger, and eventually he'll feel ready. You don't even need to be a big guy or incredibly strong guy to succeed in tennis, but you do need to be a MAN, not a child. Once he grows up and doesn't need mama to wipe his diapers, he'll be ready.

 

[Fee]

I think DY's scheduling is just fine, and I don't think Sco Jenkins approach is all that exemplary. He's playing futures & challenegers because thats what his ranking allows him to do. After he gets his ranking up high enough to get direct acceptance he won't need WCs. He gets the occasional WC, and, like DY said, I dont know anybody who wouldnt take the WC if offered. I dont see Sco Jenkins, or anyone else, turning down any WC if they were offered.

Now should Jenkins be getting more WCs, probably, but dont blame that on DY.

DY is currently ranked in the 600's. Where should he be playing? Again, DY isn't being 'offered' wildcards, his team is actively seeking them out. Big difference.

I don't blame DY for Sco's wildcards or lack of. Sco is earning everything he's getting the same way most players are. It's not his fault he doesn't have a quote from John McEnroe in his press packet.

 

[Bones08]

i SEE THAT SOMEONE MUST NOT BE A FAN OF THE NEXT BIG THING!!!!!!!(lol)

 

[Rob_C]

DY is currently ranked in the 600's. Where should he be playing? Again, DY isn't being 'offered' wildcards, his team is actively seeking them out. Big difference.

I don't blame DY for Sco's wildcards or lack of. Sco is earning everything he's getting the same way most players are. It's not his fault he doesn't have a quote from John McEnroe in his press packet.

Everyone kinda has to to seek out WC's, its then up to the TD to decide who gets them. Roddick 'sought' out a WC to Delray Beach at the last minute but since the TD had alreadyagreed to give them to other players, Roddick wound not playing.

I'm pretty sure theres some info on WCs on the USTA Pro Circuit site, if I remember correctly, it's a form you have to fill out and send in, then its up to the powers that be, to grant your request or not.

 

[norcal]

This forum is filled with arm chair analysis.

i remember watching a 14 year newly turned pro, venus williams, playing all-time great steffi graf at the manhattan beach women's tournament in california years ago. she was routed by graf 6-1, 6-4. you could see that she had a lot of potential but venus was very erratic and raw.

after the match, her "crazy" father said he was pleased with how well venus played? the press had a field day complaining that venus was "all-hype", hadn't even played any junior tennis before turning pro, didn't deserve any wildcards, and implied that she was only getting them because she was black.

.

Your comparison is a joke. I saw Venus play in her first pro tournament. I saw her win her first and second pro matches, easily, against veteran type WTA players (one was Shaun Stafford can't remember the other). There was no doubt when Venus turned pro she was ready for the tour. I'm not sure in what round she played Steffi, but losing to Steffi 1-6,4-6 isn't much more routed than most other WTA players were against Steffi.

Richard Williams was not pleased with how Venus was doing after going 0-9 and getting double bagled by a marginal pro, he was pleased how she was doing cause she was regularly winning tour matches. If DY played Fed right now I guarantee he wouldn't get 5 games. If Fed tried he could probably get a golden set off Donald.

I truly hope Donald does well and develops into a top pro, the US needs more good young players. But don't compare him to a young Venus.

 

[Bones08]

i DON'T THINK HE COULD GET A GOLDEN SET, BUT IT WOULDN'T BE PRETTY!

 

[d70]

young sucks. period.

 

[Rob_C]

DY is currently ranked in the 600's. Where should he be playing? Again, DY isn't being 'offered' wildcards, his team is actively seeking them out. Big difference.

I don't blame DY for Sco's wildcards or lack of. Sco is earning everything he's getting the same way most players are. It's not his fault he doesn't have a quote from John McEnroe in his press packet.

Here's a link to the USTA WC request page, this is the first step to getting a WC. I'm sure they get tons of them for every tournament.

http://dps.usta.com/usta_master/usta/doc/content/doc_13_7368.pdf?12/6/2004 3:09:18 PM

I'm pretty sure the ATP has a similar system.

 

[ibemadskillzz]

Last year, Young lost in the quarterfinals of the Easter Bowl to Michael Shabaz 6-2, 7-5. Young said the loss stung so much that he's been thinking about it frequently.

"I came here for the wrong reason. I came to hang out, have fun and talk to everyone. It wasn't to play tennis too much," Young said. "But he played well. He surprised me. I beat him every time last year. For him to come out and play that well surprised me."

Of course he got beat by Michael Shabaz. Michael is my friend and I use to play with him a lot. I remember when I watched him play a UCLA tennis player and beat him during the summer. Michael Shabaz, you are the man. That's my boy right there. GO MIKE.

 

[mr2union]

so did DY get into the Easter Bowl final? I read from the usta site that Querrey the number 2 seed in straight set in the final.

With the win of the Easter Bowl, Querrey got the wildcard to the Mercedes Cup.

I never followed Junior tennis and I never saw DY play. So I ain't going to comment to much. I will just say that if DY is good enough to do something with the WC that he is offered, then he deserves them. But if he continues to be 0-6 0-6 by a qualifier who never won an ATP match once, then he is OBVIOUSLY NOT ready to play any ATP match. Some posters said that playing the first round match at ATP tournament will earn him points, so he should definitely take the WC. Yes, that is good for DY, but it is so unfair to the rest of the tour.

 

[MaxT]

Last year Young and Monfil were playing JMac and Nadal at the U.S. Open fun event sponsered by Nike. Young looked visibly small and lack of power. JMac only said he had good touch, but that is of little use again adult who can kill every sitting ball.

 

[mr2union]

so did DY get into the Easter Bowl final? I read from the usta site that Querrey the number 2 seed in straight set in the final.

With the win of the Easter Bowl, Querrey got the wildcard to the Mercedes Cup.

I found out, I was confused by the USTA website yesterday. Sam Querrey won the 2005 Easter Bowl title. DY won this year's title.