Your all missing the point Re: Serena

[35ft6]

and jonh mac clearly thinks rules are only good in certain situation, even though i respect his accomplishments hes dumb serious "you cant call that there" its the rules!!!!!

Yeah, that was weird. He was flat out suggesting the lines people not make calls depending on the person and situation.

 

[Deuce]

Nice argument Deuce. Too bad that it's not up for argument. If you know tennis, then you know this is how it is. If you don't know much about tennis, (and I can see that you don't), I can see how you might feel this way about it. Heck, the U.S. Open even had a woman as ignorant about tennis as yourself out there as a linesperson!

^ What an utter cop out of a reply this is - put the focus on ME - and make wild claims about me - rather than address what I wrote.

I've been playing and following tennis for 30 years.
There are plenty of things I don't know. Tennis ain't one of them.

 

[Steady Eddy]

^ What an utter cop out of a reply this is - put the focus on ME - and make wild claims about me - rather than address what I wrote.

I've been playing and following tennis for 30 years.
There are plenty of things I don't know. Tennis ain't one of them.

Then we've been playing for the same amount of time. Players get irritated when others call "foot fault" on them. But it's understood that one doesn't do that to create a double fault on, say, match point, or next to match point. Maybe you disagree with that, but you're aware of it, right?

 

[dwhiteside]

Then we've been playing for the same amount of time. Players get irritated when others call "foot fault" on them. But it's understood that one doesn't do that to create a double fault on, say, match point, or next to match point. Maybe you disagree with that, but you're aware of it, right?

There's a difference between club tennis and sanctioned tennis with an umpire, linespeople, and ATP ranking points involved. And just because there's, (in your view), a common law tradition of letting slip close footfaults doesn't mean the tradition is correct and nondebatable as to whether or not it's right or wrong. Plenty of things which are tradition are clearly unjust.

 

[Deuce]

Then we've been playing for the same amount of time. Players get irritated when others call "foot fault" on them. But it's understood that one doesn't do that to create a double fault on, say, match point, or next to match point. Maybe you disagree with that, but you're aware of it, right?

Certainly I'm aware of it. I see players all over the place foot faulting - and I hate it.
I especially hate seeing it overlooked in a tournament - on any level.
To me, the acceptance of foot faults gives tennis a black eye.

That being said, as 'dwhiteside' mentioned above, there is an enormous difference between a local tournament where there are typically no linespeople, and the US Open.

I attended a Junior tournament recently - some of the top juniors in the world - and when I saw foot faults being called, I was very happy. Teaching kids that it is unacceptable to violate the rules is a positive thing.

There is no such thing as a petty rule in a sport. Especially at a pro level.
Again - rules are designed to create a level playing field. If one doesn't agree with the rules, one should simply not play.

 

[Steady Eddy]

There's a difference between club tennis and sanctioned tennis with an umpire, linespeople, and ATP ranking points involved. And just because there's, (in your view), a common law tradition of letting slip close footfaults doesn't mean the tradition is correct and nondebatable as to whether or not it's right or wrong. Plenty of things which are tradition are clearly unjust.

True, but...(and thanks for the reasoned reply), if Serena is playing the last few points with the assurance that she won't be called for footfaults, (not bulletproof, but unless she makes it outrageous, she's ok), I can see why she'd feel shocked and cheated if this implied guarantee was betrayed. Insiders like McEnroe know about this tradition. I think the lineswoman didn't. (She should have been briefed before the match). I think it's a good tradition too. I'd rather see tennis than rulings. But the point is, this has been a tradition, something many fans and posters are unaware of. So it's not like Serena was called for a footfault on a critical point, and that's disappointing, but that's tennis. The point is, this is almost unprecedented in tennis. If the U.S. Open wanted to break with tradition this year, they should have informed the players.

 

[Tennis Fan]

I definitely wish this whole incident hadn't happened & now they're never going to let Serena (& Venus) forget it. The commentators & everyone will be talking about this for a LONG time to come because they just love to make a mistake linger on & on, especially if they don't particularly care for the person who made the mistake.

Roddick, McEnroe, & Connors are all huge a$$holes, but the public still LOVES them to death & overlooks all the numerous outbursts & yelling they've done to the many chair umpires.

Unfortunately, if you're a minority female, nothing you do is overlooked like it is when certain other people do it & that's the unfair reality of life.

 

[dwhiteside]

True, but...(and thanks for the reasoned reply), if Serena is playing the last few points with the assurance that she won't be called for footfaults, (not bulletproof, but unless she makes it outrageous, she's ok), I can see why she'd feel shocked and cheated if this implied guarantee was betrayed. Insiders like McEnroe know about this tradition. I think the lineswoman didn't. (She should have been briefed before the match). I think it's a good tradition too. I'd rather see tennis than rulings. But the point is, this has been a tradition, something many fans and posters are unaware of. So it's not like Serena was called for a footfault on a critical point, and that's disappointing, but that's tennis. The point is, this is almost unprecedented in tennis. If the U.S. Open wanted to break with tradition this year, they should have informed the players.

I'm heading to bed. I can definitely empathize with your viewpoint and what you said in this post does make sense - it's true that I've never seen this happen before in such a crucial junction and that very well may be because of the unspoken reasons behind the actions of linespeople, actions which have indeed as you say been the standard (but not *necessarily* right or by the book or fair). Indeed, these actions, traditional as they may be, could be A) either common sense overlooking for sake of sport and the ostensible triviality of only a few centimeters, but also, for B), fear of retribution, crowd upset, and upsetting the crucial outcome of a match in such a way by something potentially negligible and unimportant. But then the whole issue of hardline rules comes into play - is it *really* unimportant, is it *really* negligible, or must we not make exceptions because it creates a shifty environment that isn't standardized and isn't entirely fair because it's situationally dependent - and this falls into the realm of debate on what sports ARE, what rules are, how sports should be, why rules exist, what the purpose of sports is, things entire books are written about! Interesting debates all around prompted by such a drama filled evening.

 

[jelle v]

I only just saw the match, but to call a double a footfault causing a double fault at that score is just ridiculous. If one does that as a line judge, one does not have any feeling for the sport or any sense of etiquette. I can totally understand that Serena reacts pissed. I don't know what Serena said and if she went to far with the things she said, but the line judge made a bad mistake there, no matter if it was indeed a footfault. You just don't call a footfault that will cause a double fault which will lead to 2 matchpoints.

Just to be clear: If Serena was out of line with the things she said, she deserves to be punished and the pointpenalty was right. But the line judgde is the first one to make a big mistake in my opinion.

 

[babbette]

"Clijsters will face Caroline Wozniacki for the U.S. Open crown in a contest that surely will be overshadowed by the inevitable fallout of Williams’ mental meltdown."
Oh lord!!:shock: Ok If I ever see anyone get frustrated or angry again during an intense moment in which they feel they were wronged i'll call dr phill.

 

[Gaudio2004]

Rules are rules - line judges are paid to call a fault when they see one.

 

[drakulie]

to call a foot fault at that instant was uncalled for.

I suppose you feel, "in that instance", if Serena had double faulted it would have been "uncalled for", for the point to go to kim?

Rules are rules.

Fact is, the lineswoman, and chair ump acted extraordinarily professional, made the right call, and should be commended for not allowing a GIANT of the WTA to bully them and "run the show", as is the case in the ATP

The ATP should use this as an example of how to take control of a match and enforce rules (ie, Nadal, Joker, and their insistent time waisting).

 

[Lionheart392]

I suppose you feel, "in that instance", if Serena had double faulted it would have been "uncalled for", for the point to go to kim?

Rules are rules.

Fact is, the lineswoman, and chair ump acted extraordinarily professional, made the right call, and should be commended for not allowing a GIANT of the WTA to bully them and "run the show", as is the case in the ATP

The ATP should use this as an example of how to take control of a match and enforce rules (ie, Nadal, Joker, and their insistent time waisting).

I agree with your last point. This incident showed that the players can have the biggest tantrum in history but the reality is that the officials have the final say, not the players. Umpires shouldn't be so afraid to punish players. I'm glad the officials last night had the stones to make an example of Serena.

 

[Lionheart392]

The speeding limit is 55.....does anyone get pulled over if they do 56?

This was a freaking important point....besides ....she didn't foot fault.

What difference does it make whether it's match point, 1 point away from match point, or the first point of the match? Officials should use the same judgement at EVERY point in the match and treat them all equally. Should the lineswoman have thought 'Ok well I WAS going to call a foot fault but this is a freaking important point, so I'll keep quiet'. Obviously not. I don't know if the call was right or not, but the fact that the match was at such a crucial stage is irrelevant.

 

[Bud]

A foot fault needs to be quite blatant to be called. Not just at this stage of the match, but at any stage. Because a foot fault is VERY hard to see. The shoe can hang over the line, but not be touching it. If videos afterwards show that the foot fault was really obvious, then that is legitimate. But if the foot fault wasn't obvious, then that is not a call that the judge should make. A rule is a rule, yes. And in a perfect world, we would call even the closest foot fault. But the problem is that it is so hard to see, that if you start trying to call everything that is barely a foot fault, you will end up handing out lots of foot faults wrongfully. And that is far worse than not calling foot faults that are barely ones.

Exactly. A lot of people seem to be missing this point.

Good posts. Glad to see I don't share this planet with nothing but robots.

I think most reasonable people see the issue in this light.

 

[Lionheart392]

I disagree.

When rules are enforced blindly without judgement then you are no different than a robot.

You have to weigh the outomes....

Should a match be decided by a possible milimeter ?

Let's say Serena did foot fault ever so slightly .....what advantage did she gain by it? Should the entire match ne decided by such a minor harmless technicality?

If it was flagrant....ok......but this was just stupid to call on that point. It decided the outcome of the match. That's a far greater injustice .

Wrong. Kim outplayed Serena in the match. THAT decided the outcome.

 

[AR15]

I disagree.

When rules are enforced blindly without judgement then you are no different than a robot.

You have to weigh the outomes....

Should a match be decided by a possible milimeter ?

Let's say Serena did foot fault ever so slightly .....what advantage did she gain by it? Should the entire match ne decided by such a minor harmless technicality?

If it was flagrant....ok......but this was just stupid to call on that point. It decided the outcome of the match. That's a far greater injustice .

No, the foot fault did not decide the outcome of the match. Serena's tantrum decided it.

You are wrong about everything and just need to shut up.

 

[Ocean Gypsy]

If you barely foot fault, then that means a linesperson could not have possibly seen that foot fault clearly. It was, therefore, too close to make such a call. It's the same when an umpire makes an overrule on the far side. You shouldn't make that call.

Some of you need to stop being foolish. Let the players play tennis.

You need to stop being apologetic for stupid, offensive, unsportsmanlike behavior. This isn't about a foot fault there sparky.

 

[aptennis91]

No, the foot fault did not decide the outcome of the match. Serena's tantrum decided it.

You are wrong about everything and just need to shut up.

What debate class did you take?
cuz that's the greatest show of ignorance that i've seen on this thread.
WATCH ESPN!! They are showing replays of Serena's so called foot fault every 10 minutes.
That was clearly not a foot fault. Unless that lineswoman has laser vision, she would not have been able to see the foot fault.

 

[aptennis91]

You need to stop being apologetic for stupid, offensive, unsportsmanlike behavior. This isn't about a foot fault there sparky.

Actually, it is..
If it wasn't for that dumb call, we'd be celebrating Clijster's superb return and the possibility of Henin coming back instead of this crap.

 

[AR15]

What debate class did you take?
cuz that's the greatest show of ignorance that i've seen on this thread.
WATCH ESPN!! They are showing replays of Serena's so called foot fault every 10 minutes.
That was clearly not a foot fault. Unless that lineswoman has laser vision, she would not have been able to see the foot fault.

The foot fault IS NOT THE ISSUE! The tantrum is the issue. She could have kept playing had she not lost the point do to the tantrum.

 

[jwbarrientos]

She had been called earlier in the match by a different line umpire, several times during this tournament and all through her career.

You sure??? Serena said (post game interview) that only in this tournament... a lot compared to previous...

 

[charliefedererer]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZcDn8JWCLo
this looks like a foot fault to me. at 40-45 secs you can see serana is already "barely" on the line, and then she twist her foot in which clearly looks like a foot fault. And even if its a lil in you should still call it, its like saying if micheal jordan or kobe bryant barely step on the freethrow line when they shot it shouldnt matter and it should just be given to them. ridiculous and i second that, Jonh Mac probably just wanted to see the match played out but ya kno what, rules are rules. Kim C didnt want to win that way but she wouldnt if they gave they point back to serena and somehow she lost. that a couple a 100 grands were talking about. but ya know its tennis and tennis is a sport so you know you gotta "EXPECT THE UNEXPECTED"

Thanks for posting this video. The camera angle makes it impossible to state with absolute certainty that it was a foot fault, but looking at this footage it certainly does look like a foot fault to me.

 

[AR15]

What debate class did you take?
cuz that's the greatest show of ignorance that i've seen on this thread.
WATCH ESPN!! They are showing replays of Serena's so called foot fault every 10 minutes.
That was clearly not a foot fault. Unless that lineswoman has laser vision, she would not have been able to see the foot fault.

Hey jerk: Show me the definitive evidence you have.

 

[JeMar]

I just saw the video of the incident and that was most definitely a foot fault.

However, with that said, that lineswoman is without a doubt the lamest, most pathetic official I've ever seen officiate a match at the center court of a slam. I've never lost my head in a tennis court, but I can definitely see myself acting like Serena if something like that had happened to me.

 

[AR15]

I just saw the video of the incident and that was most definitely a foot fault.

However, with that said, that lineswoman is without a doubt the lamest, most pathetic official I've ever seen officiate a match at the center court of a slam. I've never lost my head in a tennis court, but I can definitely see myself acting like Serena if something like that had happened to me.

OK, so in your mind, a lineman should decide when and when not to do her job? She shouldn't just attempt to make calls as she sees them?

 

[Enlightened Coelacanth]

It's one of the great unwritten codes of sports that you don't let an officiating call decide a match when it's all on the line. You let the players decide things on the field of battle.

But why is this so? Is it not worse to simply suspend the rules when the clock runs down and let players go outside the boundaries to gain advantage?

It's rare to find a linesperson with the guts to make a call like that in a tight spot, but if she saw a foot fault (and who is here to claim she definitely didn't?) then why shouldn't she make the call?
Doesn't Serena gain an unfair advantage by walking over the baseline as she serves? So wouldn't not calling that fault be doing an injustice to Clijsters? Let's not forget who is at fault here for not keeping her feet off the line. It isn't Clijsters.

It was Serena's ballistic mental melt down that cost her the match. Not her own foot fault. That's the bottom line. Period.

 

[JeMar]

OK, so in your mind, a lineman should decide when and when not to do her job? She shouldn't just attempt to make calls as she sees them?

In fifteen years of watching tennis, I do not recall a player ever foot-faulting into match points at 5-6 in the last set of a match. Has it ever happened in the hundreds, if not thousands, of matches I've seen? Of course it has. The possibilities are just too great to suggest otherwise. I've seen foot faults called, but never in such an important moment. There's a difference between calling it here and calling it at 2-3, 0-15 in the first set.

The linesperson has the common sense to not call them and let the matches come to their natural end. This linesperson apparently has no common sense and is so pedantic in her approach to the rules that it goes against 15 years of officiating precedent.

 

[charliefedererer]

I just saw the video of the incident and that was most definitely a foot fault.

However, with that said, that lineswoman is without a doubt the lamest, most pathetic official I've ever seen officiate a match at the center court of a slam. I've never lost my head in a tennis court, but I can definitely see myself acting like Serena if something like that had happened to me.

I agree the video footage leaves almost no doubt in my mind that this was truly a foot fault.
What if Michael Jordan "MOST DEFINITELY" stepped on the foul line shooting a free throw, down by one point, with time expired in the seventh game of the NBA finals, and the camera angle clearly showed he had commited a violation?
Officials are trained to make the call as a reflex. Unless they are trained to not make the call when the game is on the line.

 

[JeMar]

And just to be clear, I'm only saying that calling the foot fault was stupid. Serena's reaction toward the linesperson definitely deserved the default she received.

 

[AR15]

In fifteen years of watching tennis, I do not recall a player ever foot-faulting into match points at 5-6 in the last set of a match. Has it ever happened in the hundreds, if not thousands, of matches I've seen? Of course it has. The possibilities are just too great to suggest otherwise. I've seen foot faults called, but never in such an important moment. There's a difference between calling it here and calling it at 2-3, 0-15 in the first set.

The linesperson has the common sense to not call them and let the matches come to their natural end. This linesperson apparently has no common sense and is so pedantic in her approach to the rules that it goes against 15 years of officiating precedent.

Do you think line judges are trained in your way of thinking?

I figure they are trained to watch their line regardless of the score. In fact, if they are really concentrating on their job (and I'm sure it takes a tremendous amount of focus), then they should even be keeping up with the score.

 

[JeMar]

Do you think line judges are trained in your way of thinking?

I figure they are trained to watch their line regardless of the score. In fact, if they are really concentrating on their job (and I'm sure it takes a tremendous amount of focus), then they should even be keeping up with the score.

If that's true, then why has this never happened in the last fifteen years of grand slam play? Did they decide to switch textbooks as soon as this lady walked into line-calling school?

 

[charliefedererer]

Do you think line judges are trained in your way of thinking?

“I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn’t lived that life.”

 

[rommil]

And just to be clear, I'm only saying that calling the foot fault was stupid. Serena's reaction toward the linesperson definitely deserved the default she received.

And I commend the lineswoman for saying something about it and not letting it slide.

 

[AR15]

If that's true, then why has this never happened in the last fifteen years of grand slam play? Did they decide to switch textbooks as soon as this lady walked into line-calling school?

I don't have 15 years of grand slam play committed to memory, so I can't agree that a foot fault has not been called on a match point. Perhaps you are correct, but I think that entirely misses the point.

 

[AR15]

Do you think line judges are trained in your way of thinking?
/

“I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn’t lived that life.”

You lost me with the racial references.

 

[JeMar]

I don't have 15 years of grand slam play committed to memory, so I can't agree that a foot fault has not been called on a match point. Perhaps you are correct, but I think that entirely misses the point.

It doesn't miss the point. Think of calling a foot fault as arresting a small child for running a lemonade stand without a business permit. Sure, the child is technically violating a law, but only a complete ******bag of a cop would choose to NOT just glance over it and move on.

The foot fault and the lemonade stand are both against the rules, but we choose not to prosecute because they really don't hurt anyone. The advantage that someone gains by slightly stepping into the line isn't enough to cost someone match points in such an important match, and because of this, line officials choose to ignore the rule in such great occasions.

 

[AR15]

The advantage that someone gains by slightly stepping into the line isn't enough to cost someone match points in such an important match, .

agreed. Serena had multiple foot faults called against her during the tournament. Why didn't she stand back a couple of inches so the foot faults wouldn't continue?

And your lemon aid stand example would be more apples to apples (sorry for the change of fruit) if you mentioned that the police had given the child multiple warnings before closing her down that last time.

 

[Rain]

Rules are rules. They should call everything consistently throughout the match, throughout the tournament. If this were actually practiced, then we wouldn't have this argument about at what point in the match an official should waver from certain rules that dont "seem" as big a deal as other rules. Just call everything.

 

[charliefedererer]

Do you think line judges are trained in your way of thinking?
/
You lost me with the racial references.

It wasn't supposed to be a racial reference. It's that different judges judge differently.
JeMar has the opinion that at such a moment such a minor infraction should be overlooked. I actually think on a certain level of sportmanship he is right, and I suspect Kim Clijsters would also wish that play would have gone on without the call. If I was playing Serena, I would not want the call to be made. But neither JeMar, Kim or I were staring intently at that line to make an instanteous call as we had been instructed. She yells it out as soon as she sees it. There is no pause.

 

[tennisesq]

I despise Serena and am not defending her at all but to call a foot fault at that instant was uncalled for. She had not been pinned earlier in the match (correct me if im wrong) and at that circumstance the line official should have known what such implications would have. I know 'rules are rules' but cmon at that stage who would honestly have the guts to do that. For those people who play tennis, you would react if that happened to you.

Serena's actions however were inexcusable and I hope she receives much criticism. All her career she has been a poor loser and that match (and interview) made it blatant for everyone. She would have redeemed some of her credibility if she had been apologetic in the interview but of course her stupidity got the better of her. For a professional athlete, this is one of the lowest acts ive ever seen.

If I'm not mistaken, Serena called a code violation for racket abuse when she threw her racket on the ground at the conclusion of the first set. She made an error which cost her the set. The second code violation was for the verbal exchange with the lineswoman.

I almost agree 100%. First, that was clearly not a foot fault. Even Johnny Mac said that. To call that at this stage of the match was ridiculous, and to make an erroneous call is inexcusable. I'm not defending what she said (if she said anything threatening) because you can't defend the indefensible, but to make an erroneous call like that at that stage in the match would drive ANY tennis player bonkers. From what I saw, it was obvious that she dropped the f-bomb twice (and it was censored by CBS) but we can only speculate as to the rest was said to the lineswoman. What I don't understand is why should she apologize in the press interview for her behavior? We don't know, but perhaps she apologized to the lineswoman during her conversation with the tournament director, the chair umpire, and the lineswoman herself. I understand that some of you think she should apologize in the press as a P.R. stunt, but according to a lot of posters in this board, she's already a poor sport, even before she walked on the court today. So, redemption is nearly impossible. I think it was fair enough for her to say that she was over it and that she doesn't want to talk about it. End of story.

Also, to call her behavior "ghetto" is uncalled for. The last time I checked, this kind of behavior is not unique to people from the "ghetto". Johnny Mac was infamous for his temper and his outbursts on numerous occasions. According to the logic of this thread he should be ghetto, too, right? Wait a minute, he can't be because he's white.

 

[gflyer]

If I'm not mistaken, Serena called a code violation for racket abuse when she threw her racket on the ground at the conclusion of the first set. She made an error which cost her the set. The second code violation was for the verbal exchange with the lineswoman.

I almost agree 100%. First, that was clearly not a foot fault. Even Johnny Mac said that. To call that at this stage of the match was ridiculous, and to make an erroneous call is inexcusable. I'm not defending what she said (if she said anything threatening) because you can't defend the indefensible, but to make an erroneous call like that at that stage in the match would drive ANY tennis player bonkers. From what I saw, it was obvious that she dropped the f-bomb twice (and it was censored by CBS) but we can only speculate as to the rest was said to the lineswoman. What I don't understand is why should she apologize in the press interview for her behavior? We don't know, but perhaps she apologized to the lineswoman during her conversation with the tournament director, the chair umpire, and the lineswoman herself. I understand that some of you think she should apologize in the press as a P.R. stunt, but according to a lot of posters in this board, she's already a poor sport, even before she walked on the court today. So, redemption is nearly impossible. I think it was fair enough for her to say that she was over it and that she doesn't want to talk about it. End of story.

Also, to call her behavior "ghetto" is uncalled for. The last time I checked, this kind of behavior is not unique to people from the "ghetto". Johnny Mac was infamous for his temper and his outbursts on numerous occasions. According to the logic of this thread he should be ghetto, too, right? Wait a minute, he can't be because he's white.

Martina Navratilova on TC said that the last episode itself was enough to be defaulted, no matter the code violation in the firs set.

 

[GuyClinch]

First off a foot fault is a serious violation. If you stop calling them players will take steps closer to the net when they serve. You have to call it. If you don't it would ruin the game.

Secondly Serena's problem is the tirade that came with it. People compare this to Johnny Mac and Connors.. But I don't. These guys insulted the linesperson's intelligence and eyesight. But they never threatened to kill them. Because of course that is something they could physically do...

Its like getting pulled over by a cop - insult them sure and risk some hassle. But don't threaten to kill em.

 

[AR15]

First of all Serena did not foot fault.

Second no one is saying they should not be called....but on the point next to match point??? Way too questionable ....McEnroe didn't like it, Clijsters didn't like it....even the head official was upset.

Wrong call at the wrong time.

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=287617

I'd also like to know how you are so sure. I still have not seen definitive evidence.

 

[Andres]

For those people who play tennis, you would react if that happened to you.

Yes, I would have smacked my head with my racquet for being stupid enough to footfault set down, 5-6 down, 15-30 down.

 

[flyboy1]

I have NO problem with the foot fault call, though the foot fault wasn't egregious. What I do have a problem with is the lineswoman tattling on Serena. When it's match point at the US Open, you need to make sure that the match ends the way it's supposed to end, not on a Code Violation. It's really bad for the game and really bad for the tournament, and really unfortunate for the fans because it was a close match.

Obviously this is a very subjective issue because you can easily argue that "technically" Serena deserved a Code Violation after the first set. But I find it really hard for someone to make the case that Serena deserved a Code Violation for losing her cool towards a lineswoman, especially in THAT situation. The lineswoman had every right to call a foot fault. But I've seen many a match where a linesperson will make a call and just sit there and take it when a player reads them the riot act.

It's chicken**it to end an important match that way, with the lineswoman scampering over to the chair umpire to tattle, and then after that, when Serena gets upset at her again, she goes BACK to the chair umpire like Serena was going to do something to her. Comeon....was she really going to hurt her in front of all those people. How can she feel threatened. The faint of heart should not be linespeople. Also......boo on the chair umpire for bringing the tournament referee into the picture. Chair umpires are supposed to use discretion, not simply be drones.

Serena should have been able to finish the match and then substantially fined by the tour afterwards.

 

[Lionheart392]

I have NO problem with the foot fault call, though the foot fault wasn't egregious. What I do have a problem with is the lineswoman tattling on Serena. When it's match point at the US Open, you need to make sure that the match ends the way it's supposed to end, not on a Code Violation. It's really bad for the game and really bad for the tournament, and really unfortunate for the fans because it was a close match.

Obviously this is a very subjective issue because you can easily argue that "technically" Serena deserved a Code Violation after the first set. But I find it really hard for someone to make the case that Serena deserved a Code Violation for losing her cool towards a lineswoman, especially in THAT situation. The lineswoman had every right to call a foot fault. But I've seen many a match where a linesperson will make a call and just sit there and take it when a player reads them the riot act.

It's chicken**it to end an important match that way, with the lineswoman scampering over to the chair umpire to tattle, and then after that, when Serena gets upset at her again, she goes BACK to the chair umpire like Serena was going to do something to her. Comeon....was she really going to hurt her in front of all those people. How can she feel threatened. The faint of heart should not be linespeople. Also......boo on the chair umpire for bringing the tournament referee into the picture. Chair umpires are supposed to use discretion, not simply be drones.

Serena should have been able to finish the match and then substantially fined by the tour afterwards.

Serena's behaviour was inexcusable and she deserved to be punished, the lineswoman had every right to consult the umpire. If she didn't want to be penalised then she should've tried to be more reasonable. As I said in another thread, don't do the crime if you can't do the time. She won't get any special treatment just because she's Serena Williams.

 

[WillAlwaysLoveYouTennis]

I have NO problem with the foot fault call, though the foot fault wasn't egregious. What I do have a problem with is the lineswoman tattling on Serena. When it's match point at the US Open, you need to make sure that the match ends the way it's supposed to end, not on a Code Violation. It's really bad for the game and really bad for the tournament, and really unfortunate for the fans because it was a close match.

Obviously this is a very subjective issue because you can easily argue that "technically" Serena deserved a Code Violation after the first set. But I find it really hard for someone to make the case that Serena deserved a Code Violation for losing her cool towards a lineswoman, especially in THAT situation. The lineswoman had every right to call a foot fault. But I've seen many a match where a linesperson will make a call and just sit there and take it when a player reads them the riot act.

It's chicken**it to end an important match that way, with the lineswoman scampering over to the chair umpire to tattle, and then after that, when Serena gets upset at her again, she goes BACK to the chair umpire like Serena was going to do something to her. Comeon....was she really going to hurt her in front of all those people. How can she feel threatened. The faint of heart should not be linespeople. Also......boo on the chair umpire for bringing the tournament referee into the picture. Chair umpires are supposed to use discretion, not simply be drones.

Serena should have been able to finish the match and then substantially fined by the tour afterwards.

You threaten an official's life, and they have the right to report it and the linesperson justly did so. Serena or anyone doesn't have the right to threaten another person's life on or off court, and the law in USA besides WTA rules back that up.

But as usual you'll have those who think certain people should be given leeway just because of who they are and what's going on at the time. If the situation was reversed and someone cursed you out and threatened your life, you wouldn't like it and would report it. What an entirely stupid comment: so the match can end the way YOU want it to, a hot-head (even if justifiably angry) should be allowed to act however they please. Serena violated standards, CLEAR code violation and entirely deserved a default. From your comment, BULLIES should be allowed to say and do whatever they want, and if someone reports it, the one who reports it is the one with wrong behavior? Absurd.

The comments you make are entirely immaterial "did she really feel threatened" is IRRELEVANT. You don't make threats like that, its unprofessional, unwarranted and WRONG. Flat out. And linesperson should take whatever a player dishes out? They have the right to do their job without being threatened just as if they were at any other. If a person at court side visibly angry, and yelling threatened a player's life, you can believe this person would be taken in hand by security with a quickness. Unacceptable behavior, on or off court. A player threatening someone shouldn't be allowed either, and it wasn't. Good for them putting a stop to it.

Whether one agrees with the foot fault call or not, the linesperson was doing their job, professionally, as required and expected, call it as they see it, reporting what needs to be reported. Whether Serena received ANY footfaults calls or warnings previously in the match, threatening the linesperson in the way she did warranted a default.

 

[stormholloway]

You need to stop being apologetic for stupid, offensive, unsportsmanlike behavior. This isn't about a foot fault there sparky.

WTF are you talking about? This is why this part of the forum is such garbage, because half-brains like you are allowed to post. We're talking ABOUT the foot fault, so yes this is about the foot fault. I never apologized for her cursing out the lineswoman, ever, so shut up.

 

[Dave M]

I have NO problem with the foot fault call, though the foot fault wasn't egregious. What I do have a problem with is the lineswoman tattling on Serena. When it's match point at the US Open, you need to make sure that the match ends the way it's supposed to end, not on a Code Violation. It's really bad for the game and really bad for the tournament, and really unfortunate for the fans because it was a close match.

Obviously this is a very subjective issue because you can easily argue that "technically" Serena deserved a Code Violation after the first set. But I find it really hard for someone to make the case that Serena deserved a Code Violation for losing her cool towards a lineswoman, especially in THAT situation. The lineswoman had every right to call a foot fault. But I've seen many a match where a linesperson will make a call and just sit there and take it when a player reads them the riot act.

It's chicken**it to end an important match that way, with the lineswoman scampering over to the chair umpire to tattle, and then after that, when Serena gets upset at her again, she goes BACK to the chair umpire like Serena was going to do something to her. Comeon....was she really going to hurt her in front of all those people. How can she feel threatened. The faint of heart should not be linespeople. Also......boo on the chair umpire for bringing the tournament referee into the picture. Chair umpires are supposed to use discretion, not simply be drones.

Serena should have been able to finish the match and then substantially fined by the tour afterwards.

You also have to set an example to kids (and sadly some adults) playing the game. You can not have people jumping down a lines persons throat making threats, at any level irespecive of who any of those involved are.
IT was not a "chicken **it" way to end a match because they had no choice.
If you break a frame in anger its a code violation, if you abuse a member of the line team (or a ball person i think) it's a code violation, you get 2 of those you loose a point it just happened a at bad time for her.But equally dont you think she'd of known that and restrained herself then after the Ump called the line judge over to ask what happened/ was said the judge went to her line and got another earfull from the player.On its own thats 2 seperate violations, making 3 so that'd be a game conceded, that brings much heavier post match penalties so they didn't have to stop where they did.

Now was anyone courtside to hear what she said?